649 réponses à ce sujet

[YeoldeFog]

Hurray for the surround edge-system!

[meaglyn]

That is cool! Nice hack MD.

[Tonden_Ockay]

Man seeing the work some of you all have done and are doing really makes me want to learn how to make tiles. But dang I have just so much going on in real life. I guess I will have to wait till my kids are a lot older.

 

I used to love to build with legos as a kid and this game can somewhat be like that for adults   

[MerricksDad]

I build with this while my kid builds with legos

 

Sometimes when I test something, I switch to a goat model and wander around the hills. He loves that. Especially if I get killed by something, or attack something as a goat.

[Tonden_Ockay]

Nice 

 

My wife and I have 5 kids, I coach full contact football with my oldest and flag with my younger two boys, oh and my two girls are in cheerleading. Next will come basketball, wrestling, and spring soccer. I love playing around with NWN, but I'm really enjoying coaching, playing, and watching my kids with the sports they are in. So you can see where most of my free times goes.

 

I try to learn what I can when I can with NWN and will still try. However the only time I really get to work on it is once everyone is a sleep, which means I choose to lose sleep in order to play around with NWN  . That said, it looks like it will take a lot of time to learn how to build tilesets the way you and Zwerkules can/do. So I thought for now I will work on reskining/retexturing a few more tilesets and slowly over time learn how to do more.

 

But thanks for what you are doing. I really do like your work and can't wait to be able to use everything you have showed us here to build/make modules.  

[MerricksDad]

Spent some time last night making sure I have the feel right, height wise. I decided to keep the mountain terrain at 9m height. The rest I tried at 3m, but decided to keep them at 1.5m. It just looks better and plays better, and leaves much less eyesore when you come up to a dirt cliff. I also worked out a set of 4 textures to be used as grass. They are a sick bat **** color of green gray with patches of full gray and darker green. When the cutting crosser for making 8m wide ravines is complete, the wetter areas within those will be very emerald green. The slope of the dirt cliff is now a very low saturation rust brown, so as to blend wonderfully with the dead pine needles from the forest crossers. Both pine and spruce crossers will come with the same ground cover for ease of creation. I've also picked out a few textures for use where rocks have fallen in piles from the older mountain tiles. Two of the three textures I am using for the schist placeables are also ready, but the top face is giving me fits. I've decided that the top face simply needs to be high poly instead of using darker textures. Perhaps a mix of the two, like I did with the granite, will do the trick.

 

Today, I'd like to finish the third alternate set of granite cliffs (mountain terrain). This one is comprised of deep cutting vertical lines. The further from the upper half of the tile the cut is, the more slanted away from the top half the separated stone layer becomes. Broken chunk placeables will lay below. There is an area in the eastern hills near Keystone SD which has this same pattern in schists, but I don't think I will bother doing that. It is basically the same color, just the debris looks entirely different, like discarded piles of office paper made of stone.

 

I'm studying the range of placeable boulders I will need to complete this set and it looks like we're going from foot across rocks up to 3m boulders commonly. I'd also like to make stand-alone tiles or placeables nearly the size of a tile, for those granite pillars separated from the main dome.

 

But first... playing around with the third alternate mountain terrain. This one is not fully combinable with the other two, and I don't intend on making it so. But, you can probably fake it with the placeables when they are done, quite easily. Right now all three types come up on "mountain" terrain placement. You just need to cycle through them to get one you like that fits.

 

6AM sunrise falls on the vertical sheets of granite at the granitelands core:

[MerricksDad]

This morning I worked on the chasm, which for now, is just stretched out and realigned texture versions of one of the mountain sets. It goes from 0 to -2500 height right now, but my intent is to move it to the region of mountain (900) as a base, not grass. It doesn't do me much good from the grass level when I want to portray a mountain cliff.

