26 réponses à ce sujet

[Bountron]

So on consoles you have a modifier key like L2 on PS4 to toggle your action bars. Thus the console players can concentrate on using 5 buttons while on PC you have to manage 8!

But there are no Shift-Key combinations in Battlefield and that seems to be why we do not have those in Dragon Age?? I think they were possible in the older Dragon Age titles and it would be impossible to enjoy SWTOR without them, so BioWare knows exactly what we are talking about.

You simply cannot enjoy the game to its full extent because you have to rebind essential buttons to more comfortable positions like the Search button which is on default v! All these issues could be easily solved with modifiers...

(On top of that on PC we also have to endure the 8 button action bar restriction just due to the fact that it's console orientated design. Simply because controllers do not have enough buttons for Dragon Age Inquisition, they ALSO limited their amount on PC, which is ridiculous, but understandable considering the outcry of consolists.) according to Lee T it is just because of a bad design choice, which makes this even worse!

Dear BioWare staff, with all due respect, please consider the effort worthwile and look into PC controls, check the list below to level your product above mediocre console ports like Dark Souls! Because now I fear that you have not played it on PC yet by yourself.

- enable Modifier Keybinds such as Alt-, Shift-, Crlt-
- enable Mouse Buttons ingame
- second action bar this was just an afterthought while writing: I am not a fan of massive button management too but considering imperfect balance issues here and there this would not hurt in Singleplayer . Why lower the fun by restricting the players? Why?.

There are numerous other interesting issues such as high res interface for better overview, but they are handled in other threads like this one below:
http://forum.bioware...estions-thread/

I know you can do better

Best regards

red things are edits

[Bountron]

bump - I know: not many PC oldschool bobs out there.

[AlanC9]

What's a bob?

[mutantspicy]

meh.  PC player who has been using controllers on nearly every game since my first Apple 2c.  Controllers aren't what limits you to 8 slots.  I played DAO with a rumblepad 2 and a creative xpadder profile.  hint you can hit more than one trigger at a time to create even more modifiers.  You can also use dpad macros to have as many modifier profiles as you can think of.  So no consoles aren't the limiting factor. This was a design choice, whether by design or laziness.

[Kantr]

what did the shift key do in origins?

[Spectre Impersonator]

I know you can do better

What makes you say that? When exactly have they done better? 

[Violetbliss]

Honestly, I think the 8 key limit is for balance reasons as much as console limitation. It's already pretty imbalanced with just 8, once you can cherrypick with enough points. But I wouldn't mind a few more for skill variety, I'll admit - you can make the game as balanced as you want by ruling out offenders anyway.

 

I'd be all for modifier keys for keybinds though. I have small hands and have to use keys closest to movement or mouse. Also, mouse binds...

[Lee T]

On top of that on PC we also have to endure the 8 button action bar restriction just due to the fact that it's console orientated design. Simply because controllers do not have enough buttons for Dragon Age Inquisition, they ALSO limited their amount on PC, which is ridiculous, but understandable considering the outcry of consolists.

This limitation has nothing to do with consoles. People playing on consoles could use all their abilities in both previous titles, just like their fellow players using PCs. The gamers who did play both previous games on consoles are just as peeved as you are.

It's even harder to contemplate why they dropped the radial menu altogether while Ubisoft made a faster radial menu that do not pause the game by using the PS4 touchpad to make the radial menu into a touch interface.

Oh, by the way "consolists" are people and gamers just like you, they're as much "consolists" as you're some "some random derogatory term involving using a PC". Personnaly I enjoy games on all platforms, games are games I suppose that makes me a PConsolipadistophonian.

It's a bad design decision period, there's no need to give the devs excuses by putting the blame on some gaming platform you do not use.

[ontwonadot]

what did the shift key do in origins?

 

I was able to select multiple characters in tactical view with the shift key

[Bountron]

Despite ppl defending: the consoles are the lead platform, period. That is why the abilities look like diamond squares, so that they can be positioned in a convenient way. All the Menus have the perfect resolution for consoles, aka TV sets but not computer screens. It is playable, of course. But if you look at sharp menus like to ones of Diablo you will come across significant differences.

