Bsn passing the buck for the blood on the inquisitor's hands but have the gall to sneer at the misfortune of others
You're trying too hard to equate a spur of the moment accident fuelled by ignorance to Fiona's intentional, calculated but severely flawed choices.
You're trying to hard to equate a spur of the moment accident fuelled by ignorance to Fiona's internationally calculated but severely flawed choices.
They were both spur of the moments. The rebel mages were led to believe the templar attack was imminent. Time was a factor and political manipulation was at play. It's dishonest to say that the decision was intentionally calculated.
Honestly, I've been thinking about it and I think Alexius was telling the truth (from a certain point of view) with the exception of the imminent Templar attack. Fiona's mages were put to military service for the TI, just a very old version of it fighting a different enemy than they would expect. And I suspect that they would have eventually been given their freedom had they survived for 10 years....that just was a low probability chance because of the Inquisition. I don't know why I care about whether Alexius was honest or not, but I do think he was mostly honest in his dealings....Fiona just took a bad deal.Even if the Tevinter offer had been in good faith, it wasn't very good. 10 years of practical slavery, and that's before Alexius's goes and alters the deal. The Tevinter are well known for blood sacrifices and the like. Fiona knows this, even in the base deal. The Inquisitor has no idea what the orb will do when he/she picks it up.
They were both spur of the moments. The rebel mages were led to believe the attack was imminent. Time was a factor and political manipulation was at play. It's dishonest to say that the decision was intentionally calculated.
Honestly, I've been thinking about it and I think Alexius was telling the truth (from a certain point of view) with the exception of the imminent Templar attack. Fiona's mages were put to military service for the TI, just a very old version of it fighting a different enemy than they would expect. And I suspect that they would have eventually been given their freedom had they survived for 10 years....that just was a low probability chance because of the Inquisition. I don't know why I care about whether Alexius was honest or not, but I do think he was mostly honest in his dealings....Fiona just took a bad deal.
I'm not sure myself. The Venatori were serving Corypheus, so eventually the rebel mages would have fought the inquisition regardless, due to the Inquisitor having the anchor. Chances are they would make themselves useful by serving as the sacrifice to make the Venatori's blood magic stronger. Maybe Alexius was honest, and would've honoured the agreement, but would the control remain in his hands? He had already failed Corypheus too many times.
Fiona knew the minimum consequences of her decision. The Inquisitor did not. I don't know what's hard to understand about that. There really isn't much ground for comparison.
The inquisitor has enough sense to know it was a magical object that he has no expierence or knowledge of. If we can hold the magisters accountable for creating the blight by entering the fade and dismiss ignorance as a defense, then why should the inquisitor be exempt?
Time should not be a factor in the question of whether you want to weaken your defensive position, make a new enemy, and sell yourself into slavery all in one move. She made the worst possible strategic decision she could have made in circumstances, and no amount of rushing should have made that seem like a good idea to any half competent leader.They were both spur of the moments. The rebel mages were led to believe the templar attack was imminent. Time was a factor and political manipulation was at play. It's dishonest to say that the decision was intentionally calculated.
They were both spur of the moments. The rebel mages were led to believe the templar attack was imminent. Time was a factor and political manipulation was at play. It's dishonest to say that the decision was intentionally calculated.
That is such a flawed comparison, I don't know if you are serious or just trying to provoke responses.
Time should not be a factor in the question of whether you want to weaken your defensive position, make a new enemy, and sell yourself into slavery all in one move. She made the worst possible strategic decision she could have made in circumstances, and no amount of rushing should have made that seem like a good idea to any half competent leader.
What do you think would be the end game for the mage rebellion post divine conclave? The point of the divine conclave was to change hearts and minds of the templars and their supporters, otherwise they would have to fight an endless war resorting in terrorism and breeding resentment against the templars until they relent in their crusade to imprison or kill them. A war that would implicate ferelden. It's indentured servitude not slavery with the promise of freedom after their dues are paid, fighting an unwinnable war in the south will benefit no one. Put aside the pretentious bravado, what else would they accomplish by staying and fighting?
