Not sure if this is the right place for this but...
One of the things I liked about ME vs. DA is that there was character continuity throughout the storyline for the protagonist.. I'm sure that the Bioware team is late in the game regarding the next ME but if there would be sequels to that could we have a chance to build on relationships? The "choices" in DA didn't have the effect that ME had because of the different protagonists. Again, just throwing it out there.
So DA doesn't really fail at character continuity, there's just no one person to tie everyone together, like shep did.
More than that, there is no history between the protagonist and the previously appearing characters, and therefore no bond, no friendship to build on. Like how in ME3 Garrus and Shep are bestest of buds because they have a history with each other. The same depth of character development I felt with Garrus (or Tali, or Liara, or most of them) was not there with Morrigan or Leliana, though Varric still worked pretty well. Although, I must say, Varric was not nearly as front and center as in DA2. In DA2 I took Varric everywhere. In DAI, not so much.
Yup. Varric was not the same guy in DA:I at all. Someone else put it pretty well in another thread, that he already had his own inner circle to be a part of. I think that description works pretty well, because he only really seemed to come alive when Hawke was on the scene, or to a lesser extent, when he argued with Cassandra.More than that, there is no history between the protagonist and the previously appearing characters, and therefore no bond, no friendship to build on. Like how in ME3 Garrus and Shep are bestest of buds because they have a history with each other. The same depth of character development I felt with Garrus (or Tali, or Liara, or most of them) was not there with Morrigan or Leliana, though Varric still worked pretty well. Although, I must say, Varric was not nearly as front and center as in DA2. In DA2 I took Varric everywhere. In DAI, not so much.
We'll have to see what this story is like before we can get a sense of whether or not we'll be carrying our character from game to game. I certainly hope so.
ME was better at continuity than any other game series I played. And not for the Shepard (who is really a bland placeholder for player input) but because of a lot of minor details that come into play on imported runs. Unique dialogue, references to the previous game events, different outcomes based on previous choices - the series had it all and in a quite large amount. It had its drawbacks though, by the time of ME3 the number of possible combinations became staggeringly large forcing the devs to homogenize certain choices for the sake of the narrative flow.
Character continuity:
Ashley Williams
Legion
Thane Krios
Character continuity:
Ashley Williams
Legion
Thane Krios
Thane?
Mordin
Edit: And Jack.
Thane?
In ME2, THane had about a year before his illness would incapacitate him. ME3 starts about six months after ME2, where his most optimistic doctor gave him "three months to live. None months ago". By that calendar, THane should have been already incapacitated if not dead by the time of the Suicide Mission
In addition, Thane is quite content to quietly die, when, in particular with a romanced Thane, he has found a new reason to live and is determined to go on for as long as he possibly can. Citadel DLC had to insert a message from Thane explaining why this sudden change of heart.
In ME2, THane had about a year before his illness would incapacitate him. ME3 starts about six months after ME2, where his most optimistic doctor gave him "three months to live. None months ago". By that calendar, THane should have been already incapacitated if not dead by the time of the Suicide Mission
In addition, Thane is quite content to quietly die, when, in particular with a romanced Thane, he has found a new reason to live and is determined to go on for as long as he possibly can. Citadel DLC had to insert a message from Thane explaining why this sudden change of heart.
I think that the very point of that conversation was to illustrate that the doctor was wrong.
And I don't remember him being content with quietly dying. He refuses to join the Normandy crew because he's not at his best (and Shepard needs the best as he puts it IIRC). His condition required daily medical attention and that's why he stayed at the hospital (fits with romance arc as well - doctors help him to live longer).
Character continuity?
My femshep from ME2 showed up for some parts in ME3 while other parts it was her stunt double that showed up
I think that the very point of that conversation was to illustrate that the doctor was wrong.
And I don't remember him being content with quietly dying. He refuses to join the Normandy crew because he's not at his best (and Shepard needs the best as he puts it IIRC). His condition required daily medical attention and that's why he stayed at the hospital (fits with romance arc as well - doctors help him to live longer).
Yes. The doctor was wrong. But Thane says he visited several. This was the doctor with the most optimistic prognosis, The one who apparently predicted he'd be dead at roughly the time he met Shepard.
Yet Thane told SHepard he had about another year of functionality. 
Yes. The doctor was wrong. But Thane says he visited several. This was the doctor with the most optimistic prognosis, The one who apparently predicted he'd be dead at roughly the time he met Shepard.
Yet Thane told SHepard he had about another year of functionality.
So? Thane proved all the doctors wrong. I fail to see how it means that Thane's character changed. If anything I'd say that its very fitting to his character - not meeting expectations.
So? Thane proved all the doctors wrong. I fail to see how it means that Thane's character changed. If anything I'd say that its very fitting to his character - not meeting expectations.