 

I also worked with the mountain raise/lower to make sure I could start at 900 and still go up and down 150. It does work as expected, so there is a whole set of +1 for mountains now, both soft and angular, as well as combinations of those. The only difference between mountain and grass raise/lower is the texture. Mountain is fully granite, while the grass is that glaucus mixture with the occasional debris beside the cliff browns.

 

The chasm looks pretty good as is, and with my fog falloff values I can see the bottom pretty good from up top. The mountain+/- also looks as expected, and will make a great region to put in some on-tile or placeable dead or stunted pines. Being in the namespace of "mountain" the +1 still accepts the mountain peak terrain type, so you can insert those any time you want to cap it.

 

The only drawback so far is that you cannot create two levels of +900 terrain change, unless you use the mountain, then use the mountain peak. I don't have any walkable are planned for the mountain peak, as they are spires type formations, not flat-tops.

 

The only other raised terrain I intend to offer is also unwalkable, and that is the curtain wall made of the even higher peaks, for the "surround" terrain.

 

I did a few hours of soft study on two stream variants. One will basically be paintable as a shallow crosser, and might not actually have any depth. This will represent a rain flow channel down the nearest slope. Basically it will create a tiny debris stream in the walk way. The other type will be a 8m wide channel of varying depths, but will mostly keep in the walkable depth range. The majority of the channel will be empty, and the depression it carves out will be littered with rocks of the type of terrain it cuts though. The water will be very shallow in most places, which will help me immensely with the texture.

 

Another use for the deeper mountain stream is as a ramp over 2 or more tiles to reach the +900 elevation mountain terrain from the 0 level grass terrain. Being that my raise/lower feature is only going in increments of 150, that would otherwise take 6 tiles to cross to reach that level normally, so the ramps I create to get to the 900 will either have to be steep steps going up the cliff face, or a two or more tile group with a less steep slope. I found the perfect stream steps in the Keystone area about a mile from town where two streams flow down from the mountains after heavy rain. At the bottom of many of the steps, there is a cut-out filled with deeper water, and often laden with gemmy garnets and staurolite. Schist and limestone chunks often make the perfect stepping stones all the way up, and make the climb not very difficult at all.

 

The stream for the high plains set will be like the one many pages back on this thread. It will remain about 8m across at the widest point, with a near constant depth, and should be walkable in most places.

 

I'm now picking out textures for stream bottoms, as the water is already picked a while back, and just needs to be recolored.

 

It may take me some time to complete the mountain conversion of the 8m stream, but that won't be a problem later. What I want to do now is take a long boring day and flesh out the forest crossers. That basically requires me to clone a bunch of tiles and just put the trees on them, and then feed the set builder file the details. Hopefully I can spend less time and then automate that, being that the set file is just INI format. We'll see. Sometimes automation requires me to work longer than actually just typing it in...

[3RavensMore]

Really looking forward to seeing this set released.  From your progress reports and images it already looks and sounds like one of the best. 

[MerricksDad]

I'm trying to get the toolset to respond to multiple elevation changes over a single tile, but as before I cannot seem to force it. Has anybody had luck?

 

What I did before was edit the area file with the gff editor and adjust my heights as needed.

 

With the minis tileset I was working on, I don't leave the individual terrain as parts like you'd expect. Instead, I put the contents of 4 normal sized tiles into that packed tile area, then I make groups to be placed like rooms. I treat even the exterior zones as interior in that respect. If you can imagine a pen and paper game using terrain tiles, then you can do the same with the toolset.

 

So what I wanted to do is portray a 1, 2, or 3 elevation change within the same tile, on just one tile. I can't seem to do that with the set editor, as it only accepts +1 height changes. I can alter the file myself, but I don't know how to use the rules feature very well, so I cannot make the +2 elevation change fire for the locally adjusted tiles. Anybody got that working?

 

I was thinking that since this doesn't work the way I want it to, I might just release the basic few tile types without the ability to move from level 0 to the mountain region without special groups. I had intended to make a few of these groups anyway, but it seems like I am confined to a lower range of them in this toolset.

