Questa discussione ha avuto 163 risposte

[mbelcikuwh]

The extra damage from ignoring armor carries over to guard and health but any extra damage from bonus damage vs. barrier doesn't. The game handles damage to guard and barrier like so:

if (defender has barrier) then
     defender_armor = 0
endif

damage -= defender_armor
// other damage calc stuff
 
if (defender has barrier) then
    barrier_damage = damage * (1 + barrier_damage_bonus)
    if (defender_barrier >= barrier_damage) then
        defender_barrier -= barrier_damage
        damage = 0
    else
        damage -= defender_barrier
        defender_barrier = 0
    endif
endif
 
if (damage <= 0) then
    return
endif
 
if (defender has guard) then
    guard_damage = damage * (1 + guard_damage_bonus)
    if (defender_guard >= guard_damage) then
        defender_guard -= guard_damage
        damage = 0
    else
        damage -= defender_guard
        defender_guard = 0
    endif
endif
 
if (damage <= 0) then
    return
endif
 
defender_health -= damage

So for example, if you have 200 armor and 50 barrier and an enemy deals 500 damage) it will ignore your armor, making final damage equal to 500. Your barrier absorbs 50 damage and the other 450 damage is applied directly to health)

without any armor mitigation.

 

Now let's say that in the same scenario as above, the enemy has a 100% barrier damage bonus. The barrier still ends up absorbing 50 damage and you still take 450 damage to health. This is because any overflow damage that goes past barrier is calculated from damage unmodified by barrier damage bonus.

hmmm, i guess i won't be using any barrier spell then for the time being..

 

do you have any advice regarding the matter?

 

how's your take on these formula?personally, right now i'm confused on how to use barrier

[rpgplayer1]

I'm confused.

If character has barrier, does that mean that any damage that carries over to the health, after barrier was broken, will ignore armor.

 

Or not?

[mbelcikuwh]

I'm confused.

If character has barrier, does that mean that any damage that carries over to the health, after barrier was broken, will ignore armor.

 

Or not?

 

in short yes..but after that your armor ratings starts to work like it was supposed to be

[rpgplayer1]

It looks almost like a bug, or design oversight.

[aznricepuff]

Ok, my bad: I made a mistake in my previous post about how armor is handled when the defender has barrier. I've edited the post to show the correct pseudocode now. I've also amended the examples at the end of the post.

 

It's a subtle change that somewhat mitigates the overflow damage when barrier is very low - but even accounting for this "fix" the overflow damage to guard and health is still greater than if armor were subtracted from overflow damage.

[Zeratulr]

Which status effect immunity is supposed to make enemy impossible to sunder? The only enemies I've met so far which apparently can not be sundered are Infected Giants in Emprise du lion. They have immunity to all disabling effects but dragons have that one too and they can be sundered...

[McPartyson]

"Shocked: Target suffers a flat -20% penalty to fire, cold, and electricity resistance. Does not stack."

 

Do enemies that have no magic resistance drop below their 0% resistance (so +20% magic dmg buff when shocked is active?)

[aznricepuff]

Which status effect immunity is supposed to make enemy impossible to sunder? The only enemies I've met so far which apparently can not be sundered are Infected Giants in Emprise du lion. They have immunity to all disabling effects but dragons have that one too and they can be sundered...

 

I'm not sure what gives immunity to sundered, if anything. However, it's fairly easy to see if your sunders have any effect - just hover over the enemy NPC and see if their displayed armor value decreases. Note that at least on PC, there's a bug where if you have an NPC selected and you want to see if its armor changed, you need to de-select (by selecting another NPC) it and re-select it or else the armor value will not properly update in the UI (note that just moving the mouse cursor away does not work, you need to actually de-select and re-select).

 

"Shocked: Target suffers a flat -20% penalty to fire, cold, and electricity resistance. Does not stack."

 

Do enemies that have no magic resistance drop below their 0% resistance (so +20% magic dmg buff when shocked is active?)

