199 réponses à ce sujet

[Octarin]

You should try divinity 2 the dragon knight saga first in case you haven't played it.

 

True. But not necessary. All Divinities give something of the background, you can catch up to it. I would too though, he's right.

[C0uncil0rTev0s]

Ty guys just got all of them apart from OS. Need some time to get all of the story

[Octarin]

Ty guys just got all of them apart from OS. Need some time to get all of the story

 

Right then, we'll see you again in six months time! Have fun!

[C0uncil0rTev0s]

Right then, we'll see you again in six months time! Have fun!

Well maybe we will get banter and other critical issues patched by then

[HTTP 404]

I do have to comment that your Qunari Mage is not of the Qun.  You were born outside and considered Tal Vashoth by actual Qunari.  I am sorry that you feel that way about the game and I enjoy the game.  I don't think it is the best thing ever but I enjoy it.  I would have loved some kind of unique origin story as well.

[TurretSyndrome]

 

Now, there was 2009 release, Divinity 2: The Dragon Knight Saga, which as a matter of fact I got and I am playing for a couple of days now and it's fantastic. It's single player, classical RPG, you have your hero and you go do things along the main questline, which, so far seems quite promising. Larian Studios is German, and they have a really good sense of humour as well, you'll see minor gags and things that compare to the Fable type of gags, chuckles all around. The game resembles Kingdom of Amalur in its gamestyle and handling. 

 

 

Ah, the Dragon Knight Saga, what a gem of a game that was. The story, the side quests, the mind reading! Everything was fun in that game. 

 

The undead merchant in the tower, one of the funniest parts in the game.

[Reymoose]

I do have to comment that your Qunari Mage is not of the Qun.  You were born outside and considered Tal Vashoth by actual Qunari.  I am sorry that you feel that way about the game and I enjoy the game.  I don't think it is the best thing ever but I enjoy it.  I would have loved some kind of unique origin story as well.

 

I think that's missing the point a little bit. There's nothing to indicate that Tal-Vashoth are any more accepted than Qunari in Fereldan/Orlais, which makes the npc's impression of "Your Worship!" or at the very least the lack of opposition to you *being* that race and accepted as the Inquisitior is what makes it jarring.

 

The fact that that racial choices' superficial effect is a lower score in 'Wicked Hearts' while the common people blindly treat you no different than a human noble Inquisitor is more on point in my opinion.

 

Obviously we can't have wildly divergent reactions (or maybe we could if some *cough* 'content' *cough* was cut), but if there aren't lasting effects ingame to being a Qunari then why include it at all besides a cosmetic 'sell'? If you have to be shoe-horned into a specific backstory, why not include the noble/commoner, dalish/city elf, dwarf noble/casteless choices instead of a very out-of-place character who without any previous indication is accepted in what is a very racially divided setting?

[S Seraff]

OP I deeply sympathize. I was on the verge of returning it myself several times - something i never thought possible with a bioware game. basically, ME amd DA aree the only games I PLAY

 

my sense is that bioware dont listen, or EA dont allow them to listen, to what fans are saying they really want. a nearly endless grind, broken world state importer (I'm always nervous my hawke will come out wrong, and so far i've not been wrong to worry), no in-game face editor (which is sorely needed, and everyone knew that at launch), odd story structure (your "hey, be our inquisitor!" note, for example). 

 

I keep thinking maybe they'll release some quality of life improvements that matter. obvious ones. dunno - doesnt seem to be their priority?

[Rawgrim]

I don't have anything against consoles.. I'm fine with them and I know that console players want the same thing from a game : Immersion

 

I don't blame consoles. Ok, DAI is consolized but some people here said that DAO was great on consoles too. So why can't they make the same quality game again ?

My point was that I'm surprised that people complain about streamlining when they were well aware that their target is the console market first because it's the biggest.

