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Last Impressions: Fan/Dev Disconnect


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#1
Jackal19851111

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DAI has been a heartbreaking experience, and it's not even entirely due to the game itself or its issues (which already has been covered to death so I'll not get into it here as I've already left DAI behind)

I just want to post my last impressions for the off chance that someone at "Bioware" even reads this, as an old 16 yr fan since Baldurs Gate. And I say "Bioware" not as an insult, but out of respect and loyalty to the Bioware that I've supported for years. To elaborate on that; Bioware for me was a company that despite all its success and awards, it cared about the community, and they proved it, not just by words, but by action and this is NOT OLD NEWS; Extended Cut & Citadel DLC for ME3. It's part of the magic, not just the story and characters and lore (which I repeat -  I LOVE so much, even perhaps too much hence my passion when I started posting).

Now, you know this song below STILL gives me goosebumps to this day? These goosebumps are not due to just Inon Zur's work, these goosebumps are due to the whole experience of Dragon Age Origins (which is a PERMAMENT part of my hard drive and desktop). Both in the game AND on the forum.


I understand alot have left, for retirement or other reasons it does not matter. What matters is that they had this magic, and have left behind a legacy. An example. A standard. It's a legacy that gives me goosebumps when listening to that music.

"Bioware", note this, the ME3 team dived into the forum, ignored all the destructive comments and took in all the constructive ones. They did all this with respect and understanding. After all their hard work, and the understandable heartbreak after so many fans turned on them, they still dived in, talked to us, and then made it better. They went the extra mile, that's what builds loyalty and passion for the company - internationally.

I understand the holiday period but EA needs to give you more resources on your support and PR department to work through this period even if it means HR has to hire temporary staff on a 6 month contract or something similar. How difficult can it truly be to find capable skilled staff who are Bioware fans? Post-release support is vital. That engineer who took time off his break to work on the game, he should be compensated, not just with a pat on his back but a bonus.

To conclude, please just understand the legacy, or else "Bioware" will lose even more of the most loyal and oldest fans (unless this is their intention), who are STILL loyal to Bioware, the REAL Bioware.

"Bioware" should not look at what happened to Bioware during the ME3 ending, and feel like the fans hate Mass Effect. Fans sent cakes of RGB colors tasting all the same not because they hate Mass Effect, but because they LOVE Mass Effect and will stand up for it the same way as they stood up for it when Fox News berated Mass Effect so ignorantly as a "sex simulator" (and when fans proceeded to sh-t all over that writer's book on Amazon lol)

You need to start understanding this passion, and perhaps, you'll see this forum from another perspective, instead of jumping in and taking the very vocal (yes) but passionate comments personally. Perspective. Please understand this. Fear is not an excuse when it comes to business. Please, evidence shows that this is something that even Bioware (the real Bioware) have not learned from the ME3 debacle. It can be tough to learn and we can be tough to deal with. You are human yes but remember that to many of us fans, what was achieved throughout the years was DIVINE.

We do not want to lose that magic.

 

------------------------

 

I also want to honor what BWEAmelia posted.

 

@Amelia

 

If a part of you regrets what you did, I just want to repeat what Cole says: It's not your fault.
I say again, it's not your fault. And "Bioware", note this if you haven't already; it's not her fault.

As shocked and insulted as I was by your post and your views in regards to paying customers, it took FEM-BALLS to do what you did. I've already put DAI aside, heartbroken, but it wasn't the issues I had, patches, bugs, or whatever, it's the communication. It's something the "Bioware" team as a whole have to understand. And in that it's not your fault. As there was no active PR or management for the community, eyes turned to you as you tried to communicate with us, handling something that is not even your job to handle. You have 2 out of the 3 traits (Honesty & Transparency) that I expect and highly respect from Bioware after the magic for 16 years, and it's better than what I have experienced up to this point. Not to point any fingers at anyone else either for the silence because it's NOT their fault either.

If folks are giving you a hard time because of this, please remember what I said. Hell, shove my post in their face next time. In the end, it's not your fault. To conclude, what you did, is more of a semblance of Bioware than anything else, and I MEAN IT in earnest. The team must take it to account. Remember this from just another passionate fan.


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#2
Spectre Impersonator

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I've already put DAI aside, heartbroken

Well, I never got all emo and heartbroken over anything Dragon Age related, but I've certainly put it aside. The formula is not right in this game.


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#3
Jackal19851111

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Yes, exactly, it's the formula.

 

Actually I think I should have just summed up my massive post and just say: "Please bring back the Bioware formula"



#4
papercut_ninja

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You forgot:

 

"It´s not you, it´s me..."


