14 réponses à ce sujet

[rjshae]

Has anybody got some interesting and easy to implement ideas for creating ambiance in a town? I know you can have the usual walkpath followers and standing guards. What I was thinking of is, for example, a door that occasionally spawns an NPC that wanders around in the yard for a few rounds, then goes back indoors. Perhaps a dog chasing a cat, or randomly spawned debris like open boxes or a fallen chair.

[kamal_]

Uncle FB's includes a "chasing" script for dogs and cat, kids playing tag, etc.

[Dann-J]

Frequent trips from the tavern to the outhouse. At least until later in the night, when there'd be frequent trips from the tavern to just outside the tavern door (eventually degrading to not quite making it out the door).

 

Speaking of which, here's some ambience for you.

[PJ156]

I've often thought about this while using FB and have come to the conclusion that there is much you can do that is pointless in my opinion.

 

I think that much of what you could do would be/is missed, ambiance should be applied in bold statements of activity that would be clearly noticable to the fast passing player on their way from A to B. 

 

My to do list from this would be (some of these I have managed):

 

Key npc's moving about various buildings with changing time (FB does this)

Npc's moving around to speak with each other (shopping for instance).

Npc's approaching the PC to beg or offer services, then move back to base on refusal.

Npc's disappearing/appearing at night (FB)

responding to a change in weather (sheltering from rain)

Spawning as a random npc at point A walk to B then disappear.

Going about a job - collecting barrels, sweeping streets. (Something constant)

 

Micro activities, for me, are not worth the scripting effort (but then I am not a goods script writer) For instance I spent some time playing with scripts and laying down waypoints for a light keeper. In the end I gave up. The PC has to be there at a particular ten minutes of a 24 hour day just to see this in action, chance are it will not be spotted or appreciated. I put vomiting and going to the toilet into this category.

 

Now, if you can connect a cart to a horse and have them move in sync, I think that would be cool

 

PJ 

[kamal_]

Pj has a point, many of the things you could possibly do for ambience are unlikely to receive much if any notice. For instance I could have programmed my ai commoners to always choose the same door to go to at the end of their day, so they have a specific home, and I could have made them change their clothes daily, but who is really going to notice that?

In Crimmor I used only 6-7 commoner activites for each area, street merchant, shopper, walking around, musician, musician audience (cheering), generic worker. A few spots got extra stuff, outdoor patio food service had people sitting at tables, and martial practice spots had archers and melee practices.

My commoner ai was specifically put together to make background ambience easier to add, so I'd suggest trying it out and seeing if you are happy with the results it gives. Apep's packages for automatically changing appearance, voiceset etc on spawn will also help a lot in making sure your random people have a customized look.

[Jfoxtail]

Ambiance is a module is rarely limited to those little things like "people living their lives" although it helps.

 

Kamal for example has minimized his own contribution i.e. the "Arabian portion" of Path of Evil.. the second major area. I am sure Crimmor is the same just not had time to play it.

 

Old Festerpot created Almraven in NWN1 which is another that exemplifies ambiance

 

Ambiance is:

 

1) Cultural consistency. It makes sense

No singleton Vikings roaming the streets of a desert city. Perhaps a group in a tavern ~ make your story unfold; but consistency.

 

2) Names/personalities that fit the cultural consistency

Draw upon real world middle ages if you need to. Use Byzantine or Berber names for "Byzantine or Berber locations'

 

3) Merchants and trade people selling items aligned to cultural consistency. 

Scimitars in the desert ! Sure. Frostwolf skin cloaks... not so much.

 

4) People leading their normal lives in a way consistent with the setting. 

No wood cutting ax crews where there is no wood !

 

--

 

Of course some of this is prejudiced by our own expectations as players based on how we view the world (correctly or incorrectly).

 

Never the less the Faerun source data in the adventure guides re-enforces these cultural myths. In some cases exaggerates them even on purpose.

 

If you are creating your own world.. invest time in a back story. Its heavy lifting but it can be done and believable. 

 

Aielund Saga is one such example in NWN1. Icewind Dales and Baldurs Gate in NWN2 albiet those are recreations of ambiance created by previous developers.

[Jfoxtail]

Nothing ruins ambiance more than a bard named Brittney Spearsong... in the local tavern...

 

Unless you are going for humor as your ambiance.... and further she has questionable morals

[kamal_]

When researching for Crimmor, Almraiven was basically universally recommended in nwn1 as the "best city". Instead of being a "generic western european fantasy" city it does very well in representing the area (Calimshan) where it's located.

For Crimmor I had the Dragon magazine article as well as the 2nd edition sourcebook that covered Amn/Tethyr, plis the Maztica sourcebook as a reference since Amn is a big player there. Amn is basically imperial Spain, what with the colonizing the new world and the artwork of their soldiers looking like conquistadors. I decided that since the arabic Calimshan was to their south, I would go for a quasi moorish spain feel. That was how I tracked down what type of music I would have my bards play for instance. It also affected some of the food items, such as the ensaimadas that play a part in the plot. I had plenty of references for npcs and foods such from the sourcebooks and Dragon magazine article, so putting in appropriate npcs with appropriate personalities was straightforward enough.

