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[Ieldra]

As for Tevinter slave trade, I doubt it will remain in place. Slavery is actually an extremely inefficient way of utilizing resources. If you notice, in the real world, slavery is only practiced by societies that have not technologically advanced or sufficiently mechanize to allow for machines or in Thedas' case, magic to do the work. 

 

No society in history that has practice slavery has ever survived the test of time. Ever. Tevinter will not be able to escape this rule unless Bioware writers used their powers of artistic ingenuity to make it so. 

That assertion (italicized) is actually false. People wouldn't use slavery if it didn't have a benefit over paid and free workers under specific conditions. That slavery systems mostly (there are pseudo-legal systems and variations still in place in some areas) did not survive into modern times on Earth is not surprising, since the main influence factors on the economic feasability of slavery are population density and technology. In Thedas, there does not appear to have been any significant change in either since the start of the Blights.

 

Then there is the effect of magic. The magisters' secret, blood-magic-fueled wars would not be possible without a steady supply of expendable slaves whose absence will not be noticed by anyone but other slaves. There is a vested interest in keeping the system going at the highest levels of power.

 

So there won't be any change unless it's forced, and even then it can't be one in one step.

 

Edit:

As for standing the test of time, the Roman Empire lasted for more than a thousand years. Our modern economic and political systems are still far away from matching that.

[The Baconer]

No society in history that has practice slavery has ever survived the test of time. Ever.

 

What does "test of time" even mean in this context? Or even, I suppose, "society", since slavery exists to this very day.

[Ieldra]

What does "test of time" even mean in this context? Or even, I suppose, "society", since slavery exists to this very day.

That, too. It's illegal in all countries, but in some it's as illegal as human sacrifice in Tevinter.

[Dr. Doctor]

That assertion (italicized) is actually false. People wouldn't use slavery if it didn't have a benefit over paid and free workers under specific conditions. That slavery systems mostly (there are pseudo-legal systems and variations still in place in some areas) did not survive into modern times on Earth is not surprising, since the main influence factors on the economic feasability of slavery are population density and technology. In Thedas, there does not appear to have been any significant change in either since the start of the Blights.
 
Then there is the effect of magic. The magisters' secret, blood-magic-fueled wars would not be possible without a steady supply of expendable slaves whose absence will not be noticed by anyone but other slaves. There is a vested interest in keeping the system going at the highest levels of power.
 
So there won't be any change unless it's forced, and even then it can't be one in one step.
 
Edit:
As for standing the test of time, the Roman Empire lasted for more than a thousand years. Our modern economic and political systems are still far away from matching that.

I'm waiting to see gunpowder and other technological advances make their way into Thedas. There's not much that magic can't do, but it requires lyrium to fuel reliably. Javaris Tintop had a point, Qunari black powder is magic that anyone can use.

Tevinter is currently in the Byzantine stage, its lost a lot of its territory and instead of the Ottoman Empire breathing down its neck they have the Qunari (different religion, advances like gunpowder).

[Master Warder Z_]

So claiming that the Imperium was not a force to be reckoned with against the qunari is rather pompous claim.

Did I dismiss Tevinter actually repulsing the Qunari? No, am I surprised you tried to twist my argument?

Hardly.

It wasn't Tevinter that crippled their navy and it wasn't Tevinter that pushed them to the edge of Rivain.

Tevinter's known impact in the war is strictly within Tevinter.

[The Baconer]

I'm waiting to see gunpowder and other technological advances make their way into Thedas. There's not much that magic can't do, but it requires lyrium to fuel reliably. Javaris Tintop had a point, Qunari black powder is magic that anyone can use.

 

Good for mundanes, but even better for mages. I can't wait. :>

[TEWR]

There's nothing "made". The Evil Empire is Tevinter's current status. And in fact, I want it to be something more nuanced. Mainly because there are too many things I like about it, and because the main reason it's reviled by the rest of Thedas lies in something I see as an awesome undertaking done by the wrong people for the wrong reasons, and gone horribly wrong because of it, rather than an embodiment of "sin". I get the feeling the story wants me to agree to Andrastianism's assessment of the attempt to reach the Golden City, and that I will never do.

