Because the very first Wardens were all thugs and criminals, right? And because there's absolutely no one with honor around like Ser Stroud or anything.... *rolleyes + sarcasm to the infinite power*
And you forget that once you become a grey warden you can sense the millions of darkspawn beneath you, waiting for a leader to end Thedas. That changes the majority of wardens and they become a new person even if they were criminals before joining. Wardens escaping from their duties are quite rare.
Guest_Imanol de Tafalla_*
It is hardly surprising that the specifics behind their Joining are a tightly-guarded secret due to it being a source of power for the Grey Wardens.
Why? If others learned of the Joining and what it entails, the Wardens would lose quite a bit of market-share in the Blight-Ending business because they would have competitors who could provide the highly-demanded service of killing Arch-demons at a much lower price.
Because the very first Wardens were all thugs and criminals, right? And because there's absolutely no one with honor around like Ser Stroud or anything.... *rolleyes + sarcasm to the infinite power*
From what i remember wardens wanted to torch him for being sane and reasonable and by that traitor.
You mean like Phylacteries? Which every White Chantry nation uses?
It's too late to worry about knowledge/resources being abused/corrupted, because that's precisely what the Grey Wardens are doing with it. With the Right of Conscription, they free dangerous criminals and apostates like Avernus and Anders. They claim political neutrality but **** with politics nonetheless. Good people die unnecessarily when the Joining kills them, and this practice takes place even when there is no Blight. And they justify it all by telling people that they're heroes and that the people need them, hence the "we need them"-mentality that can be seen ITT.
And how many ordinary citizens are walking around talking about Phylacteries and blood magic? How many people feel comfortable with Mages living next door to them? That is not a part of people's everyday lives. It's "To keep those mages under control" If anyone outside the Chantry and Templar Order even know about it. Also, you act like Archdemon blood isn't scarce and could just be stored in every Chantry in Thedas. It can't. It would have to remain in very few places. Now which countries do you think would want to have it and what would they do to get it?
And you think the GWs are bad just wait until rulers get their hands on it. You think they wouldn't choose criminals?? Just look at what happens if you let Branka live and continue making Golems, the casteless are used. Of course they make Wardens when there is no Blight. They have to constantly be prepared for one. Anything could happen during an actual Blight and there may not be time to make Grey Wardens right when a Blight hits. Besides, how would they even know if it's a Blight with no Grey Wardens to sense it?
Your plan is shortsighted and guaranteed to start more war on top of Thedas getting caught with their pants down should a Blight come rolling in.
It is hardly surprising that the specifics behind their Joining are a tightly-guarded secret due to it being a source of power for the Grey Wardens.
Why? If others learned of the Joining and what it entails, the Wardens would lose quite a bit of market-share in the Blight-Ending business because they would have competitors who could provide the highly-demanded service of killing Arch-demons at a much lower price.
I doubt it. Most people hate being wardens and only stay because they can't get back to the way they were. The reason the wardens keep the joining secret is because the people would refuse such a thing, while the chantry would likely forbid it, branding it an blood magic ritual.
go ahead and make them extinct. just make sure you have a plan for the next Blight. Oh right you did...you got rid of it though.
Reforms...sure...cause idk what those fellows in the Anderfels are really about tbh. But getting rid of them completely? Naw.
I greatly approve.
Keep the Wardens of the South. They fall apart from the Anderfels folk.
Have them be a force for good.
The north can do whatever the F they wish. I got my southern Wardens doing the right thing.
And an excellent person attached to the Inquisition in the form of Warden Rainier.
Guest_StreetMagic_*
I don't like the Wardens, but can't go this far. They're like the stupid guy you have to let stay at a party, because he's your ride home. Or something.
The next time the Archdemon comes knocking on your door, don't come crawling to one of our Wardens begging for help.
I recognize the risk I am taking and accept it. I think it is worth it. Or rather, I do not think the Wardens are worth all the trouble they like to get up to in the many, many years between blights. With luck, they will lack the ability to protect their secrets as they die out and that those secrets will be leaked from within or without. Then, the threat of Darkspawn and Blights can be handled properly (ie -- with nations relying on their own military to do what they are meant to do).
