25 réponses à ce sujet

[GilgameshX]

I've been fooling around with having one on my team and not. And in the end it comes to having more dps and less survivability or having less dps and more survivability. I'm playing on hard so I just wonder if I'm not that good or something. My main is a dd tempest.

[Chadwin]

Tempest has enough surviviability on its own.

[sethroskull79]

I ran with Solas and Dorian yesterday.  Solas for damage though he does have barrier, and Dorian who has barrier but also some offensive spells.  Cassandra and My character who is a 2H Champion.  The results have been really good.  

[JosieJ]

People have soloed the game as non-mages, so it's not necessary by any means. If you have a good tank on your team and make good use of stealth on your character, I could see you getting along without it just fine. And,of course, the faster you tear down enemies, the less you'll need any defensive skills.

[sethroskull79]

Yeah if Solas gets the Pull of the Abyss + Firemine on a mob, the fight is over before I retake control with my main.  Bosses have been tougher for me.  They are still challenging fights for me on hard.  Mobs not so much.

[Rolenka]

I have sort of assumed a good strategy would be to get barrier and all its passives, then build out the rest of the abilities.

 

I'm playing a mage, but I like having another along to help out.

[Sidney]

I don't have it specced on my current mage and usually don't have more than 1 mage running along so I am a barrier-less party. Crafted materials with guard on hit and enough aggro to the Warriors and functionally nothing really bothers the mage.

[Gigamantis]

Most people here will tell you that once you get your tier3 masterwork weapon schematics you can solo faceroll everything on Nightmare naked in under 3 seconds, so it doesn't matter what you do. 

 

The truth for 99% of the game, however is that running with Barrier is more effective than going without it.  You're giving up a TON of survivability for a moderate damage increase. 

 

If you heavily dislike or are morally opposed to barrier for some reason, though, you can definitely get through the game without it. 

[actionhero112]

Yes have barrier. Not taking damage for a few seconds means a lot.

 

Why would you not have barrier on one mage in your party? That epic mage damage? ha.

[themageguy]

I find even one point in barrier is useful.

Especially if you have a party full of melee attackers, and to help mitigate damage against those damn enemy archers

[Arvaarad]

Why would you not have barrier on one mage in your party? That epic mage damage? ha.

To leave more slots for crowd control? If the mage CCs all the enemies, those enemies aren't dealing damage. Avoiding damage is just as good as eating it with a barrier - often, it's better, because damage can come with other unpleasant effects like stun, knockdown, or poison.

[actionhero112]

To leave more slots for crowd control? If the mage CCs all the enemies, those enemies aren't dealing damage. Avoiding damage is just as good as eating it with a barrier - often, it's better, because damage can come with other unpleasant effects like stun, knockdown, or poison.

And if your party is dead and riddled with arrows, their dps immediately drops to 0. Barrier is the best way to avoid the most potent and lasting status infliction your enemy can inflict, which is death.

 

I'm no doctor, but I can recommend you avoid death whenever possible.

 

And please don't pretend you need all 8 slots for crowd control. That's even more disingenuous than pretending you need all 8 slots for damage.

 

Use protection kids, choose barrier. 

[goofyomnivore]

I think it is only worth it on one mage. The other mage in your group is way better off going full damage. I can't think of an instance post-Skyhold where double barrier was needed. Maybe if you are fighting level 20 dragons at level 12.

[Sidney]

And if your party is dead and riddled with arrows, their dps immediately drops to 0. Barrier is the best way to avoid the most potent and lasting status infliction your enemy can inflict, which is death.
 
I'm no doctor, but I can recommend you avoid death whenever possible.
 
And please don't pretend you need all 8 slots for crowd control. That's even more disingenuous than pretending you need all 8 slots for damage.
 
Use protection kids, choose barrier.

barrier is problematic because it evaporates and it is range limited. It isn't a great protection spell overall. It helps early on because you have to have it but by mid game between armor, guard and all kinds of ways to direct and deflect aggro your softies shouldn't be getting attacked on a regular basis anymore.

[GilgameshX]

Just wondering, barrier mages only have the one point in barrier right?

[actionhero112]

barrier is problematic because it evaporates and it is range limited. It isn't a great protection spell overall. It helps early on because you have to have it but by mid game between armor, guard and all kinds of ways to direct and deflect aggro your softies shouldn't be getting attacked on a regular basis anymore.

On nightmare guard on anything other than heavy armor blows, it basically is destroyed by a slight wind. Guard in general blows, it's low quantity (You'll be lucky to get over 400-500 on a TANK) and is removed easily. To sustain it, you have to be taking such low damage that it's irrelevant anyways. Barrier is everything. 

 

Because you can't be spamming counterstrike every battle, there is no way to guarentee you won't take aggro from the various archer and red templar knights and abominations throughout the game, that will chunk and even kill you if you don't have barrier. 

 

It allows you to stay in melee range of dragons, even if you don't have an active block. 

