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[deerstop]

I love him! Unfortunately I love my Hawke even more, so he had to die.

[Meer]

I love how Loghain becomes the warden commander if you let Hawke sacrifice himself in the fade.

 

I was really glad to see my favorite BW character make an appearance in inquisition despite the fact that a lot of people probably killed him of.

 

His reactions towards the nightmare demon was also pretty great:

 

Loghain: Is that all you've got? It's nothing I've not said to myself.

 

Can't get enough of the guy.

That quote was so perfect for him. It reminds me of his post-recruitment in Origins, where you can dig into him for all of the things he's done; yet no matter what you say, he's pretty much unflappable since he's capable of either seeing what he's done wrong and accepting it--or just awesome at letting things bounce off.

[Aren]

My Loghain is a survivor, the stolen throne DAO, DAA, DAI and maybe even DA4, THERE WILL ALWAYS BE  a Loghain in every Dragon age

[noxpanda]

Heh loghain is a great character. Ive been through a whole rollercoaster ride of emotions as to how i feel about him. First playthrough of origins i was practically bouncing at the screen during ostagar shouting 'that guy is eviiiil'. For many playthroughs i never bothered to try and talk to him, just lopped his head off. It took reading a thread here to realise that there was a lot more to his char.

 

So i went back through origins, talked to him whenever i could and recruited him, to me that was when his character really shined. He has some great conversations with the warden (i especially liked him talking about anora and anora talking about him) and some hilarious banter with the group. He made ostagar dlc much more interesting (the revelation that cailan was gonna dump anora, which is pretty much ignored if you have alistair along). After that i went and read stolen throne and the calling, both of which added even more depth to an already interesting character. So yeah he makes it through to inquistion 90% of the time for me and again i think hes great there.

 

I personally think he is the most interesting character bioware has yet written and ill happily kill off one of my PCs to keep him alive.

[Don Lionheart]

The first time that I played Origins I just killed Loghain because he was Loghain.  No matter how much I've always loved the crazy complexities that are his character, I couldn't imagine not killing him that first time.  However, when I knew that DA:I was coming out (then known as DA3:I), I decided to go through both DA:O and DA2 a third and second time, respectively, so that I could have a perfect world state ready to go for the third game.  Then, I got to this one scene while at Redcliffe Castle after saving the Arl.  I was talking with Eamon and going through all sorts of discussion about what was going on in the world and talking about Loghain, and Eamon said something, it was just one line, but he said something that literally made me think "I can't kill Loghain."  Now, I had been going through the game up to this point fully intending to kill him like I had done in both of my other playthroughs, but whatever the line that Eamon said, I did a complete 180 in that decision.  I really wish I could remember what the exact line was or find the line in game again or online, but I've not been able to, which makes me sad.  From my recollection, the line went something like Eamon saying, "But when I saw him get on one knee and swear to protect Ferelden with his life..."  Maybe someone here recognizes the line and knows it in its entirety or has a video to it?  Anyway, that leads me to the topic of this thread.

 

Seeing that Loghain was the Warden friend that Hawke had made me SO happy, I couldn't believe it.  I thought it would be Carver because I had him join the Wardens in 2, but when I found out it was Loghain...I was almost in shock.  Loghain is one of my favorite villains of all time because his villainy is driven by his zealous love for his homeland.  I believe he really does regret what he did in Ferelden, and he believed what he was doing was best for his nation.  He also willingly accepted his punishment and has served the Wardens to the best of his ability during the time since the Blight.  I played my Warden, Hawke, and Inquisitor all the same, forgiveness and kindness, people doing the best with the hand their dealt and being good, and because of that, I let Hawke stay in the fade, as much as it killed me to do so.  Hawke seemed so much more decided to stay, and my Inquisitor felt Loghain deserved to live to help rebuild the Wardens.  This was the toughest decision in the game to make for me, but Loghain survived yet again.  I took some solace in the fact that it doesn't say the character WILL die, but only most likely will die, which gave me hope that if I chose Hawke, he, being a mage, knows enough about the fade and had the best chance of surviving in there.

 

Something just didn't feel feel right about letting Loghain die that way in the fade, and his character is so incredible that I had to let him live again.  Hawke, while he was my character, just doesn't resonate the way that Loghain does in significance to keep him alive.

[sylvanaerie]

The only reason I created a world state where he lived was so he could die in obscurity in the Fade.  Of the three options of potential 'friend' warden to Hawke, Loghain was the most stupid.  Stroud or Alistair could actually be encountered in Kirkwall, but wtf was Loghain doing with Hawke?

 

Hate that bastard, and he's never actually lived through any of my games.

