Persoanlly, I just find her useless and quite dangerous in her impulsiveness.
Mind you, I've only ever seen/heard of Fiona in DA:I.
But she put up a rebellion at the worst possible time, and then handed over her followers to an insane Magister. And then she just stands around the library not doing anything.
I just feel like I had to keep on cleaning up her messes.
There are Dragon Age books?!
Shows how clueless I am...
after you've declared independence and gone on a war of revolution, surrendering and agreeing to going back to the way things were is usually off the table. It might have been a dictate of a peace if the templars had crushed the rebellion, but I don't think any of them ever considered it.
It might also have just been a matter of pride
The point is that the Tevinter alternative is WORSE than unconditional surrender.
How so? Throwing themselves upon the mercy of the templars? I don't see what good that would do. The mages have at least a chance of surviving in Tevinter. The templars didn't give them any reason to believe that they wouldn't slaughter/tranquilize the mages anyway.
How so? Throwing themselves upon the mercy of the templars? I don't see what good that would do. The mages have at least a chance of surviving in Tevinter. The templars didn't give them any reason to believe that they wouldn't slaughter/tranquilize the mages anyway.
The point is, though, that they were willing to fight( and die) for their freedom when they dissolved the Circle system. And by taking the Tevinter offer, they'll be throwing all of that away. So much for freedom.
Well, your goals do need to change in accordance with changing circumstances.Plus, when they rebelled the circles offered neither freedom or security.
The point is, though, that they were willing to fight( and die) for their freedom when they dissolved the Circle system. And by taking the Tevinter offer, they'll be throwing all of that away. So much for freedom.
Well, your goals do need to change in accordance with changing circumstances.
Plus, when they rebelled the circles offered neither freedom or security.
So their goals changed from freedom to survival....and even going with that idea doesn't really work. They will be forced to fight the Qunari or other tervinter enemies for a peroid of ten years, and be treated as nothing more then slaves. No matter how you try and spin the decision to side with Tervinter it isn't to the benefit of the mages. Alexius even hints that ALL mages even the children will be used as fodder for war.
It was a stupid decision, their best option would to have been to stand with Arl Teegan, his men and boot Tervinter out of Redcliffe. Then the Arl and Fereldan Monarchy might have felt some gratitude for helping repel a foriegn power.
Fiona betrayed the whole idea of the mage rebellion in the first place, FREEDOM, for indentured slavery. She bascially traded one jailor, the chantry, for another, tervinter. And the mages are worse off for it. To the common peasant she proves everything they fear about mages to be true, "Give mages freedom, and they turn out just like tervinter." Now granted that isn't quite true but the common peasant will only see mages joining tervinter, not that mages are nothing more then slaves with magical ability.
The point is, though, that they were willing to fight( and die) for their freedom when they dissolved the Circle system. And by taking the Tevinter offer, they'll be throwing all of that away. So much for freedom.
Well Tevinter offered them citizenship through military service. Thats hardly slavery.
So their goals changed from freedom to survival....and even going with that idea doesn't really work. They will be forced to fight the Qunari or other tervinter enemies for a peroid of ten years, and be treated as nothing more then slaves. No matter how you try and spin the decision to side with Tervinter it isn't to the benefit of the mages. Alexius even hints that ALL mages even the children will be used as fodder for war.
It was a stupid decision, their best option would to have been to stand with Arl Teegan, his men and boot Tervinter out of Redcliffe. Then the Arl and Fereldan Monarchy might have felt some gratitude for helping repel a foriegn power.
Fiona betrayed the whole idea of the mage rebellion in the first place, FREEDOM, for indentured slavery. She bascially traded one jailor, the chantry, for another, tervinter. And the mages are worse off for it. To the common peasant she proves everything they fear about mages to be true, "Give mages freedom, and they turn out just like tervinter." Now granted that isn't quite true but the common peasant will only see mages joining tervinter, not that mages are nothing more then slaves with magical ability.
Indentured service was the word, not slavery.
Indentured service, not slavery.
If you assume that Alexius is trustworthy.
Indentured service, not slavery.
Thats just a fancy word for slavery if I remeber correctly.
Indentured service was the word, not slavery.
indentured servants who are going to be forced into military roles = slavery
Thats just a fancy word for slavery if I remeber correctly.
Not entirely. An indentured servant may only be forced to serve for a certain length of time, and if they have children while serving those children are not going to be required to serve past that point. Or at all, if they aren't old enough to serve before the indenture is over. Slavery is the permanent and hereditary, and permanently hereditary, form of service. Though again: this only matters if you trust Alexius to remember that this was indenture rather than slavery.
Not entirely. An indentured servant may only be forced to serve for a certain length of time, and if they have children while serving those children are not going to be required to serve past that point. Or at all, if they aren't old enough to serve before the indenture is over. Slavery is the permanent and hereditary, and permanently hereditary, form of service. Though again: this only matters if you trust Alexius to remember that this was indenture rather than slavery.
Okay but timed slöavery is still bad imo and its not something you force on other people.
Well Tevinter offered them citizenship through military service. Thats hardly slavery.
Yeah, just like the Circles offered the mages succor and protection from a world that hates them, not slavery, right?