 

You misunderstood me then. what I meant was that I hope that Tevinter doesn't continue to have that image, as that's been all we've been told thus far. When I said made, I didn't mean it would be some new thing, but rather that when we go there that's what they depict it as again. As of now, we kinda have the benefit of southern nations swallowing the propaganda of the Orlesian Chantry, but even then that doesn't excuse Tevinter's depiction thus far as being "Slaves and blood magic and more slaves and more blood magic." from a writing perspective.

 

Even Dorian is only there to be "the exception to the rule".

 

Really, Tevinter only exists as a gimmick for the narrative. In DAO, big bad Tevinter shows up and does slavery. In DAII, big bad Tevinter shows up to get more slaves and old slaves. In DAI, a cult exists from Tevinter, primarily comprised of Tevinter people, and even then Tevinter the nation is treated as some sort of side-entity that couldn't give two shits (when realistically they should, if it's their countrymen doing this at the behest of an ancient Tevinter magister. Public relations and all that, especially with a powerful entity like the Inquisition.

 

Frankly, I too don't hold with the Andrastian narrative of the Golden City thing. There are some kernels, to be sure, but I'm also able to see that there are holes. A lot of them, really. There's more to support the origins of the Blight have something to do with the PT Dwarves -- as I've maintained since DAII -- and that the Magisters through their actions made it noteworthy for all of Thedas (but are not responsible for it in the first place).

 

I also don't think Tevinter could've survived if they were paying so much for slaves (the war chest/treasury in DAO was 1/3 full after a few dozen Elves were shipped off, while Hayder says "those slaves cost 100 sovereigns a head"). Beyond that, the way Bioware's writing Tevinter makes me think they don't have a clue what they're doing (Bioware that is).

 

Which isn't anything new, truth be told. I don't know that Bioware really knew what they were doing for politics in Thedosian nations. 

[Xilizhra]

The funny/tragic thing is that Corypheus might not even have been planning to betray Calpernia. It's entirely possible that his binding ritual was the only way he knew to counter the effects of the Well of Sorrows and Mythal's geas.

[Ranadiel Marius]

The funny/tragic thing is that Corypheus might not even have been planning to betray Calpernia. It's entirely possible that his binding ritual was the only way he knew to counter the effects of the Well of Sorrows and Mythal's geas.

I'm sure that would make her so much happier when she was eternally trapped in an energy prison unable to escape or even get up to stretch her legs. >.>

[Xilizhra]

I'm sure that would make her so much happier when she was eternally trapped in an energy prison unable to escape or even get up to stretch her legs. >.>

Ah. I didn't actually do that quest, so I thought it was just a mental thing and not a physical one.

[Ranadiel Marius]

Ah. I didn't actually do that quest, so I thought it was just a mental thing and not a physical one.

Oh, well for a little bit more detail then, Calpernia's original master is trapped at the Temple of Dumat in a sphere of blue energy so small that I don't believe he could stand up in it if the binding ritual allowed him to get up from the kneeling position. Based on the dialogue the impression i got was that he is forced to truthfully answer all questions asked of him and may constantly be in pain.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

 You know, for all this (IMO ridiculous) speculation about Hawke or his/her Warden contact not truly dying in the Fade, I was recently thinking about Calpernia's fate and wonder if we have seen the last of her.

 

The option to talk her down exists, so there's that. We do not know of her fate, if I am not mistaken, if the mages are recruited. One might assume she was killed but that is never made clear. It is possible she is alive. As for her suicide attempt if you face her and choose not to talk her down... sure, it looked bad, but ya never know. It was executed in such a way that we do not see her death for certain. I can believe that was done deliberately to leave the option open to bring her back (at least, I can believe it a lot more readily than saying the NPC who faced Nightmare may be alive just because the wording was a little wishy-washy).

 

It is said that she was a favorite among the writers, and if the series moves to the north then her relevance to the story only increases.