[phaonica]

The first time that I played Origins I just killed Loghain because he was Loghain.  No matter how much I've always loved the crazy complexities that are his character, I couldn't imagine not killing him that first time.  However, when I knew that DA:I was coming out (then known as DA3:I), I decided to go through both DA:O and DA2 a third and second time, respectively, so that I could have a perfect world state ready to go for the third game.  Then, I got to this one scene while at Redcliffe Castle after saving the Arl.  I was talking with Eamon and going through all sorts of discussion about what was going on in the world and talking about Loghain, and Eamon said something, it was just one line, but he said something that literally made me think "I can't kill Loghain."  Now, I had been going through the game up to this point fully intending to kill him like I had done in both of my other playthroughs, but whatever the line that Eamon said, I did a complete 180 in that decision.  I really wish I could remember what the exact line was or find the line in game again or online, but I've not been able to, which makes me sad.  From my recollection, the line went something like Eamon saying, "But when I saw him get on one knee and swear to protect Ferelden with his life..."  Maybe someone here recognizes the line and knows it in its entirety or has a video to it?  Anyway, that leads me to the topic of this thread.
 
Seeing that Loghain was the Warden friend that Hawke had made me SO happy, I couldn't believe it.  I thought it would be Carver because I had him join the Wardens in 2, but when I found out it was Loghain...I was almost in shock.  Loghain is one of my favorite villains of all time because his villainy is driven by his zealous love for his homeland.  I believe he really does regret what he did in Ferelden, and he believed what he was doing was best for his nation.  He also willingly accepted his punishment and has served the Wardens to the best of his ability during the time since the Blight.  I played my Warden, Hawke, and Inquisitor all the same, forgiveness and kindness, people doing the best with the hand their dealt and being good, and because of that, I let Hawke stay in the fade, as much as it killed me to do so.  Hawke seemed so much more decided to stay, and my Inquisitor felt Loghain deserved to live to help rebuild the Wardens.  This was the toughest decision in the game to make for me, but Loghain survived yet again.  I took some solace in the fact that it doesn't say the character WILL die, but only most likely will die, which gave me hope that if I chose Hawke, he, being a mage, knows enough about the fade and had the best chance of surviving in there.
 
Something just didn't feel feel right about letting Loghain die that way in the fade, and his character is so incredible that I had to let him live again.  Hawke, while he was my character, just doesn't resonate the way that Loghain does in significance to keep him alive.

 
 

"My sister married King Maric while he was still in exile. At that time, he and Loghain were inseparable. The wild prince who'd never seen the inside of a castle, and the farmer's son. When Loghain joined Maric's rebels, he was just a rawboned boy. But he got on one knee to swear that he would see Ferelden free or die trying. He made us a free people once more. You can't know what it was like to grow up as a vassal in your own land while poncy little Orlesians minced around in their silks. I would never have believed he would do anything but what was best for Ferelden."

 

I loved hearing your story, Don Lionheart! I remember when I was first playing Origins, and between the few conversations I'd had with Loghain and the way Eamon spoke of him, I remember wanting so badly to believe that Loghain was driven by loyalty to Ferelden and not personal power. And I remember feeling like no matter what kind of mess he'd gotten himself into, that if he truly was that man that Maric adored, that I very much wanted to help get him out of that mess and give him a second chance.

 

I loved finding out that my Hawke referred to him as a "friend."

[teh DRUMPf!!]

 Loghain FTW! ... Sadly, I have to let him die in the Fade, since I cannot allow the Wardens to rebuild.

 

Which is ironic, since in so doing, the Inquisitor does to Loghain and his fellow Wardens what Loghain did to the Wardens at Ostagar.

 

I, however, get to end the story as a hero. Think that one over, if you brand Loghain an evil wrongdoer.

[Arisugawa]

left him in the fade. made for a PERFECT story arc.

 

I agree.

 

I was really skeptical about the inclusion of Loghain when I heard he could appear.

 

Everything about his portrayal was so well-done in my opinion. His level-headedness about the situation at hand, his loyalty to the Wardens despite always being an outsider among them. His acceptance of what his actions during Origins have done to both his reputation and his potential legacy. 

 

The only thing I wish could have been included was a scene between him and Threnn at Skyhold, provided Threnn survived In Your Heart Shall Burn. It would have made for a lovely moment between a soldier still fiercely loyal to her former commander and a commander who in many ways was no longer the man she remembered.

[Monica21]

 
 

"My sister married King Maric while he was still in exile. At that time, he and Loghain were inseparable. The wild prince who'd never seen the inside of a castle, and the farmer's son. When Loghain joined Maric's rebels, he was just a rawboned boy. But he got on one knee to swear that he would see Ferelden free or die trying. He made us a free people once more. You can't know what it was like to grow up as a vassal in your own land while poncy little Orlesians minced around in their silks. I would never have believed he would do anything but what was best for Ferelden."

