1018 réponses à ce sujet

[Hellion Rex]

Not to mention all the lives lost in Kirkwall from the Qunari attack due to her not returning the Tome of Koslun.

All true, but at least Isabela came back to help us in the end.

[MrsHairyMcLummox]

Imprisonement and execution shouldn't be there to only lock up a dangerous criminal, someone who can still be harmful to society? Killing a man who is committing his life to save people is justice? If this is the new generation's way of thinking I am worried for the world.

[ThreeF]

Meh, killing a boatload of slaves sounds pretty extreme, in my opinion.

 

Personally killed? I don't remember her doing that actually. I remember her various action resulting in death by proxy, like not returning the tome.  Both of course run away from responsibility, they do have that in common. I do not remember however Isabella telling you what to do and how to think on every turn, the girl just had commitment issues.

[Hellion Rex]

Imprisonement and execution shouldn't be there to only lock up a dangerous criminal, someone who can still be harmful to society? Killing a man who is committing his life to save people is justice? If this is the new generation's way of thinking I am worried for the world.

Wow, really? Cause the "old generation" wasn't exactly a prime example of humanity's finest either.

[RobRam10]

Not to mention all the lives lost in Kirkwall from the Qunari attack due to her not returning the Tome of Koslun. 

And was quite happy with letting a slave trade begin in the Free Marches for a ship.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Wow, really? Cause the "old generation" wasn't exactly a prime example of humanity's finest either.

Ignore them. Almost every post of theirs drips with judgement of posters on a personal basis. 

[Hellion Rex]

Personally killed? I don't remember her doing that actually. I remember her various action resulting in death by proxy, like not returning the tome. Both of course run away from responsibility, they do have that in common. I do not remember however Isabella telling you what to do and how to think on every turn, the girl just had commitment issues.

Nah this is pre DA2 stuff, where she killed some slaves. It's in the comics. Granted, she made up for it when she freed the slaves Castillion had taken, which led to him ordering her to steal the tome as recompense.

[ThreeF]

Nah this is pre DA2 stuff, where she killed some slaves. It's in the comics. Granted, she made up for it when she freed the slaves Castillion had taken, which led to him ordering her to steal the tome as recompense.

Ah, never read it.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

And was quite happy with letting a slave trade begin in the Free Marches for a ship.

I forgot about that one, actually. Thanks for reminding me. 

 

 

All true, but at least Isabela came back to help us in the end.

Only if she liked you enough. 

[MrsHairyMcLummox]

Ignore them. Almost every post of theirs drips with judgement of posters on a personal basis. 

 

Really? I remember you coming every single day to pester us in the Blackwall fan thread accusing us of being pro-animal abuse and such, and quoting our sentences to accuse us of romancing a murderer of children. 

 

When I was young people met in real rooms and if disturbers entered the room we could kick them out in no time. Ah good old times...

[mordy_was_here]

Ignore them. Almost every post of theirs drips with judgement of posters on a personal basis. 

 

oh **** the irony

[Hellion Rex]

Really? I remember you coming every single day to pester us in the Blackwall fan thread accusing us of being pro-animal abuse and such, and quoting our sentences to accuse us of romancing a murderer of children. 

 

Still doesn't excuse your own words, though I agree Hanako probably shouldn't be throwing stones.

[MrsHairyMcLummox]

Still doesn't excuse your own words, though I agree Hanako probably shouldn't be throwing stones.

 

Excuse my own words which ones exactly? I see I hit the target anyway, whatever these words might be... good  

 

Eh we agree, Hanako PROBABLY shouldn't have been. Intellectual honesty is not very popular nowadays.

[Korva]

Okay the Orlais is corrupt really doesn't work for me because Blackwall willingly took the job.

 

He wasn't blackmailed into it.

 

He wasn't physically forced.

 

He did it for gold. And on recognition that it was worse than he originally though he didn't call off the attack he let it go through.

 

Now this is all understandable but this certainly doesn't make him some misunderstood woobie that we're dogpiling on.

