226 réponses à ce sujet

[Bioware-Critic]

Aww, thanks!

 

Sorry to hear it's happened to you too. I've seen it happen to a lot of posters here, it's one of the main reasons I keep posting. I'm pretty new to this whole talking on forums thing too. I usually just lurk online but have been trying to change that recently!

 

I don't want the positive things about the game to go unsaid, because the people who get abuse hurled at them stop posting. People are way less likely to post the positive stuff in the first place, and it must really suck to be a developer and only ever hear people complain, even when you know some people are very happy with what you did (I kinda think that would be worse...). And I think people are more likely to post their own positive opinions, if they see other people doing it first.

 

It's fine to disagree, but the people who just start making assumptions about you and tell you your opinions are incorrect/insult you aren't simply disagreeing. 

 

Well, you have to fight for your opinion. Not for the right to say it but for it being understood correctly. Because in the end ... nothing we write here matters ... if others do not understand us. No matter what opinion they have or if they laugh at us ... If we have failed to explain ourselves to others our postings will mean less than they should. Everytime we talk to the people that are writing in here - I don't do that as much as I should, myself - the conversation and the thread itself becomes a real discussion among differently thinking forumites! And that is what should be our goal here - regardless of anything!

And of course I feel for Bioware too! Especially when I throw rocks - big ones and small ones - at their work ... and their ... colleagues ... and whatever ... myself

But I feel the best thing for me is to be honest. They should want me to be honest about how I feel about their work. They should want to know what makes me "tick"

So I try to be honest ... It is not the most fulfilling thing to write on the BSN but what can we do but try to work on making it honest feedback and such ...

[Bioware-Critic]

Everything written here! 

 

I too hope to hear a little bit more from the devs themselves. I have this hope that if they do speak up, and people do start making abusive comments, the polite side of the forum will pitch in and help the devs out a little.

 

I think it's really important that both sides of the like/dislike spectrum are voiced - we want Bioware to be aware of what worked, and what we hope to see return in the future as well as what didn't work, and what could see some improvements. 

 

Mostly I just try to remind myself that the majority of the people making sardonic comments are here because they care a lot about the series - and Bioware - and just want to see them at their best. Hopefully we can stay civil in our discussions once things calm down (fingers crossed)

 

Kudos!

[Terodil]

Dunno. I like being honest, which is why I (try to) never participate in threads such as the "3 things you liked, 3 things you disliked about DA:I" thread we had recently. I feel forced to blow stuff out of proportion that I would otherwise not even put on the table.

Yes, I feel strongly about DA:I, because I feel equally strongly about my beloved favourite game developer. I cannot in honesty tell them now how awesome they *are*; at best I can tell them how awesome they *were*. I understand that a lot of negativity can cause damage, but to me it seems more important to support Bioware in finding back to its own greatness, than to mollycoddle them. Would it help them if I put on a serene smile and said: "Oh, DA:I is brilliant, just carry on!"? It infuriates me to read how they suddenly thought imitating Skyrim was a brilliant idea. They seem to completely forget their own, considerable strengths, and blindly charge after whatever seems to be the current fad ("open world", "sandbox", and now, apparently, "accessibility").

DA:I, to me, falls drastically short of what Bioware used to deliver in terms of tight, engaging storytelling, compelling characters, and usability. Yes, landscape graphics look pretty, and the tavern songs are fantastic. But the latter are, sadly, almost insubstantial fluff compared to the core competencies Bioware needs to put substantially more effort into preserving (again IMO).

[Abyss108]

Dunno. I like being honest, which is why I (try to) never participate in threads such as the "3 things you liked, 3 things you disliked about DA:I" thread we had recently. I feel forced to blow stuff out of proportion that I would otherwise not even put on the table.

Yes, I feel strongly about DA:I, because I feel equally strongly about my beloved favourite game developer. I cannot in honesty tell them now how awesome they *are*; at best I can tell them how awesome they *were*. I understand that a lot of negativity can cause damage, but to me it seems more important to support Bioware in finding back to its own greatness, than to mollycoddle them. Would it help them if I put on a serene smile and said: "Oh, DA:I is brilliant, just carry on!"? It infuriates me to read how they suddenly thought imitating Skyrim was a brilliant idea. They seem to completely forget their own, considerable strengths, and blindly charge after whatever seems to be the current fad ("open world", "sandbox", and now, apparently, "accessibility").

DA:I, to me, falls drastically short of what Bioware used to deliver in terms of tight, engaging storytelling, compelling characters, and usability. Yes, landscape graphics look pretty, and the tavern songs are fantastic. But the latter are, sadly, almost insubstantial fluff compared to the core competencies Bioware needs to preserve (again IMO).

