Aller au contenu

Photo

Guard damage bonus or armor penetration


  • Veuillez vous connecter pour répondre
15 réponses à ce sujet

#1
GilgameshX

GilgameshX
  • Members
  • 92 messages

I'm looking to add either onto a weapon I plan to make for my tank (blackwall) but I don't really understand how either works. Which is better? Or is attack percent which seems similar to armor penetration better?

 

And weapons for rouges - would just strictly dex make the most amount of sense?



#2
Jeran

Jeran
  • Members
  • 45 messages

Guard damage bonus is the increased amount of damage you can inflict when attacking an enemy with a guard. (That's my understanding)

 

Examples are: Templars who got guard

                        Dragons

                        Drufallo

 

While Armor Penetration is I think you can increase your damage to an enemy who doesn't have any guard.... (Feel free to correct me though)



#3
GoodFella146

GoodFella146
  • Members
  • 246 messages

I don't really think that either is that good.  Can't you put on something else?  Attack % is good.



#4
aznricepuff

aznricepuff
  • Members
  • 256 messages

Guard damage bonus increases damage vs. guard. Armor penetration makes it so that your attacks ignore a certain % of enemy armor (so it's only useful vs. enemies with high armor values).

 

Attack% increases damage of all attacks and is not conditional on anything, and in the vast majority of cases is better than either guard damage bonus or armor penetration.


  • Jeran aime ceci

#5
GilgameshX

GilgameshX
  • Members
  • 92 messages

Thanks I was going to waste it on penetration.

 

For rouges, what's recommended for the weapon upgrades?



#6
Biotic Flash Kick

Biotic Flash Kick
  • Members
  • 1 561 messages

Thanks I was going to waste it on penetration.

 

For rouges, what's recommended for the weapon upgrades?

dex dex dex crit damage



#7
smooth_operator

smooth_operator
  • Members
  • 340 messages

In my opinion barrier damage is useless because I have a mage with dispel.  Using dispel also grants me other bonuses after each cast.  The hardest enemy on the game are the dragons and they use guard, so I would focus more on guard damage. 



#8
kstarler

kstarler
  • Members
  • 532 messages

I'm not sure if it's still up to date, but there is a thread for this.


  • Sunegami aime ceci

#9
JaegerBane

JaegerBane
  • Members
  • 5 441 messages

In my opinion barrier damage is useless because I have a mage with dispel.  Using dispel also grants me other bonuses after each cast.  The hardest enemy on the game are the dragons and they use guard, so I would focus more on guard damage.


The thing with this is that you're either playing on less than nightmare, where having a spell to crack barriers is an extravagance, or you're not, in which case barriers get refreshed so often that it's not worth using a spell just bring them down. I agree you should never seek to specifically improve barrier damage though, but the chances are, playing a mage will automatically get you high barrier damage simply because of the number of +magic passives.

Personally I wouldn't bother with anything that grants conditional damage bonuses. Crit chance, Attack, willpower and whichever other stat boosts your Attack. +10% damage is going to pull ahead of +20% damage against flanking, guard, barrier, knockdown'd or whatever in the long run.

#10
OrionAnderson

OrionAnderson
  • Members
  • 64 messages

JaegerBane,

 

I like Crit Damage and Flank damage, actually. The thing to remember about conditional modifiers is that they multiply with your other damage. You do need to stack attack % up to a point, but once you get 20-30% it's worth looking at other options. If your weapon has 100 base damage, and you have 20% attack, you'll do 120 damage. If you flank, you'll get +25% of your modified damage, so you'll hit for 150. Suppose you have the choice to craft attack% or flank% (obviously within the same recipe you never do). If you add +10% attack, you now hit for 130 normally or 163 on a flank. If you craft +20% flank, you still hit for 120 on a regular hit but now your flank attacks do 174!. If you make just half of your auto-attacks from flanking, you break even. Now consider your activated abilities -- If you make sure to always use them from behind, you're going to get huge value from the flank mods. Flank mods are a no-brainer for dagger rogues, who have stealth and flank attack to get behind and already need to flank to exploit twin fang. If I ran with two warriors and no Varric, I would put flank bonus in all my leather slots on my off-tank, and use charging bull.

