Guest_Caoimhe_*
Barris died on me (if you are referring to me) so never really dealt with him. And I don't ride on the Fiona Hate Wagon so she doesn't bother me. In fact, I missed her presence in the library when I chose the templars. YMMV, I guess *shrugs*
I know what you mean. It felt empty. Same with the end of the game after the party. When I went to talk to everyone the next morning, Solas' empty room just made me sad.
Only good thing about the Templar side is the Envy demon. Playing out that part of its trying to dominate you in your mind is a far better mission than the whole time travelling thing. However, having done it once now... I will go back to choosing to help the mages in following runs.
Helping the mages is far more satisfying.
You would rather have Grand Failure Fiona over Awesome Epic Ser Barris?
You must be joking?
Actually yes...because something like the reformed college of enchanters under Fiona's leadership is what I wanted from the start.
I would rather have Ser Barris who is out there actually doing something and besides who is epic character rather then overrated Fiona that does nothing but sit in library doing nothing. Because when I side with mages I feel I gained nothing but mages that constantly complain despite the fact I have given them freedom and Fiona that serves for nothing!
Mage side of the story arc introduces Dorian and most importantly, Time Magic, something that no one has ever seen or heard of before. There is an actual intellectual progression for Thedas as a whole if you do the mage side and make Alexius work for you.
The Templar side of the story, while being very well done, does not actually add anything new or innovate the lore in a very significant way. Envy Demon is nice but compared to Chronomagic ? I don't think so.
Dragon Age as a franchise runs on the theme of "Returning History". Our arch-nemesis in all three games plus the lore revelations have been all concerning historical figures and historical facts that are thought long dead but are making their way back to Theodosians in the present. This is not the case with time magic / chronomagic. It was a specific development of magic that occurred in the here and now, much like how there is only one Bianca crossbow and how Gaatlok is an invention of the now, now a past revelation.
The mage side has revelations that can actually carry forward in the future. Even Fen'Harel was surprised to witness time magic and said he has never seen it before.
Even many of us fans of the templar mission are decidedly unsatisfied with the uneven setup. Mage-side, you get to see Fiona, Alexius, Felix and Dorian and learn the gist of what is going on before you commit to the choice. Templar-side you get ... pretty much nothing. It makes the mage quest feel a lot more urgent, personal and important. Still, once Champions of the Just kicks off, it's really enjoyable. Ser Barris is a sympathetic character whom I liked from the word go, it's good to actually see the uncorrupted templars fight back and actively work towards saving and redeeming what's left of the order, Cole gets a great and very unique introduction (which he needs IMO), and the entire sequence with Envy wanting to replace me ended up feeling quite personal, gripping and creepy.
The introduction of a demon that doesn't possess its victims and thus doesn't need to tempt or break them but simply study them, a demon that can beat you even if you never give in, adds an interesting and worrying new spin to demon lore. (My only quibble with it is that Envy couldn't possibly mimic the Anchor and its powers, so how convincing would it actually be? Would it have been able to possess us "normally" once it realized that, or can't this sort of demon do possession?)
On the other hand, nothing I hear about the mage quest really sounds appealing. I hate time travel and I really dislike Fiona as a character as well as the fact that she not only gets off scot-free but is also insufferably smug and hypocritical about it. So no, I'm not dissatisfied either with the templar mission on its own merits, or compared with the mage mission.
I would rather have Ser Barris who is out there actually doing something and besides who is epic character rather then overrated Fiona that does nothing but sit in library doing nothing. Because when I side with mages I feel I gained nothing but mages that constantly complain despite the fact I have given them freedom and Fiona that serves for nothing!
What about Ser Barris vs Time Magic ? 
Surely no Templar is worth taking over the possibility of learning a branch of magic that manipulates time itself.
I'm actually very torn between these two. What bothers me is that I cannot ignore my compulsion to follow up on the plot introduced by Dorian in the Redcliffe Chantry, which is what makes going to Therinfall Redoubt difficult. But, on the other hand, I thought the actual Templar mission was very well done. While the demon could have been done better, I actually love its taunting, and Cole's introduction has far more depth to it. On top of that, I like Calpernia much more than Samson, but I enjoy Samson's connection to the previous game and to Cullen.