 

I loved hearing your story, Don Lionheart! I remember when I was first playing Origins, and between the few conversations I'd had with Loghain and the way Eamon spoke of him, I remember wanting so badly to believe that Loghain was driven by loyalty to Ferelden and not personal power. And I remember feeling like no matter what kind of mess he'd gotten himself into, that if he truly was that man that Maric adored, that I very much wanted to help get him out of that mess and give him a second chance.

 

I loved finding out that my Hawke referred to him as a "friend."

 

This is why we will always be friends.

[phaonica]

This is why we will always be friends.

 

*BIG HUGS*

[Arisugawa]

 I loved finding out that my Hawke referred to him as a "friend."

 

Strangely, this is the one problem I have with Loghain in Inquisition, but it is more a problem with Hawke.

 

My Hawke was a rogue, which means she was at Ostagar with Carver, and since she wasn't part of Loghain's forces it means that she and her brother were survivors who managed to stay alive and get to Lothering just ahead of the Darkspawn horde. She and Aveline had a conversation about this several years later, about watching the signal fire light up and then...nothing. Hope answered with nothing, just the desperate battle waging on.

 

My Hawke would not have been a friend of Loghain, not without a serious heart-to-heart in which she would have let him know exactly what Ostagar meant to her. Now, it's possible that this happened, but if it did, it happened off-camera and without any mention of it in the narrative. And without that crucial context, Hawke calling Loghain "friend" is jarring and immersion-breaking.

 

Again, this isn't a complaint about Loghain. It's about Hawke and how Hawke's acceptance of Loghain seems counter to what I experienced in Dragon Age 2.

[phaonica]

Strangely, this is the one problem I have with Loghain in Inquisition, but it is more a problem with Hawke.

 

My Hawke was a rogue, which means she was at Ostagar with Carver, and since she wasn't part of Loghain's forces it means that she and her brother were survivors who managed to stay alive and get to Lothering just ahead of the Darkspawn horde. She and Aveline had a conversation about this several years later, about watching the signal fire light up and then...nothing. Hope answered with nothing, just the desperate battle waging on.

 

My Hawke would not have been a friend of Loghain, not without a serious heart-to-heart in which she would have let him know exactly what Ostagar meant to her. Now, it's possible that this happened, but if it did, it happened off-camera and without any mention of it in the narrative. And without that crucial context, Hawke calling Loghain "friend" is jarring and immersion-breaking.

 

Again, this isn't a complaint about Loghain. It's about Hawke and how Hawke's acceptance of Loghain seems counter to what I experienced in Dragon Age 2.

 

I understand. There are a lot of people who feel that their Hawke acted out of character for them, and that does suck. Truly, when I was playing DA2, I might have expected my Hawke to not have thought very highly of Loghain either. I don't remember her having any reason to have thought any differently. But because I personally like Loghain, I was okay with her having been convinced by whatever it was that convinced her off camera.

[zambingo]

I like Loghain, he was between a rock and a hard place... he backed the wrong horse, so to speak, but a strong character never-the-less. I've never let him live however. I'm not even sure Loghain would let himself live. I think it's cool that his cameo works well, not sure I could get past Hawke being friends with him however given how Hawke viewed Ostagar.

[sylvanaerie]

Strangely, this is the one problem I have with Loghain in Inquisition, but it is more a problem with Hawke.

 

My Hawke was a rogue, which means she was at Ostagar with Carver, and since she wasn't part of Loghain's forces it means that she and her brother were survivors who managed to stay alive and get to Lothering just ahead of the Darkspawn horde. She and Aveline had a conversation about this several years later, about watching the signal fire light up and then...nothing. Hope answered with nothing, just the desperate battle waging on.

 

My Hawke would not have been a friend of Loghain, not without a serious heart-to-heart in which she would have let him know exactly what Ostagar meant to her. Now, it's possible that this happened, but if it did, it happened off-camera and without any mention of it in the narrative. And without that crucial context, Hawke calling Loghain "friend" is jarring and immersion-breaking.

 

Again, this isn't a complaint about Loghain. It's about Hawke and how Hawke's acceptance of Loghain seems counter to what I experienced in Dragon Age 2.

 

I wish I could like this more than once.  For me the inclusion of Loghain was a jarring and immersion breaking idiocy.  It's one thing for the warden to to forgive or befriend Loghain since you are there for the conversations and process, and it's up to each individual player to decide for themselves if he's worth forgiving/befriending and you can see where the actual story arc is leading.  It's another to have the 'friendship' from out of the blue shoved down your throat and be included 'for plot reasons'.  

At least my Hawke for that particular Inquisition run was a mage, so it was a little less jarring than a warrior or rogue would have been, but still made zero sense.

