199 réponses à ce sujet

[AlanC9]

Well, that's a shame. Why didn't you return it?

[Terodil]

If I may take up the question and answer it in my context:

 

I had hope.

 

I had hope that Bioware would somehow manage to catch up to their previous greatness. I personally liked all MEs, the last part included, and only DA2 was a bit of a disappointment.

 

I had hope that Bioware would once again write an excellent story, fill the world with fascinating characters, and somehow marry dark, scary, and morally obscure elements to humour, passion, and just plain fun, just like they managed to do in previous games.

 

Now guess what happened.

 

I played for 20 hours... "okay, it's a bit slow this time. And maybe I will get used to these weird controls."

 

I played for 40 hours... controls were still bad. Story had a little upturn with Skyhold etc... "just you wait, the plot turn is just around the corner."

 

I played for 60 hours... controls were beginning to drive me nuts. Story was descending into the perfectly bland. Slight disappointment setting in with character writing. "I wonder if there's anything more meaningful in the box..."

 

I played for 80 hours... ready to bash the screen in with my keyboard. Fetch quest #320 completed, beginning to wonder why this game has the Bioware label on it. "Is this all? Is this really all that DA:I has to offer? Can't be..."

 

...

 

I hoped till the end. And lost the wager that it'd get better at some point.

 

Now objectively speaking, I spent over 140 or so hours in there, so you could argue I got my money's worth. But if I had known that all my hope would be for nought, I would have returned the game straight away, like many other, apparently brighter people did. My hope made me blind, and after being forced to open my eyes and see DA:I for what it is, I feel cheated -- not just out of money, but, perhaps more importantly, out of time, and most importantly, out of my hope and love for Bioware.

 

May sound a bit pathetic but it's the truth. I used to love Bioware. Sad, isn't it.

[Reverend1313]

How does yours? I think the grander point was a call for a sense of proportion in complaints, as opposed to the self-martyrdom that's so prevalent among fan communities.

 

Bioware didn't abandon you. Bioware didn't bully you. Bioware didn't harm you. Bioware put out a game that disappointed you. Feeling and expressing that disappointment is completely legitimate, but if you drop the freaking victim narrative, maybe people will take you more seriously.

 

Seeing as Reymoose was attempting to keep this on track with my OP. I would tend to lean in his favor. The point of this post was to call out some glaring problems with the PC version and the controls. The game was apparently designed as a console game on PC and marketed as a PC game for PC gamers (which was an insult to PC gamers with any sense for their fellow gamers). 

 

And technically Bioware lied its ass off prompting the game and at the very least was extraordinary deceptive with its marketing towards PC gamers. I know thats how business works, but it doesnt mean I have to like it . 

[Dubya75]

Do you have any evidence for that statement?

 

I read it on EA's official site. I did not save the link but I guess I could find it...

 

[edit]

 

I can't find EA's announcement of the fact, but try this - paragraph just above the video: http://www.engadget....ld-mass-effect/

 

Soon after Battlefield 4's debut, EA announced that it was moving away from a fragmented development system where seemingly every studio used a different toolset to create its games, and would use Frostbite, the publisher's proprietary game engine, instead. The move could benefit the financially beleaguered publisher by eliminating licensing fees for third-party tools like the ubiquitous Unreal Engine. Gamers, however, stand to reap the biggest rewards, with the promise of higher-quality games for their new consoles.

[Terodil]

Gamers, however, stand to reap the biggest rewards, with the promise of higher-quality games for their new consoles.

OMG. You should have put a warning above your post. Now I spilt my morning coffee all over the keyboard.

Thanks for the laff.

[The Antagonist]

I wish I didn't have to hold rmb to look around

[Dubya75]

I wish I didn't have to hold rmb to look around

 

It was exactly the same in DAO and DA2.

[AlanC9]

Thanks for the response, Terodil. Sounds to me like you had two unrelated issues, unless maybe you figure that the plot issues were caused by bad gameplay decisions?

I'm not quite clear how you ended up at so many hours, though. Didn't that require voluntarily taking on a lot of the type of content that you already knew you didn't like? I'm also not clear about why you couldn't adapt to the controls, but I doubt I'm capable of understanding that anymore; I've played so many different schemes that everything gives me a sense of "been there, played that" now.

[In Exile]

You are completely missing the point of having click-to-move.

Implementing this mechanic would have allowed Bioware to give us a consistent gameplay experience as far as the tactical camera is concerned. This would also facilitate clicking on a lootable object and your toon running over there automatically.

Only if they could solve the serious pathfinding issues plagueing the AI and/or engine. I don't see them doing it.

[In Exile]

Yeah that was a monumentally stupid design decision. Another real headscratcher. Just leave them both available at once all it does is make it easier on the customer. Nothing like having your controller batteries die and you cant even hit esc or save lol....Moronic design decisions left and right.

