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[GungaDin]

(SPOILERS)

examples?
apart from sacrificing the chargers and executing some people there is nothing evil or ruthless the Inquisitor can do

Executing Blackwall is quite extreme, letting Celene die out of convenience is evil, putting Cullen back on lyrium is douchebag stuff, drinking from the Well of Sorrows out of pure paranoia...

I`ve been reading more on this topic and I should agree I don`t share the visions some people have on evil. I think being selfish and ruthless when you are supposed to be a paragon of virtue and hope is indeed evil, specially considering the Inquisitor retains a lot of power after the immediate danger is gone. Some people seems to think you can only be evil if you do random **** for sport or in a whim as a good sociopath. Well, there`s more than a face of evil and it fits quite well in DA:I. Just gotta imagine the possibilities.

[Farangbaa]

(SPOILERS)
Executing Blackwall is quite extreme, letting Celene die out of convenience is evil, putting Cullen back on lyrium is douchebag stuff, drinking from the Well of Sorrows out of pure paranoia...

I`ve been reading more on this topic and I should agree I don`t share the visions some people have on evil. I think being selfish and ruthless when you are supposed to be a paragon of virtue and hope is indeed evil, specially considering the Inquisitor retains a lot of power after the immediate danger is gone. Some people seems to think you can only be evil if you do random **** for sport or in a whim as a good sociopath. Well, there`s more than a face of evil and it fits quite well in DA:I. Just gotta imagine the possibilities.

You can totally claim to be Herald of Andraste while pissing on the chantry, for instance.

But that's waaaay too normal nowadays. Messing with the beliefs of feelings of hordes of people is nothing bad.

[cronshaw]

How low have we fallen where we are picking the game apart to find some questionable moral decisions that too by using hindsight. Love your kid fantasy game all you like but when i got into this franchise for something a bit more mature which the first game delivered to a sufficient degree. The current iteration is utterly disappointing in that regards. If you like a simple black and wide fiction good for you but i think it makes for a poor experience. Oh well i do not think i would be here for its future iterations IF there are any future iterations.

Hilarious to me that people think being able to be an evil a-hole is "adult" and "mature"

[SolNebula]

Hilarious to me that people think being able to be an evil a-hole is "adult" and "mature"

 

Being evil is just fun not mature..

[Chashan]

I don't have a problem that evil is limited to the pragmatic kind in DAI and that you can't play a tyrant.

 

On the other hand, the setup would have been perfect for a tyrant of the type "I have the mark, so do what I want or I'll leave an open rift in your backyard". Given the published material, this appears to have been a planned feature at some time. It was probably dropped because the resources needed to make it a valid storyline were out of proportion to the perceived benefit. Also, it might have been a case of too many writers saying "I really don't want to write that". 

 

In which case they should really have rowed back on not just calling the game, but the organization that is central to it what they did.

 

 

Executing evil people is hardly evil.

 

Indeed. That aside, capital punishment following a trial isn't exactly something to be shocked about in a setting where capital punishment is enacted near enough everywhere, far as we can tell.

Similarly, Tranquility is also a legitimate tool, and as I recently saw in DA:O's mage origin story, one can take stances other than 'nuh, how awful' there as well.

[EmissaryofLies]

Being evil is just fun not mature..

 

But it can be mature. Unlike the fools who think that people who wish for a broader spectrum of morality choices want to play a 'kill everyone all the time' character. It's just another thing that Mass Effect got right and this bastardization of a Dragon Age game got wrong.

[ThreeF]

In which case they should really have rowed back on not just calling the game, but the organization that is central to it what they did.

 

I'm not even sure if the title is not a pun, you know Inquisition and inquisition. It could be.

[ThreeF]

But it can be mature. Unlike the fools who think that people who wish for a broader spectrum of morality choices want to play a 'kill everyone all the time' character. It's just another thing that Mass Effect got right and this bastardization of a Dragon Age game got wrong.

That might as well be true, but for the most part it's "where is my murder knife" "why can't I kill companions" "why can't i kill anyone" ,"I'm inquisitor I want to torture people" etc. and it all boils down to some chaotic evil DnD caricature.