And how many ordinary citizens are walking around talking about Phylacteries and blood magic? How many people feel comfortable with Mages living next door to them? That is not a part of people's everyday lives. It's "To keep those mages under control" If anyone outside the Chantry and Templar Order even know about it. Also, you act like Archdemon blood isn't scarce and could just be stored in every Chantry in Thedas. It can't. It would have to remain in very few places. Now which countries do you think would want to have it and what would they do to get it?
And you think the GWs are bad just wait until rulers get their hands on it. You think they wouldn't choose criminals?? Just look at what happens if you let Branka live and continue making Golems, the casteless are used. Of course they make Wardens when there is no Blight. They have to constantly be prepared for one. Anything could happen during an actual Blight and there may not be time to make Grey Wardens right when a Blight hits. Besides, how would they even know if it's a Blight with no Grey Wardens to sense it?
Your plan is shortsighted and guaranteed to start more war on top of Thedas getting caught with their pants down should a Blight come rolling in.
Nope, the ones using Phylacteries are special forces. As it should be. And so, as I proposed, the 'Wardens can similarly be an arm of the government or military. Despite whatever people may think, most rulers are not that stupid. Phylacteries are useful and the nobility recognizes them as such. I would wager that they would also recognize the value of the Joining ritual. And nobody trusts mages less than Darkspawn.
I am pretty sure any Darkspawn blood will do, given preparation. Otherwise, they would run out during all the years between Blights. Thom Rainier was sent to go kill Darkspawn grunts for his joining before Blackwall (the real one) was killed.
What do you think I did with Branka and the 'Anvil? If the subjects in question are willing, or criminals being punished for serious crime, then I support its use for them. I would feel no differently about the Joining being given to nations' rulers. As for its abuse, it's not like the Grey Wardens were not doing that already, so that point is moot. And if we are indeed making the assumption that rulers will use it, fairly or no, then your concerns about being prepared for an actual blight and having "Wardens" around to sense it are not valid.
Isn't the biggest secret they're keeping the fact that becoming a grey warden is a death sentence; that you will eventually be compelled to seek out and kill darkspawn until they kill you back?
Well, there is this one little secret and unless you've read the novels you won't know. When a Warden goes on their calling and if you don't die, you turn into a darkspawn. Duncan left that part out when I was recruited.
Makes sense. Gotta figure nobody would join up if they knew that ahead of time.Well, there is this one little secret and unless you've read the novels you won't know. When a Warden goes on their calling and if you don't die, you turn into a darkspawn. Duncan left that part out when I was recruited.
All of Thedas is a giant mess. Getting rid of Grey Wardens just because they're shady doesn't make sense. And having someone govern them makes even less sense.
We have the Chantry controlling mages and templars. Orlesians and their stupid game. Tevinter practicing blood magic behind closed doors.
At least the Wardens don't bother you. No one's suffered because of them, unlike the others.
And you forget that once you become a grey warden you can sense the millions of darkspawn beneath you, waiting for a leader to end Thedas. That changes the majority of wardens and they become a new person even if they were criminals before joining. Wardens escaping from their duties are quite rare.
Stroud appears to be exactly the same kind of guy that he was before he became a Warden. And the fact is that most of the people who join the Wardens seem to change for the better as far as anyone can tell. And how did I forget about the Wardens being able to sense darkspawn. Not only have I not forgotten...I fail to see how it's an issue - it's what they're supposed to be able to do.
If you're referring to the Calling specifically and them being susceptible to things like that, well, hey, I kind of mentioned it in my other posts - so I definitely didn't forget. But back to the assertion that Wardens are all/mostly criminal scum, etc. Ser Ruth clearly had some lingering issues over her own guilt in the aftermath of Adamant when you judge her. She even wanted to be made a public example through your judgment of her. Ah yes, Ser Ruth - she was obviously hardened criminal scum...who wanted to be punished as atonement for her actions! *more sarcasm*
Stroud appears to be exactly the same kind of guy that he was before he became a Warden. And the fact is that most of the people who join the Wardens seem to change for the better as far as anyone can tell. And how did I forget about the Wardens being able to sense darkspawn. Not only have I not forgotten...I fail to see how it's an issue - it's what they're supposed to be able to do.