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#5
Realmzmaster

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I see that you  feel that the Bioware formula is gone while I on the other hand feel that the magic is still there. In fact IMHO Bioware has enhanced the magic by going back to design features that were present in BG1 and BG2. I am sorry that the magic is gone for you. What I feel about DAI is like what Darth Vader said "The force is strong with this one". 

 

But, YMMV.


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#6
Rizilliant

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Identity.... Dragon Age started out with an identity all its own.. Vastly superior (imo), and separated from anything else in the genre.. And so many loved it.. Why change a winning formula? The very next game came with large backlash, and wasnt received well.. Why not go back to what was?

 

Something similar happened in Mass Effect, though people did seem to receive its change well.. It went from RPG, to 3rd person action shooter...Fine, people liked it...The Dragon Age change wasnt, so why force the change? 

 

Obviously theres a disconnect between dev, and consumer.. Even if some of what we read in reviews are true.. Therews a clear divide in the playerbase.. Straight down the middle..

 

Bioware, theres PLENTY of action game sout there, and they do it FAR better. Assassins Creed, Arkham, and many, many others.. You had your own niche, and through it away.. I just dont get it..


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#7
C0uncil0rTev0s

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I see that you  feel that the Bioware formula is gone while I on the other hand feel that the magic is still there. In fact IMHO Bioware has enhanced the magic by going back to design features that were present in BG1 and BG2. I am sorry that the magic is gone for you. What I feel about DAI is like what Darth Vader said "The force is strong with this one". 

 

But, YMMV.

 

woot.

Please, continue. I'm anxious to know what of BG1 and BG2 is in DA:I.


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#8
Rawgrim

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woot.

Please, continue. I'm anxious to know what of BG1 and BG2 is in DA:I.

 

Same here. The game seems as far removed from the BG series as possible. If anything it is more like Diablo 3, with less abilities and freedom.


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#9
Jackal19851111

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You forgot:

 

"It´s not you, it´s me..."

 

I agree with you, it is definitely my fault that I purchased this game expecting it to be a Bioware title, complete with the experience that I've come to expect from them over the years.

 

 

I see that you  feel that the Bioware formula is gone while I on the other hand feel that the magic is still there. In fact IMHO Bioware has enhanced the magic by going back to design features that were present in BG1 and BG2. I am sorry that the magic is gone for you. What I feel about DAI is like what Darth Vader said "The force is strong with this one". 

 

But, YMMV.

 

I disagree, but your opinion is respected.

 

 

Identity.... Dragon Age started out with an identity all its own.. Vastly superior (imo), and separated from anything else in the genre.. And so many loved it.. Why change a winning formula? The very next game came with large backlash, and wasnt received well.. Why not go back to what was?

 

Something similar happened in Mass Effect, though people did seem to receive its change well.. It went from RPG, to 3rd person action shooter...Fine, people liked it...The Dragon Age change wasnt, so why force the change? 

 

Obviously theres a disconnect between dev, and consumer.. Even if some of what we read in reviews are true.. Therews a clear divide in the playerbase.. Straight down the middle..

 

Bioware, theres PLENTY of action game sout there, and they do it FAR better. Assassins Creed, Arkham, and many, many others.. You had your own niche, and through it away.. I just dont get it..

 

Definitely agree. I don't mind (I actually approve) of the action elements, however I do not want to see their identity lost either.

 

AI tactics please, or at least some improvement to the current system - or even, to compensate, queue actions in tac cam - I can live with that personally.


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#10
Il Divo

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Same here. The game seems as far removed from the BG series as possible. If anything it is more like Diablo 3, with less abilities and freedom.

 

As far as the action gameplay itself is concerned, I agree with the Diablo 3 comparison. 

 

The main thing I could think of is the heavy emphasis on exploration.   



#11
Innsmouth Dweller

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hack'n'slash MMO skyrim with an actual story and pre-rendered characters more complex than my own PC. that's not how i remember BG*... but you know, opinions /shrug

 

*and i'm not even a BG fan! that's sad!


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#12
Rawgrim

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As far as the action gameplay itself is concerned, I agree with the Diablo 3 comparison. 

 

The main thing I could think of is the heavy emphasis on exploration.   

 

You also swap around 8 abilities like in Diablo 3 as well.


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#13
C0uncil0rTev0s

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As far as the action gameplay itself is concerned, I agree with the Diablo 3 comparison. 

 

The main thing I could think of is the heavy emphasis on exploration.   