 

What say you?

[Uccio]

Why would be she be relevant? Ex-slave part of fringe extremist group. Hardly someone who would actually have any clout in Tevinter. 

[Catche Jagger]

I wouldn't be surprised if we see her again, especially if the next game ends up being set in Tevinter. Regardless of what happens, we never see the body. I kind of assumed that her and Samson were left the way they were at the end so the writers could justify bringing them back later.

[Patchwork]

I won't be surprised to see her and Dorian if we go to Tevinter in the next game. They might even join forces, Dorian has the right name and she gives him a perspective he badly needs if he wants to really make Tevinter better.

[Xilizhra]

 You know, for all this (IMO ridiculous) speculation about Hawke or his/her Warden contact not truly dying in the Fade, I was recently thinking about Calpernia's fate and wonder if we have seen the last of her.

 

The option to talk her down exists, so there's that. We do not know of her fate, if I am not mistaken, if the mages are recruited. One might assume she was killed but that is never made clear. It is possible she is alive. As for her suicide attempt if you face her and choose not to talk her down... sure, it looked bad, but ya never know. It was executed in such a way that we do not see her death for certain. I can believe that was done deliberately to leave the option open to bring her back (at least, I can believe it a lot more readily than saying the NPC who faced Nightmare may be alive just because the wording was a little wishy-washy).

 

It is said that she was a favorite among the writers, and if the series moves to the north then her relevance to the story only increases.

 

What say you?

I hope so. I won't get to see Calpernia in Inquisition, after all, and I don't think the story uses her to best effect.

[sandalisthemaker]

Last hope of Tevinter?  That would be Dorian.

 

That being said, I thought Calpernia was interesting and I allowed her to live in my canon run. 

[teh DRUMPf!!]

 You know, for all this (IMO ridiculous) speculation about Hawke or his/her Warden contact not truly dying in the Fade, I was recently thinking about Calpernia's fate and wonder if we have seen the last of her.

 

The option to talk her down exists, so there's that. We do not know of her fate, if I am not mistaken, if the mages are recruited. One might assume she was killed but that is never made clear. It is possible she is alive. As for her suicide attempt if you face her and choose not to talk her down... sure, it looked bad, but ya never know. It was executed in such a way that we do not see her death for certain. I can believe that was done deliberately to leave the option open to bring her back (at least, I can believe it a lot more readily than saying the NPC who faced Nightmare may be alive just because the wording was a little wishy-washy).

 

It is said that she was a favorite among the writers, and if the series moves to the north then her relevance to the story only increases.

 

What say you?

 

On a whim, I went and checked the Keep on this...

 

Player options for the Calpurnia encounter are: (1) Did not encounter; (2) Talked with Calpurnia; (3) Fought Calpurnia.

 

#3 notes that "she flung herself into the abyss" rather than be defeated by Inquisition. Also, the tile does not picture her with the skeletal image used in the 'Keep to signify character death (not that it has always mattered in the past, i.e. Leliana). And of course, it's worth noting that it says "fought" rather than "killed."

 

Very interesting. I'm not saying Calpurnia is definitely coming back in the next game, but I think they've clearly left the option open.

[Catche Jagger]

On a whim, I went and checked the Keep on this...

 

Player options for the Calpurnia encounter are: (1) Did not encounter; (2) Talked with Calpurnia; (3) Fought Calpurnia.

 

#3 notes that "she flung herself into the abyss" rather than be defeated by Inquisition. Also, the tile does not picture her with the skeletal image used in the 'Keep to signify character death (not that it has always mattered in the past, i.e. Leliana). And of course, it's worth noting that it says "fought" rather than "killed."

 

Very interesting. I'm not saying Calpurnia is definitely coming back in the next game, but I think they've clearly left the option open.

I don't think anyone would be surprised if she showed up again at this point.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

On a whim, I went and checked the Keep on this...

 

Player options for the Calpurnia encounter are: (1) Did not encounter; (2) Talked with Calpurnia; (3) Fought Calpurnia.