 

Yes, resistances can go below 0% (this applies to both enemy NPCs and party members). There is also no minimum value for resistances, as far as I know.

[Tharkun]

 

I think your first conditional has an error and should be:

 if (defender has barrier) then
     defender_armor = max(defender_armor, defender_barrier)
endif

[aznricepuff]

I think your first conditional has an error and should be:

 if (defender has barrier) then
     defender_armor = max(defender_armor, defender_barrier)
endif

 

No, what I have is correct. It's a little bit confusing but what is happening is this:

 

If defender barrier >= defender armor: set defender armor to 0. Incoming damage ignores all armor. This is the behavior that we all expect from barrier when the game says damage to barrier ignores armor.

 

If defender barrier < defender armor: set defender armor equal to armor minus barrier. I can only assume the devs coded it this way to mitigate the fact that damage that overflows barrier does not take armor into account (even though the better way to fix that problem is just to make the overflow damage actually take armor into account).

 

It's important to note that barrier (and also guard) does not just act like extra armor on the defender (for one thing armor only mitigates physical damage while barrier/guard absorbs ALL damage). How barrier/guard absorbs damage and how armor mitigation is applied are very different. Armor mitigation comes essentially at the very beginning of damage calculation before anything else (including attack%, flanking bonus, crit bonus, ability multipliers, defense, and resistances). Barrier/guard calculations on the other hand come at the very end (they are literally the last things to be taken into account before damage is subtracted from health).

[AlphaMagnum]

Given the uselessness of Mark of the Rift's tooltip, I decided to come here for advice: Do you know what the damage numbers are? It should be simple enough to compare "ticks" from MotR with skills of differing weapon damage% (100% vs 200% vs 400% etc) to see which numbers match with MotR most closely, but I was wondering if anyone's done that yet.

[gimmethegepgun]

Did some testing of the wonky nonsense of Double Daggers, specifically how the abilities interact with Dance of Death:

Killing with either strike of Flank Attack will restore 50 stamina after Flank Attack uses it (as one would expect)

When killing with Twin Fangs, if the FIRST attack of the 2 kills them, it restores 50 stamina BEFORE the 50 stamina cost of Twin Fangs is taken away. If the SECOND attack of the 2 kills them, it restores it after. Functionally, that means that if the first hit kills them your stamina will be set to 50. If the second kills then it restores the cost of the ability and you will have however much you had when you used it.

Deathblow functions the same, though the second attack using 50 stamina makes the effect more pronounced. If the first kills them, it will restore stamina before the cost of the first Deathblow, which sets your stamina to 50. Then, it will attack again, using 50 stamina, as noted in the bug. In effect, this means that if the first strike kills them YOU LOSE ALL STAMINA. If the second strike kills them, it restores your stamina before the cost of the second, but after the first. In effect, this means that if the second attack kills them, it will set your stamina to 50.

Spinning Blades also functions this way. If the very first hit kills them it will restore the stamina first, and then charge you, which will leave you with 35 stamina.

All of those "your stamina is set to x" assumes 100 max stamina. Masterworks and amulets can alter that, so they change the rules.

 

Looked Like it Hurt and Clear a Path probably follow the same set of rules, though since they restore much less stamina it would be a lot less relevant and noticeable.

 

 

Many Haven druffalo gave their lives to bring you this information.

 

 

EDIT: Tested with bows, Throwing Blades, and Shadow Strike.

Leaping Shot spends stamina and then has it restored, as expected. Throwing Blades also does, even with the first blade, which is a surprise.

Explosive Shot actually apparently deals both damage ticks simultaneously, as a 40 hp nug took both 100+ damage hits. It spent stamina before the restoration..

Long Shot, Full Draw, and Shadow Strike unsurprisingly get restored first and then spend it.

 

That just leaves Hidden Blades to check.

[Bhaal]

Winter Stillnes doesn't reduce the cooldowns anymore!?!?!?!?      

[Drasca]

How'd you get the attack time data? I'm interested in finding out the attack times while holding down the movement keys for each melee weapon type. Every melee weapon has an alternate animation set when you hold down movement + attack, as opposed to just auto-attack.

