326 réponses à ce sujet

[Lady Artifice]

  Joining don't make you grey warden as i said grey wardens are an organization and you can just leave see you aren't grey warden if you don't want to be grey warden taint ofc stays but you don't belong to organization finito.

 

Your claims are just ridiculous as HoF had nothing to do with grey warden order he was in practice tainted individual so i don't see point of future discussion if you ignore fact that some kind ritual don't make you member of organization if you don't want to...

 

 

No you aren't you can say pretty much you don't give fops about grey wardens and have own intrest why want stop blight.The warden is tainted individual and don't rly have any connection to grey warden order he decides wheter if he helps peoples or not pretty much even in da 2 it is said order didn't liked the warden way of acting during blight as it was against grey warden policy don't involve.

 

1. There is more than one type of tainted individual. One of them becomes a Darkspawn.

 

Another of them is a specialized sort of ghoul for whom the process of being physically overtaken by the taint is delayed. This type is called a Grey Warden (the tainted individual), and only those who are recruited/conscripted into the Grey Wardens (the organization) go through this process. 

 

As far as Thedosian culture is concerned, the word applies to both.

 

2. If the Wardens want you, and you refuse, they simply conscript you. You might choose to disregard this fact, but as far as the rest of Thedas is concerned? You're a Grey Warden, like it or not. Your headcanon to the contrary, and dismissal of the actual lore as "ridiculous", is just not going to change that. 

[TheKomandorShepard]

Yet you still end up doing GW busywork and can even die like a GW by killing the Archdemon. And if you live and don't manage to cure the taint, you will die a GW death.

So does that mean leliana or morrigan are grey wardens because they went on quest to stop blight with you?Same with the warden.

This is ridiculous you don't die a GW death unless you are talking about going on deep roads and doing grey warden ritual killing as many darkspawn as you can.

Sure taint eventually into ghoul but in fact nothing would prevent you from becoming merchant and living normal life until taint will become problem you don't have to have any ties with order as long you can deal with that they won't be pleased.

 

 

1. There is more than one type of tainted individual. One of them becomes a Darkspawn.

 

Another of them is a specialized sort of ghoul for whom the process of being physically overtaken by the taint is delayed. This type is called a Grey Warden (the tainted individual), and only those who are recruited/conscripted into the Grey Wardens (the organization) go through this process. 

 

As far as Thedosian culture is concerned, the word applies to both.

 

2. If the Wardens want you, and you refuse, they simply conscript you. You might choose to disregard this fact, but as far as the rest of Thedas is concerned? You're a Grey Warden, like it or not. You're headcanon to the contrary, and dismissal of the actual lore as "ridiculous", is just not going to change that. 

Grey wardens are an organization you don't have to belong to them even if you are tainted and went trough joining.

 

 

As i said this is hilarious how peoples have no sense individuality and think that after joining you are "i love grey wardens i will serve them they are my masters i will kill myself for them" even if you are forced and go through joining you can pretty much tell order to screw themselves and as long you can deal with order that won't be glad you will be fine as pretty much example i can point anders (who pretty much did what i have said) and hell even the warden can say they go their own way in epilogue.

[SporkFu]

The Elves are still waiting for their promised liberation, for one. (I was actually responding to your claims that they were held in high regard everywhere, but fine )

Okay that's cool, but them waiting for their promised liberation didn't stop them from honoring the treaty and committing to the war effort... uhh, unless you sided with the werewolves, that is. Also if you play a dalish warden, the elves of Merrill's clan do seem to hold the wardens in high regard. At least, they show Duncan a lot of respect. 

[Hazegurl]

So does that mean leliana or morrigan are grey wardens because they went on quest to stop blight with you?Same with the warden.

This is ridiculous you don't die a GW death unless you talk about going on deep roads and doing grey warden ritual killing as many darkspawn as you can.

Sure taint eventually into ghoul but in fact nothing would prevent you from becoming merchant and living normal life until taint will become problem you don't have to have any ties.

and I'm done. Good night.

[I SOLD MY SOUL TO BIOWARE]

"You are called upon to serve. From this moment forward, you are a Grey Warden."

