Guest_simfamUP_*
If I had to pick between great writing or great gameplay I will always choose great writing.
It's what I love video games for, really.
If I can get both? Great.
If I don't get what I want but the gameplay is exceptionally good? Okay.
But I love stories in almost any medium, and to interact with them is a dream come true, so that's where my love for gaming originated.
Guest_TrillClinton_*
REACTIVITY
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It is the essence of interaction.
Icewind Dale 1 > Baldur's Gate 2
You want a piece of me? Come at me bro.
Hello people thanks for the responses. The question was mainly the result of experiences gaming, where I could spend hundreds of hours on addicting MMOs or mobile Mario-esque games, or read a heft Visual Novel, and yet even though I spent so much time on them they would never been in my top video games. I could play games that were far less 'addicting' or seemed to have lamer stories and yet automatically would go higher up the list.
In other words this
That said, I think there are games that take an approach to design that bypasses the typical gameplay vs story paradigm in the sense that plots and/or game mechanics in a game might be mediocre on their own, but the holistic nature of it's design, combined with a strong attention to detail makes the experience greater than the sum of it's parts.
The top video games all had to be interesting on multiple dimension. I've played extreme sandbox games that were fairly absorbing and I've played very heavily JRPG oriented games that had some cool characters, but again, none of them really seem to matter to me in the end. I think video games are defined between right and left brain activity, like, it's right there in the title "video games," neither strictly video and neither strictly a game. Whenever a video game has pretty cool characters and pretty cool gameplay, it seems to go right to the top.
Another way to put it is lets say FFXIII is a fun and engaging and experience, the characters are really cool, it might be a fun experience, but it doesn't seem to be interfacing with the things. Objectively, you could say, well the characters were so awesome that compensates, but I'm not sure it works that way. The same with Minecraft, you could say, it's so easy to just build everything, and it's so immersive, that it compensates, but it doesn't seem to be interacting at all with narrative.
Now take something like Demon Souls or Skyward Sword, sure, there are lots of boring story and character parts in both, maybe Lighting is objectively more "cool." Likewise, it's hardly the most immersive Zelda game, and Demon Souls isn't nearly as vast as the Minecraft world, but since both are channeling multiple dimensions, that makes them the most interesting video games.
If there was such a thing as "better story" or "better gameplay," I'm basically suggesting those things are subject to diminishing returns in the context of video games, (Or things) because video games were never about your fastball in the sense of the most awesome mechanic or the most awesome world.
Or take Mario, were there more interesting games out at the time? More addicting ones? Probably. Were there more interesting anime worlds and characters out? Possibly, but Mario was blending two different worlds (East and West, in a sense) and that defined it more than necessarily doing any one feature well.
Finally I say "video games" but really it could just be "things," all kinds of things could achieve this.
Hello people thanks for the responses. The question was mainly the result of experiences gaming, where I could spend hundreds of hours on addicting MMOs or mobile Mario-esque games, or read a heft Visual Novel, and yet even though I spent so much time on them they would never been in my top video games. I could play games that were far less 'addicting' or seemed to have lamer stories and yet automatically would go higher up the list.
In other words this
The top video games all had to be interesting on multiple dimension. I've played extreme sandbox games that were fairly absorbing and I've played very heavily JRPG oriented games that had some cool characters, but again, none of them really seem to matter to me in the end. I think video games are defined between right and left brain activity, like, it's right there in the title "video games," neither strictly video and neither strictly a game. Whenever a video game has pretty cool characters and pretty cool gameplay, it seems to go right to the top.
Another way to put it is lets say FFXIII is a fun and engaging and experience, the characters are really cool, it might be a fun experience, but it doesn't seem to be interfacing with the things. Objectively, you could say, well the characters were so awesome that compensates, but I'm not sure it works that way. The same with Minecraft, you could say, it's so easy to just build everything, and it's so immersive, that it compensates, but it doesn't seem to be interacting at all with narrative.
