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[FKA_Servo]

Uh no...because boobs. Remember?

 

You're right!

 

We got so caught up in the nefarious machinations of the gay agenda that I forgot about the nefarious machinations of the feminist agenda. My B.

[Rawgrim]

No.  Dorian is gay and it should have been left at that.  But then his personal quest was really a preach/teach/lesson with the intent of preaching to parents that they should accept if their child is gay or with teaching children that their parents or other parents should accept them if they are gay and not try to change them.  It wasn't even subtle or anything.  They might as well had Dorian tell the inquisitor, "have a seat on my lap, and I'll teach you about the oppression of gays and how parents need to be more accepting of us, then you can go off and spread the good word". 

 

 

Leliana's quest in DA:O had a lot of gay element in it too. Marjorlaine was Leliana's lover and all that. Leliana speaks about it a lot when you talk to her in camp too.

 

Did that bother you as well? It is basically the same thing.

[FKA_Servo]

Leliana's quest in DA:O had a lot of gay element in it too. Marjorlaine was Leliana's lover and all that. Leliana speaks about it a lot when you talk to her in camp too.

 

Did that bother you as well? It is basically the same thing.

 

This is a double standard that I suspect he doesn't have a problem with. Call it a hunch.

[papercut_ninja]

For God's sake, can someone just stick some boobs on the red templar behemoth and be done with it...

[eyezonlyii]

Leliana's quest in DA:O had a lot of gay element in it too. Marjorlaine was Leliana's lover and all that. Leliana speaks about it a lot when you talk to her in camp too.
 
Did that bother you as well? It is basically the same thing.

Doubtful. There were boobs^2, therefore it's not gay.

[eyezonlyii]

Leliana's quest in DA:O had a lot of gay element in it too. Marjorlaine was Leliana's lover and all that. Leliana speaks about it a lot when you talk to her in camp too.
 
Did that bother you as well? It is basically the same thing.

On the Mass effect side there is nyreen and aria as well.

[Rawgrim]

On the Mass effect side there is nyreen and aria as well.

 

Well, yeah. But ME doesn't have a gay man as the lead writer.

[Killdren88]

I'm glad the Desire Demons are gone simply for the fact I was sick of seeing request for inncubus. The best compromise was to remove them from the game. It avoids the whinning.

[Poison_Berrie]

No.  Dorian is gay and it should have been left at that.  But then his personal quest was really a preach/teach/lesson with the intent of preaching to parents that they should accept if their child is gay or with teaching children that their parents or other parents should accept them if they are gay and not try to change them.  It wasn't even subtle or anything.  They might as well had Dorian tell the inquisitor, "have a seat on my lap, and I'll teach you about the oppression of gays and how parents need to be more accepting of us, then you can go off and spread the good word". 

I don't get it.

The point of most of these Inner Circle quests is to involve you into something of personal importance to the people in your inner circle. Why is this one worse than Cassandra's views and revelations about the Seekers or Solas' spirit friend?

The story, IMO, works given the context of the situation and it definitely carries a broader issue than just gay acceptance (though in the context, that stands out quite strong). 

 

Also what has any of this to do with the fact that they decided not to spend the investment into creating/finishing desire demons and brood mothers?

[Loup Blanc]

Then why are you posting here? 

 

Games that value story over gameplay are few. I am sticking around, just to see, just in case Bioware pulls one out of their ass that might interest me. But yeah, I am not counting on it.

[Lord Surinen]

Yes, Dragon Age used to be a darker game. On the other hand you can visit pretty dark places in this game, the ones that nobody should enter.

 

 

SkyKing, I fully agree with you, this game has became a platform for agendas. It has became so much ridiculous that you can hit 2 of your male companions but not even one woman (I have got banned twice for saying exactly these words. 'trolling')

 

Stop with minority content and give us back knife kills, demon teats and free us from agendas.

[Rawgrim]

I'm glad the Desire Demons are gone simply for the fact I was sick of seeing request for inncubus. The best compromise was to remove them from the game. It avoids the whinning.

 

Which was odd, really. Desire demons wern't really about sexual desires. More of general deep desires for power and whatnot.

[Winged Silver]

Yes, Dragon Age used to be a darker game. On the other hand you can visit pretty dark places in this game, the ones that nobody should enter.

 

 

SkyKing, I fully agree with you, this game has became a platform for agendas. It has became so much ridiculous that you can hit 2 of your male companions but not even one woman (I have got banned twice for saying exactly these words. 'trolling')

 

Stop with minority content and give us back knife kills, demon teats and free us from agendas.

 

This doesn't make sense to me. Bioware has always made an effort to include LGBT elements. If it was more apparent in this game, I hardly see that as an agenda 'being shoved down people's throats'. The characters who did talk about their sexuality had story reasons to do so. A lot of people talk about Dorian just dropping the preaching, but if your character asked about it, then...yeah. He's going to talk about it. Otherwise it's really not that in-your-face. And if someone did feel like it was in their face, that might have more to do with exposure than anything else. I, personally, did not find it exaggerated, and thought Dorian's story was an interesting look into the Tevinter culture, which was something we knew very little of.

