366 réponses à ce sujet

[ThreeF]

I don't quite agree with the stereotypes you put forth for the characters. 

 

Morrigan was more than just a rebel mage and she was appropriate for the story because of Flemmiths involvement. Zevran and Alistair are not broken characters. They had their unique charm too. 

 

But I will say this, without Cassandra, Inquisition wouldn't have been a thing. She pulled the tome and told rhodrick to shove it. I didn't see leliana do that.

Of course they are more than just that stereotypes, or they would be very flat charters if they were just tropes, but their core are these tropes.  Zevran and Alistair are both quite broken men, one has intimacy issues, the other has low self-esteem and feels unloved (doesn't mean they can't be charming).

 

Cassandra is a rebel and a strong female character, you just happen not to like the other characteristics that make her character whole, but they are suitable for the story. And come to think of it Cassandra has many qualities that makes her unique within her strong woman ™ trope especially in her relationship with men.

[Uccio]

Because player-centric characters are one of the most shallow type of character one can encounter in games.

 

So being a bull head is somewhat better? My way or the highway? I find such personalities quite unattractive, one eyed characters.

If the person can be persuaded to see a new worldview with correct arguments then it can add a lot the story too.

[Lord Surinen]

Whoosh.

What I have said is 100% accurate. In fact both Lionhead and Bethesda approach RPG differently than BioWare. Not to mention that AAA RPG are rare on PC.

[ThreeF]

So being a bull head is somewhat better? My way or the highway? I find such personalities quite unattractive, one eyed characters.

If the person can be persuaded to see a new worldview with correct arguments then it can add a lot the story too.

If being a bull head is part of the personality of said character then it should remain this way and not change. One of the most important characteristic of Cassandra is that she is strong willed, a bull head as you say. If she wasn't a bull head she would not be Cassandra.

[TheOgre]

Of course they are more than just that stereotypes, or they would be very flat charters if they were just tropes, but their core are these tropes.  Zevran and Alistair are both quite broken men, one has intimacy issues, the other has low self-esteem and feels unloved (doesn't mean they can't be charming).

 

Cassandra is a rebel and a strong female character, you just happen not to like the other characteristics that make her character whole, but they are suitable for the story. And come to think of it Cassandra has many qualities that makes her unique within her strong woman ™ trope especially in her relationship with men.

 

Cassandra, a rebel? How did you come to that? She is such a stonewall character it's hard to get into the core without catching her at odd parts. I don't consider her more unique than the tropes you presented. You can't just label Morrigan a trope and ignore her subtleties and then find one action Cassandra does a rebel.

 

She has to have order or believe in a higher authority, she has to believe that an order is meant to do good, and acknowledge that it has potential for bad. At the end of the day, she's almost a polar opposite of Morrigan. She's very shy deep down inside and I hate that about her. If she was always consistent with her personality then I'd be okay with her.

[FKA_Servo]

What I have said is 100% accurate. In fact both Lionhead and Bethesda approach RPG differently than BioWare. Not to mention that AAA RPG are rare on PC.

 

What Panda is driving at, I assume, is that Fable had gay marriages in 2004 and with Skyrim (the first Beth game with romances right out of the box), they seem to have thrown their lot in with the nasty progressives as well.

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

I am actually sympathetic to this position - across the three games, I don't think there's been enough variety in the LIs available to straight male PCs. (Too many humans, for one thing!) I think it's much like people asking for a gay knight in shining armour.
 
It's only the guys who demand that options be taken away from other demographics in order to cater more to straight men that I have a problem with, and you don't seem to be doing that, so we're cool .

Is kinda weird that female Li's are usually always "normal looking" like BW are too afraid to differ incase there's massive hostility to it, although i understand after seeing guys get outraged over stuff as small as Cass having a scar & josephine having a beauty mark

[Lord Surinen]

What Panda is driving at, I assume, is that Fable had gay marriages in 2004 and with Skyrim (the first Beth game with romances right out of the box), they seem to have thrown their lot in with the nasty progressives as well.

Different kinds of interactions in the world. It just happens there, you can't compare both with BW games. While I disagree with it of course, it is far less forceful and alarming than what is in DA:I.

[ThreeF]

Cassandra, a rebel? How did you come to that? She is such a stonewall character it's hard to get into the core without catching her at odd parts. I don't consider her more unique than the tropes you presented. You can't just label Morrigan a trope and ignore her subtleties and then find one action Cassandra does a rebel.

She rebels against great many things through the course of the story, I'm sorry that you don't see that. Nobody is ignoring subtleties, Morrigan has hers, Cassandra has hers, they both consist of tropes, one doesn't negates the other.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Cassandra, a rebel? How did you come to that? She is such a stonewall character it's hard to get into the core without catching her at odd parts. I don't consider her more unique than the tropes you presented. You can't just label Morrigan a trope and ignore her subtleties and then find one action Cassandra does a rebel.

 

She has to have order or believe in a higher authority, she has to believe that an order is meant to do good, and acknowledge that it has potential for bad. At the end of the day, she's almost a polar opposite of Morrigan. She's very shy deep down inside and I hate that about her. If she was always consistent with her personality then I'd be okay with her.

