900 réponses à ce sujet

[I present Chuck Bass]

If the mage can run the circle without chantry or Templar . Then yes , I support That . I do believe in education and everything . 

 

But when templar and chantry decide start blabbering the Maker stuff and wont let anyone go free or have any freedom of any kind....then...hell yeah . I open the door wide and let them roam.....

 

 

okay but do you believe its important to have people trained to combat mages and magic, like templars are? Regular soldiers have a hell of a time defeating a mage, and if a powerful one goes rogue, its hard to stop if you aren't a templar. Therefore, thats why i believe Templars are important.

[Br3admax]

Yes. Tevinter is proof that society and the world doesn't crumble if mage's are free. Ironically the region that deems mage's dangerous and locks them away has more problems with them... The Circle causes abominations and blood mages, because they don't allow mage's to master magic due to fear. There's no Kirkwall situations in Tevinter.

Because Tevinter doesn't have abominations and, especially, blood mages?

 

Oookay. 

[SnakeCode]

They had the chance in DA:I to prove to everybody that they could be trusted with freedom. They instead chose to ally themselves to the enemy of the free world. As indentured servants (basically slaves) no less. They showed that not only can they not be trusted with the responsibility that freedom entails, they also didn't really want to be free.

 

Honestly the Circle is the best place for them. It isn't perfect, and Templars would have to be closely watched, but there is no better place to help nurture their talents whilst making sure both they and the common people are protected from the harm that magic can cause.

[ThreeF]

Except that this argument completely glosses over the fact that a crazy mage can do SIGNIFICANTLY more damage than a crazy random dude.

 

Abominations are infinitely more dangerous than the vast majority of non-magic users. That pretty much invalidates your comparison, I think.

 

Doesn't matter one bit,  by keeping mages locked up you are restricting the freedom of a good portion of population and facilitate fear and distrust that borderline racism (if mages was a race). Each case of misconduct and crime, no matter how severe, must be dealt on it's own, which it's unique parameters and people should not be .all sacked together because of fear.

 

You have people in Thedas who are practically mass murderers and yet it's the mages that get the short end of the stick.

[TheTsar_]

Tevinter is mage dominated. The Southerners wish to avoid this.

Kirkwall was one extreme but Tevinter is another.

The reason they wish to avoid it, is a result of their actions trying to avoid it.. If that makes sense. It's a vicious circle, no pun intended. 

[Mims]

I think mages deserve freedom, but they should still be bound by laws and register their blood so they can be located. Have mages police mages. If you get out of line, a mage group comes after you.  

 

Since mages are naturally gifted in a way that non-mages aren't, I'd also make laws limiting how much political power mages can actually hold. No lordships, for instance, unless a town is designated as some sort of mage haven. This would keep things from getting like Tevintar or Arlathan where mages absorbed the aristocracy. 

 

Of course, nothing stops them from trying to rebel this set up. So then we're back at square one. 

[ThreeF]

Except that this argument completely glosses over the fact that a crazy mage can do SIGNIFICANTLY more damage than a crazy random dude.

 

Abominations are infinitely more dangerous than the vast majority of non-magic users. That pretty much invalidates your comparison, I think.

 

Doesn't matter one bit,  by keeping mages locked up you are restricting the freedom of a good portion of population and facilitate fear and distrust that borderline racism (if mages was a race). Each case of misconduct and crime, no matter how severe, must be dealt on it's own, whithin it's unique parameters and people should not be all sacked together because of fear.

 

You have people in Thedas, all non-mages, who are practically mass murderers and yet it's the mages that get the short end of the stick.

[TheTsar_]

Because Tevinter doesn't have abominations and, especially, blood mages?

 

Oookay. 

Blood Magic is no different than "The Game". Nobles killing people in order to gain dominance. And Tevinter doesn't have abominations that lay waste to entire cities. 

[AlexiaRevan]

okay but do you believe its important to have people trained to combat mages and magic, like templars are? Regular soldiers have a hell of a time defeating a mage, and if a powerful one goes rogue, its hard to stop if you aren't a templar. Therefore, thats why i believe Templars are important.

Look at it this way...

 

When ya hear Mage gonna be free ? what do peoples think first and always ?? 

 

They gonna RUN the hOUSe! they be in controle ! yada yada . 

 

Then ya look at the Templar , and what do they want ?? To controle . What they call 'protect and watch' is control . Nothing more to it then that . They can hide it under tons of Maker will..but in the end it is merely controlling others . 

 

And let me tell ya one more thing : the fact they have to turn fanatic to lyrium to do the job aint any better then letting a blood mage roam free . 