[Winged Silver]

But that is completely double sided.  First I don't know if he is the lead author for the whole game.  Atleast until DAI he only did parts of games.  

 

I'm pretty sure Dragon Age wouldn't be recognizable without the talents of David Gaider. I'm not even sure it would exist today without him. He did create most of the lore...

[Lord Surinen]

This doesn't make sense to me. Bioware has always made an effort to include LGBT elements. If it was more apparent in this game, I hardly see that as an agenda 'being shoved down people's throats'. The characters who did talk about their sexuality had story reasons to do so. A lot of people talk about Dorian just dropping the preaching, but if your character asked about it, then...yeah. He's going to talk about it. Otherwise it's really not that in-your-face. And if someone did feel like it was in their face, that might have more to do with exposure than anything else. I, personally, did not find it exaggerated, and thought Dorian's story was an interesting look into the Tevinter culture, which was something we knew very little of.

Well, I'm not here to judge senses, but as far as I know Dorian will speak about his non straight alignment without asking about it. Also, there is a girl whom you are forced to call 'he' during certain discussion with Iron Bull (there is no option to choose calling her 'her'). It is 'in your face'. It should have never ever be included in this game. Also, most definately BioWare did not 'always' make effort to expose people to rather unsettling content. I'm all for insight into Tevinter Imperium's culture but not by the words of an outcast who could not even follow his duty to the family. It is just another reject example after Fenris. They could have included a real deal magister companion instead of this miserable thing called Dorian.

 

 

[Winged Silver]

Well, I'm not here to judge senses, but as far as I know Dorian will speak about his non straight alignment without asking about it. Also, there is a girl whom you are forced to call 'he' during certain discussion with Iron Bull (there is no option to choose calling her 'her'). It is 'in your face'. It should have never ever be included in this game. Also, most definately BioWare did not 'always' make effort to expose people to rather unsettling content. I'm all for insight into Tevinter Imperium's culture but not by the words of an outcast who could not even follow his duty to the family. It is just another reject example after Fenris. They could have included a real deal magister companion instead of this miserable thing called Dorian.

 

He may mention it, but no more than an average person might discuss their own personality traits. As for referring to Krem as 'he'...it's typically considered polite to refer to one by the pronouns they may wish to use. If you disagree, that's not someone else shoving their philosophy on you, that's you purposely making someone uncomfortable by referring them to something they feel they are not. I hardly consider LGBT content 'unsettling'. If you do, I'm not entirely certain why you expected something else from Bioware. Many of their characters in the past games have been LGBT. Not all of them have chosen to speak about it as openly as Dorian, but that's how his character was chosen to be written. If you dislike Dorian...well that's too bad. I thought he was a fun character with a lot of humor, despite the unfortunate events in his background.

[Lord Surinen]

He may mention it, but no more than an average person might discuss their own personality traits. As for referring to Krem as 'he'...it's typically considered polite to refer to one by the pronouns they may wish to use. If you disagree, that's not someone else shoving their philosophy on you, that's you purposely making someone uncomfortable by referring them to something they feel they are not. I hardly consider LGBT content 'unsettling'. If you do, I'm not entirely certain why you expected something else from Bioware. Many of their characters in the past games have been LGBT. Not all of them have chosen to speak about it as openly as Dorian, but that's how his character was chosen to be written. If you dislike Dorian...well that's too bad. I thought he was a fun character with a lot of humor, despite the unfortunate events in his background.

It is not a personality trait. No proper gentleman(and he at least in name only is a 'noble') would speak about bedroom topic. No, sorry, calling people dinosaurs because they want it will no fly well with me. It is unsettling and unnecessary to force people into certain ways od addressing people, they should have at least allow a less progressive option where you could stick with 'she'. He himself is one, big unfortunate event that could not even marry and properly breed for his centuries old line. Like I have said, I would rather have a proper Tevinter companion. It would be glorious if they were to keep silent in every game, follow the sacred, golden rule 'no ask, no tell'.

[eyezonlyii]

A real deal magister would not have come to help with the Inquisition; it had to be an outcast, first of all. Second of all, duty can ****** off. Regardless of his reason for not wanting it, (a stance many in that position feel), his father attempted to use blood magic to alter his mind, to do it. Let's drop the gay thing for a second, because apparently that causes mass stupidity and hysteria. So you're telling me that you would condone a procedure to rewrite the way someone funtions, with an unknown outcome, in the chance that that person would then follow you whim?
That is why people hate and fear not only Tevinter, and not only blood magic, but mages in general. Only a mage, would be able to perform such a deed which is conveniently the ENTIRE reason Dorian went to Redcliffe: to stop magisters with that thought process and the power to back it up.