 

Crit damage is harder to value. For pure DPS, it's better to build crit damage than crit chance whenever crit chance is >1/2 of crit damage. Base damage is only 40%. Base crit is 5%, maybe +5% from Varric, plus incidental cunning bonuses. Hitting 20% is virtually guaranteed for rogues and happens surprisingly often for warriors. The hard part is that crits aren't all about damage. Warriors usually care more about activating passives than multiplying damage. The crit-linked debuffs last so long 20% crit is plenty, but the CDR stays good until you run out of stamina or animation time. A 2-handed battlemaster warrior would probably never build crit damage. On the other hand, rogues have various passives that can give auto-crits or massive crit chance in the right conditions. If you're team is set up to rely on those, then crit damage is great.

 

TLDR: Flank damage and crit damage get better the more attack% you already have (and crit damage also gets better the more crit chance you have). Most rogue builds should consider crafting one or both of these stats.


  • Sunegami aime ceci

#11
Rynas

Rynas
  • Members
  • 412 messages

I'm looking to add either onto a weapon I plan to make for my tank (blackwall) but I don't really understand how either works. Which is better? Or is attack percent which seems similar to armor penetration better?

 

As other folks said, Attack is better than either one, in general.

 

 

And weapons for rouges - would just strictly dex make the most amount of sense?

 

Dex is by far the best IF your crit chance is already decent.  Of course, crit chance is capped at 100% (which you can achieve with Sneak Attack), so after that, Dex Dex Dex.



#12
Rynas

Rynas
  • Members
  • 412 messages

TLDR: Flank damage and crit damage get better the more attack% you already have (and crit damage also gets better the more crit chance you have). Most rogue builds should consider crafting one or both of these stats.

 

This is true in general, but it also implies that Dex is very, very strong for Rogues only (+0.5% Attack and +1% Crit Damage per point above 10).  They're the only class for which a Utility slot is likely to be better than an Offense slot for DPS.



#13
JaegerBane

JaegerBane
  • Members
  • 5 441 messages

TLDR: Flank damage and crit damage get better the more attack% you already have (and crit damage also gets better the more crit chance you have). Most rogue builds should consider crafting one or both of these stats.


Fair points. It's probably worth saying that the scenarios you're describing will typically only apply to rogues - other classes tend not to be able to stack the cunning to get so far along the Crit chance scale that crit damage will pull ahead, and the micro and mobility required to make best use of flanking generally requires stealth in most circumstances.

The overall point you make is sound, though - no one (or even a few) stat will always remain the best choice regardless of what your current score is in each area, it's just that as a priority, the ones I mentioned would be the starting points. Most non-rogues won't get so far along the scale to justify a switch, and the ones that do will have managed it with crafted gear that would preclude them from taking more stat boosts :)
  • Sunegami aime ceci

#14
GilgameshX

GilgameshX
  • Members
  • 92 messages

How much crit chance should I aim for? I have no idea. And should I increase the crit chance via weapon + armor upgrades?



#15
Rynas

Rynas
  • Members
  • 412 messages

Are you talking about a rogue or non-rogue?

 

DW rogues should take Sneak Attack and aim for 50% crit.  For non-rogues, a decent rule of thumb is: if Attack is less than (Crit Chance x Crit Damage), increase Attack; otherwise, increase either Crit Chance or Crit Damage.  But a lot depends on your build (e.g., if crits give you other bonuses).  And Utility is usually worse than Offense for non-rogues (for DPS; if you consider defenses, it depends).

 

For archers, it's tough to come up with a general rule.



#16
Biotic Flash Kick

Biotic Flash Kick
  • Members
  • 1 561 messages

Are you talking about a rogue or non-rogue?

 

DW rogues should take Sneak Attack and aim for 50% crit.  For non-rogues, a decent rule of thumb is: if Attack is less than (Crit Chance x Crit Damage), increase Attack; otherwise, increase either Crit Chance or Crit Damage.  But a lot depends on your build (e.g., if crits give you other bonuses).  And Utility is usually worse than Offense for non-rogues (for DPS; if you consider defenses, it depends).

 

For archers, it's tough to come up with a general rule.

or if you are assassin 25% crit + sneak attack

 

you will be critting 100% of the time