 

Is anyone debating that? I for one certainly make no excuses for Rainier's actions, and have said so repeatedly. Rainier was scum, and even when he started trying to atone after Blackwall's death, he went about it in a very flawed way.

 

People keep bringing up Orlais for two reasons. First, because it is a hideously corrupt and abusive system in which Rainier's actions are actually business as usual and only merit persecution because he attacked a noble family from the winning side. If he should hang, so should pretty much everyone in power, from Celene/Gaspard/Briala on down. They have no business condemning him because their power is based on paying middlemen like him to do the dirty work for them.

 

Second, because all these unrepentantly power-grabbing schemers were doing what, exactly, while the world looked like it was ending? Not fight, bleed and sacrifice as part of the first and only defense against evil, that's what. So why, exactly, should their opinion matter more than the life of someone who, yes, was a horrible criminal once but has truly changed by now and is fighting that battle to save the world every day? As I said, I don't even like Blackwall that much as a person (though I do think he's well-written), and I certainly don't appreciate the trouble with the Warden treaties, but I respect and value his personal contribution to the Inquisition ... as well as the fact that he tried to atone even before joining us.

 

 

Basically, I was going to be forced with a charcter that's into BDSM if I was playing straight female or Blackwall, which none of my charcters are into BDSM or being a Lesbian. Yippe

 

Absolutely nothing in the game "forces" anyone to "romance" anyone. All the kissy-kissy stuff is entirely optional.

[Hellion Rex]

Excuse my own words which ones exactly? I see I hit the target anyway, whatever these words might be... good  

The whole younger generation BS.

[Viper371]

I always have Rainier stay with the Inquisition ("I own you") so I've never even done much to him at all for what he did in the past but I do resent how hypocritical he can be. I just did Crestwood and was at the mayor's house with him in my party when we saw the

Spoiler

mayor's confession

and he's the one who threw the biggest hissy fit about the situation. 

about the spoiler:
obviously, it's to prevent people from questionning his integrity.

[Abelas Forever!]

I don't hate Blackwall but I don't consider him as a hero either. He made mistakes in the past and he clearly regrets them and he tries to atone them by helping people. So he has changed completely what he used to be. Except that he keeps making mistakes in inquisition too. First he gives you the treaties. I guess his intentions are good but of course it would have been better if you would have known the whole story so you could have evaluated the situation better and should you use those treaties or not. But of course you used them because the inquisition has just started and you couldn't know that something bad happens if you use them. Well nothing big happened. It was just a war table mission. I think it would have been more interesting if the consequences of using those treaties would have been more larger to the inquisiton such as you lose a lot of influence or allies. I didn't notice that any of those happened. I think the treaties can be forgiven quite easily because his intentions were good. But the bigger issue with him is that he thinks it's a good idea to reveal himself and leave you without warning when you are trying the save the whole world and his actions can cause you a lot of trouble. So he really should have told you who he is and what he is going to do so you could have prepared for it or you could have solve the whole situation by using your resources. Well nothing big happens when he leaves you and go to Val Royeaux.  Again I think there should have been more consequences depending how you save him or do you save him at all. Anyway when he leaves you and you'll go after him it gives you multiple ways to roleplay your character and there are many outcomes to his story which I find interesting.

 

Of course if he would have told you all about himself when you meet him then his story wouldn't have been as interesting as it's now. It's also very sad that he made a big mistake in the past and now when he tries to atone it then he ends up making more mistakes. Anyway the romance is another matter. I'm not going to try it out because I don't want a make PC who will be with him after what he has done.  My PC can forgive his actions but you just don't leave your naked woman in a barn and try to reveal who you are to everybody while your woman is trying to save the world. I just don't want that happen to my PCs. My biggest issue with the romance is that he leaves you after you have spend the night together and he propably knew that he was going to leave you the next morning which I think is quite selfish and he doesn't tell you what he has done and what he is going to do while all of those things can cause you a lot of  trouble. Because I don't see how I could continue the romance after he leaves you even if I rescue him I don't see no point of trying it out.

[Ryzaki]

Is anyone debating that? I for one certainly make no excuses for Rainier's actions, and have said so repeatedly. Rainier was scum, and even when he started trying to atone after Blackwall's death, he went about it in a very flawed way.