 

Everytime someone comes around with some obvious shortcomings ppl defend the consoles and blame the PC players to be arrogant and so on. I assure you that I do appreciate all consoles and their customers, I own a Nintendo console myself.

 

=> The only thing I say is that you cannot take a game made for consoles and convert it on PC and think it is absolutely fine. It is not the same experience, of course you have to do some MINOR tweaks at least - that is not asked too much.

 

I hope they will at least enable modifier keys, so that I do not need to bind my alt key lol. The second action bar thing was some afterthought while writing my complaint, I see that I have gone too far. But I guess my assumptions were not toooo wrong nevertheless.

[coldflame]

8-skill limite worse decision ever (ok fine one of the worse decisions).

[Bountron]

Laidlaw, how much money do you want for better PC controls? Maybe direct money transfer boosts motivation..

[ontwonadot]

Despite ppl defending: the consoles are the lead platform, period. That is why the abilities look like diamond squares, so that they can be positioned in a convenient way. All the Menus have the perfect resolution for consoles, aka TV sets but not computer screens. It is playable, of course. But if you look at sharp menus like to ones of Diablo you will come across significant differences.

 

Everytime someone comes around with some obvious shortcomings ppl defend the consoles and blame the PC players to be arrogant and so on. I assure you that I do appreciate all consoles and their customers, I own a Nintendo console myself.

 

=> The only thing I say is that you cannot take a game made for consoles and convert it on PC and think it is absolutely fine. It is not the same experience, of course you have to do some MINOR tweaks at least - that is not asked too much.

 

I hope they will at least enable modifier keys, so that I do not need to bind my alt key lol. The second action bar thing was some afterthought while writing my complaint, I see that I have gone too far. But I guess my assumptions were not toooo wrong nevertheless.

 

 

um, actually they're shaped like diamonds bc they were shaped like diamonds in DA2 to differentiate activated abilities from passives and sustained abilities. You have no idea what you're talking about.

[AxholeRose]

Honestly, I think the 8 key limit is for balance reasons as much as console limitation. It's already pretty imbalanced with just 8, once you can cherrypick with enough points. But I wouldn't mind a few more for skill variety, I'll admit - you can make the game as balanced as you want by ruling out offenders anyway.

 

 

DA2 had almost unlimited spots for skills, you just couldn't put all of them on hotkeys.  How is this a balance issue?  Is DA:I trying so hard to be a MMO, like Guild Wars or something?

[C0uncil0rTev0s]

DA2 had almost unlimited spots for skills, you just couldn't put all of them on hotkeys.  How is this a balance issue?  Is DA:I trying so hard to be a MMO, like Guild Wars or something?

Bullshit, it's 40 skill slots in Lotro for example... You can bind all of them +Alt +Shift +Ctrl if needed.

[mLIQUID]

I saw having all the skill keys as a strength for pc not a weakness. Just a matter of consolidating your keys and mouse bindings within range. It's not an easy task especially for people new to the UI of mouse/keyboard for gaming, but completely do-able and in the end very powerful. If anything they should have had someone in their ranks to walk you through it. I'll nominate myself if they can provide appropriate equipment for streaming.

[Rizilliant]

Honestly, I think the 8 key limit is for balance reasons as much as console limitation. It's already pretty imbalanced with just 8, once you can cherrypick with enough points. But I wouldn't mind a few more for skill variety, I'll admit - you can make the game as balanced as you want by ruling out offenders anyway.

 

I'd be all for modifier keys for keybinds though. I have small hands and have to use keys closest to movement or mouse. Also, mouse binds...

Origins on ps3 had 6 or 8 buttons, while on pc all were allowed.. It has nothing to do with "ba;lance" as the pc, and ps4/xb1 games d not play on the same servers or anything.. Not that theres any competitive mp anyway...

 

clearly, its a catering to console market, and a slap in the face to the PC community.. Some people may enjoy using a controller, mabny of us older gamers prefer the precision of m+kb! While i admit, if im playing a shooter, or action game i may prefer the controller.. (Assassins Creed, Arkham series, Far Cry) but my rpg's i  much prefer mkb!