Emphasis on exploration of what?.. Vast nothingness? :D


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#14
Innsmouth Dweller

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Emphasis on exploration of what?.. Vast nothingness? :D

nothingness is awesome (space flight "sims" fan here) :P

exploration is one of few things good about DAI, man


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#15
Rawgrim

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The exploration in DA:I is superb. Loved that bit.


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#16
Jackal19851111

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Yes, the environments have been spectacular, and it's presented very well with the soundtrack and ambience. The world is one you want to explore.


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#17
Kroepoek

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You also swap around 8 abilities like in Diablo 3 as well.

 

You mean 6



#18
Rawgrim

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You mean 6

 

My bad.



#19
Il Divo

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Emphasis on exploration of what?.. Vast nothingness? :D

 

Just makes the comparison even more valid, I would say. DA:I isn't the only game with bland fetch quests. Actually, come to think of it, every Bioware game that has emphasized more open world exploration has featured side quests that I outright dislike, with a few notable exceptions. 



#20
Rawgrim

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Yes, the environments have been spectacular, and it's presented very well with the soundtrack and ambience. The world is one you want to explore.

 

I only get music during cutscenes. A bug that seems to have affected plenty of players. 3 months now, and Bioware still haven't fixed it.


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#21
Spectre Impersonator

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I only get music during cutscenes. A bug that seems to have affected plenty of players. 3 months now, and Bioware still haven't fixed it.

Same. Seems to work in the Hissing Wastes and nowhere else. Also, the Skyhold Drums which they said WEREN'T the default soundtrack for the place are constant.



#22
Jackal19851111

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Just makes the comparison even more valid, I would say. DA:I isn't the only game with bland fetch quests. Actually, come to think of it, every Bioware game that has emphasized more open world exploration has featured side quests that I outright dislike, with a few notable exceptions. 

 

If you are comparing DAI to the game I'm thinking you are refering to, that game has one thing the industry has to note; Mods. The amount of stuff Bethesda gets away with by mods - because they allow you the tools to reverse engineer and muck around with their game within hardcoded limits.

 

I only get music during cutscenes. A bug that seems to have affected plenty of players. 3 months now, and Bioware still haven't fixed it.

 

Yes, they need to work on their post-release support, BAD.

 

In my opinion, it's hard to pinpoint the blame in something like this, it's still a business, people are still doing their jobs, "Bioware" as a whole needs to get this sorted.


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#23
Realmzmaster

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woot.

Please, continue. I'm anxious to know what of BG1 and BG2 is in DA:I.

 

You can find some of my comments along with rebuttals by other posters on the topic here: http://forum.bioware...dakota strider

 

I will not rehash it all here.



#24
atlantico

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Well, I never got all emo and heartbroken over anything Dragon Age related, but I've certainly put it aside. The formula is not right in this game.

 

Same here, I've just set it aside for the foreseeable future. The formula is not right.

 

 

What I feel about DAI is like what Darth Vader said "The force is strong with this one". 

 

 

 

I read the OP's post about Bioware like Luke speaking about Vader, "there is good in him, I have felt it". I'm more of the Obi Wan inclination: "he's more machine than man now".

 

 

Identity.... Dragon Age started out with an identity all its own.. Vastly superior (imo), and separated from anything else in the genre.. And so many loved it.. Why change a winning formula? The very next game came with large backlash, and wasnt received well.. Why not go back to what was?

 

Something similar happened in Mass Effect, though people did seem to receive its change well.. It went from RPG, to 3rd person action shooter...Fine, people liked it...The Dragon Age change wasnt, so why force the change? 

 

Obviously theres a disconnect between dev, and consumer.. Even if some of what we read in reviews are true.. Therews a clear divide in the playerbase.. Straight down the middle..

 

Bioware, theres PLENTY of action game sout there, and they do it FAR better. Assassins Creed, Arkham, and many, many others.. You had your own niche, and through it away.. I just dont get it..

 

Exactly, well said. Agreed completely.


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#25
Rawgrim

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Same. Seems to work in the Hissing Wastes and nowhere else. Also, the Skyhold Drums which they said WEREN'T the default soundtrack for the place are constant.

 

Never seen the Hissing Wastes. A game breaking bug ruined my savegame during the Hawke quest. And then again during the ball in Orlais. 70 hours down the drain.

 

Bioware didn't fix those either. In fact, when I posted on the DA facebook page. Asking if anyone had a solution that might get me around the bug, the posts got deleted. 5 times.

 

Stunning customer treatment right there. Not sure if I have seen anything like it. Saw other posts abut bugs get deleted too.


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