Of course Alexius's sales pitch presents it like that. The reality is quite different, and to me it seems kinda obvious that a Tevinter magister doesn't trek halfway across the world to give charity to anyone. Not to mention that, as the dominant party in this arrangement, Alexius can easily change the terms of the contract. Which he did without a hint of remorse. The Mages simply swapped an oppressor for another by accepting his offer, witout even verifying if the claims of a massive Templar army was true.
Besides, is it just me, or does the Mages secceding from the Circles (and thus inevitably going to war with the Templars) seems like a short-sighted idea if the Templar army can trample them on the field of battle as they seem to readily believe, even if they take a defensive position? What was their bloody plan then?
Yeah, just like the Circles offered the mages succor and protection from a world that hates them, not slavery, right?
Of course Alexius's sales pitch presents it like that. The reality is quite different, and to me it seems kinda obvious that a Tevinter magister doesn't trek halfway across the world to give charity to anyone. Not to mention that, as the dominant party in this arrangement, Alexius can easily change the terms of the contract. Which he did without a hint of remorse. The Mages simply swapped an oppressor for another by accepting his offer, witout even verifying if the claims of a massive Templar army was true.
Besides, is it just me, or does the Mages secceding from the Circles (and thus inevitably going to war with the Templars) seems like a short-sighted idea if the Templar army can trample them on the field of battle as they seem to readily believe, even if they take a defensive position? What was their bloody plan then?
good question
Well Tevinter offered them citizenship through military service. Thats hardly slavery.
Not quite if you take Fiona's suprise at the comment Alexius makes about them being used for military purposes, that is not what she was lead to believe. It appears she was lead or allowed to believe that the indetured service would be more along the lines of an apprentice or servant role.
Yeah, just like the Circles offered the mages succor and protection from a world that hates them, not slavery, right?
Of course Alexius's sales pitch presents it like that. The reality is quite different, and to me it seems kinda obvious that a Tevinter magister doesn't trek halfway across the world to give charity to anyone. Not to mention that, as the dominant party in this arrangement, Alexius can easily change the terms of the contract. Which he did without a hint of remorse. The Mages simply swapped an oppressor for another by accepting his offer, witout even verifying if the claims of a massive Templar army was true.
Besides, is it just me, or does the Mages secceding from the Circles (and thus inevitably going to war with the Templars) seems like a short-sighted idea if the Templar army can trample them on the field of battle as they seem to readily believe, even if they take a defensive position? What was their bloody plan then?
Well to live as a free person vs being locked up in a tower and killed at will sure beats circle system.
Tevinter magisters do not offer charity, they just can smell a opportunity. A practically free bunch of mages available, even partially trained. Not taking that change would sound rather stupid don´t you think?
Alexius on the other hand had his own motives which supposedly were not part of Tevinter plans, therefore what ever he did has to be looked through the game villain lense.
Not quite if you take Fiona's suprise at the comment Alexius makes about them being used for military purposes, that is not what she was lead to believe. It appears she was lead or allowed to believe that the indetured service would be more along the lines of an apprentice or servant role.
It is still not the same as slavery. Besides one would assume that Tevinter knows which ones are fit for service and which are not. It´s not like they would just pack all into carts and drive them to the front. People need to be trained and equipped. Too old, too young or too sick people would have to do something else.
It is still not the same as slavery.
I will give you that in the strictest defintion of slavery, they are not some else's property, they are repaying a "debt" in a sense. But guess what, Alexius changes the "perceived" terms of the deal, and even the people Fiona sees as noncombatants will be forced to fight. They still lose their freedom, which was the WHOLE reason for the rebellion in the first place.
Yeah, just like the Circles offered the mages succor and protection from a world that hates them, not slavery, right?
Of course Alexius's sales pitch presents it like that. The reality is quite different, and to me it seems kinda obvious that a Tevinter magister doesn't trek halfway across the world to give charity to anyone. Not to mention that, as the dominant party in this arrangement, Alexius can easily change the terms of the contract. Which he did without a hint of remorse. The Mages simply swapped an oppressor for another by accepting his offer, witout even verifying if the claims of a massive Templar army was true.
Besides, is it just me, or does the Mages secceding from the Circles (and thus inevitably going to war with the Templars) seems like a short-sighted idea if the Templar army can trample them on the field of battle as they seem to readily believe, even if they take a defensive position? What was their bloody plan then?
Reading Asunder, Fiona was obsessed with winning the political fight for independence within the Mage Circles, using the death of a major political opponent (with Rhys voting in her favour, and against the wishes of his dead mothers faction who's votes he used) to win a political victory, despite never having the support of a majority of mages......and thats it really, she had no apparent plan beyond that political win.
Any claim that the Mages would better of under Tevinter has one easy answer......the Tranquil. Yep, you are much better off under Tevinter control, aren't you mr skull. 
I will give you that in the strictest defintion of slavery, they are not some else's property, they are repaying a "debt" in a sense. But guess what, Alexius changes the "perceived" terms of the deal, and even the people Fiona sees as noncombatants will be forced to fight. They still lose their freedom, which was the WHOLE reason for the rebellion in the first place.
I added some: Besides one would assume that Tevinter knows which ones are fit for service and which are not. It´s not like they would just pack all into carts and drive them to the front. People need to be trained and equipped. Too old, too young or too sick people would have to do something else. And the service time is still only temporary, unlike the circles which will last for the lifetime. Which is worse?
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