160 réponses à ce sujet

[Rizilliant]

I seriously don't understand your complaint. You want a mature story driven RPG that has no connection to real world issues? I honestly don't know what that would even look like. 

You misunderstood my point.. I clearly said i have no issue with it. I stated that this came off as more of a politically correct checklist, so as to make sure not one single variation of the socialist, liberal party not be offended. Rather than just making an enjoyable experience in the entertainment industry (video gaming). Every single possible outcome, for every single npc available. So none have any belief, or preference. It takes away from some of the rp imo (how can one have backstory if they have no choice, preference, or say in how that particular npc romance? Can every man, woman, elf, dwarf, draenei (sorry, i meant Qunari) be they black, white, green, grey, orpink, find every single variation/combination appealing? It just cheapens the experience for me. Its as if they have no taste, or passion. Makes then come off as a cheap ****** for lack of a better word. Idk. 

 

This is a more defined explanation of my previous post. It just feels phony, and forced, rather than well written art, and story! Not sure if you too are from America, but in recent years, it has become a crime to offend someone! And thats all this feels like.. A check, for political correctness. Not, a passionately written story weve come to know, and love from Bioware!

 

Edit: Im currently Qunari Mage,specializing in Necromancy. Im pursuing  Casandra. I dont seem to have any restrictions for also comign onto every other available npc. Shouldnt one, nullify others? As a "Seeker", shouldnt she be less inclined to take on a mage? A Necromancer at that, which she clearly disapproves? As Qunari, should Dorian even consider being romantic with my guy? They have spend generations killing one another. I didnt even have to win these people over. Its just readily available, because im the Herald! It just doesnt role play very well for me whencertain situations seem they shouldnt be. Everyone is Romeo and Juliette, lmao.

[Silvarren]

You misunderstood my point.. I clearly said i have no issue with it. I stated that this came off as more of a politically correct checklist, so as to make sure not one single variation of the socialist, liberal party not be offended. Rather than just making an enjoyable experience in the entertainment industry (video gaming). Every single possible outcome, for every single npc available. So none have any belief, or preference. It takes away from some of the rp imo (how can one have backstory if they have no choice, preference, or say in how that particular npc romance? Can every man, woman, elf, dwarf, draenei (sorry, i meant Qunari) be they black, white, green, grey, orpink, find every single variation/combination appealing? It just cheapens the experience for me. Its as if they have no taste, or passion. Makes then come off as a cheap ****** for lack of a better word. Idk. 

 

You're implying that only liberal and socialists (not the same thing) get offended by political incorrectness, and that political correctness is directly related to the topic.

 

I can appreciate your view, but pretty please don't hijack this with American politics. Thank you.

 

Regarding the Romeo and Juliette thing... I feel the same way. I play a rogue, and she's the straight and narrow type. "Cassandra disapproves" is one of the most common messages I get.

 

-S

[robertthebard]

Who gives people the right to judge others outside of court? In a court room it is suppose to be a fair trial, Sera is not someone I take as giving someone the opportunity to explain themselves and then to judge them fairly.

Is this a verdict from a court, or your own opinion?

[robertthebard]

You misunderstood my point.. I clearly said i have no issue with it. I stated that this came off as more of a politically correct checklist, so as to make sure not one single variation of the socialist, liberal party not be offended. Rather than just making an enjoyable experience in the entertainment industry (video gaming). Every single possible outcome, for every single npc available. So none have any belief, or preference. It takes away from some of the rp imo (how can one have backstory if they have no choice, preference, or say in how that particular npc romance? Can every man, woman, elf, dwarf, draenei (sorry, i meant Qunari) be they black, white, green, grey, orpink, find every single variation/combination appealing? It just cheapens the experience for me. Its as if they have no taste, or passion. Makes then come off as a cheap ****** for lack of a better word. Idk. 
 
This is a more defined explanation of my previous post. It just feels phony, and forced, rather than well written art, and story! Not sure if you too are from America, but in recent years, it has become a crime to offend someone! And thats all this feels like.. A check, for political correctness. Not, a passionately written story weve come to know, and love from Bioware!
 