 

The Warden was a Warden (no, really?) whether you like it or not. Kinda explains why they get made Warden-Commander of Ferelden and serve as such for years if they survive, y'know...

[TheKomandorShepard]

and I'm done. Good night.

Yes all you could do is how put this that picture as you done dumb thing i already explained why you don't need to be grey warden after joining.

 

 

"You are called upon to serve. From this moment forward, you are a Grey Warden."

 

The Warden was a Warden (no, really?) whether you like it or not. Kinda explains why they get made Warden-Commander of Ferelden and serve as such for years if they survive, y'know...

Aren't those duncan words that can pretty much wamt force you into joining and into being in his organisation?

 

Let me ask you something if bunch of thugs grabs me on the street and and say "from this moment forward you are member of our gang" does that mean im member of their gang because they said so?

 

Also from what i remember you can say you go your own way in epilogue (sadly they ignored that in daa) and in daa there is dialogue option that says you are only temporarily with wardens.

[Wolfen09]

Yes all you could do is how put this that picture as you done dumb thing i already explained why you don't need to be grey warden after joining.

 

 

Aren't that words of duncan that can pretty much force you into joining and into being in his organisation?

 

Let me ask you something if buch of thugs grabs me on the street and and say "from this moment forward you are member of our gang" does that mean im member of their gang because they said so?

 

Also from what i remember you can say you go your own way in epilogue (sadly they ignored that in daa) and in daa there is dialogue option that says you are only temporarily with wardens.

 

since when have the epilogues in origins been real... anyway, you make a sound argument with the thug thing... however bioware has retconned your warden into being a warden if they survived via the dark ritual... the only thing you can claim is that a warden who died in origins could technically claim that they werent a warden, that is all... but the fact still remains that bioware has the rest of the world still acknowledge him/her as a grey warden.  just like how you can hate the herald of andraste title but people still call you it in inquisition...  bioware calls him a warden, then hes a warden, even against the maker's will... 

[Augustei]

*snip*

Nay.
I might entertain this idea if those idiot surfacers actually did anything about the darkspawn when theres not a blight, you know where the darkspawn are pressing Orzammar further and further into extinction? The Grey Wardens mighten be much but having those battle hardened soldiers serve a year in the Orzammar army before going off into the deep roads to die like they do is better than the nothing that would come with their orders extinction.

The surfacers do absolutely nothing about Darkspawn unless they come to the surface or during a blight

[I SOLD MY SOUL TO BIOWARE]

 

Aren't that words of duncan that can pretty much force you into joining and into being in his organisation?

 

Let me ask you something if buch of thugs grabs me on the street and and say "from this moment forward you are member of our gang" does that mean im member of their gang because they said so?

 

The Warden could have booked it into the wilderness at any time (unless they're Dalish that is, which is basically a case of 'join or die a slow, painful death from blight sickness.')  if he/she hated the idea enough to make that comparison. They didn't. 

 

Also from what i remember you can say you go your own way in epilogue (sadly they ignored that in daa) and in daa there is dialogue option that says you are only temporarily with wardens.

 

DA:I's codex on the HoF says they 'served with honour until his/her disappearance several years later.' 

 

So no. 

[Wolfen09]

Nay.
I might entertain this idea if those idiot surfacers actually did anything about the darkspawn when theres not a blight, you know where the darkspawn are pressing Orzammar further and further into extinction? The Grey Wardens mighten be much but having those battle hardened soldiers serve a year in the Orzammar army before going off into the deep roads to die like they do is better than the nothing that would come with their orders extinction.
 

 

maybe not necessarily a year, but the wardens do go to orzammar if they can for their calling and are given a funeral sort of like the legion of the dead and sent off with legion of the dead for their calling... usually... im sure there are plenty of wardens who just go down the first hole they see and die... but it was referenced in origins as well as inquisition that they do this

[Gallimatia]

"Alistair is the real Warden here not me." -The Warden

"Here's my decision then. I'm no longer a Grey Warden. I'm leaving." - Alistair

 

Alistair unlike the Warden stay true to his word.