[jareklajkosz]

So can't find this info anywhere else so I'll post here. I believe there is a hard cap on critical damage bonus of 178%. I have a +49% crit damage bonus dagger, when equipped my crit damage bonus only improves by +25%. I figured maybe crit damage bonus stacks multiplicatively, so I removed the grip that was adding +18% crit damage bonus, but same thing.. +25% to crit damage bonus.

 

EDIT: Ok.. so it seems the actual culprit is much more complicated. This is very bizarre. I crafted an armor that gave me 7 more dex than the one I was wearing, and my crit damage predictably went up to 185%. I think crit damage bonus stacks in an incredibly odd way. I thought it was multiplicative, but nope..

 

EDIT2: Not only that.. uhh.. for some reason, increasing crit chance actually decreases your crit damage bonus. I stripped my character and respec'd, and started at 63% crit damage bonus (with only 21 dex.. odd, but whatever). I equipped a weapon with +23% crit chance bonus, and my crit damage bonus went down to 57%.

 

EDIT3: So it doesn't appear that, at least with a crafted grip and a crafted dagger, that the grip actually does anything when inserted into a weapon. Stats before and after equipping a grip are the same. Upon further investigation, looks like there might be a display issue on the character sheet. After some more mucking around, the grip bonuses are finally showing up properly. Looks like if you remove a grip from a weapon while that weapon is equipped, the character sheet does not update.

[PapaCharlie9]

Some testing info for Blessed Blades vs. non-demon enemy (Storm Coast bear).
 
Original thread for context: http://forum.bioware...-stealth-fixed/
 
Test post copied here for convenience:
 
Okay, I finally had some time to test out Blessed Blades with Cass vs a bear, decidedly not a demon.

TL;DR, I didn't see any difference in damage done with BB on or off, inside or outside of the circle, attacking as "caster" or companion. So I don't think anything was changed.

Patch 8, on PC

I stripped 26th level Cass down to plain, low-level armor and weapons, Templar Shield and Fereldan Captain Longsword (59 base damage). Cass's Attack% was 30. Cass also had 5% crit chance, so I ignored any damage numbers that were big and bold in the battle.

Accessories: Superb Amulet of Constitution (+10), Master Guard Belt (+40), Superb Ring of Attack +10%, Superb Ring of Life Drain (N/A). I went to the Storm Coast, near the mouth of the river, where bears reliably spawn. Bears were level 11, armor 45. I disabled the AI on my inquisitor (Rift Mage) and controlled Cass only.

Description of BB and expected effect

You rally all of your nearby allies to fight with greater strength, especially when facing demons.

Damage Bonus: 15%
Duration: 24 seconds
Cooldown Time: 24 seconds
Cost: 10 stamina

Upgraded to Lights in the Shadow

Attacking enemies while you're affected by Blessed Blades reduces the cooldown times of Spell Purge and Wrath of Heaven. 

Expected effect - if BB works on all enemies, perhaps at half buff if not demons, there should be an increase to the range of damage done. Either 15% or 7.5% (theory) would apply. The actual damage would depend on other factors, as per the damage formula:

final_damage = (base_damage * rand(0.95 to 1.05) - armor * (1 - armor_penetration))
             * (ability_multiplier)
             * (1 + critical_damage_bonus + flanking_bonus)
             * (1 + attack_bonus + damage_multiplier + type_bonus)
             * (1 - magic_resistance)

 
Base damage range, unmodified by BB

final_damage = ((59 * rand(0.95 to 1.05)) - 45) * (1 + 0.30)
             = (11.06 to 16.95) * 1.3
             = (14.378 to 22.035)

 
Base damage range, assuming 7.5% buff from BB

final_damage = ((59 * rand(0.95 to 1.05)) - 45) * (1 + 0.075) * (1 + 0.30)
             = (11.06 to 16.95) * 1.3975
             = (15.46 to 23.69)

 
Base damage range, assuming 15% buff from BB

final_damage = ((59 * rand(0.95 to 1.05)) - 45) * (1 + 0.15) * (1 + 0.30)
             = (11.06 to 16.95) * 1.495
             = (16.53 to 25.34)

All damage values are for auto-attacks with the sword. I did at least 20 attacks per test setup.