 

 

You're right.. The removal of healing is not streamlining but it's a very annoying aspect of the game. It gives me a sense of limitation and I waste time by traveling back to camp to replenish my supplies and than travel all the way back again. This should not be the case... Ok, I'm fine with limited potions, but at least allow me to regen health while not in combat to avoid the pain of travelling back and forth to camp.

 

 

Here is a fun fact. I player DA:O on PC first, and then later on Xbox 360. Its the same game, but it was "dumbed down" on the console for some strange reason. The puzzles and such were simplified. Especially that bridge during the Sacred Ashes

[Fast Jimmy]

I don't blame consoles. Ok, DAI is consolized but some people here said that DAO was great on consoles too. So why can't they make the same quality game again ?

Because the PC and console games were developed separate from each other. The game was developed for over five years as PC only and was ready to ship out the door March 2009, but was delayed over six months to do a console version with a different development team.

The phrase they used "for PC first" or whatever in DA:I's marketing? It actually was true for DA:O. DA:I was developed with four console platforms and one PC one at the same time. The concessions to the UI and game stability for console over PC show.

Separate UI, combat and QA teams for PC and console. That's really the only long-term solution. And it's not a cheap one.

[Elhanan]

@ OP - This paragraph seems to point to the problem:

I didn't understand why my character, a Qunari mage (the equivalent to a Muslim imam in Medieval Europe) would be promoted to the head of a quasi-Catholic paramilitary when four human adherents of the religion with better credentials were passed up. I didn't understand why healing was removed, when the previous games suggested that healing was one of the only reasons why mages were tolerated in Andrastean Thedas. I didn't understand why companions just seemed to come out of the woodwork to join my group without any more complex a motivation than authorial fiat. I didn't understand why side-quests in this game seemed to come from nothing, mean nothing, and then change nothing once I had collected the pre-requisite number of tinfoil wrappers from the beach to satisfy the quest.

* The Qunari Inquisitor is an outcast of the Qun; not part of it, especially when choosing a Mage.
* Healing is still extant; Spirit Healers are sidelined taking care of the masses, so we have potions, and more limited Spells.
* Some companions appear for the good of Thedas; others for personal agendas.
* Your quests seems to be different from the ones in my game. I accepted the ones that applied to my Inquisitor and his motives; skipped or passed on those that did not.

These problems seem to stem from a lack of understanding what is present, and the only abyss I see is one created from flawed personal expectations.

[Elsariel]

- I agree there should have been some better intro than the prisoner thing.

- How does your wrist hurt playing DA:I on PC??

- I'm sorry you had crashes every 20 minutes on PC. That was not my experience.

-You are not Qunari. Technically, you're Tal'Vashoth. They don't follow the Qun.

- I also don't get why healing was removed.

- Sera, Vivienne, The Iron Bull, and Blackwall all seemed to just be random companions: "Hey I just met you, and this is crazy, I want to join your party, so call me maybe." Cole, Dorian, Varric, Solas, and Cassandra are more intwined in the main plot.

- Side quests are filler and I don't mind that too much. I just wish there was more to the main story.

- Sorry to hear your keep info didn't import. That must be frustrating. Thankfully, that has not yet been my experience.

[Bountron]

Wouldn't give him back his money because he did not like it. You dont get the money from the cinema because the Hobbit, Battle of five Armies was not as good as Return of the King.

The game is exactly as described in the magazines I read and I have to live with that. It is a turn around. Great artwork and graphics, lackluster direction and presentation despite some very nice highlights like return to Skyhold.


Hehehe

[Octarin]

Wouldn't give him back his money because he did not like it. You dont get the money from the cinema because the Hobbit, Battle of five Armies was not as good as Return of the King.

The game is exactly as described in the magazines I read and I have to live with that. It is a turn around. Great artwork and graphics, lackluster direction and presentation despite some very nice highlights like return to Skyhold.


Hehehe

 

Actually it's not. But I have this suspicion that you're just trolling, so I won't even bother to go through the why with you. In other news, welcome to the disgruntled players forums, you're invited to take a look around at why people are complaining.