Edit: Im currently Qunari Mage,specializing in Necromancy. Im pursuing  Casandra. I dont seem to have any restrictions for also comign onto every other available npc. Shouldnt one, nullify others? As a "Seeker", shouldnt she be less inclined to take on a mage? A Necromancer at that, which she clearly disapproves? As Qunari, should Dorian even consider being romantic with my guy? They have spend generations killing one another. I didnt even have to win these people over. Its just readily available, because im the Herald! It just doesnt role play very well for me whencertain situations seem they shouldnt be. Everyone is Romeo and Juliette, lmao.

Considering what happens if neither Iron Bull or Dorian are romanced, no? Their countries may be at war, but that doesn't mean they are.

[Faeryia]

Definitely spoilers, with regards to romance stuff.

 

Long story short, for a quick reference, check out Game Theory's channel on Youtube regarding LGBT and video games.

 

So... I'm glad they included "straight" gay characters (haha, get it?) in the game. I actually think that's really cool. However, I object to how they're depicted. They're both effectively stereotypes, or deviant. Something similar happened in DA2. In fact, it's a trend in gaming's depiction of homosexual people in general. In mainstream video games, gay people tend to be shown to be "different," as opposed to just people who happen to be gay.

 

I play a "whatever-sexual" male elf who flirts with everyone at every opportunity, for some background...

 

Now, I haven't completed any of the romances, so this observation is just based on where I'm at in the various courtings. I'm at the point where I've got a choice to enter into a relationship between Dorian, Josephine or Cassandra. Here's what I mean about the gay relationships in Dragon Age 2 and Inquisition being wrong:

 

Let's start with Cassandra. At first, she's somewhat cold and doesn't respond to flirting well. Eventually, you need to try to woo her with gifts and doing your man-thing, trying to get the girl, so to speak. You have to "work" for her affection. You can't just say, "Hey, I like to flirt with you, and I may want to have a relationship" and have them just latch on to you.

 

Same thing with Josephine. If you want to get with her, you need to defend her life one way or another against some assassins. It takes time and effort. There's the actual building of a rapport.

 

Leiliana, a bisexual character from Dragon Age: Origins, you do something similar. You have to confront her past, protect her life, say nice things, give gifts, etc.

 

In my opinion, these are fairly well-written, in a Bioware sense. However, the gay relationships are ridiculous. Let's do a quick review of the relationships and the type of people they are:

 

Cassandra - Strong, passionate about justice, tough on the outside, soft on the inside. Romanced by treating her like a woman. Requires the protection of her life to romance.

 

Josephine - Exotic, comes from nobility, has integrity, has a little bit of a school-girlish demeanor when it comes to relationships. Requires the player to play the hero and protect her.

 

Leiliana - Again, strong, different, kind of special, secretive, talented, caring, romantic. Requires protecting her life to romance her.

 

Seeing a pattern? Ok, let's move on to my problem, finally.

 

Dorian - Quirky, sarcastic, funny, antagonistic, comes from a place most consider "evil / bad," rejects his family's intentions. Flirty. Romanced by finding out that his dad has a problem with him being gay. Mention that you think that's great in a flirty way and suddenly you're all over each other. If this happened in real life, I would be offended and completely freaked out. I just expressed attraction and then bam, mouth-rape. I felt extremely violated, even as a person who doesn't really care about gender. Immediately after discovering he's straight homosexual, starts making more sexual comments, particularly with Giselle. "You'd be surprised at the credit my tongue gets me." To his credit, when you subtly say that you're not interested, "You're brave," instead of "I think that makes you even better in my eyes," he backs off and it doesn't seem too awkward. 

 

His romance, for lack of better words, lacks both romance, sincerity and integrity. It's apparently assumed that if two gay people flirt and find out that the other is gay, that's a green light to start sucking face, which is kind of the opposite of how real relationships work in real life.

 

Sera - I like her, but she's crude, enjoys torturing (figuratively) nobility, or people that she sees as "big people." Not exactly attractive. Kind of plain, veering on ugly. (That nose, yo.) I haven't romanced her (not a female), but I can only imagine that if I was, I'd just have to say that I too have a thing for my own sex and we would just suck face.

 

Anders - A rebel mage, impulsive, mass murderer, possessed. Varric ends up saying that he wound up insane in the end. Again, deviant. Expressing mild interest results in a make-out session without engaging in a romance.