You don't understand. This is a direct contradiction to what Thane told Shepard in ME2, where he said we would be fine for another 8-12 months.
This was approximately six months before ME3. Where he tells Shepard he has already surpassed his most optimistic life expectancy six months earlier.
And yeah, his character changed in another way, especially if he was romanced. In ME2, Thane can find a new purpose in life, and is no longer seeking death.
"I have worked so hard. Meditated and prayed and done good deeds. Atoned for the evils I've done. Prepared. I consider my body's death, and a chill settles in my gut. I am afraid, and it shames me"
You don't understand. This is a direct contradiction to what Thane told Shepard in ME2, where he said we would be fine for another 8-12 months.
This was approximately six months before ME3. Where he tells Shepard he has already surpassed his most optimistic life expectancy six months earlier.
And yeah, his character changed in another way, especially if he was romanced. In ME2, Thane can find a new purpose in life, and is no longer seeking death.
"I have worked so hard. Meditated and prayed and done good deeds. Atoned for the evils I've done. Prepared. I consider my body's death, and a chill settles in my gut. I am afraid, and it shames me"
And there is a cure available. The writers put in Thane's death for feels. They put in Jacob's hooking up with Bryn as a "Jacob finally found what he's been looking for." Then oops! There are people who play femShep? 15% who cares about them! We look at this as: Thane dies for no reason; Jacob cheats. Leaving our femShep with two choices for LI in ME3 if we "Virmired" Kaidan: Liara and Samantha.
You don't understand. This is a direct contradiction to what Thane told Shepard in ME2, where he said we would be fine for another 8-12 months.
This was approximately six months before ME3. Where he tells Shepard he has already surpassed his most optimistic life expectancy six months earlier.
And yeah, his character changed in another way, especially if he was romanced. In ME2, Thane can find a new purpose in life, and is no longer seeking death.
"I have worked so hard. Meditated and prayed and done good deeds. Atoned for the evils I've done. Prepared. I consider my body's death, and a chill settles in my gut. I am afraid, and it shames me"
That's his assumption based on his body's state at the time of ME2.
He was fine for 6 months, no?
He tells Shepard that he has surpassed doctors' most optimistic predictions. Not his most optimistic life expectancy.
He no longer seeks death and he does not do that in ME3. Not sure where you get it from. Sitting in a hospital under daily medical care, constantly exercising is not really "seeking death". If anything, he does not give up.
Thane didn't need to die the way he did.
Just have Kai Leng run away after being thrown to the ground. The doctor tells him to avoid anymore stress like that again. He would be available to show up in the Citadel dlc and have a goodbye or at least a holo-bye in London and then let the player speculate when he dies after the reapers are stopped..
I mean isn't that what ME3 is all about? Speculation
And there is a cure available. The writers put in Thane's death for feels.
It was the opposite actually. The writers teased the possibility of a cure in LotSB for feels. Prior to DLC Thane was quite clear that his illness was terminal. In fact it is one of the first lines of dialogue he utters. Additionally the lore on Kepral's Syndrone gives it a 100% morality rate. Prior to ME2 no Drell had ever survived it.
What happened is that Thanemancers started lobbying for a cure for the character after ME2 released and Bioware appears to have considering caving for the sake of fanservice. Ultimately I think Bioware got it right in Mass Effect 3. Or at least they did with him dying. It could have perhaps played out a bit differently, and he probably should have had more content, particularly for players whose Shepard romanced him...but they got it right with Thane dying. Introducing a cure would have invalidated Thane's entire character arc in ME2 and turned him into a special snowflake who survives a disease that strikes down every other Drell.
I found it very weird that I had to do a loyalty mission for Garrus in ME2. I'd already DONE his loyalty mission in my own eyes, darn it, in ME1. We became squadmates. I helped him with his issues, tracking down his nemesis, etc. Then in ME2, I was really taken aback that Garrus wasn't "loyal." I do feel that those who did ME1 should have been given "loyalty credit" for Garrus, although I did enjoy his loyalty mission. I just hated having to earn the loyalty of who I felt was one of my Shep's most loyal friends all over again.
On Thane, as a Thanemancer, I didn't mind that Thane died in ME3, although I will never play that version again, preferring the modded version.
I was just so angry at the way it was handled, and much of it was very out of character.
The Thane in the hospital basically breaks up with femshep and then ever after has nothing to say to her at all. He's honestly quite cold and just says "we knew it had to end," whereas I just don't agree that this is consistent with the guy who found a new lease on love and life in ME2 (nor do I feel he would dump Shep and resign himself to a hospital).
