79 réponses à ce sujet

[DarkSun09]

I've heard various people discussed how great it would be if the game included a transgender option in the CC so that trans people can play as trans characters and have that aspect of their identity referenced or recognized by NPCs in the game. And I, for one, would have no problem if the developer included that option for players, but I'm a bit confused as to whether or not (and why) trans people would want to play as trans characters in the first place. I'm hoping someone who has a deeper grasp of this topic can help me understand. 

 

First, let me preempt any hostility or censorship from the community by saying that I mean no offense. If my question does offend, however, I apologize. I hope you can forgive any transgression and understand that any trespass comes from a place of ignorance and not one of intolerance.

 

My question is simple: Why would you want to play as a transgender character, if you can play as the gender you truly are on the inside? My understanding is that being born into the wrong gender is a source of pain and frustration for many (most? all?) transgender people. A young trans man I met once in a Woman & Gender Study class described the feeling as being trapped in his own skin. He hates it when people call him by the wrong pronoun, and/or bring up the fact that he was born female.

 

When I pose the question to Krem in the game, he was equally put off that I brought it up at all. He's a man and just wants to be known as a man. He doesn't want to talk about the fact that he was born female. Is that not also the case for other trans people? 

 

So then... if you were playing a game like Inquisition... and you have the option to play as the gender you truly are in your heart and mind and soul, then why would you want to play as a character who was born into the wrong body? Why would you want to bring that up in conversation with NPCs, or have them reference that aspect of your identity instead of just treating you like a regular guy or girl? I... I don't understand.

[Captain Wiseass]

Probably depends on the person. And the playthrough.

[Rake451]

Playing as a dude that was born a woman?  Sure, why the hell not?  We've already got Krem, and he's awesome.

 

Now, playing a Quanari that's secretly 10 nugs stacked on top of each other?  That one could get interesting.

 

Listen, after the 20th playthrough, it's time to get a little creative.

[Broganisity]

I am a man. I am also human.

But I have played as women, spirits, and machines. I have played as Dwarfs, Elves, Qunari, Werewolves, Krogan, Vampires, Hobbits...the list goes on.

Perhaps it's because I prefer to step into the role of a character rather than to play as myself that my answer is as it is. If I were to play as myself in every game that I could, it would be largely the same choices; the same outcomes. By stepping into the role of another person; their thoughts, beliefs, and mannerisms temporarily become my own and I am exploring a world with a new perspective. However, I do not believe any single aspect of the character's being is so paramount that it overrides all others: do I, as myself, want people to keep pointing at me going 'Hey, he's a man. and a human.'? Do I, in the role of a female dwarf, want people to keep pointing at me going 'Hey, she's a dwarf'? What if that dwarf likes flowers, poetry, spiced goat cheese and a side of roasted pork and prefers to be alone? Is none of that as important as her being a dwarf? In this regard, would people want to play as a transgendered character and want people to keep going, 'Hey. They're transgender.'?

This doesn't answer your question because I feel that there is no proper answer that can satisfy your curiousity...unless it's headbutts. We could all do with some more headbutting around here, also cheese.

[DarkSun09]

I can't speak for anyone, let alone transgender people but... I'd play as one to see how the world would react to it. Romantic interests in particular.

 

This is, of course, assuming the game in question reacts to it at all.

Oh yes, it would be interesting to see how romantic interests react to this. If the game does not reference it at all, would you feel like the developers cheated you? Like the whole trans thing was just thoughtlessly, shallowly tacked on, without much depth or care? Or what if it were referenced over and over again? Would that be offensive?

 

Hmmm... I think I would prefer it if a main party member/love interest were trans instead of the player-controlled character, and then I would have the option to romance him/her or see other npcs react to him/her.

[Jeremiah12LGeek]

I wouldn't personally make one, but I'd be fine with the option.

 

The only real issue I can see to including transgender in the CC would be the need to write and record extra scenes. If the self-identified gender were used in all scenes, then the inclusion would be somewhat moot.

[KennethAFTopp]

I wouldn't, but I would not lament that there would be an option. There are other thing I would prefer they spend their budget on honestly, but that's up to them.