[Augustei]

maybe not necessarily a year, but the wardens do go to orzammar if they can for their calling and are given a funeral sort of like the legion of the dead and sent off with legion of the dead for their calling... usually... im sure there are plenty of wardens who just go down the first hole they see and die... but it was referenced in origins as well as inquisition that they do this

"When the time of a Grey Warden's Calling draws near, a Warden honors a longstanding agreement between the Wardens and the dwarves and serves a year fighting darkspawn in the Deep Roads at the side of the dwarves." - World of Thedas page 152

[GenericEnemy]

lol this is an argument? We're called 'The Warden' for a reason. 

[Wolfen09]

alistair would have to have been a warden to begin with..... joking aside, anders is the same way... but in all technicality anders is being hunted for deserting the order, and it may not say it, but i wouldnt be surprised if alistair was being hunted as well.  you can leave on a journey like our hof does (i assume he got permission first), but if you leave the order, you will be hunted and if not captured, killed.  you go awol in real military, its the same way... you will be stripped of your rank and sent to prison in real life, but i assume the wardens would kill you if they couldnt capture you..

[Augustei]

Let me ask you something if bunch of thugs grabs me on the street and and say "from this moment forward you are member of our gang" does that mean im member of their gang because they said so?

If the state says those thugs have the legal right to press you into their service than yes, yes you are.

[Lady Artifice]

 

Grey wardens are an organization you don't have to belong to them even if you are tainted and went trough joining.

 

 

As i said this is hilarious how peoples have no sense individuality and think that after joining you are "i love grey wardens i will serve them they are my masters i will kill myself for them" even if you are forced and go through joining you can pretty much tell order to screw themselves and as long you can deal with order that won't be glad you will be fine as pretty much example i can point anders (who pretty much did what i have said) and hell even the warden can say they go their own way in epilogue.

 

 

That isn't what's happening.

 

What's happening, is people are trying to explain to you that Grey Warden is not just the name of an organization. It is also what people commonly call the specific type of "tainted individuals" who maintain their humanity, and their individuality, and can use the abilities granted to them through the joining to kill lots and lots of darkspawn without quickly becoming one themselves. 

 

A word is required to separate the "tainted individuals" who are darkspawn from the ones who are not darkspawn. For the sake of convenience, the term "Grey Warden" is used. Anders may have left the Warden order, but he is still referred to by others as a Warden and always will be, however he feels about it. 

[TheKomandorShepard]

since when have the epilogues in origins been real... anyway, you make a sound argument with the thug thing... however bioware has retconned your warden into being a warden if they survived via the dark ritual... the only thing you can claim is that a warden who died in origins could technically claim that they werent a warden, that is all... but the fact still remains that bioware has the rest of the world still acknowledge him/her as a grey warden.  just like how you can hate the herald of andraste title but people still call you it in inquisition...  bioware calls him a warden, then hes a warden, even against the maker's will... 

Well im not talking about epilogue slides im talking about coronation part (that was part of the story) where you can pretty much discuss your future.In daa as i can said (you can say) that your working for wardens is only temporary.Regardless whether devs said screw you to players that was in fact option in origin and even if you were eager for warden you had nothing to do with them in dao either way.

 

This is different with inq than with the waren in dao in fact inq is forced to be member of inquisition player don't have agency here at best can say they aren't herald of andraste and in fact that doesn't make them herald of andraste hell it is only title.In dragon age you are nothing more than adventure that isn't serving or taking orders from any organisation.

 

 

The Warden could have booked it into the wilderness at any time (unless they're Dalish that is, which is basically a case of 'join or die a slow, painful death from blight sickness.')  if he/she hated the idea enough to make that comparison. They didn't. 

 

 

DA:I's codex on the HoF says they 'served with honour until his/her disappearance several years later.' 

 

So no. 

Wheter warden could or not escape is up to debate it is clear you can said you don't want to be grey warden you are forced to go through joining then duncan dies when you have to stop blight as it is pretty much plot of the game you do that as leader of independent group of adventurers that have no ties to grey warden order nor takes orders from anyone there are plenty dialogue options that can point that.