Well, she does rebel against the Chantry by breaking away from it to form the Inquisition. She also wants to go against how the Chantry and Seekers currently are if she gets in a position to do so. 

[Uccio]

If being a bull head is part of the personality of said character then it should remain this way and not change. One of the most important characteristic of Cassandra is that she is strong willed, a bull head as you say. If she wasn't a bull head she would not be Cassandra.

 

Bull headed people can be made to see a different viewpoint. I know, I did it too. In her case such feature makes her as subtle as rock. That does not add to her charm. And if being a bull head is the only thing making her Cassandra then the character is not well made, very one dimensional.

[Uccio]

Well, she does rebel against the Chantry by breaking away from it to form the Inquisition. She also wants to go against how the Chantry and Seekers currently are if she gets in a position to do so. 

 

No she doesn´t really rebel. She keeps stating from the beginning that she served the divine, not chantry. So she doesn´t rebel against anything, she just works on like she did with divine justinia. 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

No she doesn´t really rebel. She keeps stating from the beginning that she served the divine, not chantry. So she doesn´t rebel against anything, she just works on like she did with divine justinia. 

She even says she is a rebel and heretic for doing what she did, but believes it is the right thing so will let history decide. 

[TheOgre]

She rebels against great many things through the course of the story, I'm sorry that you don't see that. Nobody is ignoring subtleties, Morrigan has hers, Cassandra has hers, they both consist of tropes, one doesn't negates the other.

 

Then how exactly is -she- breaking the norm, the diversity? She was unique in her character, but I see her no more or less unique than Morrigan. I wanted someone sure of themself. It didn't happen, I had to play a softer inquisitor that's well meaning toward most and pro chantry and order. As a result, I was limited in that regard.

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

Different kinds of interactions in the world. It just happens there, you can't compare both with BW games. While I disagree with it of course, it is far less forceful and alarming than what is in DA:I.

How are LGBT characters "forceful & alarming" in DA:I? there's 4 of them & the only 1 that's mandatory never mentions her sexuality whatsoever

[TheOgre]

She even says she is a rebel and heretic for doing what she did, but believes it is the right thing so will let history decide. 

 

That's a case of her doubting herself, one thing I didn't like particularly. She pulled a badass move and then right after, "was it the right choice?" I just wanted to chastise her as my character but I could not really.

[In Exile]

That was actually my problem with Cassandra, I had no interest in her character, not personality nor her world view which was the total opposite of mine. I had to butter her up for a romance which made me just annoyed. Why can´t she change her view of the world? Then Josephine option was just sad, I really don´t see her as a viable option.
I tried to play female pc version (which I think have better romances) but what I really want to play is a straight male pc with variable romance options.

Yeah, how dare she not completely abandoned her worldview and attitude. That's the kind of character development we need to see.

[Lord Surinen]

How are LGBT characters "forceful & alarming" in DA:I? there's 4 of them & the only 1 that's mandatory never mentions her sexuality whatsoever

They are speaking about their choices in  life openly, that is Dorian is speaking even if you don't ask him. Then there is a woman who you are forced to call 'man'. There is no option to call Krem 'her' during dialogue option with Iron Bull.

[Angry_Elcor]

They should add more females for male only romance options to balance everything out.

 

But then there would be more females than males... AND THEY WOULD TAKE OVER!!!

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

They are speaking about their choices in  life openly, that is Dorian is speaking even if you don't ask him. Then there is a woman who you are forced to call 'man'. There is no option to call Krem 'her' during dialogue option with Iron Bull.

Yes &....? why is that a bad thing exactly?

[Angry_Elcor]

Different kinds of interactions in the world. It just happens there, you can't compare both with BW games. While I disagree with it of course, it is far less forceful and alarming than what is in DA:I.

 

Wait, what? How can someone, who wants to be able to force a female elf to marry them and break their will through physical torture, actually use the words "forceful" and "alarming" in the same sentence with a straight face?

[Lord Surinen]

Yes &....? why is that a bad thing exactly?

It is not a time nor place to discuss it in details(not to mention forum rules). BioWare should stop forcing agendas.

[In Exile]

They are speaking about their choices in life openly, that is Dorian is speaking even if you don't ask him. Then there is a woman who you are forced to call 'man'. There is no option to call Krem 'her' during dialogue option with Iron Bull.

You shopped in the wrong aisle. "Bigotry Simulator: 1933" is only available on Stormfront. That'll give you the perfect platform to express your distaste at the idea of non-straight characters having the temerity to exist in your physical presence, and you'll find a group of like-minded individuals who want to use women as breeding pods for their racially pure dream race.

[XxPrincess(x)ThreatxX]

It is not a time nor place to discuss it in details(not to mention forum rules). BioWare should stop forcing agendas.

"forcing agendas" you must have a sore throat

[xkg]

They are speaking about their choices in  life openly, that is Dorian is speaking even if you don't ask him.

 

Happens in RL very often. Do you want example ?

No one asked you about your preferences, yet you keep talking about them.