 

TL;DR - Homosexuals in these games are depicted as sexually over-eager, and they are generally "not normal," ie. excessively crude, not serious, insane / possessed. Straight characters are far more well-adjusted or normal-ish, and require actual time / effort to get with, as opposed to simply finding out that they're of the same sex and interested. 

 

-S

 

I haven't thought about it, but you're right. Although, to be fair, Anders is the same deviant mass murderer no matter what gender Hawke has, and the scene where he jumps your character plays out the same way with both male and female Hawkes. But I agree with you that it would be nice if the Dorian/MaleInquisitor relationship would have been less wham bam thank you... eh...sir, and more mature romance and lets get to know each other a little before we exchange saliva.

[10K]

Oh? The wiki appears to disagree, as do Youtube videos. Or rather, specifically, qualifying the ability to have sex with a character based on your alignment kind of sidesteps the point.

I didn't mean you must be renegade to have casual sex, or you must me paragon to advance the relationship. Casual sex is considered the renegade route and actually following her romance arc is considered the paragon route. That aside, my post was about how false your statement was. If the player follows Jack romance arc, Shepard and Jack doesn't have sex. You implied Jack is fixed by Shepard's D. which isn't true. As I stated in my OP, if the player chooses casual sex Jack is still how she was. As crazy as ever. Until ME3, which implies her students and Grissom academy helped her. If the player chooses to follow her romance arc, She softens up and through her relationship with Shepard he eventually gets her head on straight. But not because of Shepard's D. Because following her romance arc they don't have sex.

 

In the end, that scene can be widely interpreted, and wiki is just the author's interpretation. Looking at every other romance where sex is suggested, they all have the same thing in common; sex is strongly suggested. There's only two romances that indicate other wise; Jack and garrus' 

[Faeryia]

This is slightly off topic, but is it possible to flirt with Solas without playing a female elf? I know he can only be romanced by a female elf but a lot of the other characters you can flirt with even if it will never lead to anything, like Cassandra and Dorian while playing a female character. 

 

I have one of the "bad"  copies of the game so I was just curious if the no-flirt options in the dialuge with Solas while playing as a human female was just yet another bug.

[Terodil]

But I agree with you that it would be nice if the Dorian/MaleInquisitor relationship would have been less wham bam thank you... eh...sir, and more mature romance and lets get to know each other a little before we exchange saliva.

 

Bringing "maturity" into it doesn't hold water. There's nothing intrinsically more "mature" to pursuing the romantic style of courting, neither is it more "mature" to take a more direct route. They are different tastes/styles, that is all. Some people like it, some people don't, but I find it slightly disingenous to berate the writers for bad writing / stereotyping simply because it does not match your personal taste.

[In Exile]

See? And if Alistair has chosen something a little less phallic (like a metal fence, perhaps?), I wouldn't have had a momentary, glitched ping on my 'dar.

At the very least if my option wasn't to ask him if he was a virgin which triggered the whole conversation. I dont know about everyone else but I tend not to have conversations about virginity and licking phallic objects with just anyone.

[Faeryia]

Bringing "maturity" into it doesn't hold water. There's nothing intrinsically more "mature" to pursuing the romantic style of courting, neither is it more "mature" to take a more direct route. They are different tastes/styles, that is all. Some people like it, some people don't, but I find it slightly disingenous to berate the writers for bad writing / stereotyping simply because it does not match your personal taste.

 

I didn't mean this as critisism towards the writers. I don't think the romances are badly written... and as far as I recall I never stated in my post anything about the quality of the romances. I just wish that there were a couple of more scenes between Dorian and the male Inquisitor before tongues got involved.

 

It looks to me that you think pursuing a romantic style of courting is just as mature as taking a more direct route is? Which  you, of course, is free to do. Your view on romance and sex is your own business and no one elses. Thank you for sharing though.

 

The reason I used the word 'mature' is because that is the word Bioware itself has used to describe the romances in DA I. And when I think of a mature romance it involves getting to know a romance option on a deeper level before jumping them.

[Terodil]

Sorry, I didn't mean to suggest you intended criticism towards the writers. If you misunderstood it as such, the blame is on me. I was referring to some others in this thread who did, including the thread starter. I respect their personal taste and opinion, I just don't think it's fair to call stuff "unrealistic" or "immature" for the singular reason that it doesn't match your preferences.

