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[leaguer of one]

The ****

That horse will eat you're soul.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Some party banter with Cole revelas that before the Inquisitor even showed up that Vivienne manipulated the marquis to attack the Inquisitor because he insulted her, and then was perfectly willing to follow through with whatever the Inquisitor decided to show off her power and her own level of importance. 

 

And quite frankly, even if her natural inclination is to let him live but shamed, it still doesn't change the fact that a mage can kill a noble man, and a Chevalier to boot if her dressing him down means anything. 

 

Vivienne may be in less danger of becoming an abomination because of her attitude, but she is just as dangerous due to her willingness to play the game in Orlais, manipulate people and treat them as tools. Blackmail, murder, corruption, she's eyeball deep in it. When Cassandra complained about all the underhanded dealings in the Winter Palace, Vivienne dismisses it as just part of the game, even the servants being killed.

 

She may not be an abomination or anything similar, but she's not a paragon of virtue either, and willingly plays a game that got tens of thousands of elves killed by Celene in order to keep up appearances. 

 

I'd say she's actually in a position to do a lot more harm over a period of time than any abomination met in any of the games thus far. 

That... scares me. I still think she's in a lot of ways less dangerous than an abomination because at least she doesn't pick her victims completely at random and she  knows the meaning of restraint, but... dude.

 

I'd have a bit more insight into characters if I hadn't picked a fighting style for my Inquisitor that makes Cole redundant, wouldn't I?

[leaguer of one]

That... scares me. I still think she's in a lot of ways less dangerous than an abomination because at least she doesn't pick her victims completely at random and she  knows the meaning of restraint, but... dude.

 

I'd have a bit more insight into characters if I hadn't picked a fighting style for my Inquisitor that makes Cole redundant, wouldn't I?

But that would be the case for her mage or not. Magic is not the only dangers of the world? Would she be less dangerious in the game and in manipulation if she was a master swords man and not a mage?

[TheKomandorShepard]

1. Been their so many time with these games. Never did it change as we walked in.

 

2. No, it's the part you say it change the instant they walk in. The chant does not say that. If you're going to us the chant of light to prove you're point, use what it says and no make stuff up. You ether are now say the chantry is right and what they say in the chant is right, making what you say wrong about how the city changed. Or you say how you think the city changed is right, meaning your saying how chantry says  the city changed is wrong.

1.And how you know that something that you didn't see changed into thing you saw? In first place unless you want to tell me that someone built exact copy of the circle in the fade, the fade does change. 

 

2.Now you are trying put something i didn't say in my mouth.    In first place i suggests read my previous post again because judging from what i see you failed awfully in doing so. Once again i didn't use chant to prove my point in matter that black city could have been corrupted by corypheus upon his arrival i literally explained than in my previous post ,what of course you ignored.What i simply based on chantry version that maker could have cursed them as it claims.So pretty much even if corypheus version on that was true in any way doesn't mean that maker didn't curse them or simply they didn't corrupt city in moment they have arrived there.    

 

In first place i didn't said that chantry is right in everything they say so stop going into extremes just because i based something on chant , what i claimed that chantry was for certain right about magisters going to black city and that they brought taint into real world , i never claimed that maker exist and magisters corrupted city and was involved in black city incident, what i said that there is nothing to disprove such possibilities and can be as true version of taint being contained in black city long before corypheus arrived and i used that as possibility in my discussions before that one.    

[leaguer of one]

1.And how you know that something that you didn't see changed into thing you saw? In first place unless you want to tell me that someone built exact copy of the circle in the fade, the fade does change. 

 

2.Now you are trying put something i didn't say in my mouth.    In first place i suggests read my previous post again because judging from what i see you failed awfully in doing so. Once again i didn't use chant to prove my point in matter that black city could have been corrupted by corypheus upon his arrival i literally explained than in my previous post ,what of course you ignored.What i simply based on chantry version that maker could have cursed them as it claims.So pretty much even if corypheus version on that was true in any way doesn't mean that maker didn't curse them or simply they didn't corrupt city in moment they have arrived there.      

1. It changes but not in the way you say it does.

 

2. But you are using what the chantry says which still from the chant of light. So really what is the source of you're theory? Are you getting this from what the chantry says or are you making it up?

[Master Warder Z_]

._.