[stonerbishop]

That might as well be true, but for the most part it's "where is my murder knife" "why can't I kill companions" "why can't i kill anyone" ,"I'm inquisitor I want to torture people" etc. and it all boils down to some chaotic evil DnD caricature.

Yes and it's fun. Origins had it to a much greater extent. It lessened with hawke and more so in inquisition. Maybe going north will give us the evil opt ions in next game.

[Farangbaa]

Similarly, Tranquility is also a legitimate tool, and as I recently saw in DA:O's mage origin story, one can take stances other than 'nuh, how awful' there as well.

It's a legitimate tool, but not for punishment, only as a precaution.

[JackPoint]

You can totally claim to be Herald of Andraste while pissing on the chantry, for instance.

But that's waaaay too normal nowadays. Messing with the beliefs of feelings of hordes of people is nothing bad.

Its also nothing new, the Catholic church as been doing it for 2000 yrs

[Il Divo]

That might as well be true, but for the most part it's "where is my murder knife" "why can't I kill companions" "why can't i kill anyone" ,"I'm inquisitor I want to torture people" etc. and it all boils down to some chaotic evil DnD caricature.

 

That's kinda my issue. Maybe it's because evil feels like a loaded term, one that I thought was abandoned past KotOR. Even if they fall into stupid evil territory, Jade Empire, Mass Effect, and Dragon Age all at least tried to give the pretense that you're not just a sadistic ******.

 

Murder knife decisions, from what I've seen of Bioware games, typicall fall into insane evil, where as issues like Anvil of the Void present moral dilemmas for the player to consider. 

[ThreeF]

That's kinda my issue. Maybe it's because evil feels like a loaded term, one that I thought was abandoned past KotOR. Even if they fall into stupid evil territory, Jade Empire, Mass Effect, and Dragon Age all at least tried to give the pretense that you're not just a sadistic ******.

 

Murder knife decisions, from what I've seen of Bioware games, typicall fall into insane evil, where as issues like Anvil of the Void present moral dilemmas for the player to consider. 

 

Exactly, if the "evil" option is to be implemented I rather the time is spend on a more intricate type.

[zeypher]

Hilarious to me that people think being able to be an evil a-hole is "adult" and "mature"

Whats hilarious is your reading comprehension. How does morally questionable = evil? Look i have realised that this tame fantasy games suit you, more power to you but not for me. There is not a single morally questionable decision we have to make for the greater good. Not everyone likes unicorn farting rainbows style fantasy. I was anyways done with mass effect with their gradual retardation, looks like dragon age is also done in that regards. Now the reason you ask why am i still here? well hoping that a patch makes the game work properly and controls and their binding s get properly fixed. Since i have already paid for this product i want to get some value out of it. 

 

Finally point this is a bloody game IE something meant to be fun, but your beloved company has removed the fun and made it a political manifesto. I play games as a hobby to get some form of escapism from real life where i already have to deal with crap like that. 

 

A lot of us warned that this would happen hell we even foresaw that this is going to be their direction, the reason we are still here is simple Hope being our weakness. We kept hoping that this will be good. They even told us like origins in their advertising. But as they say lesson learned.

[IanPolaris]

It's a legitimate tool, but not for punishment, only as a precaution.

 

Since when?  Forced servitude has always been an acceptable form of punishment both IRL and in Thedas (and even in our modern world, prisoners being forced to work is not out of the pale).  You can say that tranquility is more than this, and I'd agree, but I'd also point out that the Death Penalty in Thedas is nothing special.

 

Not just that but we know that Jowan was going to be punished with Tranquility because the charges of being a bloodmage weren't open-and-shut (otherwise he would have been executed), and Dorian tells us that the Magisterium in Tevinter uses Tranquility as a punishment for the most serious of magical crimes.

 

Frankly under the correct cases (and IMHO we see one in DAI), Tranquility is acceptable as a punishment if proper due process has been done.  I think that's especially true since Tranquility can (in principle) be reversed [unlike death].