[Rizilliant]

um, actually they're shaped like diamonds bc they were shaped like diamonds in DA2 to differentiate activated abilities from passives and sustained abilities. You have no idea what you're talking about.

lmfao!  wow, you really didnt know before posting did you.. lol, sigh.. i needed that...  

 

Diamonds r activated abilities, circles r passives.. Nothing to do with the console ui.. Look at origins on console, the ui was circle if i recall correctly..

 

Most games use circles to mimick the shape/layout of the buttons.. Does your controller use diamond buttons?

[robertthebard]

DA2 had almost unlimited spots for skills, you just couldn't put all of them on hotkeys.  How is this a balance issue?  Is DA:I trying so hard to be a MMO, like Guild Wars or something?

I always love the MMO claim. In Rappelz, I had, at bare minimum, 36 skills I could use, and then a bar very similar to what we get here, for my pets. Those were, BTW, just the bindable ones w/out getting too extreme in keybinding. I could have 8 bars of 12 empty slots very easily, and could hotkey them all, if I was into that much. Ultimately, I had hot keys for crucial stuff, and then just clicked on stuff I didn't use often enough to have to worry about hot keying. But hey, you are right, Guild Wars did just that. I never got very far in GW, but it does do that.

[Rizilliant]

I always love the MMO claim. In Rappelz, I had, at bare minimum, 36 skills I could use, and then a bar very similar to what we get here, for my pets. Those were, BTW, just the bindable ones w/out getting too extreme in keybinding. I could have 8 bars of 12 empty slots very easily, and could hotkey them all, if I was into that much. Ultimately, I had hot keys for crucial stuff, and then just clicked on stuff I didn't use often enough to have to worry about hot keying. But hey, you are right, Guild Wars did just that. I never got very far in GW, but it does do that.

I had 4 bars of 12 in my WoW days, and used every single one!  (and i dont macro.. I prefer to actually play  my game!)

[ontwonadot]

lmfao!  wow, you really didnt know before posting did you.. lol, sigh.. i needed that...  

 

Diamonds r activated abilities, circles r passives.. Nothing to do with the console ui.. Look at origins on console, the ui was circle if i recall correctly..

 

Most games use circles to mimick the shape/layout of the buttons.. Does your controller use diamond buttons?

 

 

...are you responding to me or the person I quoted? Because you just reiterated what I said.

[Bountron]

um, actually they're shaped like diamonds bc they were shaped like diamonds in DA2 to differentiate activated abilities from passives and sustained abilities. You have no idea what you're talking about.

What problems do you have? I know that of course... We are talking about Modifier keys here (Shift-, Crlt-, Alt-) and you concentrate on this example I gave you. Sorry but YOU have no idea what you are talking about, you completely disregard the main problem at all. And because many players do not know the differences between console user interface and PC I give you a nice screenshot you can look at and learn about.

 

Please notice the right angle between the buttons on console!

I dont give a da** that it is aimed for consoles, but you have to agree that it is. I think this is a matter of fact. I have addressed some apparent problems and I want at least some modifier keys enabled, which were enabled in previous installments and are not present in BF4 / Frostbite either I think!

 

[C0uncil0rTev0s]

No, thanks, we don't need that console bullshit for our PC. Please, just add as many skill slots as the screen allows you to. As it was before. Thanks.

[Bountron]

Honestly, I think the 8 key limit is for balance reasons as much as console limitation. ...

If it was for balance, the Ai controlled party members would not use skills that are not on their bar. You have to literally disable them manually. Otherwise they wouldnt have implented this and tossing off the bar would have the same effect as disabling.

If you still dont believe me ask the game designers on Twitter and see yourself!

[Lee T]

Everytime someone comes around with some obvious shortcomings ppl defend the consoles and blame the PC players to be arrogant and so on. I assure you that I do appreciate all consoles and their customers, I own a Nintendo console myself.

This particular shortcoming has nothing to do with consoles though. It's a poor design decisions period. There are plenty of other games with more complex menus and more abilities than DAI on consoles, including DAO and DA2.

While consoles and controllers do have technical limitations compared to PC+KM, NONE could justify this 8 abilities limitation. Smart developers have always found workaround to compensate for the limited number of "keys" on the controller. This include the Bioware team in their previous games, which is even more maddening.