I think this is the point where I leave

[TheKomandorShepard]

1. It changes but not in the way you say it does.

 

2. But you are using what the chantry says which still from the chant of light. So really what is the source of you're theory? Are you getting this from what the chantry says or are you making it up?

1.So it changes, it is settled than black city could have been corrupted upon magisters arrival...

 

2.And?That i can use chant as source of magisters goings to black city automatically means that i agree and think everything in chant is right?LoL Im getting  information from the chant but once again doesn't mean in everything in chant is true for an example (because i see you grasp to comprehend) part where magisters corrupted city might be true but then part where maker was involved or how he was involved may be false.  

   

[leaguer of one]

1.So it changes, it is settled than black city could have been corrupted upon magisters arrival...

 

2.And?That i can use chant as source of magisters goings to black city automatically means that i agree and think everything in chant is right?LoL Im getting  information from the chant but once again doesn't mean in everything in chant is true for an example (because i see you grasp to comprehend) part where magisters corrupted city might be true but then part where maker was involved or how he was involved may be false.  

   

1.There is no way it can do that.

 

2. Then it goes back to zero. What is you're source, grounds, or evidence that this happened?

[TheKomandorShepard]

1.There is no way it can do that.

 

2. Then it goes back to zero. What is you're source, grounds, or evidence that this happened?

1.Please, then explain to me as you are expert on what black city is , why they couldn't have done that?

 

2.<Facepalm> you are still failing to grasp what im saying. Once again im basing that on chant (what once again doesn't mean it is true) but is possibility.

[leaguer of one]

1.Please, then explain to me as you are expert on what black city is , why they couldn't have done that?

 

2.<Facepalm> you are still failing to grasp what im saying. Once again im basing that on chant (what once again doesn't mean it is true) but is possibility.

1.Well, being that it's theorized to be more like the crossroads...

 

2. I'm not saying your taking it from the chantry any more....I asking your base of your theory?

[TheKomandorShepard]

1.Well, being that it's theorized to be more like the crossroads...

 

2. I'm not saying your taking it from the chantry any more....I asking your base of your theory?

1.So you pretty much all you have to support your statement that it can't be done is someone theory that might or not be true on black city...

 

2.<Cries> I literally explained on what i based my theory on like twice and you ask for it again , i won't even bother with that read my last post again.

[leaguer of one]

1.So you pretty much all you have to support your statement that it can't be done is someone theory that might or not be true on black city...

 

2.<Cries> I literally explained on what i based my theory on like twice and you ask for it again , i won't even bother with that read my last post again.

1. with the choice between one theory that has proof and you're that has none....

 

2.No, you did not. Which is why I'm asking. You just said where it's from...Not the supports of it.

[TheKomandorShepard]

1. with the choice between one theory that has proof and you're that has none....

 

2.No, you did not. Which is why I'm asking. You just said where it's from...Not the supports of it.

1.You don't have any proof ,all you have is theory and speak about it as it was fact and then when asked of evidence that would support "fact" you give another theory...  

 

2.Yes i did, once again i said i based it on information about it in the chant so supports are in the chant. If you are asking for evidence i can't give you one because simple im talking about possibility of something not fact and if i had evidence of that it would be fact...

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

But that would be the case for her mage or not. Magic is not the only dangers of the world? Would she be less dangerious in the game and in manipulation if she was a master swords man and not a mage?

I wasn't on this, since again: my main objection to mage freedom is the idea of abominations in the general population, which can be addressed in other ways but needs to be addressed somehow.

 

But to answer your question... yes? I don't remember how exactly this detail was revealed in the conversation, but apparently the guy she froze was a chevalier. They don't accept anything short of a mastery of swordsmanship. Even if the poster who said that is wrong, Vivienne attacked him from up two flights of stairs. An archer could take her at that range, if he can draw and aim a bow as fast as she can cast a barrier spell. (Or else simply kill him, if he's the only one gunning for her.) But a swordsman? Hopelessly screwed. You want to know what the difference between a mage and a mundane is without balance being forced on them due to unbalanced games being less fun? This. You can absolutely argue that Vivienne should be locked in the Circle where she can't do exactly this.

[leaguer of one]

1.You don't have any proof ,all you have is theory and speak about it as it was fact and then when asked of evidence that would support "fact" you give another theory...  

