135 réponses à ce sujet

[Rasande]

The charm from Skyrim comes from making your own adventure from exploring, not quests, they're just there to point you in a direction and add some substance.

Can't really blame anyone who prefers a strikt narrative and structure from aimless exploration for not liking Skyrim.

 

Which is kind of why this new direction worries me. Narrative is what Bioware is good at and that ussually suffers when the game is open ended.

I liked DA:I, but most of the side content really was MMOish and i really hope they improve on that..

Exploration should be player driven, it should be it's own reward by finding something cool like a fun dungeon or a new questline that takes you in a diffirent direction, not a new marker on the map for yet another collectible, And if the world itself isn't intereting or fun to explore.. well, then you're borked.

 

If you land on a planet for mission X and on the way to your objective come across a pirate base or a small settlement that opens up a sub-plot that gives more insight to the planets/race/the over-arching mission/history of the galaxy/whatever that could be pretty cool.

[Vortex13]

I was actually fairly satisfied with the exploration in ME1, aside from reused enemy base layouts and some impossible terrains.
The main problem in the game for me was that there was no story/character driven side quests like in ME2 or most other Bioware games. So if we can get both: well written side quests for our party AND ME1 type exploration (with some technical improvements) it would be really awesome.

Sadly that's what I was waiting for in ME3 considering they had done two successful games already and it was a no brainer to combine best elements from previous releases...

 

 

The reuse of the bases in ME 1 made sense (to me) from a lore perspective. Yes, BioWare was re-using assets, but in reality a pre-fab shelter is exactly what to expect when colonizing far reaching locations. 

 

 

I agree on the rest of the post though. 

[MrFob]

The reuse of the bases in ME 1 made sense (to me) from a lore perspective. Yes, BioWare was re-using assets, but in reality a pre-fab shelter is exactly what to expect when colonizing far reaching locations. 

 

 

I agree on the rest of the post though. 

 

Agreed, it worked for the prefabs. What was really strange though was that all the underground caverns and mines had all the same layouts as well. That is where the sense stopped and the asset reuse became really apparent. Also, the fact that we only found Kowloon class modular freighters and no other space ships was a bit annoying as well. ME2/3 improved on that one (e.g. with the Strontium Mule N7 quest in ME2).

On a side note, for the next game, I do wish for a bit more variety with the prefabs as well. E.g. Horizon in ME2 showed that even with a prefab colony, you can still create interesting and new environments.

 

All in all, I hope for a variety in the style of missions that we'll see in ME3. I want some huge planetary maps where we can explore with the MAKO, ME1 style but I also want some small and tacky N7 style side quests -> Dock at a ship, take out the pirates and get the hell out. One of DA:Is problems is that I very quickly settle into a routine, go to the new area -> check the distribution of camps and other quest markers -> lawn maw the map.

Just as long as there is enough variety in the next ME, i am happy. If every star system can surprise me and the game doesn't set itself into a formula, then it would be really good IMO.

[NM_Che56]

You know what's funny: I remember a while back people were begging for an MMO style Bioware game (Mass Effect, IIRC)...but then what's the major criticism of DA:I? MMO elements! LOL

 

This just is yet another example of how this community is just nutty.

[MattFini]

Agreed.

 

I haven't been here for a while, but I'm happy to see others agree.

 

The "bloat" of DA:I makes the game feel aimless on more than one occasion and I have the same concerns about the next ME. 

[Dashen Thomas]

 
Exploration should be player driven, it should be it's own reward by finding something cool like a fun dungeon or a new questline that takes you in a diffirent direction, not a new marker on the map for yet another collectible, And if the world itself isn't intereting or fun to explore.. well, then you're borked.
 
If you land on a planet for mission X and on the way to your objective come across a pirate base or a small settlement that opens up a sub-plot that gives more insight to the planets/race/the over-arching mission/history of the galaxy/whatever that could be pretty cool.

Couldn't agree more. And as others have pointed out, variety of mission types and scale really is a key thing as well. So that you never know quite what to expect when landing on an unknown planet or docking a derelict ship.

[Son of Shepherd]

It's a popular belief that ME next will have 'a focus on exploration.' Many speculations have been based on this belief.

It's clearly part of the game. But from the N7 day stream I got the impression it'll be like ME1.

 

I think another viewing, or a first one for some, may be helpful. Here it is:

 

Mike Gamble clearly states "We don't want to force the player into the Mako all of the time," before saying

"This is a game of choice, we want exploration to be just one ingredient."

 

One of the developers from Montreal says "If exploration is something you want to keep aside, it's up to you."