Results: BB not active

Damage range: 14-22, median 20

Results: BB active, both bear and Cass in circle

Damage range: 14-22, median 20

Results: BB active, both bear and Cass outside the circle

Damage range: 14-22, median 20

All of those damage numbers are in line with predicted base damage.

Conclusion: BB has no effect on non-demons. Or at least, on bears.

I also tried my Rift Mage IQ with a level 1 fire staff, in and out of the circle, but didn't see any difference there either.

The one thing I did notice is that different blue status icons would show for Cass, depending on whether she was inside or outside the circle.

Inside, three icons would show: Blessed Blades, Wrath of Heaven, and one that looks like Maker's Will??

Outside the circle, only the BB icon was shown for Cass. That to me is a pretty clear indication that against demons, you don't have to be inside the circle to get the buff.

For the IQ (other party member), only the Maker's Will icon displayed while in the circle, nothing outside the circle. So the BB buff doesn't  apply at all for party members? Or maybe does not apply outside the circle for party members? I did see that, about one out of every 20 hits, the bear would get WEAKENED status, so that seems to track.

[AnUnculturedLittlePotato]

So after figuring out that Revival does spirit damage to undead someone asked me to do some basic corpse testing. (tracking down an arcane horror and revenant might take a bit considering I suck and am level 12 ) It seems as though it deals 30x weapon damage as spirit damage. Original Thread

So here's what I got. I have a 29 fire damage and 33 electricity damage weapon. Time to test on level 12 corpses.

29 damage fire staff results: 878, (970, 957 I hit both at once. Maybe matters?), 878 (das odd  ), 878, 934 hit them at the same time again.

33 elec staff: 1023, 1423 crit, 970, 1040, 993, 993

So weapon damage definatly seems to be an increase. But I'm too hungry for math q.q
Edit 2: So it seems like it is 30x ISH. I say ish because corpses have a spirit vulnerability. So it might be more like 25x
Edit 3: Revival damages revenants.

Modificata da AnUnculturedLittlePotato, 15 agosto 2015 - 08:14 .

[capn233]

Was pointed here from a thread I made.

 

Character I am currently playing is a female Qunari 2H warrior, and FF is on.  I picked Reaver and as soon as I evolved to Terrifying Fury I had several instances where my critical hits ended up causing fear in the Inquisitor as opposed to the enemy, and one instance where Cassandra was also affected.

 

At first I thought it might be from getting crits on units immune to fear (happened against a Terror and Assassin), but then it also occurred vs a hyena so I dropped that hypothesis.

 

I tried playing a bit the other day with FF off and the glitch didn't occur, although I wouldn't consider that an exhaustive test.  This was at Level 14 on the Inquisitor in the Hinterlands vs predominantly Level 11 enemies.  Today I had switched FF back on and tried fighting enemies on Cassandra's Seeker mission (Level 11), and Exalted Plains (random units at predominantly Level 11), and it also did not occur.

 

There is a similar issue (not well characterized AFAIK) in MP with the Katari's passive Grisly Mutilation, which is similar in that it is supposed to cause fear / panic in the enemies.  Of course, there is no FF in multiplayer.

 

Anyway I am going to go back to FF off and see if this bug occurs.  If It does, then I may need to investigate whether or not a difference between player and enemy level may be to blame.

[Bigdawg13]

This may sound like a dumb question but does the Champion's "to the death" skill act as a perma-taunt while you remain within range? 

[Dabrikishaw]

I see no reason it shouldn't.

[Bigdawg13]

I see no reason it shouldn't.

 

Have you seen the "stuff that doesn't work" thread?  Plenty of reasons why things that should work don't. 

[Kallas_br123]

this information is still accurate? particularly of skills, which do not work as the tootypes imply?