This and furthermore, convincing cullen to get off lyrium addiction and convincing cassandra to rebuild the seekers affects the storyline of the templars in therinfal more than it does than the mages so there's that too narratively.
What about Ser Barris vs Time Magic ?
Surely no Templar is worth taking over the possibility of learning a branch of magic that manipulates time itself.
...story of mages makes more sense of DA:I story but...then you get Fiona and f~ck 
....
There is one hint about the whole time magic thing in that it never worked until after the breach foreshadows what you find out if you do in hushed whispers that it can't effect anything that takes place before the breach.
Mechanically I enjoyed the Templar mission. I liked the sense of urgency you had while searching for things but then having to run back to the main hall. I kind of wish they had used that mechanic elsewhere in the game. However I didn't care for the templar story. I didn't get how the demon got away with as much as it did. I also don't care for Cole since I couldn't fully understand what he was talking about half the time. the biggest peeve however is that even if you rescue the Templars you still have to face an army of Red Templars and you still end up going after the real Seeker Luscious. I ended up ditching my Templar playthrough so I didn't see Calpernia's quest to the end, but I didn't find it as enjoyable as tracking down Samson, a character I already felt some connection with.
In the end the Mage quest had a fun time travel element which gave the rest of the game a real sense of urgency. It's not just that you have to stop the big bad, you get to see WHY the big bad needs to be stopped. Also Dorian is one of the best written and voice acted characters in the game. Just the setup for the Mage quest made more sense with the threat of a Tevinter Magister and cult moving into Ferelden. It just felt like an issue that demanded more attention than the Templars who are simply acting like jerks.
The only thing i regret when choosing templars is the Anora/Alistair cameo.
Siding with the templars give some good things: some good soldiers (of course once disbandend the order 
they can't even get that their boss is an envy deamon. really, great deamon/abomination hunters we have here... no surprise you let all mages run away...) Calpernia and the dwarven "radio". Barris...he survived in the run I sided with the templars, but I can't really see why people like him. Is bland and really forgettable. And is nowhere in Skyhold to talk to after. bah. really don't make a change.
I really liked Cole's presentation, it was cool, just like it was cool the deamon. But there was nothing really new in the mission.
Siding with the mages was great on many levels: Connor, various point of view of the mages, Dorian, Fiona (I like her, can't understand where people see the mary sue, because she is flawed as hell, but I like her.) and the time magic. Is quite a big step in the DA lore, something that have never happened, quite more interesting than a more refined walk into the deamon territory. And the effect of the red lyrium on the various companions is heart wreking. Same as Leliana's condition in the future.
As I see it, siding with the templars is more good for new players. Less connections to the pasts games, more understanding of the basic lore of DA, while siding with the mages have lots of cameos and references to DAO and DA2. (Redcliff, Alistair/Anora, Fiona, Connor, Samson)
Ser Barris is a badass who runs around Thedas saving mages and mudanes alike. He is worth much more than nonsensical time travel (which makes much more sense as being explained as simulating the effects of time travel by altering memories of those in a region).What about Ser Barris vs Time Magic ?
Surely no Templar is worth taking over the possibility of learning a branch of magic that manipulates time itself.
I wonder how many people would still choose Templars if Barris didn't exist or always died at the end of the mission.
Guest_Caoimhe_*
Mechanically I enjoyed the Templar mission. I liked the sense of urgency you had while searching for things but then having to run back to the main hall. I kind of wish they had used that mechanic elsewhere in the game. However I didn't care for the templar story. I didn't get how the demon got away with as much as it did. I also don't care for Cole since I couldn't fully understand what he was talking about half the time. the biggest peeve however is that even if you rescue the Templars you still have to face an army of Red Templars and you still end up going after the real Seeker Luscious. I ended up ditching my Templar playthrough so I didn't see Calpernia's quest to the end, but I didn't find it as enjoyable as tracking down Samson, a character I already felt some connection with.
In the end the Mage quest had a fun time travel element which gave the rest of the game a real sense of urgency. It's not just that you have to stop the big bad, you get to see WHY the big bad needs to be stopped. Also Dorian is one of the best written and voice acted characters in the game. Just the setup for the Mage quest made more sense with the threat of a Tevinter Magister and cult moving into Ferelden. It just felt like an issue that demanded more attention than the Templars who are simply acting like jerks.