Now take something like Demon Souls or Skyward Sword, sure, there are lots of boring story and character parts in both, maybe Lighting is objectively more "cool." Likewise, it's hardly the most immersive Zelda game, and Demon Souls isn't nearly as vast as the Minecraft world, but since both are channeling multiple dimensions, that makes them the most interesting video games.
If there was such a thing as "better story" or "better gameplay," I'm basically suggesting those things are subject to diminishing returns in the context of video games, (Or things) because video games were never about your fastball in the sense of the most awesome mechanic or the most awesome world.
Or take Mario, were there more interesting games out at the time? More addicting ones? Probably. Were there more interesting anime worlds and characters out? Possibly, but Mario was blending two different worlds (East and West, in a sense) and that defined it more than necessarily doing any one feature well.
Finally I say "video games" but really it could just be "things," all kinds of things could achieve this.
With just games I can enjoy either a heavy story or heavy gameplay focus, but if I'm going to consider it for my top video games of all time list? Then I agree that it needs to go above just being simply that.
It's why the original Half-Life pretty much permanently owns the top spot on my list. The story is admittedly nothing groundbreaking, but they managed to weave into very solid gameplay with great pacing in a way that many games in 2015 still can't do it even half as good as Half-Life did back in 1998. It was almost unheard of that a first person shooter back then even had story in it beyond "here be bad guys, go kill" much less to actually blend it well with gameplay.
MMO wise I think the only one I've played that I'd even consider is World of Warcraft in its early days, but then Blizzard also managed to merge aspects of what was at the time traditional hardcore MMO mechanics with a more casual feel to it. That foundation was so solid that they're still going quite strong a decade later.
Guest_Catch This Fade_*
REACTIVITY
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It is the essence of interaction.
Interaction is what makes video games, well, video games too.
Without that moment to moment interactivity from the player, whatever it is, then it ceases to be a video game and is something else entirely. Something akin to a choose your own adventure book, if there's some semblance of interactivity. Controlling the actions of the on-screen avatar almost 1 to 1, whether that's shooting, walking, jumping, pushing, pulling, and other stuff is something only video games do
TL;DR
Gameplay is the essence of video games and is hella important. Everything else should compliment that.
Guest_simfamUP_*
Icewind Dale 1 > Baldur's Gate 2
You want a piece of me? Come at me bro.
It depends on what you like...
BG has a charm to it given that its NPCs have far more life than anything IWD produced.
But on level design and gameplay it far outweighs the pros of BG.
BG2 on the other hand...
Yeah. BG2 kicks ass.
^ Well I don't need to read great walls of China texts to play IWD! I think reading a PDF book is easier and more beneficial.
Story is kind of overrated. If all I wanted was story I'd read a book or watch a movie.
Gameplay is what keeps me coming back to a game, and as far as story goes I like games that give you as much freedom as possible to tell your own.
Guest_simfamUP_*
^ Well I don't need to read great walls of
Chinatexts to play IWD! I think reading a PDF book is easier and more beneficial.
Hah!
You play PST then.
You'd get 10x the amount of text you'd get in ANY game EVER xD
(still the best game ever made tho')
Hah!
You play PST then.
You'd get 10x the amount of text you'd get in ANY game EVER xD
(still the best game ever made tho')
PST has more text in the prologue then most modern games have overall.
Guest_simfamUP_*
PST has more text in the prologue then most modern games have overall.
And the most I've ever spent with a floating skull flirting with mindless zombie chicks xD
I want to try this theory out though so if you think it's interesting please if you have an answer I am curious..
Today Robert Boyd asked on Twitter, out of Final Fantasy XV, Persona 5, and Xenoblade Chronicles X, which were we most excited for?
I said, XCX > FFXV > P5.
XCX would likely have the most addictive and rewarding gameplay. FFXV would likely have the best visuals and sound. P5 would likely have the better story and cast of characters.
Testing...
Final Boyband 15.
Today Robert Boyd asked on Twitter, out of Final Fantasy XV, Persona 5, and Xenoblade Chronicles X, which were we most excited for?
I said, XCX > FFXV > P5.