 

On "maturity", I think we'll simply have to disagree. Speaking in extremes, I don't think that somebody who is interested in one-night-stands is any more or less mature, again simply by that preference, than somebody who pursues a life-long romance (although one could argue that the former is not really a romance at all in the sense of a romantic relationship.) This assessment comes dangerously close to a morality statement for me, which I really don't think any of us has any business to make.

 

Given how far BW have distanced themselves from bringing morality into relationship preferences, I really doubt that "mature" refers to the question of "long courtship" vs. "short courtship before first kiss". Come to think of it though, I don't really know what exactly they mean by 'mature'. It can't be the age of the people involved -- maybe it's just that they don't have a 'press F to kiss now' button. What do I know.

[Faeryia]

Sorry, I didn't mean to suggest you intended criticism towards the writers. If you misunderstood it as such, the blame is on me. I was referring to some others in this thread who did, including the thread starter. I respect their personal taste and opinion, I just don't think it's fair to call stuff "unrealistic" or "immature" for the singular reason that it doesn't match your preferences.

 

On "maturity", I think we'll simply have to disagree. Speaking in extremes, I don't think that somebody who is interested in one-night-stands is any more or less mature, again simply by that preference, than somebody who pursues a life-long romance (although one could argue that the former is not really a romance at all in the sense of a romantic relationship.) This assessment comes dangerously close to a morality statement for me, which I really don't think any of us has any business to make.

 

Given how far BW have distanced themselves from bringing morality into relationships, I really doubt that "mature" refers to the question of "long courtship" vs. "short courtship before first kiss". Come to think of it though, I don't really know what exactly they mean by 'mature'. It can't be the age of the people involved -- maybe it's just that they don't have a 'press F to kiss now' button. What do I know.

 

So you writing: " I find it slightly disingenous to berate the writers for bad writing / stereotyping simply because it does not match your personal taste." in a post containing a quote from my post doesn't imply that you thought that I was saying that the writers had done a bad job? I guess my English is worse than I thought.

 

As for taking a moral stance, I'm pretty sure I didn't. But again, English isn't my first langauge and if I somehow managed to state in my post that a one night stand or any kind of romantic relationship between two consenting adults is somehow immoral then I apologise. 

 

Again, my use of the word 'mature' was based on the fact that that is how BioWare described the romances in DA I, and on my own view that a mature relationship involves a deeper connection than what I took it had been established between Dorian/MInquisitor. This doesn't mean that I think either Dorian or MInquisitor are immoral in any way.

[Terodil]

I quoted you because you brought maturity into the discussion, and that was the main object in that particular post of mine (as somewhat evidenced by the order of my comments). Once more, apologies for allowing this to be misunderstood. Can we move on now? Or do you intend to insist on feeling offended?

[Silvarren]

I didn't mean this as critisism towards the writers. I don't think the romances are badly written... and as far as I recall I never stated in my post anything about the quality of the romances. I just wish that there were a couple of more scenes between Dorian and the male Inquisitor before tongues got involved.

 

It looks to me that you think pursuing a romantic style of courting is just as mature as taking a more direct route is? Which  you, of course, is free to do. Your view on romance and sex is your own business and no one elses. Thank you for sharing though.

 

Pretty much this. It's just my own personal preference and took me by surprise, and made me question why, without any foreknowledge of Dorian's casualness, my Inquisitor decided that that particular moment was a good time to swap saliva. I'm sure that if my Inquisitor had known that there Dorian's romantic style was more one night-standy that it wouldn't have stuck out so much to me.

 

Also, something else that may have contributed to that perception is that right before that scene (the dad quest) was when you asked him about whether or not he had a thing for Felix, he was all, 'No, I would never take advantage of my sponsor's son as his ward." That made me think that he had more integrity and a sense of... Hm... I'd say honor, but that's not quite right, and not scruples necessarily, but it just made me think that his boundary was in a different place than it was, apparently. 

 

-S

[robertthebard]

Pretty much this. It's just my own personal preference and took me by surprise, and made me question why, without any foreknowledge of Dorian's casualness, my Inquisitor decided that that particular moment was a good time to swap saliva. I'm sure that if my Inquisitor had known that there Dorian's romantic style was more one night-standy that it wouldn't have stuck out so much to me.
 