 

2.Yes i did, once again i said i based it on information about it in the chant so supports are in the chant. If you are asking for evidence i can't give you one because simple im talking about possibility of something not fact and if i had evidence of that it would be fact...

1. The fact that the many time we go into the fade the environment never instantly change tone is my proof. You're the one that said it happen that way. You need to prove it.

 

 

2.Alright. now we are getting some were. It you if you got this theory form the chant then your wrong.  Because the chant said the look around and walked and marveled the golden city first before it turn black.

 Remeber you said...once again i said i based it on information about it in the chant so supports are in the chant.

 

This it what it says.

 

That far, different from what you said happen. Aka, it instantly happen as they walk in. They walk  thought the golden city to the point of mavaling it and then it changed.

 

That's different from what Cory said which is he found it that way.

 

Nothing said it instantly happen and it changed before he noticed it.

[leaguer of one]

I wasn't on this, since again: my main objection to mage freedom is the idea of abominations in the general population, which can be addressed in other ways but needs to be addressed somehow.

 

But to answer your question... yes? I don't remember how exactly this detail was revealed in the conversation, but apparently the guy she froze was a chevalier. They don't accept anything short of a mastery of swordsmanship. Even if the poster who said that is wrong, Vivienne attacked him from up two flights of stairs. An archer could take her at that range, if he can draw and aim a bow as fast as she can cast a barrier spell. (Or else simply kill him, if he's the only one gunning for her.) But a swordsman? Hopelessly screwed. You want to know what the difference between a mage and a mundane is without balance being forced on them due to unbalanced games being less fun? This. You can absolutely argue that Vivienne should be locked in the Circle where she can't do exactly this.

I did not mean if she was a master sword man an a mage. I mean if she was a master sword man(woman) to the degree of being the better of chevalier(and yes their people like that.) and not a mage at all if it made a difference to you if she still play the game the way she does.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

I did not mean if she was a master sword man an a mage. I mean if she was a master sword man(woman) to the degree of being the better of chevalier(and yes their people like that.) and not a mage at all if it made a difference to you if she still play the game the way she does.

I know exactly what you said. Perhaps Clearly, you didn't understand me.

 

We know that mages are more dangerous than master swordsmen, because we see the ease with which a swordsman can be taken down by a mage as Vivienne introduces herself. We apparently have reason to believe the swordsman we watch Vivienne take down is a master, but we don't really know for sure because at that range it wouldn't have mattered even slightly.

[TheKomandorShepard]

1. The fact that the many time we go into the fade the environment never instantly change tone is my proof. You're the one that said it happen that way. You need to prove it.

 

 

2.Alright. now we are getting some were. It you if you got this theory form the chant then your wrong.  Because the chant said the look around and walked and marveled the golden city first before it turn black.

 Remeber you said...once again i said i based it on information about it in the chant so supports are in the chant.

 

This it what it says.

 

That far, different from what you said happen. Aka, it instantly happen as they walk in. They walk  thought the golden city to the point of mavaling it and then it changed.

 

That's different from what Cory said which is he found it that way.

 

Nothing said it instantly happen and it changed before he noticed it.

 

1.That is just pathetic, you repeat something i have already countered as i said environment in the fade does change just not necessarily in front of your eyes but it does and i gave example that was the fade copy of the circle.I don't need prove anything because i already have said im speaking that possibility of something exist when you are denying such possibility exist so you are one who who should prove that it isn't possible and as far you have no fact that would support that corrupting black city by magisters was impossible...

 

2. No ,sadly we aren't getting somwhere ,as we were already here and i already have explained that and you even posted the same picture, and once again it seems i have to... 

 

I was talking about maker cursing magister... what is what chantry is saying...

 

im done with you pretty much i sure know better to not argue with you how long you insisted that rylock didn't wanted anders dead...

[thesuperdarkone2]

1.That is just pathetic, you repeat something i have already countered as i said environment in the fade does change just not necessarily in front of your eyes but it does and i gave example that was the fade copy of the circle.I don't need prove anything because i already have said im speaking that possibility of something exist when you are denying such possibility exist so you are one who who should prove that it isn't possible and as far you have no fact that would support that corrupting black city by magisters was impossible...

2. No ,sadly we aren't getting somwhere ,as we were already here and i already have explained that and you even posted the same picture, and once again it seems i have to...