XCX would likely have the most addictive and rewarding gameplay. FFXV would likely have the best visuals and sound. P5 would likely have the better story and cast of characters.
Testing...
Best visuals and sound.. I'm not sure that would break either way. It sounds like you straight prefer the game of XCX to the character/world of P5.
Anyway, it sounds like opinions are overall pretty split. I guess what I feel like makes video games unique are that they interface in a lateral dimension with a person's desires. The NFL will provide you with insane spectacle or, pop music can provide insane chaos and silliness, but both only seem to fuel one dimension of a person's brain, whereas video games attempt to give you both simultaneously. When they cease to balance and focus on one or the other they seem to lose their essential character as video games and slowly become vaporized. They can still be interesting and fun, but it's different.
It depends on what you like...
BG has a charm to it given that its NPCs have far more life than anything IWD produced.
But on level design and gameplay it far outweighs the pros of BG.
BG2 on the other hand...
Yeah. BG2 kicks ass.
I'd still BG1 > 2.
Guest_EntropicAngel_*
Today Robert Boyd asked on Twitter, out of Final Fantasy XV, Persona 5, and Xenoblade Chronicles X, which were we most excited for?
I said, XCX > FFXV > P5.
XCX would likely have the most addictive and rewarding gameplay. FFXV would likely have the best visuals and sound. P5 would likely have the better story and cast of characters.
Testing...
Most addictive and rewarding? How so? I haven't followed X at all, but if it's following in the original's footsteps, it's mainly combat, combat, combat (though with plenty of exploration) along with the worst fetch quests in gaming ever.
Final Boyband 15.
They aren't in a boy band, they're hosts.
Noct is makin' some lady feel fine at dinner.
Really the only thing Final Boyband 15 has going for it in visuales is simply pixels, when it comes to style, aesthetics and design, P5 is way better then Boyband 15 from just that one preview. As for sound, yeah....Voice acting and music has always been superior compared to FF in Atlus games.
Guest_EntropicAngel_*
I'd say you're cray, but I realize you're talking opinions.
Explain to me how SE crappy hair, generic armor and boring designs are more interesting then what Atlus just showed yesterday in the P5 preview?
Guest_Catch This Fade_*
Today Robert Boyd asked on Twitter, out of Final Fantasy XV, Persona 5, and Xenoblade Chronicles X, which were we most excited for?
I said, XCX > FFXV > P5.
XCX would likely have the most addictive and rewarding gameplay. FFXV would likely have the best visuals and sound. P5 would likely have the better story and cast of characters.
Testing...
I don't know about that... at least in the music category
Shoji Meguro can give Yoko Shimomura a run for her money I think.
Guest_Catch This Fade_*
Explain to me how SE crappy hair, generic armor and boring designs are more interesting then what Atlus just showed yesterday in the P5 preview?
While P5 is oozing style out of every orifice going by the preview (plaid pants for a uniform, how is that NOT stylish), making it more interesting than any new game coming out overall, I will say that FFXV's combat and sense of scale make it a pretty interesting title as well despite the bland character design.
TL;DR
I agree with you wholeheartedly but FFXV isn't wholly uninteresting.
Guest_EntropicAngel_*
Explain to me how SE crappy hair, generic armor and boring designs are more interesting then what Atlus just showed yesterday in the P5 preview?
You say crappy, I say sweet. You say generic, I say realistic. Tomato. Tomahto.
Also you should take a look at the most recent screenshots for the game, released like a week ago. The enemies shown there are anything but generic. Humanoid bots with green faces, red eyes, and guns coming out of their forearm/hand.
Not generic but pretty dam boring looking. Final Boyband 15 simply has no style, it is bland to look at.
I'm going to say that whether having a good story or good gameplay is more important all very much depends on the volume of each. Just take Metroid Prime 2 and Metroid Other M for example. Both of these games had bad stories, but in Metroid Prime 2, what little story there was stayed out of your face most of the time, so you could focus your attention on the excellent gameplay and environments. In Metroid Other M, on the other hand, there was just too much story for the player to ignore and the final product suffered as a result.
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