Also, something else that may have contributed to that perception is that right before that scene (the dad quest) was when you asked him about whether or not he had a thing for Felix, he was all, 'No, I would never take advantage of my sponsor's son as his ward." That made me think that he had more integrity and a sense of... Hm... I'd say honor, but that's not quite right, and not scruples necessarily, but it just made me think that his boundary was in a different place than it was, apparently. 
 
-S

Sorry, but this keeps bugging me, and I have to ask: Realistic according to what? I'll admit, as a heterosexual male, I have no idea how homosexual relationships work. I am, however, guilty of making the assumption that, people being people, they don't play out any differently from what I'm used to, barring gender of the participants. That said, I have seen relationships start over less, and relationships that never happened despite being more involved.

I guess what's bothering me most here is that deliberately choosing flirt options in a scenario where that's the only way to start a relationship seems to me like it would indicate that I'm trying to start a relationship. I have played this quest line with Dorian as a heterosexual male PC romancing Cassandra, and at no point did he seem to be overtly trying to come on to me. I, of course, did skip all the flirt options, since I wasn't looking to start a relationship. I then had the Mother Giselle dialog, but it was my Inquisitor that called her on it, not Dorian, despite there being no real relationship other than friends to talk about. He and IB then went on to have their thing, which came out in party banter as we progressed through the game. I'm just struggling with the concept of what's not realistic?

What was it, for example, that you thought would happen by choosing most or all of the flirt options in dialog with him? This is, at the end of the day, a video game, and there aren't any other indicators to starting a relationship. From the OP, I thought he pulled an Anders on you, and went all "hey, you're being nice to me, you must be interested". In subsequent posts, I came to realize that this wasn't the case. I'm just trying to figure out what wasn't realistic about the PC and Dorian expecting your intentions to be anything other than a relationship, when the flirt options are the only way we have to express interest.

Sorry if this seems redundant, but it's quite confusing when one considers that, in the medium we're offered, this is the only way to express interest in a relationship.

[Ryzaki]

I haven't thought about it, but you're right. Although, to be fair, Anders is the same deviant mass murderer no matter what gender Hawke has, and the scene where he jumps your character plays out the same way with both male and female Hawkes. But I agree with you that it would be nice if the Dorian/MaleInquisitor relationship would have been less wham bam thank you... eh...sir, and more mature romance and lets get to know each other a little before we exchange saliva.

 

No it doesn't.

 

Males get an option to stop him right before he pounces on you.

 

Females...don't.

[Faeryia]

I quoted you because you brought maturity into the discussion, and that was the main object in that particular post of mine (as somewhat evidenced by the order of my comments). Once more, apologies for allowing this to be misunderstood. Can we move on now? Or do you intend to insist on feeling offended?

 

Sorry, I didn't mean to be a turd. I had a rotten day at work and then came home to absolute chaos and I took my bottled up irritation out on you. It was very unfair of me and I apologise. 

[Faeryia]

No it doesn't.

 

Males get an option to stop him right before he pounces on you.

 

Females...don't.

 

Ahh... Okay... I don't remember having the option when I played as a male, but it was a while a go so you're probably right. Sorry.

[Ryzaki]

Ahh... Okay... I don't remember having the option when I played as a male, but it was a while a go so you're probably right. Sorry.

 

XD I only remember because I lmao when I picked an option and Hawke didn't even say anything Anders just pounced. It was like the dialogue choice had me hitting the play button.

[Silvarren]

Sorry, but this keeps bugging me, and I have to ask: Realistic according to what? I'll admit, as a heterosexual male, I have no idea how homosexual relationships work. I am, however, guilty of making the assumption that, people being people, they don't play out any differently from what I'm used to, barring gender of the participants. That said, I have seen relationships start over less, and relationships that never happened despite being more involved.

I guess what's bothering me most here is that deliberately choosing flirt options in a scenario where that's the only way to start a relationship seems to me like it would indicate that I'm trying to start a relationship. I have played this quest line with Dorian as a heterosexual male PC romancing Cassandra, and at no point did he seem to be overtly trying to come on to me. I, of course, did skip all the flirt options, since I wasn't looking to start a relationship. I then had the Mother Giselle dialog, but it was my Inquisitor that called her on it, not Dorian, despite there being no real relationship other than friends to talk about. He and IB then went on to have their thing, which came out in party banter as we progressed through the game. I'm just struggling with the concept of what's not realistic?