[robertmarilyn]

Ty guys just got all of them apart from OS. Need some time to get all of the story

 

I just now bought them all, including OS. Looking forward to playing them. I'll start with the first one and work through them. 

[Elsariel]

Actually it's not. But I have this suspicion that you're just trolling, so I won't even bother to go through the why with you. In other news, welcome to the disgruntled players forums, you're invited to take a look around at why people are complaining.

Not sure he's trolling. He said it was lackluster in presentation and direction so it's not like he doesn't see faults.

[Sartoz]

You know, DA:O was a great game on consoles as well, and there are probably just as many upset console gamers over this game as PC gamers.  Stop blaming the existence of consoles for this.  

True...--> ".. many upset console gamers over this game as PC gamers.."

 

Hmmm...-->".. Stop blaming the existence of consoles for this"

 

Unfortunately, this game was first designed for the Next Gen consoles ( from Bio interviews), only for Bio to realize that the game would not fit well into the Old Gen hardware (low CPU power, low GPU power, low memory footprint... etc)... some serious re-design choices were made... And, (again, from Bio interviews) Bio admitted that the graphics for the Old Gen consoles had to be toned down... What Bio attempted to do is to give the New and Old Gen console players the same game play ... one of the reasons for such poor hairstyles is the mesh layer design... so, less mesh layers = ps3 and 360 but horrible graphics.. more mesh layers = PS4 and XB1 and good graphics. In the PC we can set the graphics to Low = ps3/360 equivalent graphics....

 

The cross platform console strategy is one reason why the old gen console players have so many performance problems... but the PC version also does not have the proper PC keyboard and mouse controls as found in DAO + DA2. nor the expected UI, inventory management, auto-attack feature from DA2 and the tac list from DAO+DA2... and the almost useless tac-cam. Features, that from old DA PC players, were expecting in DAI. The UI and game controls immediately screams Console Port. And a very poor one at that.

 

This game has so many problems affecting all platforms that's it's unbelievable.. and yes, the PS4/XB1 plays well, minus odd bugs. Yet, even some of these Next Gen guys have posted asking when Patch4 is coming out, for the PS4... 

 

Oh, well, patience I'm told is a virtue.

[Sartoz]

I think that's missing the point a little bit. There's nothing to indicate that Tal-Vashoth are any more accepted than Qunari in Fereldan/Orlais, which makes the npc's impression of "Your Worship!" or at the very least the lack of opposition to you *being* that race and accepted as the Inquisitior is what makes it jarring.

 

The fact that that racial choices' superficial effect is a lower score in 'Wicked Hearts' while the common people blindly treat you no different than a human noble Inquisitor is more on point in my opinion.

 

Obviously we can't have wildly divergent reactions (or maybe we could if some *cough* 'content' *cough* was cut), but if there aren't lasting effects ingame to being a Qunari then why include it at all besides a cosmetic 'sell'? If you have to be shoe-horned into a specific backstory, why not include the noble/commoner, dalish/city elf, dwarf noble/casteless choices instead of a very out-of-place character who without any previous indication is accepted in what is a very racially divided setting?

Personally, I don't understand the reason for including the Qunari character. Perhaps, to appease to the fan base?

 

Plus, given the back story of the Qunari, humans have all kinds of reasons to distrust the invaders... Exalted marches were required to "throw them out" from their land grab invasions...

[Elsariel]

Personally, I don't understand the reason for including the Qunari character. Perhaps, to appease to the fan base?

Plus, given the back story of the Qunari, humans have all kinds of reasons to distrust the invaders... Exalted marches were required to "throw them out" from their land grab invasions...

People have been clamoring to play Qunari since DAO so I think fan appeasement was a big part of it. It does seem like both Qunari and Dwarves are tacked on. There really should have been more challenges, different reactions if you chose to play anything other than human warrior /rogue. That, of course, would require much more writing and voice work but there it is.

[HTTP 404]

I think that's missing the point a little bit. There's nothing to indicate that Tal-Vashoth are any more accepted than Qunari in Fereldan/Orlais, which makes the npc's impression of "Your Worship!" or at the very least the lack of opposition to you *being* that race and accepted as the Inquisitior is what makes it jarring.

