1551 réponses à ce sujet

[Arshei]

I dont understand Vivianne.

The magic isn't more dangerous than a sword, but if you can make fire with your hands, the templars take you to a tower -.-

She is a ****** who wants attention from the chantry

[Drasanil]

I dont understand Vivianne.

The magic isn't more dangerous than a sword, but if you can make fire with your hands, the templars take you to a tower -.-

She is a ****** who wants attention from the chantry

 

Pretty sure it's more than just Vivienne you don't understand if that's your position. 

[leaguer of one]

Surviving the Harrowing is a thing. In fact it's rather the result everyone's hoping for since if they don't get a proven Enchanter out of it they can't ask the mage to refund their lyrium investment.

You can  say the same about how the Avvar does it. Both cases produce a mage that can handle their magic and the ones that don't die. Not very different.

[TK514]

Yeah you guys are right, Clearly Thedas needs to adopt The Witchers Nilfgaardian method of dragging upstart mages to the centre of victory square and having them publicly executed to set an example 

 

You mean Thedas before the Chantry offered sanctuary to the Mages.  It'd be a step back, but I guess we could return to that if you want.  I honestly expect that to be the final outcome in Divine Schmooples' ending anyway.

[leaguer of one]

I don't remember ever having the relatively weak Veil (I say "relatively weak" because the Veil as a whole is being fed through a paper-shredder at that point in the game) mentioned during In Hushed Whispers, despite logically knowing it should be there. Might be because I didn't bring Solas, since I switch pretty freely between my mages and don't remember who I brought where except that I hadn't met Dorian yet. Still, if you were right that we would have heard about a relatively weak Veil in the Frostbacks, I'd think I'd remember hearing about it in Redcliffe. Although you're right that this entire line of questioning is probably pointless because spirits coming and going is in and of itself a feature of the Frostbacks rather than a bug.

 

Do you ever have the option to ask if their system is flawless? I'm still not sure I'd trust them, since "it's unnatural to there culture to hide info benevolent or malevolent" doesn't seem to be a strong enough guarantee that I'd trust someone from this setting implicitly. (Especially since I think I remember coming across mention of an abomination who A: violated their cultural norms regarding spirits and B: tried to hide it. But even without that, this isn't Faerun. It's Thedas.) Still, unless you explicitly ask, you might not hear about it because it's so rare as to not be worth mentioning. This might be encouraging, but it's not what you said the case is.

1. It was said many times when the time trevel magic is talked about.Added the rift is the veil sundered. And we already know the veil is weak in the frostback. The entire mountain was shown to have a weak veil from dao with the Shrine of Andraste/Mythal being their and the mountain theorized to be a titan.

 

2.She did not violate her cultural norms and she was being watched regardless. It's already cover if they go sick. They have a better understand of spirit then we do. Even Solas point out they have no issues.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

 Even Solas point out they have no issues.

Okay, that's enough that I'm willing to let this go. He's not trustworthy per se, but he would reasonably know and I don't think he has any dog in the fight here. Yes, he likes spirits, but he's not pretending they don't have their dark side. It still seems out of whack with the rest of the setting, but I suppose it's not too egregious given what happens to the mages you'd very much expect to ruin it for them.

 

2.She did not violate her cultural norms and she was being watched regardless. It's already cover if they go sick. They have a better understand of spirit then we do.

My understanding was that she was supposed to have the spirit removed from her as per her cultural norms.

 

 

1. It was said many times when the time trevel magic is talked about.

Right. That rings a bell, thanks.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

You can  say the same about how the Avvar does it. Both cases produce a mage that can handle their magic and the ones that don't die. Not very different.

With the major difference being that White Chantry mages can skip the Harrowing if they don't think they can handle it. There's a price, but it's a better deal than dying considering that Thedas has no provable afterlife to the best of my knowledge.

[leaguer of one]

Okay, that's enough that I'm willing to let this go. He's not trustworthy per se, but he would reasonably know and I don't think he has any dog in the fight here. Yes, he likes spirits, but he's not pretending they don't have their dark side. It still seems out of whack with the rest of the setting, but I suppose it's not too egregious given what happens to the mages you'd very much expect to ruin it for them.

 

My understanding was that she was supposed to have the spirit removed from her as per her cultural norms.

 

 

Right. That rings a bell, thanks.

 

1. Actually, being that he is an elf of old and much of the union with spirit is not only what made him a god in the first place, he statement would still be valid and true. Added, Mythal is theorized to help start the Avvar in the first place via bond with Bright Axe.

 

2.It's pretty clear it's need to be done for her to stay in the hold.

[leaguer of one]

With the major difference being that White Chantry mages can skip the Harrowing if they don't think they can handle it. There's a price, but it's a better deal than dying considering that Thedas has no provable afterlife to the best of my knowledge.

That's more of the issue that the Avvar don't know about the act of tranquility. That does not mean if anyone were to use the Avvar ways of teaching mages that tranquility can't be used. If it were their would be even less death then the harrowing.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

2.It's pretty clear it's need to be done for her to stay in the hold.

And yet you said this isn't her violating her culture's norms?

 

That's more of the issue that the Avvar don't know about the act of tranquility. That does not mean if anyone were to use the Avvar ways of teaching mages that tranquility can't be used. If it were their would be even less death then the harrowing.

Assuming that no spirit possesses the new Tranquil.

[leaguer of one]

And yet you said this isn't her violating her culture's norms?

 

Assuming that no spirit possesses the new Tranquil.

 

 

1.He cultural norms said in her case she would be watch. The exile was her own choosing.