I asked Arkazleth and our resident dwarf harrumpher Dorateen for their opinions on the cultural ppropriateness of things such as Sathur Rinif and her husband's relative occupations. Her making ensaimadas as a pastry and her husband's bee keeping profession weren't picked at random.

A while ago I found a list somewhere of medieval professions, good for making npcs that arent the standard smith/innkeeper/generic merchant etc professions. Some of those professions integrate quite well into the types of things an adventurer might need, such as a professional translator to read those ancient scrolls from the dungeon the party found, or a heraldrist to identify the crest warn by their attackers.

[Dann-J]

The point of ambience in towns and cities isn't for the players to notice it. The point is to stop the players from noticing the absence of any ambience. In fact, if the attention of players is drawn to the ambience then you might have overdone it.

[Lugaid of the Red Stripes]

Using shouts can help liven city ambiance, allowing NPCs to interact with each other rather than just following their own waypoints like zombies.  Dana'an 2.0 has a couple of areas with this kind of ambiance demo-ed out; New Market, Tondee's Tavern, Port Royal, and the Port Royal Courthouse. 

 

I don't think I quite got around to scripting an outhouse that would shout for a random passerby to sudden urge to sit on it, but the some mechanic would apply.

 

Hardest thing to do with ambient scripts is create liveliness where and when the player will actually notice it.

[rjshae]

It sounds like a good tactic then may be to use triggered ambiance; activating particular sequences of activity when the player starts to come within view.

[Dann-J]

It sounds like a good tactic then may be to use triggered ambiance; activating particular sequences of activity when the player starts to come within view.

 

I've been experimenting with a custom AOE aura that causes NPCs to turn towards the player and make comments when you get within their AOE trigger (a 5 metre radius around them). It could be expanded to include additional comments when you leave their AOE. Merchants can hawk their wares to the player as they pass by, or villagers can make plot-related or reputation-related comments based on local variables stored somewhere.

 

I have a heartbeat script for neutral animals that has them wander about or follow waypoints, and occasionally make one of three specified sounds at random (stored as string variables on them). There's also an option to make them stay within a specified radius of a home waypoint, so they don't wander halfway across a city. It really livens up domestic animals if pigs occasionally grunt, or stray dogs growl, pant or bark, with the sound actually coming from an individual animal rather than a randomised sound object. 

 

I also have the option of giving neutral animals a 'timid' custom AOE that causes them to run away from players if they get too close. Walking through a flock of wandering, clucking chickens can cause them to run every which way in panic, with them all returning to within range of a home waypoint again once you've gone.

[rjshae]

I've been experimenting with a custom AOE aura that causes NPCs to turn towards the player and make comments when you get within their AOE trigger (a 5 metre radius around them). It could be expanded to include additional comments when you leave their AOE. Merchants can hawk their wares to the player as they pass by, or villagers can make plot-related or reputation-related comments based on local variables stored somewhere.

 

I've done something similar, although I just used a trigger--that gives finer control over the behavior, but it takes a little more work to lay it down. It's a nice effect though, particularly for shopkeeps, guards, and flunkeys.

[Tchos]

Same here, but I use the perception script.

[Jfoxtail]

The point of ambience in towns and cities isn't for the players to notice it. The point is to stop the players from noticing the absence of any ambience. In fact, if the attention of players is drawn to the ambience then you might have overdone it.

 

I agree and I disagree.

 

It depends actually on the "setting" or the ambiance you are trying to achieve.

 

(Wow how about that for saying nothing LOL.)

 

More exactly:

 

In "Zombie Armageddon" settings the whole point is you have to notice the ambiance - its over the top. Dim, smokey, creepy..... etc

 

In  "Comedy Parody Central starring Jon Stallwart" the ambiance - has to be about over the top such as my aforementioned Barbarian Brittney Spearsong and her phallic lute. 

 

In Kamal's "Medieval Moorish settings" clearly the ambiance is more subtle and therefore it adds to the quality of the mod. I speak of the Path of Evil but I have no doubt that Crimmor is exactly as good (Hall of Fame). Kamal is more serious and adventurous with his settings.

 

The ambiance balance is hard to achieve.

 

Many / Most of you are excellent at it so please take my comments in context.

 

I would only suggest that DannJ is correct as well... but I would a further note.

 

"Don't over-invest in creating ambiance".  Dont loose site of your forest because the trees are in the way.

 

Minimalist touches work fine especially if they are "consistent" and believable within context of the source material (Faerun, Greyhawk).

 

If you are creating a custom setting you do have to heavily invest in ambiance to make it believable.