 

Thats not a solution and never was . I believe in understanding one another to get the real solution . 

 

Add to that , I dont understand why a Mage cannot stop another Mage . They have Power right ?? Let them handle it . They can dispel Magic too ! they can defend against another mage with Power that are Natural . Not some Lyrium Drug . 

 

No . The Templar shouldnt exist at all . They are an abomination of another kind . It create fanatic wich without any power are already a bad thing . Ya shove Lyrium in them and they get powerful fanatic . Ya brainwash them with maker crap and it just get worse . Ya build an order and ya have a crappy system that sooner or later will go out of control . 

[Maiafay]

Tevinter is mage dominated. The Southerners wish to avoid this.
Kirkwall was one extreme but Tevinter is another.

Point is, they don't have abominations running around loose like the South swears will happen if mages get one whiff of freedom. The circle is a broken system. Let the mages rule themselves.

[NoForgiveness]

Sort of... I like the idea of them becoming a "jedi order." Protection and training should be the responsibility of the mages themselves. I also think the mages need to involve themselves in the world. Help and protect the mundanes and it'll help alot with the fear.

[I present Chuck Bass]

Blood Magic is no different than "The Game". Nobles killing people in order to gain dominance. And Tevinter doesn't have abominations that lay waste to entire cities. 

 I Don't know, blood magic can cause the entire world to fall into chaos, the Game at worst causes a civil war. If the tevinter weren't so busy getting their ass kicked by the qunari, it would be scary what those magisters would be up too.

[Br3admax]

Blood Magic is no different than "The Game". Nobles killing people in order to gain dominance. And Tevinter doesn't have abominations that lay waste to entire cities. 

Well besides the fact "the Game" doesn't involve demons, that isn't what you just said. Also, you have no proof that a city in Tevinter, or Southern Thedas for that matter, has ever had an abomination destroy it or not. 

 

The reason they wish to avoid it, is a result of their actions trying to avoid it.. If that makes sense. It's a vicious circle, no pun intended. 

No, that doesn't make sense at all. If you mean that their measures to avoid blood magic is what causes blood magic, that too is false. If it's not one thing it's another. Blood magic will always happen because there will always be idiots who want more power. Limiting it is the best course of action.

[raging_monkey]

I think mages deserve freedom, but they should still be bound by laws and register their blood so they can be located. Have mages police mages. If you get out of line, a mage group comes after you.  
 
Since mages are naturally gifted in a way that non-mages aren't, I'd also make laws limiting how much political power mages can actually hold. No lordships, for instance, unless a town is designated as some sort of mage haven. This would keep things from getting like Tevintar or Arlathan where mages absorbed the aristocracy. 
 
Of course, nothing stops them from trying to rebel this set up. So then we're back at square one.

like a "mutant registration act" in marvel hmm i like it so far

[AshesEleven]

Blood Magic is no different than "The Game". Nobles killing people in order to gain dominance. And Tevinter doesn't have abominations that lay waste to entire cities. 

???

 

Blood Magic is a type of magic.  The Game refers to the political and courtly intrigues of Orlais.  

 

 

 

 

You have people in Thedas, all non-mages, who are practically mass murderers and yet it's the mages that get the short end of the stick.

 

WHAT.  

 

Dude, look, I understand your point of view, but how the hell can you claim that there are no mass murderers who are mages?!  Did you play DA2?  Do you not realize what abominations are?

 

Let's not even get into all the destructive things magic has done: the Breach, the Blights, the Circle Tower in Fereldan, the Harvester, etc etc etc.

 

If you're arguing for mage freedom, fine, but don't pretend that magic isn't dangerous.  It is, far more dangerous than a sword ever could be.  To say otherwise is silly.  

 

A lot of Tevinter Magisters have been mass murderers, if we want to go there as well..

[Vita Brevis]

Because Tevinter doesn't have abominations and, especially, blood mages?

Well I don't see it overrun with abominations. Their templars can handle them even without specail abilities just well and without hoarding them all in one place "just in case". 

 

If you're arguing for mage freedom, fine, but don't pretend that magic isn't dangerous.  It is, far more dangerous than a sword ever could be.  To say otherwise is silly. 

The most dangerous weapon is the tongue. That applies both to Thedas and the real world.

[Mims]

like a "mutant registration act" in marvel hmm i like it so far

 

Less ominous, but yes. You do need to reassure the non-magical public that there is some sort of protection for them. Even if in reality its a bit more complicated than just grabbing a vial and hunting them down. 