 

#3 notes that "she flung herself into the abyss" rather than be defeated by Inquisition. Also, the tile does not picture her with the skeletal image used in the 'Keep to signify character death (not that it has always mattered in the past, i.e. Leliana). And of course, it's worth noting that it says "fought" rather than "killed."

 

Very interesting. I'm not saying Calpurnia is definitely coming back in the next game, but I think they've clearly left the option open.

Great.

[AresKeith]

Last hope of Tevinter?  That would be Dorian.

 

That being said, I thought Calpernia was interesting and I allowed her to live in my canon run. 

 

Dorian, Mae, Calpernia team up?

[Ieldra]

 You know, for all this (IMO ridiculous) speculation about Hawke or his/her Warden contact not truly dying in the Fade, I was recently thinking about Calpernia's fate and wonder if we have seen the last of her.

 

The option to talk her down exists, so there's that. We do not know of her fate, if I am not mistaken, if the mages are recruited. One might assume she was killed but that is never made clear. It is possible she is alive. As for her suicide attempt if you face her and choose not to talk her down... sure, it looked bad, but ya never know. It was executed in such a way that we do not see her death for certain. I can believe that was done deliberately to leave the option open to bring her back (at least, I can believe it a lot more readily than saying the NPC who faced Nightmare may be alive just because the wording was a little wishy-washy).

 

It is said that she was a favorite among the writers, and if the series moves to the north then her relevance to the story only increases.

 

What say you?

I'd say the writers have been hedging their bets. They didn't want to commit one way or the other, and this gives them the ability to make Calpernia relevant to the next chapter of the story, or not. The inconclusiveness of Calpernia's exit does not indicate anything for the future except that it's possible that she might return. Usually, scenes like this in stories point to a return of the character in question, but that presumes that the writers know how the story will continue, and I'd take any bet that nobody in the DA team had the slightest idea what comes next when they wrote this scene.

 

I've often criticized Bioware's writers for refusing to be bound by past events they've written, and to retcon beyond the limits of the acceptable whenever they feel like it. I take it their reaction to such criticism is to refuse to make definite statements whenever they can get away with it. I must admit that's not the kind of solution I appreciate, but it's better than resurrecting Leliana.

[TEWR]

Dorian, Mae, Calpernia team up?

 

With Alexius, Feynriel, and Fenris too.

 

That's what happens in my headcanon anyway. Felix too, since I have him join the Wardens in my 'verse. And Varania.

 

Plus a whole host of other characters, because why not?

[TEWR]

 You know, for all this (IMO ridiculous) speculation about Hawke or his/her Warden contact not truly dying in the Fade, I was recently thinking about Calpernia's fate and wonder if we have seen the last of her.

 

The option to talk her down exists, so there's that. We do not know of her fate, if I am not mistaken, if the mages are recruited. One might assume she was killed but that is never made clear. It is possible she is alive. As for her suicide attempt if you face her and choose not to talk her down... sure, it looked bad, but ya never know. It was executed in such a way that we do not see her death for certain. I can believe that was done deliberately to leave the option open to bring her back (at least, I can believe it a lot more readily than saying the NPC who faced Nightmare may be alive just because the wording was a little wishy-washy).

 

It is said that she was a favorite among the writers, and if the series moves to the north then her relevance to the story only increases.

 

What say you?

 

I kinda wonder how Corypheus reacted. He obviously has a soft spot for her (he sees her potential and wants her forgiveness for how he's going to enslave her to his will so she won't be enslaved to Mythal's will) and I have to wonder if he did fight her.

 

I personally think he didn't, but then I don't subscribe to the whole "Cory is arrogance personified" trite BS the writers described him as, given that he's got more depth to him then just being "I AM RIGHT!!!!!"

 

As for Calpernia showing up, I believe it. And I hope for it. Though I doubt the writers will give her much care and devotion -- I have to agree with Xil that she wasn't utilized to her full potential for Inquisition.

[Catche Jagger]

Great.

You don't seem very happy about the idea.