I was talking about maker cursing magister... what is what chantry is saying...

im done with you pretty much i sure know better to not argue with you how long you insisted that rylock didn't wanted anders dead...

Considering that blighted lyrium existed before the first blight in given the primeval thaig, the ancient elves using red lyrium, and andruil's apparent corruption from apparently the taint, the taint existed before the magisters

[The Baconer]

I know exactly what you said. Perhaps Clearly, you didn't understand me.

 

We know that mages are more dangerous than master swordsmen, because we see the ease with which a swordsman can be taken down by a mage as Vivienne introduces herself. We apparently have reason to believe the swordsman we watch Vivienne take down is a master, but we don't really know for sure because at that range it wouldn't have mattered even slightly.

 

Even Blackwall admits in he'd have no chance in hell against Vivienne.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Considering that blighted lyrium existed before the first blight in given the primeval thaig, the ancient elves using red lyrium, and andruil's apparent corruption from apparently the taint, the taint existed before the magisters

First how do you know it existed there before first blight , primeval thaig may have existed before blight but i don't remember any source information that red lyrium was there before blights... ,second where it is said ancient elves were using red lyrium  ,third where it is said anduril was corrupted by the taint?

[leaguer of one]

1.That is just pathetic, you repeat something i have already countered as i said environment in the fade does change just not necessarily in front of your eyes but it does and i gave example that was the fade copy of the circle.I don't need prove anything because i already have said im speaking that possibility of something exist when you are denying such possibility exist so you are one who who should prove that it isn't possible and as far you have no fact that would support that corrupting black city by magisters was impossible...

 

2. No ,sadly we aren't getting somwhere ,as we were already here and i already have explained that and you even posted the same picture, and once again it seems i have to... 

 

I was talking about maker cursing magister... what is what chantry is saying...

 

im done with you pretty much i sure know better to not argue with you how long you insisted that rylock didn't wanted anders dead...

1, you did not counter it. You just said something baseless with no proof. You can't counter my point with no proof.

 

2.And you're still wrong being the Cory says the city was empty. You go on an on but you're still not getting the the chantry is wrong about the cause of the blight. and cory is proof.

[leaguer of one]

First how do you know it existed there before first blight , primeval thaig may have existed before blight but i don't remember any source information that red lyrium was there before blights... ,second where it is said ancient elves were using red lyrium  ,third where it is said anduril was corrupted by the taint?

It a thaig that's older then dwarven history stated by the shaperate themselves. And it has a blighted lyrium idol....in a sealed vault away from darkspawn. 

[TheKomandorShepard]

1, you did not counter it. You just said something baseless with no proof. You can't counter my point with no proof.

 

2.And you're still wrong being the Cory says the city was empty. You go on an on but you're still not getting the the chantry is wrong about the cause of the blight. and cory is proof.

1.I did unless you are blind and didn't notice where i gave an example of fade changing... as i said unless you want to tell me that somone built exact copy of circle in the fade ,the fade does change environment.So pretty much your poor attempt to pose that magister couldn't corrupt black city upon arrival as fact failed...

 

2.Let me ask you something does chant claims maker cursed magisters?

Now is there possibility that maker cursed magister?

 

 

It a thaig that's older then dwarven history stated by the shaperate themselves. And it has a blighted lyrium idol....in a sealed vault away from darkspawn. 

It is older than dwarven history reaches ,in first place primeval thaig has golems that were created during first blight to fight darkspawn that means dwarves were still using thaig during first blight ,so pretty much lyrium could have been infected with taint during or even after the blight. 

 

 

 

[MisterJB]

I know exactly what you said. Perhaps Clearly, you didn't understand me.

We know that mages are more dangerous than master swordsmen, because we see the ease with which a swordsman can be taken down by a mage as Vivienne introduces herself. We apparently have reason to believe the swordsman we watch Vivienne take down is a master, but we don't really know for sure because at that range it wouldn't have mattered even slightly.

I don't recall anything of him being a Chevalier.
Anyway, she had the advantage of terrain and surprise. And he was wearing finery and the sword was likely meant for a duel. Armament is important. The World of Thedas describes how weapons laced with lyrium "shatter spells like glass".

Bregan, former Commander of the Grey, took on both the Architect and Utha at the same time and won. The Architect probably dwarfs Vivienne.