[Catwall]

Interesting question. Personally, I am for including as many options as possible for creating characters that are actually reflective of the player or are aspects of identity that they want to explore. tl;dr: why not?

 

PS-The opening post of this thread is (for me) proof positive that you can actually start topics that question issues of sexual identity and inclusion without being as pointless and irritating as a flannel dild0.

[DarkSun09]

I am a man. I am also human.

But I have played as women, spirits, and machines. I have played as Dwarfs, Elves, Qunari, Werewolves, Krogan, Vampires, Hobbits...the list goes on.

Perhaps it's because I prefer to step into the role of a character rather than to play as myself that my answer is as it is. If I were to play as myself in every game that I could, it would be largely the same choices; the same outcomes. By stepping into the role of another person; their thoughts, beliefs, and mannerisms temporarily become my own and I am exploring a world with a new perspective. However, I do not believe any single aspect of the character's being is so paramount that it overrides all others: do I, as myself, want people to keep pointing at me going 'Hey, he's a man. and a human.'? Do I, in the role of a female dwarf, want people to keep pointing at me going 'Hey, she's a dwarf'? What if that dwarf likes flowers, poetry, spiced goat cheese and a side of roasted pork and prefers to be alone? Is none of that as important as her being a dwarf? In this regard, would people want to play as a transgendered character and want people to keep going, 'Hey. They're transgender.'?

This doesn't answer your question because I feel that there is no proper answer that can satisfy your curiousity...unless it's headbutts. We could all do with some more headbutting around here, also cheese.

Yes, I did not think the answer would be easy to come upon. My best hope is for responses such as yours, actually. Something that is not quite a simple yes or no, and more... introspective... contemplative. Thank you for the thoughtful response.  

[Qun00]

They usually want to be either a guy or a girl.

Including the detail that character X used to be something else wouldn't make a whole lot of difference.

I can see the crazier types who want to identify as neither having trouble, but I don't see the need to feed everyone's fantasies for the sake of being politically correct.

[berelinde]

I can't speak for anyone, let alone transgender people but... I'd play as one to see how the world would react to it. Romantic interests in particular.

 

This is, of course, assuming the game in question reacts to it at all.

See, that's why I would not want to play as a trans man. It's bad enough in RL when society, friends, and even lovers treat you as your apparent gender and reject the reality of trans status. I'd rather just play a cis male character.

 

Buuuuuut, I would love having the opportunity to play a character who identifies as a non-binary gender and have the game react to that accordingly. It's probably outside the scope of a game, though. Is Thedas really progressive enough to ask characters their preferred pronouns or to offer the full range? There are probably players who are unaware that there are more than two sets. But yeah, playing a non-binary character would be awesome.

[DarkSun09]

I think there's a happy medium to be had in the vast majority of things, and neither extreme tends to please me a whole lot. This is one such case. No references would make the addition quite... pointless, beyond the idea of having it for inclusion's sake (which isn't bad). At the same time, talk about it too much and it'll seem unnecessary, forced and, depending on how it's done, offensive. (note: I get the feeling you understand my initial post in your thread as identifying myself as a transgender... that isn't the case, figured I'd clarify

 

That'd be interesting, too. I thought of the main character because, in most games, party members aren't leaders of any big organisation. In DAI, for example, you're the leader of an entity that is already under a great deal of scrutiny as it is. Having a transgender leader would add yet another thing to consider, if the writers have it in them to add characters actively against that idea in their game.

Oh, I didn't think that. Sorry if my use of "you" made it sound like I was assuming things. I just meant... like... "you" the player, role-playing as a trans character, would you be offended if such and such were the case... you know what I mean? 

[Broganisity]

Yes, I did not think the answer would be easy to come upon. My best hope is for responses such as yours, actually. Something that is not quite a simple yes or no, and more... introspective... contemplative. Thank you for the thoughtful response.  

 

You are essentially seeking a Socratic discussion that's the same as 'What is Piety?'.

 

We could sit here all day and ponder just what piety truly means, and never really come up with a proper conclusion...bu if done right, we all walk away a little bit wiser...and maybe headbutts.

Honestly though I'd just prefer face AND body customization (arm/leg lengths...hand widths...I'm talking full out here!), but the amount of resources required for that and then making sure armors and all that properly fit- I'm not designer, but I can imagine that being a pain.