2.Like a spirit would want to. It was an extreme case that happened with Pharamonte. It's not even happen in dai with all the rifts opening.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

1.He cultural norms said in her case she would be watch. The exile was her own choosing.

2.Like a spirit would want to. It was an extreme case that happened with Pharamonte. It's not even happen in dai with all the rifts opening.

1: I think this is the cultural norms having a punishment for violating them encoded in them, not the norms not being violated at all. Anyway, is she still being watched if she leaves the Avvar? Do the Avvar gods have that much of a reach? I guess I can believe it, since Cole's reach is pretty freaky according to his banter with Bull over the ending of his Companion quest.

2: Fair point, I suppose.

[Arshei]

Pretty sure it's more than just Vivienne you don't understand if that's your position. 

 

Anders Greatly Disapprove.

---

So... you think for born with magic you have to be a prisioner?

Like the black people in the real life?

 

[leaguer of one]

1: I think this is the cultural norms having a punishment for violating them encoded in them, not the norms not being violated at all. Anyway, is she still being watched if she leaves the Avvar? Do the Avvar gods have that much of a reach? I guess I can believe it, since Cole's reach is pretty freaky according to his banter with Bull over the ending of his Companion quest.

2: Fair point, I suppose.

Well, atleast as long as she says in the valley. These are being that don't rest who sense thing people can't feel. It would be like Cole with out his body.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Anders Greatly Disapprove.

---

So... you think for born with magic you have to be a prisioner?

Like the black people in the real life?
 

Horrible comparison ,prejudice toward people because of skin color and containment of people that can be national or even world threat are 2 different things.

[Drasanil]

Anders Greatly Disapprove.

 

I must of missed that part where Anders used a plain old sword to blow up a Chantry to prove it was just as dangerous as magic... oh wait...

  

So... you think for born with magic you have to be a prisioner?

Like the black people in the real life?

 

Of course! Because those two things are totally equivalent. Everyone knows black people are at semi-regular risk of being possessed, can control peoples' minds with blood, summon demons and kill with a look/gesture. I mean, that's how early Africans managed to conquer most of the known world in ancient times and establish an empire that lasted a thousand years. Well, until Jesus came along any ways and smashed their power with his divinely inspired barbarian armies.

 

I studied history too you know 

[Arshei]

I must of missed that part where Anders used a plain old sword to blow up a Chantry to prove it was just as dangerous as magic... oh wait...

  

 

 

Of course! Because those two things are totally equivalent. Everyone knows black people are at semi-regular risk of being possessed, can control peoples' minds with blood, summon demons and kill with a look/gesture. I mean, that's how early Africans managed to conquer most of the known world in ancient times and establish an empire that lasted a thousand years. Well, until Jesus came along any ways and smashed their power with his divinely inspired barbarian armies.

 

I studied history too you know 

 

Lel, I did not mean that
You do not choose your skin color. A mage can decide if he is mage or not?

Of course every mage use blood magic, oh wait...  Isn't fair be a prisoner for how you're born.

Then you deny the holocaust?

Not for being a jew you must be killed.

[Master Warder Z_]

._.

The hell

[Drasanil]

You do not choose your skin color. A mage can decide if he is mage or not?

Of course every mage use blood magic, oh wait...  Isn't fair be a prisoner for how you're born.

 

You can't chose whether or not you're sick. Doesn't stop the government from quarantining if you pose a danger to the larger population. 

 

Then you deny the holocaust?

Not for being a jew you must be killed.

 

[Arshei]

You can't chose whether or not you're sick. Doesn't stop the government from quarantining if you pose a danger to the larger population. 

 

 

 

 

The mages aren't sick.

Why a kid can take a sword and kill all his family, but a simply mage can't be free?

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

The mages aren't sick.

Why a kid can take a sword and kill all his family, but a simply mage can't be free?

For the same reason the sick person can't be free. The mage is dangerous whether or not he/she wants to be.

[Arshei]

For the same reason the sick person can't be free. The mage is dangerous whether or not he/she wants to be.

 

So the solution is take them all up in a tower?
That's a beautiful method, why not try it with humans so there is no more violence in the world?

[TheKomandorShepard]

So the solution is take them all up in a tower?
That's a beautiful method, why not try it with humans so there is no more violence in the world?

Yes.

And why would humans lock themselves in towers and how that would solve violence problems ,avoiding fact that pretty much there is no one who would control such system.

 

 

The mages aren't sick.

Why a kid can take a sword and kill all his family, but a simply mage can't be free?

Avoiding fact that child would need to be pretty much screwd up in the head still nowhere close to what mage can do... good luck with normal child doing what connor did and that is still far from largest damages that mages have done.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

So the solution is take them all up in a tower?
That's a beautiful method, why not try it with humans so there is no more violence in the world?

Mundane humans don't need to be monitored for becoming abominations. (And neither do Avvar, apparently, so they get a pass too. As nervous as I am about granting those.) If you've forgotten: I said the mage doesn't have to choose to be dangerous. Most people do.

 

Besides which the Tower really is meant to keep the mages away from the general population, which means that locking all humans in them is a bit counterproductive.

[Arshei]

Mundane humans don't need to be monitored for becoming abominations. (And neither do Avvar, apparently, so they get a pass too. As nervous as I am about granting those.) If you've forgotten: I said the mage doesn't have to choose to be dangerous. Most people do.

 

Besides which the Tower really is meant to keep the mages away from the general population, which means that locking all humans in them is a bit counterproductive.

 

How many abomination have you see in Dragon age inquisition with all the apostates there are?

Hawke and Brethany are abominations?

What about Morrigan?