The inquisitor has enough sense to know it was a magical object that he has no expierence or knowledge of. If we can hold the magisters accountable for creating the blight by entering the fade and dismiss ignorance as a defense, then why should the inquisitor be exempt?
They were both spur of the moments. The rebel mages were led to believe the templar attack was imminent. Time was a factor and political manipulation was at play. It's dishonest to say that the decision was intentionally calculated.
Fiona had an indeterminable span of time to mull over the decision while being protected inside a heavily fortified town, whereas the Inquisitor had to stop Cory from getting the orb the moment after he barged into the room.
Fiona not sending word to Fereldan's monarchy through Teagan or courier for reinforcements, and not believing that Fereldan's national army can protect them from a few thousand Temps is beyond me.
What do you think would be the end game for the mage rebellion post divine conclave? The point of the divine conclave was to change hearts and minds of the templars and their supporters, otherwise they would have to fight an endless war resorting in terrorism and breeding resentment against the templars until they relent in their crusade to imprison or kill them. A war that would implicate ferelden. It's indentured servitude not slavery with the promise of freedom after their dues are paid, fighting an unwinnable war in the south will benefit no one. Put aside the pretentious bravado, what else would they accomplish by staying and fighting?
Short term their goal should have been staying put while putting their ducks in a row, helping the village as much as possible to change attitudes. They were under royal protection which is better than any protection Alexius could offer due to various logistics. Long term, either aim for integration or negotiate safe passage to TI if they believe that to be impossible. However, and this is the important part, don't negotiate under duress and agree to terms which are treasonous to the peoe currently sponsoring you.What do you think would be the end game for the mage rebellion post divine conclave? The point of the divine conclave was to change hearts in minds, otherwise they would have to fight an endless war resorting in terrorism and breeding resentment against the templars until they relent in their crusade to imprison or kill them. A war that would implicate ferelden. It's indentured servitude not slavery with the promise of freedom after their dues are paid, fighting an unwinnable war in south will benefit no one. Put aside the pretentious bravado, what else would they accomplish by staying and fighting?
Short term their goal should have been staying put while putting their ducks in a row, helping the village as much as possible to change attitudes. They were under royal protection which is better than any protection Alexius could offer due to various logistics. Long term, either aim for integration or negotiate safe passage to TI if they believe that to be impossible. However, and this is the important part, don't negotiate under duress and agree to terms which are treasonous to the peoe currently sponsoring you.
Going to TI is not stupid in and of itself if you can get decent terms (and they will keep to them, which is questionable). Helping the TI take over vital land in a foreign country that the TI is incapable of holding with no escape plan and another enemy that you believe is on your doorstep is not decent terms however. There was no end game plan there.
Maybe it could have happened as you say. that is if we assumed all things worked out smoothly, i.e., if they remained secure and safe. If they can't get someone to co-opt them though they're sitting ducks fighting an endless war. And since fiona took in all refugees, some of them tevinter agents, redcliffe might have still been sacked and their bridges with ferelden been burned even with out fiona's consent. I guess we'll never know.
Even if the original deal of being servants had gone through, the Tevinter are known for sacrificing their servants for blood. They aren't going to be much better off in Tevinter than if they had surrendered or never even rebelled in the first place. That's before we even get into the altered deal where they're fighting the Qunari, which would see them being the most expendable mages in the entire Imperial Army.
The original deal was not as cruel as you make it seemed. Sure some of them required military service, maybe they would be expendable, but those that weren't military would be safe. And I assume the legion would try not to die for atleast the practical reason of not wasting resources.