[mLIQUID]

I would think a trans-gender person in life would want to be the gender they most identify with. I am a hetero male but wouldn't say it's out of the question to play a female. In all I doubt a person with an internal voice describing a gender would consider themselves a mutant needing a distinct class. It's not easy to put yourself in someone's shoes, but I don't think it's how they see themselves. Having lived around Hollywood for many years I see the conviction of what is known to a person and not relating to their physical self. In the end no matter if you're male or female, purple or green, you are normal because you exist. The more you believe in yourself the more adversity you will find... comes with the territory for anyone regarding anything.

 

If you're asking to incorporate a special story-line to an individual plight I'm sure they'll be a modding community that would be interested in exploring that role.

[CrimsonN7]

Can't speak for transgendered folk but if the option was available in the next DA game either as a PC or as a LI I would be tempted to try it out. I enjoyed Krem and I'd be all for seeing more people like him in future DA games.

 

You've still got plenty of arse left chief!

[katokires]

I've heard various people discussed how great it would be if the game included a transgender option in the CC so that trans people can play as trans characters and have that aspect of their identity referenced or recognized by NPCs in the game. And I, for one, would have no problem if the developer included that option for players, but I'm a bit confused about whether or not (and why) trans people would want to play as trans characters in the first place. I'm hoping someone who has a deeper grasp of this topic can help me understand. 

 

First, let me preempt any hostility or censorship from the community by saying that I mean no offense. If my question does offend, however, I apologize. I hope you can forgive any transgression and understand that any trespass comes from a place of ignorance and not one of intolerance.

 

My question is simple: Why would you want to play as a transgender character, if you can play as the gender you truly are on the inside? My understanding is that being born into the wrong gender is a source of pain and frustration for many (most? all?) transgender people. A young trans man I met once in a Woman & Gender Study class described the feeling as being trapped in his own skin. He hates it when people call him by the wrong pronoun, and/or bring up the fact that he was born female.

 

When I pose the question to Krem in the game, he was equally put off that I brought it up at all. He's a man and just wants to be known as a man. He doesn't want to talk about the fact that he was born female. Is that not also the case for other trans people? 

 

So then... if you were playing a game like Inquisition... and you have the option to play as the gender you truly are in your heart and mind and soul, then why would you want to play as a character who was born into the wrong body? Why would you want to bring that up in conversation with NPCs, or have them reference that aspect of your identity instead of just treating you like a regular guy or girl? I... I don't understand.

When I do it is because I want my suffering acknowledged. Just for the drama. Usually not, just want to dream that I am "normal".

[nightscrawl]

I'm sure it just depends on the specific trans person and how they want to be represented in the game. I would also think that it would be ideal to play as the gender you identify as since this game format is the perfect medium for it. But other players might feel that part of their identity comes from the struggle they've gone through and might want to have that represented as well.

 

Also, the inclusion of the option, even if not taken, is important. It's the same with the relationship aspect of these games. A real life gay person may have no interest in romancing the followers of the same gender as presented in the game. Maybe they just don't like them for whatever reason. But the inclusion of the option for that person, and all players, is meaningful.

[NoForgiveness]

I'm just going to say, I wouldn't want resources wasted on this. People can play whichever gender they want to and that should be enough. Now I'm leaving. Fast.

[DarkSun09]

You are essentially seeking a Socratic discussion that's the same as 'What is Piety?'.

 

We could sit here all day and ponder just what piety truly means, and never really come up with a proper conclusion...bu if done right, we all walk away a little bit wiser...and maybe headbutts.

Honestly though I'd just prefer face AND body customization (arm/leg lengths...hand widths...I'm talking full out here!), but the amount of resources required for that and then making sure armors and all that properly fit- I'm not designer, but I can imagine that being a pain.

Haha. Not seeking it, no, but I'm pleased just the same when the tone of the discussion veer in that direction. ^^

 

And hey, full face AND body customization? It's not a crime to dream...  

[DarkSun09]

When I do it is because I want my suffering acknowledged. Just for the drama. Usually not, just want to dream that I am "normal".

You are normal... if there is even such a thing as "normal." You're just not the average.