If you're referring to the Calling specifically and them being susceptible to things like that, well, hey, I kind of mentioned it in my other posts - so I definitely didn't forget. But back to the assertion that Wardens are all/mostly criminal scum, etc. Ser Ruth clearly had some lingering issues over her own guilt in the aftermath of Adamant when you judge her. She even wanted to be made a public example through your judgment of her. Ah yes, Ser Ruth - she was obviously hardened criminal scum...who wanted to be punished as atonement for her actions! *more sarcasm*
One does not forget wardens can sense the darkspawn, my point was constantly sensing an army beneath your feet that can end all life on surface changes people. I hated the way Ser Ruth was introduced. I think I found a way to fully spare her and make her see it but I forgot how... I think it was an Inquisition perk that opened a new dialogue...
So, let's pretend that the Grey Wardens are disbanded. A thousand years pass, and no blight. And then an archdemon arises.
1. By then everyone will assume that the idea that only a tainted warrior can kill the archdemon is a "legend."
2. The formula for the potion will probably be lost by then.
3. Even if they have the formula, who the heck would be stupid enough to drink darkspawn blood on the basis of a "legend."
4. The archdemon blood needed for the potion will be long gone because no one thought it important enough to preserve it.
I have the feeling that the Dread Wolf could have shown the world a different path, but he's keeping secrets as well. Shame on him for not leading the way to a different solution.
The Wardens do what they do because over time it has worked. They came up with the best solution possible with the data they had. There is a reason the joining is a secret, and unless the Hero of Ferelden can find a cure for the taint, they're probably going to have to keep the joining a secret.
Oh, and while we are waiting for a Blight, who is going to keep the darkspawn population in check? Certianly not the beleagured Deep Roads dwarves who are slowly dying off, and I'd be willing to bet the that healthy and untainted will run rather than risk being tainted in a daily battle with darkspawn. Thus the horde will grow and grow finding the untainted gods will be a surer thing.
Isn't forming a society to destroy a fictional video game's plot point a bit of a weird thing to do? 
I mean, BSN is weird and I'm definitely weird even by BSN standards but this is a whole extra level of weird...
Isn't forming a society to destroy a fictional video game's plot point a bit of a weird thing to do?
I mean, BSN is weird and I'm definitely weird even by BSN standards but this is a whole extra level of weird...
Be glad it's not another romance thread.
I am pretty sure any Darkspawn blood will do, given preparation. Otherwise, they would run out during all the years between Blights. Thom Rainier was sent to go kill Darkspawn grunts for his joining before Blackwall (the real one) was killed.
Not completely true. The current formula for the joining requires archdemon blood as well. (Origins). The firs time they tried it they didn't have arhcdemon blood of course, but I suspect that a lot more died trying to "join." Can't say for sure, but archdemon blood may lower the death rate of those attempting the joining. Or, archdemon blood raises your constitution, to allow more to survive.
Be glad it's not another romance thread.
Any tainted blood will do but the joining requires an instantly lethal dose of taint. A small amount of Archdemon blood will suffice but the taint is watered down in Darkspawn so you require more of it to achieve the same result.
We don't know exactly the difference in toxicity but if it is along the lines of a vial of Archdemon to a keg of Darkspawn then that could make it exceptionally difficult to perform the joining with basic Darkspawn blood.
I can't think of his name, but the warden who rides the archdemon and falls tells us that you need a drop of the archdemon blood for the ritual. Maybe I misunderstood, but since we still had to gather regular darkspawn blood for our joining, I figured it was an added ingredient.
'Wardens can similarly be an arm of the government or military.
I am pretty sure any Darkspawn blood will do, given preparation. Otherwise, they would run out during all the years between Blights. Thom Rainier was sent to go kill Darkspawn grunts for his joining before Blackwall (the real one) was killed.
Whose government? There are more than one. Yet the Blight could hit anywhere at anytime which brings up the issue posted pages ago about governments focuing on political bs over aiding a possible rival nation.
Nope, you need Archdemon blood. It's a mix of darkspawn blood and Archdemon blood. Thom was sent to do the very same task the Warden had to do in DAO. Collect a vial of darkspawn blood. Which would then be mixed with the Archdemon blood, however it is they do it, and then drunk by the recruit. if all it takes is regular darkspawn blood then Anders could have simply recommended Carver or Bethany drink the blood. It doesn't work that way, which is why they needed to find Wardens to do it right
I can't think of his name, but the warden who rides the archdemon and falls tells us that you need a drop of the archdemon blood for the ritual. Maybe I misunderstood, but since we still had to gather regular darkspawn blood for our joining, I figured it was an added ingredient.
Retour en haut