[EmissaryofLies]

That might as well be true, but for the most part it's "where is my murder knife" "why can't I kill companions" "why can't i kill anyone" ,"I'm inquisitor I want to torture people" etc. and it all boils down to some chaotic evil DnD caricature.

 

Ruthless/Aggressive Hawke and Renegade/Renegon Shepard defy such stereotypes. There is a reason to murder knife in DA II beyond "rah kill people, rah!" There is a reason to sabotage the Genophage. A reason to kill certain companions beyond "I do not care for his face"; maybe certain companions got too big for their britches and stepped up only to be knocked down. Unless you're just metagaming, of course.

 

There are those of us who understand the necessity of having the ends justify the means. Those of us who are not entertained with grossly unrealistic heroics that mostly boil down to childhood fairy tales and cartoons. Those of us who root for the 'bad guy' when we watch certain films.

 

DA II and the ME Trilogy lends players like us a voice and Inquisition desires to stifle and otherwise silence that voice.

 

It isn't right.

[Vilegrim]

You can totally claim to be Herald of Andraste while pissing on the chantry, for instance.

But that's waaaay too normal nowadays. Messing with the beliefs of feelings of hordes of people is nothing bad.

 

 

nope it isn't.  Convincing them that human sacrifice was a holy act would be, which I actually would not want to do.

[omgodzilla]

Killing Celene and beheading people isn't enough. The game could've gone way further with how ruthless you could be without being too unrealistic. I don't understand why poeple are confusing "ruthless" with "Muhahahaha iMA BLOW UP THE WORLD!"

[Joseph Warrick]

When people see assassinations, public beheadings and mind wipes as measured and reasonable, I suppose it's a good thing they are disatisfied.

 

In swtor you can tell a jedi "I'm going to keep your padawan's skull as a trophy", but that's because you're just a sith thug. You're the embodiment of destruction, not a world savior. You're the equivalent of corypheus, not the inquisitor. Playing as corypheus is, like it or not, beyond the scope of the game. Reminds me of people who wanted Bioware to allow Shepard to agree with the Reapers and help them harvest humanity... yes they existed in the old BSN.

[Hazegurl]

That might as well be true, but for the most part it's "where is my murder knife" "why can't I kill companions" "why can't i kill anyone" ,"I'm inquisitor I want to torture people" etc. and it all boils down to some chaotic evil DnD caricature.

Not every death is "chaotic evil"

 

ex: Shooting Mordin to stop him from curing the genophage and thus ruin your chance at Salarian aid Is not chaotic evil.

 

ex: Murder knifing Anders for blowing up innocent people is not chaotic evil.

 

ex: Murder knifing some shopkeeper to get Dorian's Amulet back is chaotic evil and anyone who sees you doing that should dump you...unless they are the same type. Which is why, I don't pull out the murder knife here because killing some dude for an Amulet when I can easily use my influence is stupid.

[RepHope]

You can't be evil but there are definitely a couple options to be bitter, resentful, and bewildered. The story requires that you care about the Breach and want to close if however, and it requires that you not be a complete psychopath, as doing that makes it hard to gain support.

[EmissaryofLies]

Curious to see if I speak for more than myself when I say that I wanted to be Hardened Leliana.

[ThreeF]

Not every death is "chaotic evil"

 

ex: Shooting Mordin to stop him from curing the genophage and thus ruin your chance at Salarian aid Is not chaotic evil.

 

ex: Murder knifing Anders for blowing up innocent people is not chaotic evil.

 

ex: Murder knifing some shopkeeper to get Dorian's Amulet back is chaotic evil and anyone who sees you doing that should dump you...unless they are the same type. Which is why, I don't pull out the murder knife here because killing some dude for an Amulet when I can easily use my influence is stupid.

 

Erm.. I'm pretty sure I didn't said that every death is "chaotic evil", not sure what you are getting at. And, btw, if we are going to use labels, killing Anders for blowing up innocent people is not "evil", it's "tragic".