 

The fact that that racial choices' superficial effect is a lower score in 'Wicked Hearts' while the common people blindly treat you no different than a human noble Inquisitor is more on point in my opinion.

 

Obviously we can't have wildly divergent reactions (or maybe we could if some *cough* 'content' *cough* was cut), but if there aren't lasting effects ingame to being a Qunari then why include it at all besides a cosmetic 'sell'? If you have to be shoe-horned into a specific backstory, why not include the noble/commoner, dalish/city elf, dwarf noble/casteless choices instead of a very out-of-place character who without any previous indication is accepted in what is a very racially divided setting?

 

All I said was that the Qunari we chose to play is not from the Qun.  You are reading into much more than what I wrote.  If you read my last sentence, you would see that I wish there was an origin to play through.  So I do not disagree with how different races affect the game.  

[KaiserShep]

Personally, I don't understand the reason for including the Qunari character. Perhaps, to appease to the fan base?

 

Plus, given the back story of the Qunari, humans have all kinds of reasons to distrust the invaders... Exalted marches were required to "throw them out" from their land grab invasions...

I suspect that this is very much the case, and I think that it took priority over how well (or poorly) it fits into the story. With Origins, it works because of two key reasons: Duncan is the common element for every origin, and the Grey Warden organization itself is a temporary measure meant for a singular purpose, so it doesn't matter if it's an elf or a dwarf or whatever, because it's a monster-hunter that's meant strictly to stop the blight then go away. The backstories, for the most part, strike me as being particularly flimsy, and a playable origin likely would have little hope of correcting that, because save for the human mage, none of the characters have any direct tie to the story other than that they might have been sent to spy or were hired by whomever, which isn't exactly riveting stuff.

[DaemionMoadrin]

Larian Studios is German, and they have a really good sense of humour as well, you'll see minor gags and things that compare to the Fable type of gags, chuckles all around. The game resembles Kingdom of Amalur in its gamestyle and handling.

 

What? A funny german game? Now I'm curious. *goes off to buy games*

 

Btw... it's not like they didn't try to optimize for PC, it's that they concentrated their efforts on AMD's Mantle (the CPU/GPU in both next gen consoles is AMD) which works significantly better on PC.

From the release notes of the current NVIDIA driver: Dragon Age Inquisition runs poorly (stutters) on NVIDIA hardware. [1588023]

Huh. Coincidence? I think not.

[Rizilliant]

C0oncil0r: I started with Divinity: Original Sin,a nd  I friggin LOVE IT! Its not dark in design, but the gameplay is absolutely spot on.. Very well done.. The dev actively communicate, and this game completely outshines this abysmal Bioware tragedy! Its absolutely worth every penny.. The few problems the game did have were addressed quickly, and professionally!

 

Edit: As for Qunari experience.. The more you play, and read about experiences in Inquisition, its very clear that the game was made to appeal to all, but was deliberately half assed.. The silent treatment after release only enforces this thought.. Great hype, appeal to all, sell to multitudes of player types,... Once sold, deny all the obvious problems, and shortcuts.. Tout GOTY award purchases to cover it all up..

[Bountron]

Actually it's not. But I have this suspicion that you're just trolling, so I won't even bother to go through the why with you. In other news, welcome to the disgruntled players forums, you're invited to take a look around at why people are complaining.

Hi Octarin,
I have briefly glanced over your posts and I want you to know that I can fully understand your anger and critique. In fact, I ve already collected warning points from the forum moderators for telling them the truth in nice words, so we are on the same boat.

Nevertheless, I rubbed some salt into the thread participants wounds because it is simply unfair to say everything is bad. Although I prefer the older games, I do appreciate the huge amount of work they have invested in (artwork) - I just say that it is sad they wasted so much potential.
I think this one is just the next step in their evolution, transformation into a Ubisoft like company. Their games are getting increasingly similar and yet very popular and they try to copy them. You also mentioned the money aspect.