What was it, for example, that you thought would happen by choosing most or all of the flirt options in dialog with him? This is, at the end of the day, a video game, and there aren't any other indicators to starting a relationship. From the OP, I thought he pulled an Anders on you, and went all "hey, you're being nice to me, you must be interested". In subsequent posts, I came to realize that this wasn't the case. I'm just trying to figure out what wasn't realistic about the PC and Dorian expecting your intentions to be anything other than a relationship, when the flirt options are the only way we have to express interest.

Sorry if this seems redundant, but it's quite confusing when one considers that, in the medium we're offered, this is the only way to express interest in a relationship.

 

Let's say in this case that "realism" is subjective, due to differences in people. What I'm pointing out though, is that just because I flirt with someone doesn't mean I want to make out with them. If I'm in a relationship with them, woohoo, it's go time, and that's pretty understandable. If Dorian was female (even with a personality like Dorian's, like Isabela. Kind of.) I would think my Inquisitor was just as creepy in that particular situation. But that's not what the writers chose to do between the Inquisitor and Dorian. They specifically chose that relationship to do that with.

 

The funny thing is that I was cool with it when I came on to Anders, or vice versa, because I didn't get the creepy vibe. Maybe it's because I wasn't a wispy elf or something. I just don't like the apparent assumption that my flirting (or indicating that I wanted a romance, for that matter) meant that I wanted to jump them right there. My Inquisitor is a rogue, but not that kind of rogue. If the kiss had literally waited 2 minutes until I got the option to choose to do that, that would have been fine to me. Or hell, just have some option like "Kiss him, you fool." I guess I need my romance options spelled out for me. I blame the quest indicator epidemic that pervades games nowadays. xD

 

-S

[robertthebard]

Let's say in this case that "realism" is subjective, due to differences in people. What I'm pointing out though, is that just because I flirt with someone doesn't mean I want to make out with them. If I'm in a relationship with them, woohoo, it's go time, and that's pretty understandable. If Dorian was female (even with a personality like Dorian's, like Isabela. Kind of.) I would think my Inquisitor was just as creepy in that particular situation. But that's not what the writers chose to do between the Inquisitor and Dorian. They specifically chose that relationship to do that with.
 
The funny thing is that I was cool with it when I came on to Anders, or vice versa, because I didn't get the creepy vibe. Maybe it's because I wasn't a wispy elf or something. I just don't like the apparent assumption that my flirting (or indicating that I wanted a romance, for that matter) meant that I wanted to jump them right there. My Inquisitor is a rogue, but not that kind of rogue. If the kiss had literally waited 2 minutes until I got the option to choose to do that, that would have been fine to me. Or hell, just have some option like "Kiss him, you fool." I guess I need my romance options spelled out for me. I blame the quest indicator epidemic that pervades games nowadays. xD
 
-S

I can kind of understand that, and thanks for answering. I suppose that another way to look at that particular scene might be more of a comforting kiss. I haven't watched the videos, and won't engage in the relationship to know, but from the friendship path, that does seem to be a possible scenario. It shows him what he needs to see, after all, a measure of acceptance, and an acknowledgment that you're interested. Perception is reality in these cases, so I can't say for sure, but perhaps that was more the intent?

[Elsariel]

I can kind of understand that, and thanks for answering. I suppose that another way to look at that particular scene might be more of a comforting kiss. I haven't watched the videos, and won't engage in the relationship to know, but from the friendship path, that does seem to be a possible scenario. It shows him what he needs to see, after all, a measure of acceptance, and an acknowledgment that you're interested. Perception is reality in these cases, so I can't say for sure, but perhaps that was more the intent?

That was some comfort kiss!

I think this conversation just shows how quickly or slowly people may warm up to intimacy.

[DarkAmaranth1966]

This thread sounds like my family.

 

Me: It's just a kiss and dating, you aren't sleeping with him yet - relax.

Sis: OMG They Kissed, they're gonna get AIDS (Or make babies depending on genders.)

Dad: It's a make believe game, it doesn't have to be realistic.

[robertthebard]

That was some comfort kiss!

I think this conversation just shows how quickly or slowly people may warm up to intimacy.

I haven't seen it, would it make a 51 year old biker that used to bounce at a strip club blush?