 

Yes, but being honest about your opinions isn't the same as hurling abuse at the developers or being toxic. Disliking Inquisition and posting the reasons why (like you did) isn't a problem, it's only a problem when people start throwing personal insults at those that disagree. Which I think is why the Devs don't post here more. Not because some people don't like the game, but because those people will start hurling abuse at them.

[Bocochoco]

Yes, but being honest about your opinions isn't the same as hurling abuse at the developers or being toxic. Disliking Inquisition and posting the reasons why (like you did) isn't a problem, it's only a problem when people start throwing personal insults at those that disagree. Which I think is why the Devs don't post here more. Not because some people don't like the game, but because those people will start hurling abuse at them.

They must have really thin skin then. Internet words never hurt me. Maybe all of us should be charged with cyber bullying?

[coldflame]

Developers are were active on the multiplayer forum.

 

Fixed that for you. It was just a PR stunt and nothing more from the devs. They are not more active on the MP forum than the SP forum.

 

They were active for like 3 days after the s**t storm, then it was silence again.

[AlanC9]

I would like to see how they explain why they cut down the tactics department from DAO and DA2. I would like to see how they explain why they restricted the skills to eight at a time for the quick-slot-bar in SP. And I would like to see how they explain why on earth they removed the ability to choose from all my skills freely during combat and why they removed weapon-switching ...

If you have the answer to that - I am all ears, AlanC9!

By all means, tell me ...

How do any of those questions actually lead to an argument that Bio can "lose"? Bio'd never argue that you personally ought to like a feature.

[Abyss108]

They must have really thin skin then. Internet words never hurt me. Maybe all of us should be charged with cyber bullying?

 

Because speaking words in real life gives them a magical power that they do not have when you write them down. And because its OK to hurl abuse at someone if they are not "hurt" by it. And because it really adds to the conversations when you add insults instead of acting civil towards other people.

 

If you honestly don't understand why people are expected to be polite to one another, there's not a lot I can say to you.

 

Fixed that for you. It was just a PR stunt and nothing more from the devs. They are not more active on the MP forum than the SP forum.

 

They were active for like 3 days after the s**t storm, then it was silence again.

 

I've been reading their posts over there just fine.

[Dreamer]

I'm not surprised they don't post with how toxic and entitled this place is. Sure, there are some lovely people here who I'm sure Bioware would love to discuss things with, but the moment they step foot here, the rest of the forums are going to start hurling abuse at them. I've already read numerous accounts from the devs about getting abuse on twitter/blogs, why would they want to subject themselves to it here too?

 

They will definitely be reading what everybody writes here, and will be taking it into account, they just aren't doing it publicly, or wasting time on forum arguments instead of working on the game.

 

I think they'll come back and post a lot more when things die down around here. 

 

If the toxicity exists regardless of the devs' presence on the forum, should not the default behavior be to interact anyway? We are paying customers, after all, and if BioWare isn't inclined to engage with the people who pay their salaries, perhaps they should leave the business. Blaming internet toxicity is a cop-out and an excuse to justify not having to be responsible for the decisions they make.

 

The haters already exist. What they do by intentionally avoiding communication with the community is exacerbate frustrations.

[Catbus]

I think it's all about perception! They know they would loose arguments in a heartbeat and thereby don't want to do anything but fling around some minor "information-bits". It's all about PR for them. And I think that EA tells them what to do! They would not dare to act freely ...

 

I think this post here is justification enough for them to avoid this forum.

[TheOgre]

I think this post here is justification enough for them to avoid this forum.

When communication dies, so does the fan base and any true support with future flops. I cannot express more how this won't do them well long term.

[coldflame]

Though I have also seen fandoms even more toxic than this. At least here no one is sending death threats to writers because they didn't like a story... as far as I know, anyway.

 

 Didn't one of the female devs at bioware get harassed then quit her job or something? or was it just a rumour?

[TheOgre]

Because speaking words in real life gives them a magical power that they do not have when you write them down. And because its OK to hurl abuse at someone if they are not "hurt" by it. And because it really adds to the conversations when you add insults instead of acting civil towards other people.

If you honestly don't understand why people are expected to be polite to one another, there's not a lot I can say to you.


I've been reading their posts over there just fine.

What if they decided at the start not to engage feedback forums period?
They were quiet even when bsn was more calm than now.. Da2 tried to interact with the angry public when rape threats were issued to the cm then. I think dai bioware agreed forum interaction is suicide. Just use their money for pr and let it coast..

[TheOgre]

Didn't one of the female devs at bioware get harassed then quit her job or something? or was it just a rumour?

Yes, and they still interacted with the community even after she quit.

[coldflame]

 

I've been reading their posts over there just fine.

