So do we have any details on what exactly the reforms Cassandra makes as Divine entail? Are mages allowed any time outside the circle (sort of like a supervised field trip)? Are mages still not allowed to have relationships? are their children still taken from them at birth, never to be seen by them again?
What about the Templar? are they treated better? are their moral standards for recruitment improved? are they still not allowed to befriend their charges?
We don't know yet. All we know is that Cass intends to give mages more freedom while keeping them in circles while she intends to turn the Templars into protectors of the innocent rather than mage jailers. What that means is currently unknown but considering that the Chantry still controls the Circles under Cass, I wonder how many of the bad parts will still remain. Too bad nonhumans can't be part of the Chantry if she's Divine.
A better question is why men still aren't allowed in the priesthood.
Who gives a **** about elves, qunari or dwarves.
What did you expect? Wisdom? from the False Orlesian Chantry?
What did you expect? Wisdom? from the False Orlesian Chantry?
I wouldn't expect anything good from that false and heretical Orlesian Chantry, even with Cassandra as the Divine she submit to that decaying systen of Southern Thedas Chantrty.
Probably a lot of what you are saying, and a bit more.
I imagine Mages get more personal freedoms, a greater chance to live outside of towers with supervision, treated a bit less like prisoners, and all that.
Im a mage supporter, and i think Cassandra would make a fine Divine.
I have a hard time deciding between her and a softened Leliana though. Reforms are fantastic, but there really is no substitute for freedom.
I imagine Mages get more personal freedoms, a greater chance to live outside of towers with supervision, treated a bit less like prisoners, and all that.
I think the Mages will get more than personal freedoms since Cassandra say she'll allow the Mages to govern themselves within the Circle, but with Chantry's supervision. They'll probably get more personal freedoms as well.
i just hope the Templars aren't given as much leeway with their charges as they were previously... the whole handing over a mage to someone who was likely tormented or new someone harmed by a mage, and doing so with so little restrictions on that Templar's treatment of said mage.
I think the Mages will get more than personal freedoms since Cassandra say she'll allow the Mages to govern themselves within the Circle, but with Chantry's supervision. They'll probably get more personal freedoms as well.
It seems pretty fair to me. Though, personally, i would hope that the Dalish would stop having to fear Templars trying to take or kill their mages as well.
Either way, I personally think she will be a good Divine.
Well, one way or another, mages get more "freedom" no matter what options the player chooses.
Leliana throws everything out the window and says "do what you think is best."
Cassandra says she will do reforms... how that will go, who knows? Mages have more control over the Circles? They already made their own policies, it was just the Templars encroaching on the autonomy of the Enchanters.
Vivienne is a mage who has complete control over the Circle system and the re-established Templar Order. Best option for Divine in my opinion. Cassandra should just focus on rebuilding the Seekers.
Mages could always leave the tower, if they had the permission of the First Enchanter, according to Vivienne who is a First Enchanter. Mages could have relationships, as can be seen in The Calling with the female mage flirting with Duncan, tales of the Antivan Circle, Vivienne being a mistress, and so on. It is children, families, and marriage that was restricted, unless you had special privilage or good standing like that one mage in Fereldan who had a son and granddaughter living on his property outside the Circle.
It's difficult to kill someone you are friends with, so I'd find Templars befriending mages to be difficult, unless it is between a Templar and a harrowed mage of good standing, like with Gregoir and Irving.
I think Circles would be turning into prisons again pretty soon, under Cassandra or anyone. It's Stanford Prison Experiment all over again - jailors will be drunk on power, mages would start fearing them, and so on, and so forth. Certainly, some of the mages, like Vivienne or the protagonist would be protected by Plot Armor. Others? Tranquility, Harrowing, suffering, abuse, rape, being taken away from your family, your kid being ripped apart from you and so on. Nah.
explain this stanton experimentI think Circles would be turning into prisons again pretty soon, under Cassandra or anyone. It's Stanford Prison Experiment all over again - jailors will be drunk on power, mages would start fearing them, and so on, and so forth. Certainly, some of the mages, like Vivienne or the protagonist would be protected by Plot Armor. Others? Tranquility, Harrowing, suffering, abuse, rape, being taken away from your family, your kid being ripped apart from you and so on. Nah.