 

You can do anything on hard and normal and be fine and to an extent, that rule also applies to nightmare as well.

 

But to people struggling with the game, do you really think the best advice is to forgo their main damage mitigation on harder difficulties? Especially when the spell is so easy to obtain.

 

Probably not.

[Rynas]

Barrier + Heal X% of damage taken can get you some pretty hefty healing on Nightmare.  Not nearly as effective with guard because of the armor reduction, plus the fact that max guard is so low.

 

As a rogue or mage, having a party member with Barrier can be nice because it lets you spend less time protecting yourself and more time doing damage.  As a tank, it's good because it can provide a lot of free healing.  The question is if it's worth giving up a companion's slot that could be used for something else.  Imo it's pretty good for Solas.  He basically has unlimited mana, and it helps reduce cooldowns on Fire Mine/Pull of the Asskicking.

[GilgameshX]

A barrier mage is a mage with JUST barrier right? Or does the mage have other skills to?

[Navasha]

Well, to me, having the guardian spirit passive is awesome for a mage.   Keeps you from getting one shotted by a cloaked assassin.   Since you have to have barrier to get it.... its worth it enough to have it on your bar as well.   I would skip almost everything else in that tree though.  

[Gaz83]

I run with a mage for the banter, rather than the barrier (although it does help).

 

If it's a choice between damage and defence, I'll always go for damage. You have plenty of potions, and re-fills are usually a fast travel away. 

[Kulyok]

I usually give Solas full Barrier tree(except for revive/dispel branches), and just give my main mage one basic barrier. Then have Solas use barrier on cooldown as preferred spell. Myself, I prefer lightning, but I use a barrier or two when needed - on cooldown if things are bad.

 

It's important on nightmare, especially if you're closing level 12 rifts around level 9-10. On casual, though... well, unless you're doing a dragon two levels higher than you with an all-rogue party with grey equipment, no, you don't really need it. 

[Sidney]

On nightmare guard on anything other than heavy armor blows, it basically is destroyed by a slight wind. Guard in general blows, it's low quantity (You'll be lucky to get over 400-500 on a TANK) and is removed easily. To sustain it, you have to be taking such low damage that it's irrelevant anyways. Barrier is everything. 

 

Because you can't be spamming counterstrike every battle, there is no way to guarentee you won't take aggro from the various archer and red templar knights and abominations throughout the game, that will chunk and even kill you if you don't have barrier. 

 

It allows you to stay in melee range of dragons, even if you don't have an active block. 

 

You can do anything on hard and normal and be fine and to an extent, that rule also applies to nightmare as well.

 

But to people struggling with the game, do you really think the best advice is to forgo their main damage mitigation on harder difficulties? Especially when the spell is so easy to obtain.

 

Probably not.

 

 

Nightmare frankly I don't care that level is usually so whacked out on Bioware games it has it's own levels. I play on Hard and Barrier is not essential after a certain point.

[teks]

On nightmare guard on anything other than heavy armor blows, it basically is destroyed by a slight wind. Guard in general blows, it's low quantity (You'll be lucky to get over 400-500 on a TANK) and is removed easily. To sustain it, you have to be taking such low damage that it's irrelevant anyways. Barrier is everything.

Because you can't be spamming counterstrike every battle, there is no way to guarentee you won't take aggro from the various archer and red templar knights and abominations throughout the game, that will chunk and even kill you if you don't have barrier.

It allows you to stay in melee range of dragons, even if you don't have an active block.

You can do anything on hard and normal and be fine and to an extent, that rule also applies to nightmare as well.

But to people struggling with the game, do you really think the best advice is to forgo their main damage mitigation on harder difficulties? Especially when the spell is so easy to obtain.

Probably not.

turn the bolt, turn the blade. What arrows?
With the dr on a warrior, guard is ridiculous. If you want unlimited guard always. Masterwork unbowed on hit. If you want guard without killing dps, charging bull.
Its 25% of your base health presented as a regenerating bar of badass. There is nothing which will make that not awesome.

[Isgard]

A barrier mage is a mage with JUST barrier right? Or does the mage have other skills to?

Almost - on Nightmare i use a Knight-Enchanter/Vivienne with Barrier, Dispel and Winters Grasp for cc

As i play with Friendly Fire button set most of the skills of the mage become useless anyway

But ever with just 3 skills i find the Barrier-mage extremly usefull. The tank and the mage do all the defensive so that the other 2 can go offensive all out.

And if you still lack damage take Sera with you. With the bow she is THE damage dealer. Deactivate all skills exept Flask of Lightning.

[RLDragon]

Have been running a Rift Mage with Fade Step instead of barrier.  It takes no mana and has a 12 second cooldown as opposed to the 24 second cool down on Barrier.  Using Clean Burn to lower cooldowns I pretty much have Fade Step available any time.  If I am being attacked I Fade Step away and have the rest of my party concentrate on the mob that is on me.  I also have three CC's in the Rift Mage line.