56 réponses à ce sujet

[Abyss108]

you can say waht you want, you are the herald becouse they want you to be, and that's the only option the game gives you, you can only denounce to close advisors, even the chantry mother call on you twice after haven, that even you are not sent by andraste you should let people belief becouse they are in need of faith......could you scream your lungs, IM NOT THE EFFING HERALD as an option when you were made inquisitor ? NOPE, no such option there, only with cassandra, and you get a disaproval from her.

 

 

 

you are mistaken, if you are talking about the beggining, josephine reply to you, seems to imply she will not run with that, and will instead make up something and hate you for complicating her job.

 

No, you're completely wrong about this... I had the opportunity to tell people I wasn't the Herald of Andraste in every single conversation where it was brought up. There wasn't a single point I was forced to pretend I was. I played a very religious Elf who believed in the Creators, I definitely would have noticed if at any point she started claiming to be a fan of a human religion.

[Blade_RJ]

I mean to the game world, not your inner circle.....but the guy above you said latter its possible, i haven't got there yet. I know about those option playing as dalish supremacist, i used every one of them . you can belive all you want, but the inquisition force you to play as the herald, but aparently later on, you can change that.

[Uirebhiril]

 

 

*cough*

 

On a more serious note, I think part of the point laced through the entire game is that no matter what you believe, the people and histories will have their own view. Through the game you can refute your holy status, but eventually it does come down to accepting that people will see what they want to. Playing as an elf, I was given opportunity to tell people what I believed - or didn't - and did not feel entirely slighted by that. It's certainly a lot better than we've gotten in the other games, but it does leave us questioning just what makes a god and how divinity is handled. I found it interesting, even if my elf rolled her eyes a few times.

[Il Divo]

 

 

*cough*

 

On a more serious note, I think part of the point laced through the entire game is that no matter what you believe, the people and histories will have their own view. Through the game you can refute your holy status, but eventually it does come down to accepting that people will see what they want to. Playing as an elf, I was given opportunity to tell people what I believed - or didn't - and did not feel entirely slighted by that. It's certainly a lot better than we've gotten in the other games, but it does leave us questioning just what makes a god and how divinity is handled. I found it interesting, even if my elf rolled her eyes a few times.

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=Zjz16xjeBAA

 

Basically, Life of Brian in a nutshell.

 

"You've got it all wrong! You're all individuals!"

 

"Yes, we're all individuals!"

[Bad King]

 

 

*cough*

 

On a more serious note, I think part of the point laced through the entire game is that no matter what you believe, the people and histories will have their own view. Through the game you can refute your holy status, but eventually it does come down to accepting that people will see what they want to. Playing as an elf, I was given opportunity to tell people what I believed - or didn't - and did not feel entirely slighted by that. It's certainly a lot better than we've gotten in the other games, but it does leave us questioning just what makes a god and how divinity is handled. I found it interesting, even if my elf rolled her eyes a few times.

 

Thumbs up for the reference (which I also repeatedly thought of while playing)! In terms of telling people what you believed as an elf though, I only recall there being one opportunity for you to tell a human that you believe in the creators and not the Maker.

[In Exile]

As always, Bioware isn't fond of weird supremacist views. You can't be pro-Creator for the same reason you can't be pro-mageocracy.

[Bad King]

As always, Bioware isn't fond of weird supremacist views. You can't be pro-Creator for the same reason you can't be pro-mageocracy.

 

What exactly makes the elven religion more supremacist than the Andrastian faith? The main belief of the latter is that the Chant of light needs to dominate Thedas, which is a form of cultural supremacy, and yet the game allows you to play as a faithful Andrastian. 

[perfect_victime]

In the end, saying you are not the Herald, you are vindicated. The Humans that believe they are special are in for the big slap into reality. As to what the world believes, Mother Jezzel explains that fairly well at the camp.

[nightscrawl]

But you can't brand yourself whatever you wish - that is the purpose of my thread. You can only choose one of three options (Andrastian Theist/Fully Agnostic/Atheist). A fourth option would have added more realism to playing as a Dalish elf. Also, the people would certainly care about your opinion on the matter if they considered you the herald of their religion. It would be somewhat reminiscent of the Pope announcing that Islam is the correct religion.