I picked Cass because she's the only one who knows the Tranquil cure, the main reason I side with mages. The reforms are probably exactly what the three ladies implied they would do, Cass also says she wants to help the poor and make the chantry more welcoming
I'm not sure i see Cassandra's reforms being much (despite liking her a lot as a character. She's very much conservative and i see changes being modest. So maybe more freedom for fraternisation among mages, freedom to move between circles but not license to live outside them.
Cassandra (and Vivienne as well) will only be the Divine for so long. They might be able to make modest changes to how the Circles are governed, but unless they maintain a good support base to carry on the changes after their passing, all of them can simply be undone by the next Divine with a stroke of a pen... err.. quill.
While it might be to the lesser extent in Cassandra's case, that could very easily happen to Vivienne. Her being the first mage Divine was a game changer, but she caused a lot of ruckus, revolts, and hurt feelings when she got that job. As her Divine epilogue slide said, the new Templar Order and the changes regarding the Circles were all tied to her, and that will all be gone once she dies. I wouldn't be all that surprised if the Grand Clerics swing for a very conservative Divine the next go around to replace the controversial Vivienne and what they see as still too liberal Cassandra.
As much as Leliana seems utter crazy (to some) for ending the Circle, it gave the mages freedom that cant be simply taken away by a single person (the Divine) in the future. It also forces the mages and everyone else to the negotiation table to maintain peace in the future. It will be horribly rocky to start with, but it forces them to learn and adapt to one another. Instead of having to rely so heavily on the Chantry/Templar/Seekers to take care of all mage/magic related problems.
Im a mage supporter, and i think Cassandra would make a fine Divine.
I have a hard time deciding between her and a softened Leliana though.
Leliana goes a bit too far for my liking. In terms of ideology, sure, I agree with her -- but it seems weird that she can just make huge sweeping changes like that and get everyone to be friends without a hitch. It feels too ... fairy tale and I have trouble believing that they would really let it stick. Plus, after everything that happened to and with her, I'm not sure softening her will stick, either.
Still, as much as I love Cassandra, I don't see her as politically savvy enough to navigate the pitfalls of that job. She's thoroughly fed up even before it all begins, which is not a good sign. So I can't really say whom I like better as the next Divine. Might go with Leliana anyway, and so Cassandra remains free and can take care of the Seekers and the (ex-)templars.
A better question is why men still aren't allowed in the priesthood.
Who gives a **** about elves, qunari or dwarves.
Something tells me you'd like Tevinter.
As for the OP--I really, really doubt that whoever is chosen as Divine will have any concrete consequences on the game world. IMO, they're going to disappear/die and we'll never hear from them again.
explain this stanton experiment
http://en.wikipedia....ison_experiment
Or, rather, http://hpmor.com/chapter/60
It seems pretty fair to me. Though, personally, i would hope that the Dalish would stop having to fear Templars trying to take or kill their mages as well.
Either way, I personally think she will be a good Divine.
That's why Leliana as Divine appeals to me - the Circles are dissolved, the Templar Order is disbanded (with existing templars serving the Inquisition), the College arises to find solutions to age-old problems, and a Dalish elf (possibly even a mage) could potentially be leading the Inquisition with support from the Chantry.
The elven mages in the clans would be safe from the Chantry and the templars.
Two things bother me with having her as the Divine.
One is that, even softened, Leliana can be a bit...murder-y. I cant help but think that "Everyone should be allowed into the chantry!" can slip into "Everyone should be Andrastian!" very easily. I can see her, with the best of intentions (When the Chant spreads to the 4 corners of the earth, the Maker returns!), forcing the chantry upon everyone.
The second concern i have with her is that, while i support the idea of freedom for mages, i do think that mages need to have some kind of required education, just to keep from accidentally blowing up themselves and half of a small town.
Why do all these outcomes sound so.. fairytale like? Every choice of Divine has good outcome (in viewpoint of mages at least) with no negative consequences. Or is consequences something we will see in next game? Cause I really doubt as major changes as all of these Divines want to make can happen without major problems.
no he wouldnt... he really wouldntSomething tells me you'd like Tevinter.
As for the OP--I really, really doubt that whoever is chosen as Divine will have any concrete consequences on the game world. IMO, they're going to disappear/die and we'll never hear from them again.
In my first game Leliana makes a reform I agreed with on the face of it but the epilogue told me she killed a lot of people to make it happen. I think, given that, that I would rather have incremental reform and in that regard Cassandra might be the better choice.
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