 

People keep bringing up Orlais for two reasons. First, because it is a hideously corrupt and abusive system in which Rainier's actions are actually business as usual and only merit persecution because he attacked a noble family from the winning side. If he should hang, so should pretty much everyone in power, from Celene/Gaspard/Briala on down. They have no business condemning him because their power is based on paying middlemen like him to do the dirty work for them.

 

Second, because all these unrepentantly power-grabbing schemers were doing what, exactly, while the world looked while it was ending? Not fight, bleed and sacrifice as part of the first and only defense against evil, that's what. So why, exactly, should their opinion matter more than the life of someone who, yes, was a horrible criminal once but has truly changed by now and is fighting that battle to save the world every day? As I said, I don't even like Blackwall that much as a person (though I do think he's well-written), and I certainly don't appreciate the trouble with the Warden treaties, but I respect and value his personal contribution to the Inquisition ... as well as the fact that he tried to atone even before joining us.

 

 

 

Absolutely nothing in the game "forces" anyone to "romance" anyone. All the kissy-kissy stuff is entirely optional.

Oh good then you're not attempting to pull the whole "if you kill him you're killing all the people he could've saved." nonsense.

 

This is the most absurd argument I've ever heard. So because other people get away with a crime no one should be punished for it.

 

They were fighting each other. You know like the mages, the templars and pretty much a whole lot of other groups. You can't even get the mages or templars to help the breach til you go solve their issues. So if you want to condemn Orlesians I suggest you get a long list of names to tick off that did nothing while the breach rampaged. But you want to know why their opinion should matter more? Because they have armies and resources Blackwall couldn't get me. His atonement is nice and all but acting like he brings more to the Inquisition than the Orlesians is laughable at best.

 

That it is.

[Angry_Elcor]

Ignore them. Almost every post of theirs drips with judgement of posters on a personal basis. 

 

I had always wondered if there was a medical condition that made on immune to irony, and now I know.

[Master Warder Z_]

Only funny jokes warrent funny responses =P

I agree.

[Ryzaki]

A cuthroat woman and a liar that killed Orlesians for the promise of sweet gold? Where do I sign up?

 

Believe me if Blackwall was an unrepentant liar and bandit without the self righteousness I'd like him far more.

[Addai]

Sure their are mitigating circumstances and each court determines what they are. "X country is corrupt and made me kill" isn't really one of them.
 
I'm hardly in the wrong job. The whole point is to gain favor and support, if you look like an incompetent fool, then you're not doing your job right. You can complain about those pansies all you like, it doesn't change the fact that you need them and they are well within their rights to give and take support at will. Even to their own detriment. And if you want the Inquisition to survive past Cory and a hole in the sky, which my IQ desired. Then it's better to not throw a tantrum about the harshness of politics and step on the wrong toes when all you really want to do is save your friend/LI.

That's probably the difference in our estimation of their importance. I want to seal the Breach and defeat Corypheus, that's all. Then, supposing we have any say, my plan would be to disband the Inquisition and send everyone home. I would keep Skyhold at most as an institute for study of the Fade. The armies can go back to whatever petty disputes their leaders wish to draw them into later. And if anyone wants to send complaints about conscriptions after you've saved the world, they can go ahead and send them. Varric can use the seals as target practice.

Believe me if Blackwall was an unrepentant liar and bandit without the self righteousness I'd like him far more.

I actually agree with you, sort of. His idealism does irk me.

[Steelcan]

Believe me if Blackwall was an unrepentant liar and bandit without the self righteousness I'd like him far more.

 

basically

[Master Warder Z_]

basically

*drools*

[Iakus]

Believe me if Blackwall was an unrepentant liar and bandit without the self righteousness I'd like him far more.

I dunno.  I kinda like that he's repentant, but doesn't know exactly how to go about atoning.  A villain strugling to remake himself into a hero, though he doesn't really know how.

 

I mean, his trying to emulate what he thinks is a better man than he is both endearing and a bit bizarre to me.