[Octarin]

Definitely spoilers, with regards to romance stuff.

 

Long story short, for a quick reference, check out Game Theory's channel on Youtube regarding LGBT and video games.

 

So... I'm glad they included "straight" gay characters (haha, get it?) in the game. I actually think that's really cool. However, I object to how they're depicted. They're both effectively stereotypes, or deviant. Something similar happened in DA2. In fact, it's a trend in gaming's depiction of homosexual people in general. In mainstream video games, gay people tend to be shown to be "different," as opposed to just people who happen to be gay.

 

I play a "whatever-sexual" male elf who flirts with everyone at every opportunity, for some background...

 

Now, I haven't completed any of the romances, so this observation is just based on where I'm at in the various courtings. I'm at the point where I've got a choice to enter into a relationship between Dorian, Josephine or Cassandra. Here's what I mean about the gay relationships in Dragon Age 2 and Inquisition being wrong:

 

Let's start with Cassandra. At first, she's somewhat cold and doesn't respond to flirting well. Eventually, you need to try to woo her with gifts and doing your man-thing, trying to get the girl, so to speak. You have to "work" for her affection. You can't just say, "Hey, I like to flirt with you, and I may want to have a relationship" and have them just latch on to you.

 

Same thing with Josephine. If you want to get with her, you need to defend her life one way or another against some assassins. It takes time and effort. There's the actual building of a rapport.

 

Leiliana, a bisexual character from Dragon Age: Origins, you do something similar. You have to confront her past, protect her life, say nice things, give gifts, etc.

 

In my opinion, these are fairly well-written, in a Bioware sense. However, the gay relationships are ridiculous. Let's do a quick review of the relationships and the type of people they are:

 

Cassandra - Strong, passionate about justice, tough on the outside, soft on the inside. Romanced by treating her like a woman. Requires the protection of her life to romance.

 

Josephine - Exotic, comes from nobility, has integrity, has a little bit of a school-girlish demeanor when it comes to relationships. Requires the player to play the hero and protect her.

 

Leiliana - Again, strong, different, kind of special, secretive, talented, caring, romantic. Requires protecting her life to romance her.

 

Seeing a pattern? Ok, let's move on to my problem, finally.

 

Dorian - Quirky, sarcastic, funny, antagonistic, comes from a place most consider "evil / bad," rejects his family's intentions. Flirty. Romanced by finding out that his dad has a problem with him being gay. Mention that you think that's great in a flirty way and suddenly you're all over each other. If this happened in real life, I would be offended and completely freaked out. I just expressed attraction and then bam, mouth-rape. I felt extremely violated, even as a person who doesn't really care about gender. Immediately after discovering he's straight homosexual, starts making more sexual comments, particularly with Giselle. "You'd be surprised at the credit my tongue gets me." To his credit, when you subtly say that you're not interested, "You're brave," instead of "I think that makes you even better in my eyes," he backs off and it doesn't seem too awkward. 

 

His romance, for lack of better words, lacks both romance, sincerity and integrity. It's apparently assumed that if two gay people flirt and find out that the other is gay, that's a green light to start sucking face, which is kind of the opposite of how real relationships work in real life.

 

Sera - I like her, but she's crude, enjoys torturing (figuratively) nobility, or people that she sees as "big people." Not exactly attractive. Kind of plain, veering on ugly. (That nose, yo.) I haven't romanced her (not a female), but I can only imagine that if I was, I'd just have to say that I too have a thing for my own sex and we would just suck face.

 

Anders - A rebel mage, impulsive, mass murderer, possessed. Varric ends up saying that he wound up insane in the end. Again, deviant. Expressing mild interest results in a make-out session without engaging in a romance.

 

TL;DR - Homosexuals in these games are depicted as sexually over-eager, and they are generally "not normal," ie. excessively crude, not serious, insane / possessed. Straight characters are far more well-adjusted or normal-ish, and require actual time / effort to get with, as opposed to simply finding out that they're of the same sex and interested. 

 

-S

 

I guess you missed my post about how the story writers quite probably just took all of their grad students' experimental plot beats and put them together loosely to form a 200+ hours gameplay. You talk about stereotypes? These are the straight and gay stereotypes of 15 year olds, cause that's where the game's address to. It's a PG13, all expectations of actual adult behaviour can be left at the door.