And nobody ever mentions or talks about Thane, nobody mentions his situation, nobody asks Shep about him (shoot, when she romanced him in ME2, it was the talk of the ship, garnering discussions from Mordin, Kasumi, Kelly and others), and when he dies, nobody says a damn word. She isn't given a paramour achievement even if faithful to him and making out with him in the hospital, and in the original version, there was no final vision of him (at least the EC fixed this). Even the Citadel DLC content, as lovely as it is, rubs me the wrong way because it just feels like someone went, "Oops, we forgot Thane was an LI, here, feel better?"
Continuity-wise, I was also very irritated at the subtle and (I felt) OOC choices for Legion. Most of his major dialogue with Shep in ME3 is, "Oops, I lied about that, I knew you would be upset," and to me, that just doesn't feel appropriate or realistic.
I also disliked the ME3 handling of Kasumi (it felt haphazard and sloppy), Jacob (I just don't think he would have cheated quite so egregiously with NO word to Shep at all -- I don't like Jacob myself, but he did seem irritatingly honorable in ME2) and even Mordin. While I was touched at Mordin's death in ME3, I don't quite believe the total flip-flop he does on the genophage (nor do I agree with his new take that it's a priority now, and one worth dying for).
I think part of it for me is that I'm biased. I loved ME2 so much, I loved that squad, I loved that they were these mismatched damaged people finding new hope, comradeship and relationships, and that they were willing to die (flaws guilt and all) on a mission no one would ever appreciate. So for ME3 to arrive and spend so much damn time and attention on ME1 romances while jettisoning most of those squadmates and connections really made me sad.
On minor characters -- I thought Chakwas was very true to life, but I kind of loathed Ken in Engineering. Where he'd been charming in ME2, in ME3, most of his anecdotes are kind of coarse and gross and super-sexist. Did anyone else catch this?
Actually, same with EDI. I loved their evolution in ME2. Loved. When EDI called him "Jeff" after the crew had been lost, I was so moved. But the sexbot was just ridiculous, the outfits on her were ridiculous (as was the body on her, like, come on, talk about pandering to the lowest denominator), and I was actually embarrassed that I'd ever had a crush on Joker in game 1.
The real missed opportunity to me is an EDI who never got a body. I do believe Joker loves her and that she loves him (possibly even more), and that this developed beautifully in ME2. I just think it would have been more interesting and poignant for the story that instead of Joker going, "How do I have sex with a robot?" that he fall in love with EDI and go, "Okay. You know what? I don't need to have sex, I love her. We're there for each other."
But ironically, despite this, to me EDI is one of the better-written characters in ME3, and she does have a poignant and clear evolution. When she begins to determine her own outlook, philosophy, and moral code toward the end of ME3, it's really moving to me, and beyond that, Tricia Helfer voices her so wonderfully that she gives EDI a warmth and focus that make me love her in spite of her incredibly insulting sexbot design.
Anyway, I really love ME3 even if it sounds like I don't. But it felt characterwise like someone just read a bunch of ME2 flashcards:
Kaidan: single, devoted/creepy
Liara: single, devoted (yet curiously way less creepy to me than in 1, and LotSB actually made me like her)
Miranda: bioengineered, psycho dad, sister issues
Kasumi: Keije, thief, witty, sad
Mordin: scientist, helped doom the Krogans/genophage, sings G&S
Joker: Became friendly with EDI the AI (let's hook them up!)
Thane: dying assassin (what? there was more?)
I did think Samara's scenes at the monastery were very well-done and touching, however, and it was also fun watching Liara have to deal with the realities of Protheans.
Which brings me to: Javik. It's very very difficult for me to totally reconcile the Javik we meet with the sophisticated Prothean civilization we saw for two full games before. Honestly Javik is the one who seems primitive to me, and I do wish he grew at all -- he seems to progress very little during the game, and it's kind of depressing to view the game through his eyes. I would have liked for Liara or Shep to have affected him more, even a little. To give him some kind of hope.
DA:O - Leiliana who would sing and talk about shoes.
DA:I - I had Darth Leiliana. It was war and I wanted to win, not play nice.
I was looking out for the people. Why is it I always end up as bad or worse than the villain in the end?
I am the Herald of Andraste! Bow before me!
DA:O - Leiliana who would sing and talk about shoes.
DA:I - I had Darth Leiliana. It was war and I wanted to win, not play nice.
I was looking out for the people. Why is it I always end up as bad or worse than the villain in the end?
I am the Herald of Andraste! Bow before me!
It's the political view Bioware is trying to inject for quite a few games already, no such thing as pragmatism and dealing with harsh realities,
it's either DA:O's Leliana, or lady stab&slash from DA:I.
Rainbow farting unicorns Vs. puppy stomping cartoonish villains.
Don´t know if it´s the different localisation and VA but I got the impression that Mordin tried to convince himself all the time in ME 2, that he did the right thing with the genophage modification. I wasn´t really surprised that he changed his stance in ME 3. Bakara and all the females dying because they were so desperate for a cure probably did the last push.
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