 

Mac Walters makes similar comments. Plenty of quotes regarding conflict/combat too.

Although they also talk about 'marrying' the experiences it doesn't sound like exploration has to be in your story at all. 

 

So there you go. Does that debunk a few theories?

[chris2365]

 

I think another viewing, or a first one for some, may be helpful. Here it is:

 

Watching this video again just makes me even more desperate for info 

 

And I have a sneaky feeling we'll have to wait until E3 to find out more...

[goishen]

Yah, one thing that Mac Walters said in that that I didn't like (that I just picked up on), is the "we don't wanna take you outta the world, be it cut scenes, having to pull up another screen".

 

Eish.   It's prolly gonna be just like DA:I.   I'm still gonna buy it, but man.

[MrFob]

Yea, that would be bad. I really don't want these fixed camera angle conversation that we had in DA:I. That was a definite step back from previous DA (and ME) games. If you gonna make a conversation, make it a cutscene. I am not saying there has to be super duper action in all of them but please, make it a proper dialogue scene, not some fixed angle or Zaeed-like ambient conversation.

[DraGGon2k]

It's a popular belief that ME next will have 'a focus on exploration.' Many speculations have been based on this belief.

It's clearly part of the game. But from the N7 day stream I got the impression it'll be like ME1.

 

I think another viewing, or a first one for some, may be helpful. Here it is:

 

Mike Gamble clearly states "We don't want to force the player into the Mako all of the time," before saying

"This is a game of choice, we want exploration to be just one ingredient."

 

One of the developers from Montreal says "If exploration is something you want to keep aside, it's up to you."

 

Mac Walters makes similar comments. Plenty of quotes regarding conflict/combat too.

Although they also talk about 'marrying' the experiences it doesn't sound like exploration has to be in your story at all. 

 

So there you go. Does that debunk a few theories?

Tbh that sounds like it's going to be EXACTLY the same as in DA:I, since there are all areas were basically also optional(aside from power requirements for main quest).

[Son of Shepherd]

Tbh that sounds like it's going to be EXACTLY the same as in DA:I, since there are all areas were basically also optional(aside from power requirements for main quest).

Open world combat would never work in ME. So how will it be the same?

[MrFob]

Open world combat would never work in ME. So how will it be the same?

Uh, what? Have you played ME1?

[Vortex13]

One of my favorite things about ME 1 was the sheer scale of the enemies you would encounter from giant Thresher Maws to Geth Colossi, to running up the side of the Citadel tower with Sovereign just towering over the landscape. 

 

 

 

Well that and the OP adept class  . On my insanity play though I would intentionally engage the Geth Colossus on foot using lift and singularity to toss the 3 story mech around like a toy… I was a true Biotic GOD!

[Son of Shepherd]

Uh, what? Have you played ME1?

Well sure you have enemy bases on explorable planets, but would you really class it as open world? in the true sense?

 

Point is, it's nothing like DA:I. Why and how would next ME be?

[MrFob]

Well sure you have enemy bases on explorable planets, but would you really class it as open world? in the true sense?

 

Point is, it's nothing like DA:I. Why and how would next ME be?

 

First of all, my response was about open world combat and I see no reason why that would not work in an ME game, especially, given that in ME1, we are already dealing with enemies in large environments.

 

Second, how was ME1's structure majorly different from DA:I? You have multiple large maps, which you reach from a world/galaxy map and which you can explore on foot or on a mount/in a vehicle. Sure, the ME1 areas are less detailed and there are more of them but in principle, it is the same.

 

Third: We don't know how the next ME is going to be set up at all, so how much it is or isn't going to be similar to DA:I is simply unknown.

 

And fourth: No one in this thread was creating any rumors, we were analyzing DA:I's structure and offering our opinions on what might work or might not work in the next ME. It's all speculation though.

[Son of Shepherd]

First of all, my response was about open world combat and I see no reason why that would not work in an ME game, especially, given that in ME1, we are already dealing with enemies in large environments.

 

Second, how was ME1's structure majorly different from DA:I? You have multiple large maps, which you reach from a world/galaxy map and which you can explore on foot or on a mount/in a vehicle. Sure, the ME1 areas are less detailed and there are more of them but in principle, it is the same.

 

Third: We don't know how the next ME is going to be set up at all, so how much it is or isn't going to be similar to DA:I is simply unknown.

 

And fourth: No one in this thread was creating any rumors, we were analyzing DA:I's structure and offering our opinions on what might work or might not work in the next ME. It's all speculation though.