Now back to the real world, this is akin to taking someone from their family and breaking them until they adhere to the guidelines of whatever rules you are trying to set for them. This is known leniently as "conditioning" but as strongly as "brainwashing" or "corrupting". In fact it's actually reverse forced sterilization. So yeah, it's a pretty dark road that actually could hav e been explored more deeply than it was, and may have benefited from such.
Again we are presented with the exact same scenario in Origins, but it's completely okay because it is the protagonist in the role of Dorian's father, and the victim is a straight male (actually this can happen twice depending on how you look at it). Who is this unlucky victim, well the one and only Alistair if course.

[Winged Silver]

It is not a personality trait. No proper gentleman(and he at least in name only is a 'noble') would speak about bedroom topic. No, sorry, calling people dinosaurs because they want it will no fly well with me. It is unsettling and unnecessary to force people into certain ways od addressing people, they should have at least allow a less progressive option where you could stick with 'she'. He himself is one, big unfortunate event that could not even marry and properly breed for his centuries old line. Like I have said, I would rather have a proper Tevinter companion. It would be glorious if they were to keep silent in every game, follow the sacred, golden rule 'no ask, no tell'.

 

Riiiiiight. Okay. I absolutely disagree with you. And I'm going to leave it that. There's little point in devolving further into argument, considering I doubt either of us will change our mindsets.

[eyezonlyii]

It is not a personality trait. No proper gentleman(and he at least in name only is a 'noble') would speak about bedroom topic. No, sorry, calling people dinosaurs because they want it will no fly well with me. It is unsettling and unnecessary to force people into certain ways od addressing people, they should have at least allow a less progressive option where you could stick with 'she'. He himself is one, big unfortunate event that could not even marry and properly breed for his centuries old line. Like I have said, I would rather have a proper Tevinter companion. It would be glorious if they were to keep silent in every game, follow the sacred, golden rule 'no ask, no tell'.

So long as all the straight companions follow the same rule. I don't want to have to hear how Varric finds Bianca beautiful or Black wall and Josephine start seeing each other.

[Lord Surinen]

A real deal magister would not have come to help with the Inquisition; it had to be an outcast, first of all. Second of all, duty can ****** off. Regardless of his reason for not wanting it, (a stance many in that position feel), his father attempted to use blood magic to alter his mind, to do it. Let's drop the gay thing for a second, because apparently that causes mass stupidity and hysteria. So you're telling me that you would condone a procedure to rewrite the way someone funtions, with an unknown outcome, in the chance that that person would then follow you whim?
That is why people hate and fear not only Tevinter, and not only blood magic, but mages in general. Only a mage, would be able to perform such a deed which is conveniently the ENTIRE reason Dorian went to Redcliffe: to stop magisters with that thought process and the power to back it up.

Now back to the real world, this is akin to taking someone from their family and breaking them until they adhere to the guidelines of whatever rules you are trying to set for them. This is known leniently as "conditioning" but as strongly as "brainwashing" or "corrupting". In fact it's actually reverse forced sterilization. So yeah, it's a pretty dark road that actually could hav e been explored more deeply than it was, and may have benefited from such.
Again we are presented with the exact same scenario in Origins, but it's completely okay because it is the protagonist in the role of Dorian's father, and the victim is a straight male (actually this can happen twice depending on how you look at it). Who is this unlucky victim, well the one and only Alistair if course.

i don't think that 'help' is necessary. there are far greater motivation stimuli than will to help, like 'personal gain'. I would not only condone it, I would praise it and write a new chant about the very procedure. You do not keep your line pure for centuries only to get some halfwit destroying it because of whims like 'love' or even 'attraction'.

 

I'm not interested in the real world. Brainwashing used for good, is well, good.

I see no 'victims'.

[eyezonlyii]

i don't think that 'help' is necessary. there are far greater motivation stimuli than will to help, like 'personal gain'. I would not only condone it, I would praise it and write a new chant about the very procedure. You do not keep your line pure for centuries only to get some halfwit destroying it because of whims like 'love' or even 'attraction'.
 
I'm not interested in the real world. Brainwashing used for good, is well, good.
I see no 'victims'.

Well if it were that important to papa pavus, he'd find another way. He can't stand his wife? I'm sure there is a prominent woman who wouldn't mind getting a leg up in tevinter society by adding to the pavus gene pool. Dorian isn't his only option. He's still fertile too as he's still breathing.

[Laurelinde]

Brainwashing used for good, is well, good.

 

 

Who defines "good"? 

[Lord Surinen]

Well if it were that important to papa pavus, he'd find another way. He can't stand his wife? I'm sure there is a prominent woman who wouldn't mind getting a leg up in tevinter society by adding to the pavus gene pool. Dorian isn't his only option. He's still fertile too as he's still breathing.

It would only produce another unknown. Dorian is a grown up. I won't call him a man for his doings, but he is a grown up and it is a far better tatus than a baby. Not to mention that 'divorce' would most probably complicate a lot of things, bad for business.

 

Who defines "good"? 

I do.

 

[Hanako Ikezawa]

So long as all the straight companions follow the same rule. I don't want to have to hear how Varric finds Bianca beautiful or Black wall and Josephine start seeing each other.

I don't want to hear about this either. If it wasn't for the fact that they never actually start a relationship then I would have yet another Bioware game where I can't do the romances.