You can't just run two contradictory UIs at the same time. The actual graphical output is not the same. Maybe Bioware could do it but this hybrid UI would be a third UI.

[devSin]

It was exactly the same in DAO and DA2.

There was no reason at all for vertical orientation in those games, however. It was fine because it was never needed.

Inquisition demands mouse-look in a way the past games never have by virtue of its mechanics and level design. It's just not comparable.

[Terodil]

Thanks for the response, Terodil. Sounds to me like you had two unrelated issues, unless maybe you figure that the plot issues were caused by bad gameplay decisions?

I'm not quite clear how you ended up at so many hours, though. Didn't that require voluntarily taking on a lot of the type of content that you already knew you didn't like? I'm also not clear about why you couldn't adapt to the controls, but I doubt I'm capable of understanding that anymore; I've played so many different schemes that everything gives me a sense of "been there, played that" now.

Oh yes, DA:I has many issues, controls and writing being the foremost on my mind. I know this thread is about controls chiefly, but your wide question warranted a more holistic response.

Re: long time: I confess being a completionist. Besides, that explains itself again; unless you complete a quest, you never know if there isn't some awesome little plot hiding behind a crappy little fetch quest. Like... gather 10 sheep pelts, but instead of simply handing them in and dusting your hands the follow-up would tell you to disguise your party in said pelts and infiltrate a secret meeting of some evildoers. Or Iron Bull suddenly chimes in and demands said pelts as material for his "super happy fun room" in the inn's basement. Sadly, I cannot remember a single instance where I was excited to discover a stealth plot.

As I said in this and other threads, playing a melee rogue feels inappropriately tiring and complicated. You shouldn't have to press W, hold your autoattack button, mash your ability buttons and direct the mouse with the RMB held at the same time to achieve results. You shouldn't have to watch your auto-'attacking' rogue in tactical mode shuffling back and forth, trying to hit that huge dragon leg in front of her. Etc. etc., enough has been said on this already. It's not about an inability to adapt, it's about a lack of usability.

[In Exile]

There was no reason at all for vertical orientation in those games, however. It was fine because it was never needed.

Inquisition demands mouse-look in a way the past games never have by virtue of its mechanics and level design. It's just not comparable.

That's not true at all. I mean it may be true for your play style but it was not for mine.

[Jackal19851111]

The suggestions made for PC either add/fix or offer more options. Why are you against it? If you are enjoying the controls, then that's great! Hell I still remember a poster in the PC community thread who expressed his guilty pleasure playing the game using a controller. Told him if he enjoys his experience that's what matters in the end.

 

One thing I don't understand is why several fanboys are flaming those making suggestions that - as I mentioned - either add/fix or offer more options.

 

Now in regards to mouselook toggle / mouse button rebinding, I strongly agree with that suggestion. This issue is pronounced for me and many others due to the new action mechanics. In all swordplay games I play - the big fat right mouse button is for blocking. DAI's action mode allows for permanent mouselook gameplay, so no reason why RMB can't be rebinded/mouse look turned on as a toggle. As with any game I adapt, but blocking restricted to keyboard will never reach the level of intuitiveness as blocking on the mouse, just play any action RPG title with swordplay and you'll see.

 

If DAI was the only action RPG in the market, sure whatever, but their competitors who have the same action mechanics have full usability - and those have set a standard that DAI fails to match. Suggestions are made to improve the gameplay, why are you against this?

[Hexoduen]

Still waiting on bindable mouse buttons

Still waiting on re-bindable LMB RMB

Still waiting on holding LMB RMB to move

 

Hoping for a better UI designed with a keyboard and mouse in mind and not just adding arrows to the console UI.

Hoping for Click to loot

Hoping for Click to move

 

Praying for better communication from the Developers!

 

Regarding UI and controls I'm personally still waiting (hoping) for:

• Click-to-move/loot/attack in action cam  (maybe as an option?)
• Auto-attack in action cam  (maybe as an option?)
• Show interactables always with a toggle, or by holding a button  (at least remove the submarine sound effect!)
• Detailed tooltips
• Option to remove/resize minimap
• Option to hide buttons on quickbar I never use  (Seach, Timer, Hold, Attack, etc.)
• Zoom out further in tac cam
• Navigate tac cam on mouse screen edge
• Select multiple companions by clicking character portraits (shift + mouse click), or by holding and dragging mouse
• Tilt the camera without zooming in  (the auto-zoom is annoying as hell)
• Better overview of our inventory

[SkaldFish]

<snip>Like... gather 10 sheep pelts, but instead of simply handing them in and dusting your hands the follow-up would tell you to disguise your party in said pelts and infiltrate a secret meeting of some evildoers. Or Iron Bull suddenly chimes in and demands said pelts as material for his "super happy fun room" in the inn's basement.<snip>

Please tell me you've applied to BioWare for a position as a writer. I hoped for this kind of interest throughout, but was disappointed.

