also all this qunari spy talk?
let's get real
bull noticed them as soon as they got in
bull could work with leilana and BOOM
no qunari spy problems
seriously
bull knew exactly who the assassins were
it's ****** sad
whats scary is if leilana knew because
hey she let blackwall get away for so long
maybe our little red headed bard doesnt trust the qunari and maybe letting bull die would be a minor security breach
makes you wonder especially if she is hardened
There should have been a battle after his men died. "Okay, they are dead, let's head back to skyhold"
No way, I chose the Qun and was fully expecting to be able to go over there and avenge them ... was really disappointed that wasn't part of the quest.
Guest_Donkson_*
Biotic Flash Kick, I almost thought I was reading a post made by Sera. 
Biotic Flash Kick, I almost thought I was reading a post made by Sera.
ill make sure to mention cookies and frigging crotch punching qunari spies off the top of skyhold next time.
I've seen both outcomes and reloaded to save the Chargers. In my subsequent playthroughs I am sticking with saving the Chargers as well. It just feels like the right option regardless. Bull winds up with a really deep care for the Chargers and condoning sacrificing them for the greater good of the Qun does not seem like Bull at all. Sten would do that, but Iron Bull has a heart and it seems he's come to care for them as if they were his immediate family.
To each their own but screw the Qunari, they will be fine.... if they want to sabotage an alliance after expecting one of the Inquisitor's family-like party members to sacrifice their own family for some ships that should have come prepared.... F THEM.
Chargers all day!
Bull's men, always the Bull's men if I don't intentionally try to make the run a hell to myself.
I managed sacrifice them only once in my 'let's-be-assholes-to-everyone' run and it was awful.
I know I'm weak but the power of Krem is too strong.
Those are Qunari who who quite recently occupied another city in my inquisitor's home country and whom he fully expects to have to fight at some point in the future. Of course he values their lives less than a mercenary group under his command. He wasn't that keen on risking giving them a foothold in the first place.
The attack on Kirkwall was not authorized by the Qun. It was an independent decision made by the Arishok. The Qunari on the boat were not responsible.
Seriously, go to 2:57 of this video if you don't believe me. Varric straight up tells you that the Qun didn't authorize the attack.
Neither. Don't let Bull join the party, and avoid the choice and dudebro Qunari entirely.
Letting them die is good for Iron Bull, reminds him of who he is.
I realised the game was up to something when they had the Inquisitor talk to the charges and drink with them. That's when I thought "Something bad is going to happen to these guys", and then *bang* the Qun quest comes up and I am absolutely unable to sacrifice the charges - I actually came reading the forums to find out what happens if you sacrifice them, because I don't even want to do it and then reload a save. NOPE.
Letting them die is good for Iron Bull, reminds him of who he is.
Yes because people don't change ever and if they do lets kill their friends so they know who they are.
I would say think of it this way. What do you think Bull needs more:
I realised the game was up to something when they had the Inquisitor talk to the charges and drink with them. That's when I thought "Something bad is going to happen to these guys", and then *bang* the Qun quest comes up and I am absolutely unable to sacrifice the charges - I actually came reading the forums to find out what happens if you sacrifice them, because I don't even want to do it and then reload a save. NOPE.
There's an easter egg I love in that scene. Bull introduces Stiches, the Chargers' Ferelden healer who became a soldier during the Blight. Bull says he makes great healing potions that taste like crap. Stitches: "That's because it's a poultice sir."
The healing items during DA:O? Poultices. When using one, the Warden or companions would make a drinking motion. When I first saw that scene I cracked up laughing.
What do the chargers get me? 6 mercs who get utterly destroyed by a small Venetori ambush.
What do the Qunari get me? Thedas's version of the CIA and US navy. Seriously, you get one of the best spy networks and THE most powerful naval force in the friggin world.
The Qunari are jerks? Well, Joseph Stalin was a jerk as well but the US teamed up with him anyways and sent him TONS of equipment and money in the fight against Nazi Germany. That alliance ended up playing a very critical role in Germany's downfall. Sometimes, its better to not be picky about your allies in the middle of a war. Oh and to all of the people saying that the Qunari do not honour alliances, Bull pretty much says that this alliance is a big new step for the Qunari. They've apparently never made a deal like this with a foreign power before. Whether or not they will invade Thedas one day is a different question but for the time being, this alliance offers valuable support in the fight against Cory. Cory is the immediate threat that needs to be dealt with. Why not get some Qunari aid? Even if they do attack Thedas in the future, why not use them to our advantage while we can? Think of them as tools rather than as allies if you must.
Mercenary or not, the BCs are part of Inquisition forces and under my PC's command and protection. I felt it would be hypocritical to tell Leiliana that our men are not disposable and that we're better than Corypheous then turn around and sacrifice them for the supposed greater good. At least that's how I played my Inquisitor so it would depend on the personality. And I don't trust the Qun and anyways.
The Inquisitor makes calls that cost people their lives all the time. The soldiers that died at Adamant? The men sent to scout the Storm Coast, or to help that elf party open the tomb in the Emerald Graves? The people who die or are maimed simply maintaining a presence in the Western Approach? Or heck, that army that was sent to the Arbor Wilds to fight Corypheus's forces? All died for the greater good. The Chargers are no different
There's an easter egg I love in that scene. Bull introduces Stiches, the Chargers' Ferelden healer who became a soldier during the Blight. Bull says he makes great healing potions that taste like crap. Stitches: "That's because it's a poultice sir."