 

If that is in case sadly it still doesn't matter that cleary devs don't respect player choices but still that was in case in dao and daa.

 

 

 

 

If the state says those thugs have the legal right to press you into their service than yes, yes you are.

If you want to be dictated who you are by law your call not everyone chose to membership in organisation is matter of own choice unless you are forced and even then you can escape with that you will have face consequences. Not to mention that ferelden kicked wardens out.

[Augustei]

you know its funny, the treaties in origins obligated those people to help fight... yet we couldnt leave zathrian alone and find another dalish clan?  or couldnt just go to the council of dwarves and have them do something, like idk put the whole king thing on ice to deal with it...  the mage thing was kind of exempt in this case, but still...  and why should a warden have to round up other nations like garahel did...  why is there not an agreement between all countries to send troops to others that are having blights...  i understand self preservation and all that crap, but cmon a blight is best stopped early and not later... stupid politics...

 

If anything, it shows that lack of common sense is a very serious problem in thedas... whether it be the wardens, loghain, or other countries in general

Well nobody believed it was a blight, All the Wardens said is they "feel" its a blight. The Wardens don't tell anybody they can sense the archdemon and all that. But yeah the Fereldens dont really trust the Grey Wardens before the blight and its not without reason, For all their talk of neutrality they have a hard time maintaining that neutrality.
Lets not forget the wardens are the ones who helped the Orlesian Emperor Drakon spread the chantry to the north. The Wardens are leashed in Orlais to the throne, this is especially evident in Awakening with the line that Seneshal Varel says to you if you ask why Orlais only sent 12 Wardens "The Warden-Commander of Orlais wanted to send you more but the Empress wouldn't allow it."

So with its recent conquest at the hands of Orlais, Ferelden doesn't really trust the Wardens. Heck most of them are esentially Orlesian. Lets not forget despite being born in Highever, Duncan grew up in Orlais.

[TheKomandorShepard]

That isn't what's happening.

 

What's happening, is people are trying to explain to you that Grey Warden is not just the name of an organization. It is also what people commonly call the specific type of "tainted individuals" who maintain their humanity, and their individuality, and can use the abilities granted to them through the joining to kill lots and lots of darkspawn without quickly become one themselves. 

 

A word is required to separate the "tainted individuals" who are darkspawn from the ones who are not darkspawn. For the sake of convenience, the term "Grey Warden" is used. Anders may have left the Warden order, but he is still referred to by others as a Warden and always will be, however he feels about it. 

Call tainted individual whatever you want pretty much im talking about grey warden order and that you don't have to be part of it pretty much whole topic is about grey warden order and thus my whole point stays.

[Wolfen09]

so basically you just dont like being labeled as something against your will, and no matter how history views it, thats all that matters to you... ok, keep doing that, but lore wise the games will make your pc a warden.  and frankly as far as most of the world is concerned thats what your pc is...  so keep calling your warden a random adventurer, we are going to call him/her/it/whateverthehellyoulabelitas a warden

[Augustei]

Call tainted individual whatever you want pretty much im talking about grey warden order and that you don't have to be part of it pretty much whole topic is about grey warden order and thus my whole point stays.

If the Orlesian Wardens were allowed into Ferelden at the start of the game this would be a different story.
By The Landsmeet when you bump into Rhiordan though you already have your armies assembled and they have pledged fealty to you. You got the Orzammar King his Throne, You dealt with the Werewolves, You dealt with the Circle Tower issues. So Ultimately the armies are loyal to you and not the order, But yeah at the very very start of the game if the Orlesian Wardens were allowed into the Kingdom you'd be defering to them.
By the end of Origins your a national hero thats ended the blight and is loved by almost everybody, and you have royal favor.. So once again, different story.

The Warden is a unique acception to the rule by the end of Origins, since they have such a degree of power and influence they aren't bound to the order like others. Early game though your just the only Warden in the Kingdom, Besides that follower buddy of yours that doesn't like leading.
 