[contacthope]

Is there anything I can change in my "Options" to not have to hold down the right mouse button to look around or change directions like I could do in Mass Effect?  I play for hours at a time and as someone who has arthritis pretty bad in my right hand, it gets really painful after a bit.  I want to be able to just hold the "e" key and move my mouse without having to hold anything on the mouse down.  Does that make more sense?  LOL

[Terodil]

Please tell me you've applied to BioWare for a position as a writer. I hoped for this kind of interest throughout, but was disappointed.

 

Thank you But as a matter of fact, I'm not sure I'd like that position, even if I could fill it (which I can't). I can well understand that writers would burn out after a while. The effect is often seen with brilliant first works such as "Matrix", "KOTOR", ... -- you can feel how much love and how much thought have churned in the writers' hearts for a long, long time until they managed to pour it all into one single form. The follow-up is often good, but it simply cannot re-iterate the quality and innovativity the original had.

 

The sad thing though: Both WoW and SWTOR, often destroyed by critics for 'soulless mmo' characteristics, had such moments *galore*. Doubtlessly, WoW had a lot of stupid fetch quests, but many of them actually started really well-written quests. I was just thinking of that Cataclysm quest chain in... what's-its-face "earth realm"... where you had to pick up a box first, and were then asked to hide in it while the Twilight Hammer cultists discussed their plans. Or the old vanilla Alliance-only quest where you would stumble across a beautiful little sprite hidden in Feralas that would start off a series of fetch quests, initially, that would look utterly bland. But after a while it'd turn out that the sprite was becoming daddy/mommy and needed somebody to hatch their baby because the furbolgs (I believe) had destroyed their home. So after like... 12 steps in that chain you'd be proud adopted parent of the cutest little rainbow sprite hatchling. D'awww

 

 

 

P.S. / Edit: Just to close the bridge to the OP again: And both SWTOR and WoW have very user-friendly, RSI-minimising control schemes that border on the perfect. No surprise there, they had many years to improve, re-evaluate, and improve them again.

[Reverend1313]

Any word on the next patch..any light at the end of the tunnel...heck has anyone spotted a tunnel? 

[Jeffry]

Any word on the next patch..any light at the end of the tunnel...heck has anyone spotted a tunnel? 

 

I for one am not even looking for one anymore, I switched roads.

[DanteYoda]

Well i just figured we'd get what we had in the other two games you know...

 

Right click to loot..

Both mouse buttons moved the character...

Auto attack a target..

 

But now i'm wondering if we'll ever see another patch at all, after you know all the backlash.

[Reverend1313]

Well i found out where all the devs who knew what they were doing and worked on DA:origins went...

 

http://www.theverge....d-coast-legends

[Kendar Fleetfoot]

There's no way for Bioware satisfactorily address the UI because we can t agree on what the UI needs. I think this mouse button move is a pointless waste of resources. I don't mind the WASD camera movement. I loathe the menu UI and find the crafting UI very clunky. I think it would be a waste of resources to do click to move.

Which one of us does Bioware have to satisfy? Why are your complaints better?

This is why they won't comment on any of this.

I totally disagree.

 

After more than 500 hrs and playing the game through 4 times, for the first time ever I am experiencing pain in my arms from playing with a M&KB. Not once in over a 1,000 hours of DA:O, a 1,000 hours of Skyrim, and a 1,000 of AC:BF did I ever experience pain in my arms from using the controls. Not to mention having played AC3 4 times, Crysis 1,2,3 all 5 times.

 

Click to move and to loot need to be implemented as does movement directed by the mouse without holding the RMB down all the time.

[Hexoduen]

Click to interact and auto-attack in the default third-person point of view, just like Origins and DA2. That's how I prefer it.

For those who want to mash a button and control their character like it's an action RPG, we could get an option of switching between the two control schemes.

 

And no the tactical camera doesn't do it for me. It doesn't zoom out far enough, I see trees so green with the camera angle and the camera cannot be moved with the mouse on screen edge

[Chardonney]

Click to interact and auto-attack in the default third-person point of view, just like Origins and DA2. That's how I prefer it.

For those who want to mash a button and control their character like it's an action RPG, we could get an option of switching between the two control schemes.

 

If the click-to-move would be added, then it should definitely be optional or my game would fly out the window. I don't like click-to-move movement at all and wouldn't want to use it. I would prefer the ME style camera movement, though, where you didn't have to hold down the mouse button to look around.