 

If you think a bit of scraps from them almighty devs is enough, well good for you. Ain't you easy to please?

[AlanC9]

If you think a bit of scraps from them almighty devs is enough, well good for you. Ain't you easy to please?

If "easy to please" means "not really caring if the devs show up to chat or not, but enjoying it when they do," then I suppose I'm in that category too.

[Sylveria_Relden]

509+ pages and 12,000+ posts with little to no dev interaction can't be wrong.

 

http://forum.bioware...unity-concerns/

[robertthebard]

I don't blame them one bit. Just go look at the early ME 3 boards for why they'd avoid this place like the plague. Quoted out of context, posts twisted in their meanings, death threats. Yeah, if I were a game dev, I'd avoid this place like the plague too.

[Abyss108]

Considering I bought a game, not a monopoly on the devs time, no, I don't think I have the right to demand their eternal attention on a game forum. That's incredably entitled. When I buy a movie, I don't demand the director and all the actors reply to my criticisms of the performance. 

 

Guess what, for every other game I play, the game devs don't post at all. Bioware does a lot more than most. Its their job to make a game, not to subject themselves to abuse. 

 

Furthermore, posting would probably make things worse. There are some ridiculous requests on the forum and if Bioware posted the fact that they weren't going to implement some of them people would scream and rave about how Bioware doesn't care and is ignoring their fans and its a disgrace. Even if it was something only about 10 people wanted, or it would be a years development.

[papercut_ninja]

The average bioware fan is not the kind of person who feel the need to post their opinions on forums and comment sections...out of millions of copies sold, less than 1% of those customers come to the boards, and among that 1% there is an overrepresentation of the sort of people who generally contribute to the toxic and vile environment that plagues comment sections and forums internet-wide...

 

...so no, if you are a creator of art, your best option for maintaining your integrity and self-preservation is to stay as far away from comment sections and forums as possible...

[Teddie Sage]

Communication is indeed the keyword here. I believe they need more PR interacting with us. 

[Catbus]

When communication dies, so does the fan base and any true support with future flops. I cannot express more how this won't do them well long term.

 

I majored in communication, and one thing I recall distinctly is that it's a two-way process. So don't jump to the conclusion that if communication dies, it's Bioware that killed it.

[Dreamer]

Considering I bought a game, not a monopoly on the devs time, no, I don't think I have the right to demand their eternal attention on a game forum. That's incredably entitled. When I buy a movie, I don't demand the director and all the actors reply to my criticisms of the performance. 

 

Guess what, for every other game I play, the game devs don't post at all. Bioware does a lot more than most. Its their job to make a game, not to subject themselves to abuse. 

 

Furthermore, posting would probably make things worse. There are some ridiculous requests on the forum and if Bioware posted the fact that they weren't going to implement some of them people would scream and rave about how Bioware doesn't care and is ignoring their fans and its a disgrace. Even if it was something only about 10 people wanted, or it would be a years development.

 

I guess it's a good thing no one is actually demanding that.

 

/burns the straw man

[Beama Beorhtost]

I decided to delurke 'cause of the as usual assumtion that people complaining are filling the forum with toxicity.

I think that you are missing the point that many of the threads here were started to give not only a feedback on the palability of the game but on the technical problems encountered. Quite frankly I don't think that you can think the people on the old gen and pc, whom have shelled $$$ for a product, some of them including me preordering expensive versions as soon as the announcement was made, and haven't been able to play it, as not having any entitlement. As I see it we are entitled to a working product.

With regards to personal attacks on the devs I don't condone them but I feel that their complete absence in the SP boards and lack of informations with regards to the fixes they were working on has contributed to the perception that they only care abou MP because of the revenue that can get them and made the situation and atmoosphere very difficult to control.

With regards to personal attacks on forumers, I hope that you understand that instances like posting in a thread dedicated to problems on the old gens saying I wonderfully your game run and how much fun you're having on the new gens and that that people that bought it on the old gen were just deluded and incompetent idiots (I'm not joking, it is a real post) will be met desdain and anger as well as will posters trying to tell people which has spent their adult lives playing on pc that there is no problem with the controls and they must be lazy because they want to be able to bind them to different keys or refuse to use consol controllers.

As a last point, there's been the tendency of legitimate and polite requests for bugs fixing made both on the BW facebook site and sent to the various devs twitter accounts been deleted as soon as they appear on the page in question. I seriously don't think that such behaviour coupled with their prolongued silence can lead to people goodwill.

Just want to add that I do hope that the lately renewed presence of Allan on the boards will be able to re-establish a channel of communication because we can all benefit from it.

[turuzzusapatuttu]

Developers are active on the multiplayer forum.

Oh. THAT explains what they intended to focus when they announced the multiplayer mode.