[Hair Serious Business]

Sorry but Wardens always go exiled in my plays,reasons:

1)I hated becoming Warden in DAO(Duncan I blame you)

2)I hate any organization that goes all mysterious and keeps secrets for themselves

3)I get more approval points for exiling them lol

 

So bie bie Wardens,say hello to broodmother from me

[TheKomandorShepard]

so basically you just dont like being labeled as something against your will, and no matter how history views it, thats all that matters to you... ok, keep doing that, but lore wise the games will make your pc a warden.  and frankly as far as most of the world is concerned thats what your pc is...  so keep calling your warden a random adventurer, we are going to call him/her/it/whateverthehellyoulabelitas a warden

Story never views you as grey warden member in dao as i said being called the warden is rather nickname in dao you rly have no ties to grey warden order and i said said you are leader of independent adventure group you don't take orders from grey warden order neither you have follow their rules you have plenty dialogue option to say that.

 

That they don't respect what player could do (years after game) be in dao and even in daa is another matter than what it was and what you could do in game.

 

As i said even if your warden was pro-warden in dao still no ties with them until daa where for some reason s/he decided work for grey wardens and as i said you still could say that is only temporary.

 

 

If the Orlesian Wardens were allowed into Ferelden at the start of the game this would be a different story.
By The Landsmeet when you bump into Rhiordan though you already have your armies assembled and they have pledged fealty to you. You got the Orzammar King his Throne, You dealt with the Werewolves, You dealt with the Circle Tower issues. So Ultimately the armies are loyal to you and not the order, But yeah at the very very start of the game if the Orlesian Wardens were allowed into the Kingdom you'd be defering to them.
By the end of Origins your a national hero thats ended the blight and is loved by almost everybody, and you have royal favor.. So once again, different story.

The Warden is a unique acception to the rule by the end of Origins, since they have such a degree of power and influence they aren't bound to the order like others. Early game though your just the only Warden in the Kingdom, Besides that follower buddy of yours that doesn't like leading.
 

 

Or simple the warden could escape from ferelden and go his way (of course you don't have that option in game) but now we change the story so warden could just escape and let orleisan wardens do their thing hell in fact you can say "wardens are gone i let someone else take care of blight" but game doesn't allow you as you have to finish game.

[Xetykins]

Why do I need more? I only need an army of normal people (who are more likely to die than anyone doing the ritual btw, yet they're there) and 1 Grey Warden to deliver the final blow. Sure, more would be nice, but you don't need an army of Wardens to defeat a blight.And considering how easily people turn to fighting the Darkspawn, I don't see how I'd face difficulties finding enough volunteers to drink their blood. Just ask for volunteers in the armies. The Elves are still waiting for their promised liberation, for one. (I was actually responding to your claims that they were held in high regard everywhere, but fine )btw, I see people saying a lot that Archdemon blood is necessary for the joining. It is not. It's used pretty much all the time but there are ways around it. Using Archdemon blood is the most effective, but not absolutely necessary.

Why do you need more? Gosh.. do i need to answer that? Or do you think wardens are immortal save for the archdemon? I stray well placed arrow could end your single warden's life. Or you plan on bringing the chalice with you and just grab the nearest sob everytime your 1 warden dies on the way to the archdemon?

[Augustei]

Or simple the warden could escape from ferelden and go his way (of course you don't have that option in game) but now we change the story so warden could just escape and let orleisan wardens do their thing hell in fact you can say "wardens are gone i let someone else take care of blight" but game doesn't allow you as you have to finish game.

The Orlesian Wardens are forbidden from crossing the border though, man your Warden must be a pretty big A'hole to leave an entire country to die when he's one of the only wardens in it lol.

He'd probably have to leave Thedas, The Wardens are a Thedas wide organization after all. Even in areas they don't have chapter houses they still operate there at times (Like Kirkwall). If your warden doesn't get pressed back into service upon discovery they'd probably kill him for desertion. Especially desertion during a blight.
Thats how Alistair died in my game actually, attempted desertion during a blight. My Warden wouldn't allow that precedent to be established.