The healing items during DA:O? Poultices. When using one, the Warden or companions would make a drinking motion. When I first saw that scene I cracked up laughing.
Ahah, yes, I noticed it and it made me laugh. 
I love these little details in games.
The Inquisitor makes calls that cost people their lives all the time. The soldiers that died at Adamant? The men sent to scout the Storm Coast, or to help that elf party open the tomb in the Emerald Graves? The people who die or are maimed simply maintaining a presence in the Western Approach? Or heck, that army that was sent to the Arbor Wilds to fight Corypheus's forces? All died for the greater good. The Chargers are no different
True, but many (including myself) tent to RP their Inquisitors as hypocrites without even noticing it at first; it doesn't matter until you actually know the guys you're asking to lay down their lives. It's a part of the human nature to care about the people you know as individuals rather than just as a part of a faceless mass. Not saying it's a good excuse not to sacrifice these guys but I get why so many rather take them than the Quin, not matter how useful they might be. Aah, the double standing morals in this game~
A bird in a hand is worth two in a bush.
On top of that the Qunari have been known to not care about treaties they make (aka Kirkwall). They also might be an ally now, but in the future they'll likely be an enemy for my Andrastian Inquisitor. By aligning with them I would only strengthen them, and possibly even open up ways for them to gain more allies. I also firmly believe in forcing the Qunari to fight with Tevinter forever. With both powers busy with each other the south won't have to worry about a powerful Imperium or a Qunari conquest. I wouldn't want to do anything to tip the balance of power in the favor of either.
That leads into why I cannot bring myself to choose Gaspard as Emperor of Orlais... To me this would force the Imperium to focus on their Southern Borders, possibly resulting in their collapse like our real life Byzantine Empire.
The Inquisitor makes calls that cost people their lives all the time. The soldiers that died at Adamant? The men sent to scout the Storm Coast, or to help that elf party open the tomb in the Emerald Graves? The people who die or are maimed simply maintaining a presence in the Western Approach? Or heck, that army that was sent to the Arbor Wilds to fight Corypheus's forces? All died for the greater good. The Chargers are no different
The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
I wish this would apply to politics too. Reality doesn't always reflect ideology I guess.
As inquisitor you got to look at the big picture. An alliance with the Qunari is more important than a few mercenary soldiers. Iron Bull is a warrior and soldier he understands.
What do the chargers get me? 6 mercs who get utterly destroyed by a small Venetori ambush.
What do the Qunari get me? Thedas's version of the CIA and US navy. Seriously, you get one of the best spy networks and THE most powerful naval force in the friggin world.
The Qunari are jerks? Well, Joseph Stalin was a jerk as well but the US teamed up with him anyways and sent him TONS of equipment and money in the fight against Nazi Germany. That alliance ended up playing a very critical role in Germany's downfall. Sometimes, its better to not be picky about your allies in the middle of a war. Oh and to all of the people saying that the Qunari do not honour alliances, Bull pretty much says that this alliance is a big new step for the Qunari. They've apparently never made a deal like this with a foreign power before. Whether or not they will invade Thedas one day is a different question but for the time being, this alliance offers valuable support in the fight against Cory. Cory is the immediate threat that needs to be dealt with. Why not get some Qunari aid? Even if they do attack Thedas in the future, why not use them to our advantage while we can? Think of them as tools rather than as allies if you must.
Except the strategic situation is different. Corypheus isn't a direct threat to the qunari, and the Inquisition has been doing rather well in containing him so far (for me, this quest has been coming up after both the Winter Palace and Adamant Fortress). Which means that any scenario where I take a hit to save qunari forces benefits them a great deal more than it benefits me.
If the WWII scenario applied, Corypheus would be on his way to defeat the qunari, and by supporting them I'd bind his forces so that he'll have fewer resources to oppose my own attack. Instead, you can accurately predict that an alliance with the qunari would not take a significant weight off your shoulders, since they're not positioned to aid you in time even if they wanted. Instead, the net outcome is that you strengthen them at your expense with little gain for yourself. Of course the qunari are interested in such an arrangement...
Edit:
Or you can look at it from the qunari side: by allying with the Inquisition the Inquisition *may* gain a little benefit, but we have an additional foot in the door with no expense on our side, and if the Inquisition takes losses saving our people it'll be easier to conquer them in the future.
Nope. I won't be the one letting the qunari gain a foothold. Not with my main Inquisitor anyway, who is also a mage who has allied with the mages and has even more reason to detest the Qun.
Men die in War. It was Iron Bull's mistake that saw his men killed. It was Iron Bull's lack of proper training that saw his men die. Iron Bull's choice on, wether, or not to lead his men himself, his fault. Why jeporadise an alliance for the sake of rabble?
The additional war table operations granted from alliance are tedious. I didn't uncover the right agent after more then 24 hours of war table operation time, and I wasn't gonna reload, or look at any guide for their tedious war table operation. I have another war table opperation from them. There are benefits to alliance
The only real logical choice to be made was, killing, the tone deaf chargers. I am curious if how saving the chargers affected friendship? Without them Iron Bull seems mostly the same a little glum, but is like every other male who wants to date my male inquisitor. I find to be quite strange...
For me, its simple. An alliance with the Qun is a deal with the devil anyway. I certainly wasn't going to sacrifice my men to save a bunch of brainwashed collectivists.
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