But I think it is playable and in MY country you have no legitimate right to give it back after 20!! hours of consuming the game and then say :"hey biofail, here you have it, nice try btw" I dont know how things are in the US, but this is a slap in the face to all honest ppl who have done great work, although the final product did not live up to their customers expectations well enough. And they get overfrustrated cause of pure hatred posts in their forums.

BioWare has changed, changed the focus to appeal to an Assassins Creed audience maybe. It is more action oriented, less tactical, easier. I think we have to deal with it and avoid their products in the future if the situation gets worse. But I had some good moments too, I dont gloss over that. The perma clicking and lootorgy is pure stupidity though.

So you have my respect and I hope you get my point. If you are looking for storyheavy games I'd recommend Telltale games.

[Kallipolis]

Hey all, this is Kallipolis again.  I'm not so used to commenting on forums, so it was a little bit of a surprise to see that this thread got so big overnight.  I absolutely appreciate hearing the multiplicity of opinions expressed here, and really, it's nice to know that I'm not standing alone in the wilderness, throwing rocks at the fortress wall, as it were.

But I didn't want people to think that I was judging them if they liked the game.  Far from it -- I'm honestly happy for you if you enjoyed DAI.  Games you enjoy are games you enjoy, and nobody has the right to tell you what your tastes ought to be.  I mean, for all its bad design, I enjoyed DAII despite the fact that it's regarded as merely a few shades more enjoyable than the Hantavirus.  I think that DAI had the skeleton of an uncontestedly good game.  Just go to Metacritic, and you'll see that commenters are divided because DAI isn't a straightforwardly bad game.  What baffles me is that BioWare could have had their cake and eaten it too:  They could have appealed to gamers like me and appealed to whatever market they were aiming for with DAI if they had just made simple design changes.

The "actionization", or "consolization", or what-have-you of DAI isn't the big problem.  When I returned DAI, I went to Steam and downloaded BioShock Infinite and Deus Ex: Human Revolution -- and I really loved them, despite the fact that they were well out of my comfort zone regarding action games.  But I asked myself, "Why did I enjoy those two action games and not DAI?"  In BioShock Infinite, the flabbiness of the gameplay was outweighed by an imaginative, charming story that was both tight and well-paced.  In DX:HR, the big, open areas are filled with people, secrets, and information to discover.  Quests are given by real people, and they feel like they have emotional weight behind them.  For instance, in Hengsha, China, my character was asked by a high-ranking prostitute to assassinate a crime boss looking to force her girls to undergo risky surgery.  You can actually argue the morality of murder with her, and if you do, she offers you another way to complete the quest!  I'm not a designer, but I don't think that the infamous "gather ram meat" quest in the Hinterlands wouldn't have been so objectionable if the quest had actually demanded reflection on the part of the player.  What if, when you gathered the ram meat, the game said that you had to make a decision as Inquisitor about who got the most food?  You could choose to feed militia-worthy individuals in order to draft them into your army (reflected in Power gained from the quest); you could choose to feed artisans and crafters in order to get more items and resources; or you could order that the ram meat be given preferentially to children and the sick and elderly, despite it not being an advantageous choice.  That's what an RPG is to me:  Not the collection of the ram meat, but the reflection on what to do with it after you have it.

I want to talk about some of the points that were brought up by people like Elhanan (whose opinions I do respect in this instance):

"Dragon Age lore paints Spirit Healers as rare. / Potions were the new design by BioWare."

It might surprise you to know that I agree about the Spirit Healers, to an extent.  DAO made it so that certain specializations were unlocked after interesting choices and quests (Blood Mage, Reaver, and Arcane Warrior, for example).  But DAO failed in giving the rarer specializations equal screen-time.  The Spirit Healers we see in the Dragon Age games, Finn excluded, are people who've had questionable relationships with spirits.  The Legionnaire Scouts in Awakening are dwarves who've trained in Taint- and lyrium-imbued caves for years.  How did the Warden gain Spirit Healer powers?  How did Hawke become a Reaver, when that requires drinking magically-prepared dragon blood?  DAI had the right idea by making specializations the product of a quest, but they lost a golden opportunity by removing Spirit Healer and Blood Mage totally.  It would have been a nod to previous games and, frankly, an awesome quest that the game needed to go into the Fade and commune with a demon or spirit to gain either the Spirit Healer or Blood Mage specializations.