[zestalyn]

By law, all children in the USA are required to attend school for obvious reasons.

 

Similarly, all mages should be required to attend an institution where they can learn and responsibly harness their abilities in a safe and nurturing environment where they are allowed a reasonable amount of personal freedoms. 

[I present Chuck Bass]

Look at it this way...

 

When ya hear Mage gonna be free ? what do peoples think first and always ?? 

 

They gonna RUN the hOUSe! they be in controle ! yada yada . 

 

Then ya look at the Templar , and what do they want ?? To controle . What they call 'protect and watch' is control . Nothing more to it then that . They can hide it under tons of Maker will..but in the end it is merely controlling others . 

 

And let me tell ya one more thing : the fact they have to turn fanatic to lyrium to do the job aint any better then letting a blood mage roam free . 

 

Thats not a solution and never was . I believe in understanding one another to get the real solution . 

 

Add to that , I dont understand why a Mage cannot stop another Mage . They have Power right ?? Let them handle it . They can dispel Magic too ! they can defend against another mage with Power that are Natural . Not some Lyrium Drug . 

 

No . The Templar shouldnt exist at all . They are an abomination of another kind . It create fanatic wich without any power are already a bad thing . Ya shove Lyrium in them and they get powerful fanatic . Ya brainwash them with maker crap and it just get worse . Ya build an order and ya have a crappy system that sooner or later will go out of control . 

 I don't know templars like Ser Barris, protect mages, they don't control them. But to your point about mages being able to stop other mages, if a mage is using blood magic, they have a significant advantage over a mage using non blood magic, and have difficulty stoping them as a result. I think if you are going to have mages, it would be unwise to not have Templars who can combat magic the most efficiently. The problem is the chantry doesn't oversee the Templars enough, and as a result the Templars abuse their powers.

[ThreeF]

WHAT.  

 

Dude, look, I understand your point of view, but how the hell can you claim that there are no mass murderers who are mages?!  Did you play DA2?  Do you not realize what abominations are?

 

 

I think you misunderstood me, I'm not saying there aren't mass murderers that are mages, I'm saying that there are mass murderers that aren't .

 

Thedas with it's Circles sort of reminds me of German Nazi setting to be honest

[raging_monkey]

Less ominous, but yes. You do need to reassure the non-magical public that there is some sort of protection for them. Even if in reality its a bit more complicated than just grabbing a vial and hunting them down.

i wouldnt say it was "omnious" but i think its a good start

[Kinsz]

Should mages be free? Nope , the circles should be kept , mages should live in better conditions though , no more abuses , and allow them to leave if they wish once they prove they are capable of handling their magic.

[AlexiaRevan]

 I don't know templars like Ser Barris, protect mages, they don't control them. But to your point about mages being able to stop other mages, if a mage is using blood magic, they have a significant advantage over a mage using non blood magic, and have difficulty stoping them as a result. I think if you are going to have mages, it would be unwise to not have Templars who can combat magic the most efficiently. The problem is the chantry doesn't oversee the Templars enough, and as a result the Templars abuse their powers.

But the Templar seek the right of annulement everytime Blood Magic is Involved . They didnt do squat in DAO when it happen....

 

And there is more to this issue then 'Oh is Magic Bad?' . There is the right of annulement issue . There is the Harrowing issue and then there is the Tranquil solution issue . 

 

It isn't just about letting mage be free . It is a whole system of control and abuse . There are good Mages who want to learn and live happy and safe with everyone else . And ya also have peoples who don't want Magic at all , yet they are shoved in the same category as everyone just because of Magic . 

 

So I dont think this issue is cut and clean as just 'Letting the Mage be free' . the whole system should be seen for what it is and find a solution for each issue that appear . 

 

But let take your idea out : let say the Mage live in a circle free , study and have all freedoms . And templar live elsewhere under the chantry and are there if anything ever Happen . 

 

Do you really believe , that the chantry or the Templar would just go their merry way and Let them be free ?? when the chantry tied the duty of a Templar to a Holy institution and that if ya go against it you are undoing the Maker will ?? 

[I present Chuck Bass]

 

 

Thedas with it's Circles sort of reminds me of German Nazi setting to be honest

 I don't know about that, close to half of the mages want circles, no jews wanted concentration camps. The Nazi's goal was to eliminate the Jews, the circle doesn't want to kill mages, some templars do but the circles aren't there for that.

[raging_monkey]

Aha a question to all.

How does a mage "prove" themselves? Multiple harrowings, community sevice, military service, or just do "favors" for powerful people