 

I would really like to make a new toolset, but I'm no good with the graphics programming, so I couldn't display a 3D view, just a 2D view using the map icons. If I could somehow get the code for the toolset, I could change the two aspects I normally do by hand with the gff editor.

[MerricksDad]

I seem to have stumbled across a way to represent 2 or more height changes within the toolset with only one additional terrain type. If I have a height change of 3M and I have another terrain type of 6M, and I want to combine them, normally I cannot have anything but corners representative of those individual terrain types. I cannot also transition from the 0M or 3M terrain to the 6M terrain without a special tile, even though the transition from 3M to 6M is just another +1 height transition. You simply cannot do two height transitions on a single tile from inside the toolset. With gff editor, you can do this all you want, as long as you know how to poke at the data.

 

So I was thinking that I needed a way to shift from +1 at 3M to the 6M other terrain. Shift.... what do you do before you shift in older cars? You apply a neutral setting to the gears. So what I needed was a neutral type of terrain.

 

Within this neutral type of terrain, I can pack duplicates of other tiles which share a height. Then by designating a corner of the tile as Neutral, I can stitch together the +1 height transition and the 2 unit height other terrain.

 

Because the Neutral terrain is double packed (or more) that gives a base of 2 tiles that could spawn at the intersection, so without further alternative tiles for that intersection, worst case scenario in the toolset is that I have to hit erase once or twice to get the tile to switch to the other.

 

So with this Neutral corner, I can now portray a tile which is top left to bottom right: grass, mountain, chasm, grass +1, and then place that adjacent to a tile which is grass+1, mountain +1, grass, grass +1. Below is an illustration.

 

In the toolset, the 0 and the adjacent +1 listed in green represent the proper acceptable height transition mechanism in the toolset. The M and +1 listed in red are not a matching height transition, because you cannot match a height transition of one terrain to a different type of terrain. So basically, you cannot do this in the toolset.

 

 

The second image shows the same tiles but with the trouble corners set to a third terrain type, Neutral. This allows the tiles to properly match up with applying a height transition to the other corner.

 

Neutral +1 can either be specifically defined, it could clone the set from Neutral 0, or it could be omitted, disallowing either corner from using any height transition.

 

I picked this up after trying to make some of the tile combinations in Torchlight 2, where they transition 2 and 3 tile heights together easily. While their map maker is very different from NWN, the basic concept of the tiled area is the same, so I figured there must be some way to pull it off in NWN.

 

Now I can easily transition two heights at once, but in the current iteration of my tileset, the mountains are actually more than 2 transitions high. I had originally gone with 900 for mountains and 150 for grass raise, which left me with 6 transitions to reach the higher level. I might as well do that with an area transition to a higher place, or via doors, like a cave or something, but I wanted to be able to actually trek up the mountain.

 

So then I changed the mountain height to 600, while setting the normal height transition to 200. I could reach the top of a mountain section in only three transitions, but still I couldn't do that in the tileset.

 

In TL2, they have alternate mountain edges, which show 2 or 3 transitions as tight unwalkable steps on the height transition. The character to tile size ratio of NWN is slightly different, so I would like a walkable ledge, much like they have in Dungeon Siege 1. I figure I can now do that with these Neutral corners, and a crosser called ledges or steppes. I can either portray one lower ledge, one higher ledge, or both ledges using the same crosser used against the neutral corner. This opens up a large array of cave, bridge, and mountain pass options for the tileset. It also completes the needs I had for the underdark tilesets!

[MerricksDad]

Taking the last few, and the weekend coming up, completely off NWN. I need uninterrupted time to do what I need to do to complete this set, and I don't currently have that. My boy goes back to school tuesday, and I suspect by wednesday, I can dive in and clone up a bunch of tiles and get really deep into finishing. I'm so close I can feel it.

 

I also figured out a way, hopefully, to fix the badlands set so I can have the entire 4 depths of badlands represented in the tileset without height issues.