And as I said before:
Depends on the master really. Dorian would say you think that way because you are applying the sort of villanous cliches everyone expects out of tevinter. Sure it wouldn't be pleasant, it would be work ranging from cooking to cleaning or even helping alexius research. But the rebel mages are apostates that are wanted dead or tranquil so the alternative is unsavory. But if Alexius wasn't part of the venatori and wasn't cruel out of desperation, Dorian describes him a decent man. Tevinter prohibits sacrifices technically and Alexius might be a magister of honor if you can believe it.
The principle of the rebellion, however, was that freedom was worth fighting and dying for. If you're going to give yourself to the Tevinter, you might as well have simply stayed in the Circle. Getting a bad master in Tevinter is probably as likely as being stuck in a bad Circle in the South,The original deal was not as cruel as you make it seemed. Sure some of them required military service, maybe they would be expendable, but those that weren't military would be safe. And I assume the legion would try not to die for atleast the practical reason of not wasting resources.
And as I said before:
The principle of the rebellion, however, was that freedom was worth fighting and dying for. If you're going to give yourself to the Tevinter, you might as well have simply stayed in the Circle. Getting a bad master in Tevinter is probably as likely as being stuck in a bad Circle in the South,
Fight for freedom sure but in proper context. But only if that fight has a chance of success. Otherwise you are just dying and nothing changes. To continue to live to fight another day is the only defiance mages have left in redcliffe. That is before they were co-opted by Calpernia.
Fight for freedom sure but in proper context. But only if that fight has a chance of success. Otherwise you are just dying and nothing changes. To continue to live to fight another day is the only defiance mages have left in redcliffe. That is before they were co-opted by Calpernia.
Fight for freedom sure but in proper context. But only if that fight has a chance of success. Otherwise you are just dying and nothing changes. To continue to live to fight another day is the only defiance mages have left in redcliffe. That is before they were co-opted by Calpernia.
If the rebellion wasn't going to succeed then she shouldn't have incited the war in the first place.
Having the mage rebellion fight to the end makes a better statement about mage freedom that sulking off to Tevinter does, especially as taking the deal undercuts the mage's entire stance.
As Fenris says, Na via lerno victoria. 'Only the living know victory.' Sensless bravado benefits them none.
Having the mage rebellion fight to the end makes a better statement about mage freedom that sulking off to Tevinter does, especially as taking the deal undercuts the mage's entire stance.
It isn't even about live and fight another day with Fiona, she never brings up this point.
As Fenris says, Na via lerno victoria. 'Only the living know victory.' Sensless bravado benefits them none.
The fact is that if they all die, they become a symbol of mage freedom for future generations, but if they run off to Tevinter, they can be pointed out as cowards, failures, and linked to the abuses of the Magisters.
That's the kind of talk the chantry tries to delude their templars with, "pain for purpose". They can reform tevinter and urge mage unity in all of thedas to conquer the oppressive south. And since the south won't let the mages be free of their own accord, peaceful resolution is no longer an option. A tactical retreat does not have to mean surrender. People like Dorian and Calpernia are among the ranks who sees the need to reform tevinter. The southern mages can help in that, at least give them a purpose.
That's the kind of talk the chantry tries to delude their templars with, "pain for purpose". They can reform tevinter and urge mage unity in all of thedas to conquer the oppressive south. And since the south won't let the mages be free of their own accord, peaceful resolution is no longer an option. A tactical retreat does not have to mean surrender. People like Dorian and Calpernia are among the ranks who sees the need to reform tevinter. The southern mages can help in that, at least give them a purpose.
Reforming Tevinter usually ends in death for being a "maleficar" or being tranquilized. Besides, Tevinter couldn't defeat a United South with the Qunari at their backs. Even if some of the rebels survive their stint as servants or in the army, they will start at the very bottom of the mage hierarchy.
The Venatori are a bunch of tevinter pariahs who successfully spread chaos in the south, imagine if they had strong leadership of calpernia to guide the entire tevinter imperium. It's not like the qunari are exactly thrilled with the south either. If kirkwall is any indication of the chantry, the vints might just provoke another qunari war or spread corruption among the south. The south's stability is a lot more fragile than most people like to believe.
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