One thing that annoyed me about that mission with defending the Great Hall is sometimes when exiting or entering the Hall, the door would say I was in the Hall and heading back to the Hall, and if I clicked it, it would hang then send me back with new demons to attack.
Ser Barris is a badass who runs around Thedas saving mages and mudanes alike. He is worth much more than nonsensical time travel (which makes much more sense as being explained as simulating the effects of time travel by altering memories of those in a region).
Edit: Also Dagna invents 3D TV on Templar path.
Why isn't he my companion instead...it's not fair BW not fair 
Because people need him and therefore he cannot sit around hoping a PC takes him out of the castle.Why isn't he my companion instead...it's not fair BW not fair
Why isn't he my companion instead...it's not fair BW not fair
Because he's essentially just an average grunt. Taking Barris as a companion is the equivalent of taking random Inquisition soldier #745 out into the field with you. It should be telling that the only reason Barris gets anywhere is because the Inquisitor promoted him and he never would have gotten anywhere with the Templars normally.
Because people need him and therefore he cannot sit around hoping a PC takes him out of the castle.
I just wish he was some boring plain character instead of epic bada$$ that he is...because it kinda makes you angry how such epic character has most minor role while some *coughs* others got major ones just for being writer's pets!
Because he's essentially just an average grunt. Taking Barris as a companion is the equivalent of taking random Inquisition soldier #745 out into the field with you. It should be telling that the only reason Barris gets anywhere is because the Inquisitor promoted him and he never would have gotten anywhere with the Templars normally.
Have you recruited Bore Wall? The guy screams "average boring liar guy that needs killing". Ser Barris on another hand is awasome!...wish I can have him instead of Fiona even on mages run...alas I get stuck with Fiona if I want mages or to get better romance with Dorrian and that is torture because I can't stand Fiona
I would rather have Ser Barris who is out there actually doing something and besides who is epic character rather then overrated Fiona that does nothing but sit in library doing nothing. Because when I side with mages I feel I gained nothing but mages that constantly complain despite the fact I have given them freedom and Fiona that serves for nothing!
Guest_Caoimhe_*
I just wish he was some boring plain character instead of epic bada$$ that he is...because it kinda makes you angry how such epic character has most minor role while some *coughs* others got major ones just for being writer's pets!
This is so annoying yet so common in games! Sometimes I find that character that's just perfect to be a companion, yet they are only one for part of the plot then they leave or die. Like General Leo in Final Fantasy 6 for those who've played that game. I would have loved having Barris' aid and still choose to side with the mages since I loved Hushed Whispers best!
I don't expect Fiona to be running around Thedas: that isn't really her job as the grand enchanter. I expect her to "bring solutions to age-old problems", and it seems that she delivers.
Anyway, the main difference to me is that I'd feel terrible about abandoning the mages to their fate...that's why I just can't bring myself to to do the templar quest.
Yeah servitude to Tevinter does $ucks...plus whole Redcliff case....but then FIONA the special snowflake....ugh! I wish we get Barris still because he is not anti-mage and he could fit in mage plot role too....but Fiona...Fiona....ughhhhh....still wish there was option "Cut her head" I'm just frustrated how little choice we get regarding Fiona while we have lots of choices what to do Barris and how his fate shall end we can even get him killed...while Fiona 
.
This is so annoying yet so common in games! Sometimes I find that character that's just perfect to be a companion, yet they are only one for part of the plot then they leave or die. Like General Leo in Final Fantasy 6 for those who've played that game. I would have loved having Barris' aid and still choose to side with the mages since I loved Hushed Whispers best!
This!
...story of mages makes more sense of DA:I story but...then you get Fiona and f~ck
That is why I conscript the mages. My Dalish mage saw that the Mage-Templar situation was as Solas described :- A Sealed Boiling Pot Scenario. On the surface, it seemed fine and dandy but incoming kaboom was inevitable.
However, Lavellan also saw that the mage rebellion leadership is, as to quote Vivienne, "quite demented". The leadership, i.e. Fiona, was so poor. No proper planning, no objective, no allies, no cohesion.
As such, Lavellan conscripted them because he felt that he and by extension, the Inquisition, can lead and make the mage rebellion worth something.
I would even argue that the Bright Hand, which is what comes if you conscript the mages, is much more realistic and acceptable outcome under Leliana or Cassandra as Divines, as opposed to the College of Enchanters.
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