 

I noticed in the Coniferous Mountain Forest tileset, that the base tiles are not started at Z=0. The bases are, of course, but the mesh is set quite a bit higher, as though this problem has come up before. To refresh the memory of any following that issue, the problem seems to start with multiple levels of negative height on the walkmesh, from tile to tile. It isn't so much at a tile transition, as a very specific z value. Suddenly the error pops and your character moves to a very high Z value. I personally encounter the issue starting in the 3k range, if I recall correctly. It may be closer to 2k. So what I think I will do is make it so even the lowest depth of the walkable mesh is set higher than 3k depth. This may mean making the terrain types slightly less steep, but also changing the base 0-level of the grass terrain by adding what looks like wasted height to the base plane. We'll see if that works, and I think it will.

 

This will come in handy for the deep cavern areas in the three underdark sets coming up next. I am starting to itch over those sets so much that I might completely skip the limestone canyon tileset from the black hills and come back to it later. All the parts and techniques are coming together for the cave series in such a rush that I am feeling very antsy about moving on. I've even downloaded gigabytes of texture and terrain sketches, as well as inspirational images from other games.

 

But first, Wednesday, I will be working on putting the final touches on the height changes, including those multiple height changes per tile using that neutral terrain corner. This should be really fun to work with, and with only minimal annoyance in the toolset. This is a huge benefit over having to GFF edit all your areas, or use only named tile placement, where you simply name every single odd tile you would ever need, and place them individually, much like putting a puzzle together. I assure you, that is very annoying without a physical catalog with pictures.

 

After that, I'll be finishing up the rocks and trees placeables. I will add the water features and cave entrances last. I'll release other tile improvements at a later date, including mine heads and humanoid constructed areas.

 

I'll then release the Granite lands set, and quickly finish the High Plains set, including the four badlands regions, and its regional placeables.

 

I really do think I will skip the Limestone Canyon set, and move directly to the Karst Caves set. It may be a simple matter of cloning and redecorating the Karst caves for the other two sets at that point, as they will have the same tiles, just at different elevations. Then I can return to the Limestone Canyon.

 

It should be 6 good sets in only a year of nearly nonstop work. Not including the work I already put into figuring out the bugs since 2008...

[MerricksDad]

Starting tomorrow, I need to make dummy tiles, or placeholders, for all the tiles I intend to make for this set, this way I can get the SET file out of the way and not mess with it anymore until I need to add groups and features.

 

Is anybody interested in having a "blanks" copy of a tileset with two interchangeable height elevations, chasms, streams, water, a wall type, and mountains, all without any textures applied, or any major shaping on rises? This would only be useful if you wanted to portray an entirely white world with a blocky tileset, or for using as a basis for your own tileset with all the options already spelled out. White tiles would indicate tiles you still needed to make in your own set, so you could see your progress basically in real time.

 

I've always thought it would be interesting to have such a thing. So if you want one, speak up, and also let me know if you have any requests for such a blank tileset.

 

Basically what I will be doing is scriptually creating a three height terrain with all the needed tiles for mixing those three (0, +1, and +2 on the same tile), and then adding the boxwork for the mentioned most common crosser types, and then having a separate script force them all into the required SET file. It could be a great learning tool, and would basically show you all those too damn many tile combinations you need that I talked about in my basic tileset tutorial (which I assume scared the crap out of people).

[T0r0]

*holds up hand* That would be an excellent learning tool !!!

[MerricksDad]

I'm thinking to name all the blanks tiles with a tmd05_##### setup, where the numbers are just a five digit index. Then I will make up a big texture with the entire number range as text on the texture. Then apply that portion of the texture to the whole face of the blank tile, so when you are looking at it in the toolset, you can see what tile you are looking at by name/number and simply load that one up in nwMax. Or maybe I will just do 0-9 and make 5 digits out of small planes floating over the model which can be easily erased or something. Maybe put them on a same-named dummy in each tile so you can kill them externally with a script. Something easy like that.