 

My canon was King Alistair, Stroud as the 'friend', that Hawke met during the conflict with the Qunari, and ultimately the one left in the fade.

 

I will say Loghain had a decent cameo, though, and I don't regret seeing it, because I like to see different things in each playthrough.  Thanks to keep this was possible, because I still don't like the bastard, and he never survived any of my Origin games.

[blahblahblah]

My Loghain is a survivor, the stolen throne DAO, DAA, DAI and maybe even DA4, THERE WILL ALWAYS BE  a Loghain in every Dragon age

Loghain disappears after DAI just like the Warden, so in your logic he became a ghost.

[Spooky81]

It can be easy to side with and spare Loghain as any origin other than the Human Noble.  For the many that did carry over a Human Noble Origin, it's interesting to see how many kill of the same Loghain that allied with the Arl that killed your family and those that picked Loghain over Alistair and forgot about his relationship with Howe.  I don't think any light was revealed on what Loghain's perspective was on the Highever massacre and if he went with Arl Howe's justification that the Couslands deserved it for "selling out to the Orlesians".  Something that would have been a weight on the HN's decision to spare Loghain.

 

As with others, the DA Keep is the only way for me to see the DAI Loghain experience.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

 The Ostagar connection did not bother me because, for one, it gave some reason for why Loghain would be Hawke's contact in the first place. Whom else would Loghain trust enough to work with than a fellow Fereldan? Loghain also says he knew the names/families of everyone who died in that battle, so the name Hawke might have meant something to him too.

 

 

As for being left behind in hopeless battle... that may have been Aveline's perspective of the battle, but my Hawke was quite literally the anti-Aveline in just about every way. Where Aveline may have resented Loghain's betrayal of the king and abandoning the soldiers, my Hawke would be more like "Soldier lives are forfeit, even ours. Get over it." [Aveline Rivalry +15]

[teh DRUMPf!!]

It can be easy to side with and spare Loghain as any origin other than the Human Noble.

 

City Elves say "hi!" ^^

[Arisugawa]

 The Ostagar connection did not bother me because, for one, it gave some reason for why Loghain would be Hawke's contact in the first place. Whom else would Loghain trust enough to work with than a fellow Fereldan? Loghain also says he knew the names/families of everyone who died in that battle, so the name Hawke might have meant something to him too.

 

 

As for being left behind in hopeless battle... that may have been Aveline's perspective of the battle, but my Hawke was quite literally the anti-Aveline in just about every way. Where Aveline may have resented Loghain's betrayal of the king and abandoning the soldiers, my Hawke would be more like "Soldier lives are forfeit, even ours. Get over it." [Aveline Rivalry +15]

 

And I'm glad it worked for you, but that doesn't mean the experience was any less jarring for those of us that played a Hawke who sympathized with Aveline's perspective.

[phaonica]

As much as I loved my Hawke calling Loghain friend, I agree that they probably shouldn't have done it the way they did. There are plenty of reasons to keep Loghain alive even if you hate and/or disagree with him, and furthermore just because a Warden spared him for whatever reason doesn't mean the Hawke in the same canon agreed with that decision.

 

I did like the idea of Hawke being there, but the devs probably shouldn't have Hawke voice a stance on something that they haven't explicitly gotten input from the player about. I know the Keep specifically asked whether or not my Hawke agreed with what Anders did. I'd have been irritated if, for example, by siding with the mages the game assumed that meant my Hawke agreed with Anders. Why not also go ahead and ask: What was Hawke's stance on blood magic? How about the Warden's decision to spare Loghain?

 

Or hell, if Hawke had just called Loghain a 'contact' instead of 'friend', then maybe that would have left their relationship open to wider interpretation.

[Aren]

Loghain disappears after DAI just like the Warden, so in your logic he became a ghost.

Oh oh..... here it is..... again............

 

Spoiler

Are you really so frustated? 

[blahblahblah]

Oh oh..... here it is..... again............

 

Spoiler

Are you really so frustated? 

I have a question for you, where is Loghain after he went from  [/spoiler]Weisshaupt?  

[Monica21]

Loghain disappears after DAI just like the Warden, so in your logic he became a ghost.

 

Well, he "disappeared" in Awakening when the Wardens sent him to Orlais, but here he is again. If not left in the Fade, he might play a role in whatever is going on with the Wardens, which means it's entirely possible to see him again. I'd actually say more likely than what I thought would happen after Awakening.

[Aren]

I have a question for you, where is Loghain after he went from  [/spoiler]Weisshaupt?  

What kind of question is this? Have you seen DA4 yet?   Loghain is easy to implement and if they will choose for the sequel the north of Thedas we can have the chance to meet him.  

Simon Templeman  always around Thedas.

                                                                     

                                                                                           Dragon age----------------> Loghain  age