 

The games structures are similar at the most basic level maybe. You can play ME1 without going to any explorable places though. Pretty tough to do that with DA:I though as you need power, influence and xp (to level up effectively).

 

I wasn't referring to anything specifically said in this thread with my post regarding the N7 day stream. It was more of a general thing regarding the speculations of this board for the past few months. 

[spinachdiaper]

ME1,2,3 had fetch quests, it could be bad if fetch quests completely replace side story side quests. The only thing the next ME really should not have is a war room like DAI, some of those timed missions were so long it was preposterous.

[Mcfly616]

 While something akin to a more detailed version of ME1s world/level design is something I hope for, it'll all mean nothing if they use the same narrative structure they've been using for over a decade. They need to not worry about continuing the next games story over the course of multiple installments. The next games story should be able to stand on it's own.

 

The narrative and story need to branch drastically in the final act of the game. The setting, characters and outcome should have the possibility of being entirely different in certain acts of subsequent playthroughs. The places the story takes us, the people we see there, and what happens are all varied due to choices having consequences we could not have foreseen. Witcher 2 did this type of thing very well.

[Sion1138]

that doesnt exactly inspire confidence lol

 

Dread more like.

[windsea]

I don't mind filler content IF  i have good main/side quests that i'm going to be doing at the same time in the same area.

[goishen]

I've said it before, I'll say it again here.  

 

I don't mind doing side missions if, at any point, I can pick and progress the story.  Take SR3 as an example.  And no, not the dick and fart jokes.  I could, at any time in that game, pick up the main story as I wanted.  Do two missions and wanna go on a third main story mission?  Sure!   Just completed four hours of side quest stuff and wanna break it up by doing a main mission quest?  Sure!   Wanna go through the entire game without going on one side mission?  Sure!

 

 

Usually, I'd do about an hour to an hour and half of side quests then just to break it up, go on a main story mission.  Other times, I'd go on that game just to spin doughnuts in front of the cops.

[Han Shot First]

A-friggin'-men. This is precisely why I went from "extremely enthusiastic" to "somewhat cautious" in DAI's wake.

Exploration sounded great. The lifelong Trekker in me was entrhalled.

And then...

 

I had the same experience with DA:I.

 

I hope the devs take some of the criticism of DA:I, and the OP's post, into consideration. Story and characters have traditionally been Bioware's strong point, and that should be the focus. Don't sacrifice that for the sake of exploration. The game world (or galaxy in this case) should only be as large as the amount of meaningful or interesting content you can fill it with. Less is sometimes more! 

[Farangbaa]

I honestly can't believe people call DA:I a grind. Seriously.

Grinding is killing the same creature over and over and over again for a 0.001% chance (or less) of the drop you want... and you gotta get 3 of them.

Nowadays anything without a cutscene, apparantly, is a grind.

As for the story being locked and them 'forcing' you to do 'filler': gross exageration. You get power for basically everything. But I suppose doing anything besides main story guests is grinding too

[CptFalconPunch]

I hope it's a callback to ME1's exploration more than anything. Obviously I hope it's better crafted and implemented with greater variety. But I've been thrown off by the linearity of the sequels since the day ME2 released. I personally thought ME2's side missions were terrible from a plot and narrative standpoint. I was definitely unsatisfied. 

 

 

I like looking for relics of ancient civilizations and stumbling upon ship wreckage and skeletal remains of ill-fated explorers who had passed thru before me. I certainly don't want every little thing I do in the game to be tied back into the main story. That's an easy way to make the universe seem ridiculously small and completely break my immersion. 

 

Apart from that mission with the AI on the ship, everything else was pretty under whelming in ME2.

 

I can't exactly say why, but there was something about those side-mission in ME1, they definenetly weren't rich in content, but it certainly let my imagination do alot of work.

• The skyboxes. Come on how many times people got stuck staring at the sky?
• The local wildlife. I'll be damned if I'm the only one that though that by messing with it, they would errect a mako monument and declare it their god in the next cycle.
• The open fighting. Sniping from across mountains, cool.
• In eletania, that huge sphere was pretty damn cool. It let my imagination go wild just by a bit of text and a simple prop. Or the prothean pyramids. They didn't have a kick-ass cinematics or anything. It was just inspired.

I'm starting to realize that by giving us these "cycles" you get the impression anything you do might affect the cycle after you, and everything here is because of the cycle before. Add that to the dream of exploring space everyone has and you're done.

 

 

 

Stuff that you are hoping to find as an explorer. ME2 side-quests were mini-games. Varied sure, but not very good or enjoyable.