You guys ever wanted a white room with a weapon rack full of guns, like in the matrix, except for NWN with a stash of loot of all kinds ? hahaha "The loading program". Maybe like a weapon rack closet with each rack having a set of the OC content items on it, so you could easily just go to the rack program and pick out ANY known weapon without having to script it to your character by name.

 

 

[MerricksDad]

So two days of "other" work shooting down my moving forward with this, however I have been perfecting the jiggle on the danglymesh grass alternatives and this happens:

 

My wife walks over while I am mod testing the new grass, which I placed into clumps in three sections on the high plains tileset, at highest wind. They jiggle a bit too much. I say "they're wrong. too jiggly". She says "My god, it's like a whole gopher village is fornicating under those plants."

[Frith5]

Wives say the darndest things!

[MerricksDad]

Having fun documenting this as I go. I'll have to update the basic tileset tutorial when this is done.

 

So far, I've completed a comprehensive diagram showing how to make what I call shared crossers, inclusive crossers, and exclusive crossers, as well as all the data to mix 2, 3, or 4 terrain types together, and the three types of crossers allowed on those tile combos.

 

So here is what those are:

 

A Shared Crosser is any type of crosser which can go between any two terrains, including the same adjacent terrain. For example, you can place my new forest crossers in stead of forest terrain, and that forest can be placed on rocky ground, or on plain ground, but can also come out of rock faces caused by a height change, even if that is stunted. In all situations, there are 15 tiles required to make a full set of crossers for any given corner combination. For example, if you have a tile corner combination of ABBB, you have 15 tiles with crossers on them with this corner combination to fulfill the crosser's needs. Because any basic tileset with a height transition has not just ABBB, but also AABB, AAAB, and ABBA (and sometimes BAAB), as well as AAAA, you need a lot of tiles to finish a complete set of shared crossers. Expect to make about 75 tiles, if not 90, just to combine two corner types. I would suggest rarely using this tile type, unless you intend to automate the process of tile making.

 

Less strenuous is the Exclusive Crosser. If shared means that any two corner terrains can share this crosser, exclusive means that only equal adjacent corners can contain this crosser type. There are only 9 tiles to create a full set of Exclusive Crosser tiles for two-corner-type areas. This is because in a tile such as ABBB, only the B part of the tile can contain 1 or 2 crossers. Likewise in the AAAB, only the A portion can contain 1 or 2 crossers. There are no instances of ABBA or BAAB tiles for this type, unless you make special diagonal crossers. This counting does not take into consideration the full AAAA or BBBB tiles. This small crosser is sufficient for making roads, non-cutting rivers which might include waterfalls, and ledges on mountain faces, and is commonly used for standard walls.

 

A common type of crosser we are all familiar with is the Smooth crosser. I categorize this as an Inclusive Crosser. You include only the areas of the tile where two different corner types meet. In the smooth crosser, you only smooth height changes. Other types of crosser which would use this method are stacked stone retaining walls, hill-cutting streams (without waterfalls), or elevated walls ringing a height elevation. This crosser requires 18 tiles to complete a full set mixing only two corner terrain types. In the case of streams, removing 4-edge combos will reduce your tile count by 1. Removing 3-edge combos will reduce your tile count by 2.

 

In all situations, to cross three or 4 types of terrain corners, the shared crosser will always require the full 15 tiles per combo, unless you skimp.

 

To cross 3 terrains with an exclusive crosser, only 6 tiles are required. You cannot use an exclusive crosser on 4 different corners of terrain.

 

To cross 3 terrains with an inclusive crosser, there are 27 tiles required to fill the set. Add 9 more if you make special accommodations for diagonal tiles like I do to account for their dual nature. To cross 4 terrain types, there are only 20 tiles, and no reason to worry about diagonal tiles, unless you want diagonal height ramps, in which case, add at least 9 more tiles, of which one joins 4 terrain types in a single jump.