Replacing healing with potions didn't feel like a positive move.  It reminded me of the most annoying parts of the Vancian magic system -- all of my forward progress, all of my spectacular battles, were hobbled by the fact that I kept thinking, "Oh great, another battle.  How many of my potions is this one going to drain?"  I don't find it fun to have to stop my exploration of a giant world every five minutes to trudge back to a camp, then trudge back to where I was.  Video games are all about immersion, and running around for potions made me feel more like an office worker who had to refill the printer than an epic hero come to save the land.

"Your big grey Inquisitor is Vashoth, not a follower of the Qun."

I understood the differentiation (and thought it would be fun to be a Saarebas after seeing their fascinating characterization in DAII).  But Andrastean Thedans aren't me.  They see seven foot-tall grey horned giants who can control fire, and their first response is to turn to the Chantry's teachings:  All the grey giants are Qunari.  The Qunari are all heretics.  Mages are tainted with a communicable original sin that sets them apart from God.  It struck me as unrealistic that centuries of dogma instilled in the heads of fearful, uneducated peasantry would be overturned the moment a Qunari mage (suspected of killing the Divine) showed up with an unexplainable glowing effect in her hand.  The writers had a opportunity to introduce a genuinely alternative storyline for such an unorthodox character, but after seventeen hours, I didn't notice any real differentiation between a human Inquisitor and a Qunari one.  I didn't play the elf or dwarf characters, but I'd be willing to bet that it's largely the same problem for their players too.

"Your companions aren't all working for the same goals."

That wasn't my complaint.  In fact, only two companions in DAO are working towards the same goal as the Warden:  Alistair and Wynne.  Morrigan wants a tainted child.  Zevran wants to die.  Shale and Oghren are without a home or identity, and follow the Warden because they have nowhere else to go.  It is a Sten's role in the Qun to submit to the will of a superior.  Leliana, as we see in DAII and DAI, may be following the Warden to spy on them.  Dog follows the Warden not because he cares about Darkspawn, but because he loves the Warden.

What bothered me about DAI's companions was that there seemed to be no reason for them to become my companions in the most familiar sense of the word.  Solas and Varric just appear with no more a build-up than, "We happened to be in the neighborhood, and it looked like you needed a rogue and a mage."  With Blackwall, Leliana just sort of tells you, "We heard there was a Grey Warden in the area.  Go get him, Inquisitor!"  Iron Bull shows up and pretty much shrugs, offering his assistance out of the blue.  That disappoints me, if only because the previous Dragon Age games gave you a "test run" with all of your companions to get to connect with them before you brought them into the main quest.  In some places, whole levels were designed for that goal.  Sigrun and Kal Hirol from Awakening come to mind.

"Side quests are purely optional."

They are.  But I don't find that a good argument for the tedium of DAI's side quests.  DAO, for example, was packed full of side quests too.  But in DAO, most of the side quests feel like they create new stories for your Warden and expand the world in some way.  It wasn't executed perfectly -- the "Denerim thieves' guild" quests are banal in the extreme -- but Slim Couldry and his quests were small, almost meaningless, and ended up being absolute jewels regardless.  Side quest doesn't have to mean "busywork".

Plus, DAI is about 60% side quests.  For better or worse, It's the natural result of trying to create a game world like Skyrim.  If you ask me to go without them, I suddenly find myself paying sixty dollars for a third of a game.  If I can't ask EA to pay only twenty dollars to play 1/3d of their game, then it seems only fair that EA has to provide a game where 2/3d of the content is more than rock-collecting.