[PapaCharlie9]

this information is still accurate? particularly of skills, which do not work as the tootypes imply?

In a word, no. They haven't been comprehensively updated since Patch 5 and we're on 9 now. Take with a grain of salt.

[Kallas_br123]

Anyone know if the skills in patch 9 are working as they should? or if there is a guide that is up to date?

[Cydh]

Here are some of the lesser known features as of Patch 9 for some Warrior Skills. Don't hesitate to correct me if I'm wrong, I'm merely listing from memory.

 

Warrior

 

General:

 

• All general passive skills apply to all weapon styles. Not a bug.
• Upgrades to skills don't apply to instances of the skills from Items with "chance on hit" effects.
• Stagger on Hit and Stagger on Being Hit apply the "Stunned" debuff, but it is not always displayed on the screen. The Stagger effect will always apply Combos with detonator abilities.

Sword and shield:

• Auto attacks:
  • if pressing forward while attacking, the third attack in the sequence will make the character lunge a short distance and deal single target damage. Otherwise, the third attack will be a close range swing attack with a slightly wider AOE than the first two.
  • Bug: if pressing forward while attacking a target that is slightly to the side and near an elevation change (cliff or slope downwards), the third attack in the sequence will sometimes throw the warrior forward a long distance, which can cause fall damage or death.
• Sweet Revenge: the Stun effect is overriden by the knockback.
• Turn the Bolt:
  • Exactly what it says on the tin.
  • The 50% bonus is multiplicative with the Front Damage resistance from a shield and applies after armor.
  • Remember that Archers-types generally also have a Flanking damage bonus when they don't attack you from the front (unless you have Bear Mauls the Wolves), which applies before Armor Reduction, so It's not unusual to see a factor 100, 200 or more between shots taken from the front and shots taken from behind at high level.
• Lunge and Strike:
  • Only the first attack is a detonator: if the first attack staggers the target, the second attack will not detonate it.
• Ring the Bell:
  • Bug: when bashing a target that is slightly to the side and near an elevation change (cliff or slope downwards) will sometimes miscalculate the attack as a lunge and throw the warrior forward a long distance, which can cause fall damage or death

Vanguard

• Charging Bull:
  • Any autoattack will interrupt Charging Bull and immediately turn the character to face the targetted enemy.
  • Bug: when Charging Bull is interrupted by a Shielded enemy from extremely close range, the ability will trigger no cooldown, cost no stamina, and still deal damage and generate guard. Under very rare circumstances it is possible (but very unreliable) to "charge-lock" an enemy with a shield, and to kill it very slowly that way.

Battlemaster

• Coup de grace:
  • Bug: doesn't apply to autoattacks on knocked down enemies, since autoattacks can't hit knocked down enemies.
• That's the Spirit:
  • the bugs mentioned in the OP still apply. Total Damage bonus is 50%, total Armor bonus is ~30%.
  • Chance on hit to cast Horn of Valor will always cast the base version, regardless of upgrades the character may have. Also, unlike Walking Fortress, the last effect applied will always replace a previous cast, regardless of power and duration.
• Break their Spirit:
  • Bug/missing description: also deals 100% weapon damage to every enemy in an 8 yards radius, regardless of Guard. Chance to cast effects are checked once per enemy hit.

 

Also of note:

 

• x% Life on Being Hit: also applies to damage dealt to Guard.
• x% chance to cast Mind Blast on hit: will reliably apply an Eldritch Detonator for 1200% weapon damage on all nearby enemies staggered by "stagger on being hit" effects.
• x% chance to cast Hidden Blades/Shield Bash on hit: will only apply a Rupture detonator for 800% weapon damage on enemies staggered by "stagger on hit" effects, and only if the attack that procs the effect also procs the stagger.
• "Stagger on being hit" cannot free you from Ogre punches. On the other hand, the Stagger effect on Rock Armor tonic can and will.
• Taunt effects can sometimes interrupt some enemy attack animations, such as Charging Bull-like skills.