 

I'm now teaching GMAX how to make this combination output in 3D, and then I'll share the files, probably as an exported simple tileset without the burden of texture. Should be pretty easy, I had already done this before years ago with my 4+ height change tileset.

[MerricksDad]

Pausing for a while, possibly the weekend. So far 313 tiles and that covers this:

 

Grass

Mountain

Water

Pit

Grass + Raise

Grass + Mountain

Grass + Water

Grass + Pit

Grass + Raise + Soften

Grass + Raise + Mountain

Grass + Raise + Mountain + Soften

Grass + Raise + Pit

Grass + Raise + Pit + Soften

Grass + Water + Soften

Grass + Water + Raise

Grass + Water + Raise + Soften

Grass + Water + Mountain

Grass + Water + Mountain + Soften

Grass + Water + Pit

Grass + Water + Pit + Soften

Mountain + Water

Mountain + Pit

 

Still to do:

 

Grass + Raise + Mountain + Water

Grass + Raise + Mountain + Pit

Grass + Raise + Water + Pit (two tiles)

Grass + Mountain + Water + Pit (two tiles)

And soften versions for all those

 

Also simple stream crosser for those combinations, and a wall to boot

 

And then I think I will just put the all-white tileset out like that and make additions as requested.

 

I'm torn between doing and not doing a few rows for Mountain+, but I am thinking of leaving no Mountain+ at this time, so that there is no 3 level height change in this version. 3 Height changes will just make a lot more messy tiles to clone.

 

Because I have the ability to move 2 height changes in a single tile built into this, you will see in this release how the Neutral corner type works (or kinda requires work from you) to get that extra elevation change working. Any tile that contains adjacent mountain and raise will clone that tile in the tileset, replacing that corner with N as an option, so that when you use the Neutral corner type to seal the gap, this tile will be an option which fits your local tiles. Depending on the complexity of the gap, many tiles could associate with that corner, so you will have to pick through the tiles using "erase" in the toolset, to match the corner chunk you need.

 

All tiles will be fully walkmeshed to walkable, and will 100% match the height of the placeholder tile, but may be of medium complexity. This should not be to the point of slowing you down while you view the white world.

[MerricksDad]

I lied: had time to complete these

 

Grass + Raise + Mountain + Water

Grass + Raise + Mountain + Pit

Grass + Raise + Water + Pit (two tiles)

Grass + Mountain + Water + Pit (two tiles)

And soften versions for all those

 

And some interesting corner ramp variants of them, so we're up to 404 tiles so far

[s e n]

Man if you're up to multiple raise tiles and you're a lover of crossers why don't you give a look at my quadruple raise system matrix or to see something already implemented my terria wip tileset. the issue there is with multiple raise terrain edgetiles get confused so you can't have all the edgetile variations (only way to get the missing ones working is to create special edgetile crosser with 10x40 meters, 30 of which out of the map with opacity value specifically set to match the one the engine uses for default edge tiles) using one instead of five terrains saves a lot of troubles for the builder and a lot of headaches for the maker while dealing with the height values cycled with different terrain entries in the set file editor. Michael Darkangel did improve his set file editor to allow multiple height values for the same terrain and it works

[MerricksDad]

Set file editor yes, but not the neverwinter toolset. Is there a version of the toolset with the upgrade?

 

What version of the set editor is the one MDA fixed to allow for the multiple height change?

 

Also, if you want to fix the edge tile issue without using my surround terrain idea, try my neutral corner idea. It should clear up the edge tile issue because even with a neutral corner on tiles, you should only rarely come into contact with an edge corner which is neutral, and even if you do, it would only be one of two types. Of course if you neutral corner a 4 height system, you need at least 2 neutral types, neutral low and neutral high, or maybe three.

 

I discovered that while working on neutral corners for +1 height change on the base named tiles when used against +1 height change of other types of tiles. Like if I have mountain, which spans 2 at once, and I have height +1, then I can make up the difference in the adjacent tile with just one Neutral hop. But if I have mountain +1 be 3 height elevation changes from 0, and I have height +1 on an adjacent tile, I either double up the neutral variety, or I have a neutral high and a neutral low, one collecting all the Mountain+0 and the other collecting all the Mountain+1 tiles.

 

The last time I did this, I did it with GFF editor, and I had no need of cloned or neutral tiles. 4 height changes was easy, especially when you can script GFF changes for specific map coordinates and just raise them +1 or +5 at a time. Fun for making floating tiles over a cliff edge. It was easy for me because I had all these external programs to do my work for me. But I can't release it that way and expect people to enjoy it, or even understand it.

[s e n]

for edge tiles i remember I did try every existing (and not existing) combination in the 2da without effort: some of the multiple height edge tiles or did not show or they got their height gone wrong (if i remember correctly)

 

I'm not sure about why you're not able to get different height tiles of a single terrain work inside the toolset, never had that problem, just some rare toolset crash (very rare in fact). its just the old set editor doesnt allow for height values over 1, and if you edit a set file that already has multiple height values, the famous editor almost everyone uses (can't remember the name atm) fu#@s the values.

so its good to just use last set editor version MDA did release, I am sure that works.

[MerricksDad]

I've never been able to get the multiple height changes in a single set to work with the raise/lower tool in the toolset. Maybe I will examine your set and see what you did differently. I can only get +1 height values, and beyond that I just get red box errors showing me which tile I am missing, even though I have that tile set up. So I assumed it wasn't working in the toolset and could not work (for 7 years now).

 

Edit:

 

I have came, I have saw, and it has kicked my ass. Thanks for pointing me toward that. I can now finish mine in peace.

 

I like the GrassTextureName entry in the SET file and I also like the fact that you pulled it off showing I don't need to make any primary or secondary rules at all. This open up two more tileset types for me that I wanted to do.

[MerricksDad]

Now I have been counting up the tiles to the following:

 

G0 G1 G2 G3 G4 Water Pit and Smooth crosser and I get a staggering quantity of tile requirements.

 

I then set it lower trying G0 G1 G2 G3 Water Pit Smooth, and I get a lot less requirements.

 

But then if I do G0 G1 G2 G3 Water Smooth, and treat the pit as a -3 hole from a G3 position, then I get a reasonable quantity of tiles required.

 

This assumes I can only smooth with one height change, which includes G0 and W, G0 and G1, G1 and G2, G2 and G3.

 

In addition to the tiles I already made yesterday, which I think was 25 subsets ...

 

For the first idea, I stopped after a page of requirements and I had already gotten to 26 additional subsets to complete the full set. 26 lines of 9 to 27 tiles is too much.

 

The second idea gave 36 additional subsets. Still over where I stopped before.

 

The third idea allows for 20 additional subsets to complete the set, and is still a bit large, but still something I can do easily with automation.

 

In the current set of all white tiles, the height change is 3 meters, and my pit object is -12m, with water being -3m. But in the third option, if I leave the height change as 3m, the pit will seem a bit more shallow.

 

So that's a total of 45 or 46 subsets, not including rivers and walls. I'm already at 403-404 tiles at 25-26 subsets, and I think a basic set with 3 height changes would be in the 1k range of tiles, as it was before when I did a sloppy 4 height changes.

 

But this thing that Sen showed me which works perfectly will make it possible, somewhat simple, and without the need for a neutral corner mess.

This will not be the quality I was showing with the mountain being 9m and accepting a +1 setting it to only 10.5, and having only 1.5m rises. Instead you will have only 9m rises as a maximum, and height changes are twice as steep as my last picture of the Scottish looking hills.

 

We'll see what it looks like in white first, and then I can shape the Granitelands around the height changes in the white set if I want to go that far.

[s e n]

it opens new horizons

I remember I got an excel list of all variations needed for 2, 3 and 4 raise system that included height values but I can't find it on my archive and I dont remember if I did post along with the raise system example mod and hak in the old vault and or Rolo did move that to the new vault,