You are missing Lebanese Dude's point, which is that your PC doesn't name yourself this in the first place. Other people bestow this title upon you, which is why the only options are to accept it, reject it, or be conflicted. In the end it's not about what you are calling yourself, but about how other people see you. You (or your character) may think how they see you is offensive and that's your prerogative, but it likely won't change their behavior.

[Bad King]

You are missing Lebanese Dude's point, which is that your PC doesn't name yourself this in the first place. Other people bestow this title upon you, which is why the only options are to accept it, reject it, or be conflicted. In the end it's not about what you are calling yourself, but about how other people see you. You (or your character) may think how they see you is offensive and that's your prerogative, but it likely won't change their behavior.

 

It's not only about how others see you but how you react to their view, and all three reactions are IMO unsatisfactory reactions for a religious Dalish elf. 'I have faith that I am indeed Andraste's herald', 'I don't know if I'm Andraste's herald' and 'I'm nobody's herald' are all reactions that consider the Andrastian faith as the norm. A fourth option being 'I do not believe that I am Andraste's herald, but I have faith that the creators blessed me' would be perfect IMO as it doesn't accept that Andraste was responsible/maybe responsible while also not rejecting all religion. If you're playing a Dalish Andrastian, a Dalish who is fully agnostic or a Dalish atheist, then there is no issue, but most Dalish believe in the creators. Furthermore, more reactions to your reactions (from the people) would have been nice.

 

That's really what I'm trying to get at in this thread.

[LobselVith8]

Actually, it's because you saw a feminine entity in the Fade. If most of the Andrastians interpret this as Andraste (including a religious inquisitor), then why shouldn't an inquisitor faithful to the creators interpret the entity as one of the Dalish gods (particularly when the only survivor of the conclave was a worshipper of these gods)? 

 

I suppose it's possible. Perhaps Falon'Din, who used to guide the elves in the Beyond?

 

"In ancient times, the People were ageless and eternal, and instead of dying would enter uthenera-the long sleep-and walk the shifting paths beyond the Veil with Falon'Din and his brother Dirthamen. Those elders would learn the secrets of dreams, and some returned to the People with newfound knowledge." - Keeper Gisharel of the Ralaferin Clan

 

 

 

 

[In Exile]

What exactly makes the elven religion more supremacist than the Andrastian faith? The main belief of the latter is that the Chant of light needs to dominate Thedas, which is a form of cultural supremacy, and yet the game allows you to play as a faithful Andrastian. 

 

You can't co-opt the faith. That is, you can accept the title of Herald, and you can accept what the Inquisition believes regarding it (from an Andrastian POV), and you can even be Andrastian, but you can't actually have your own Andrastian take on it, or your own take on Andrastianism. The equivalent - which is absolutely missing - is to have more opportunities to express faith in the Creators (a confusing title, I've found, because my understanding was that the Dalish did not believe all of their gods were creator gods). 

[jellobell]

I actually liked being able to tell everyone within earshot that I was nobody's herald, and then have them shuffle uncomfortably for a bit before going back to calling me the herald anyways. I thought it was rather realistic. After all, initially a lot of your power and influence (and the power and influence of the Inquisition) comes from people thinking you're divine. They're not gonna want to acknowledge that you're going off-message.

 

Later on, when the Inquisition has achievements of its own to speak for it, then people more often call you Inquisitor than Herald. 

 

Also, there's a theological reason why a Dalish wouldn't say that their powers came from one of the Creators. The Creators are supposedly all locked away (though that can be called into question after the temple of mythal). For my particular Dalish, she had no interest in putting her own beliefs front and center. Her faith was private, and she didn't feel the need to educate people about her religion. Thus, I think "I am nobody's Herald" is a good compromise, RP-wise.

[Han Shot First]

There wouldn't be an Inquisition without devout Andrastian belief. It is those beliefs that are fueling the organization's recruitment, at least among the humans and city elves. And the humans are making up the majority of your manpower.

 

So even though a Dalish Inquisitor may be frustrated that people are viewing him or her as some sort of messiah sent from a god you don't worship, it still benefits the Inquisitor in the long run. If the majority of the people believed you weren't sent by the Maker or Andraste, the organization's strength would completely evaporate. 

[Paragonslustre]

The 'feminine' figure who pulls you out of the hole is wearing Chantry garb.  It's kinda hard to miss that hat.  If she'd just been a feminine figure you could put any interpretation on it.

[Il Divo]

You are missing Lebanese Dude's point, which is that your PC doesn't name yourself this in the first place. Other people bestow this title upon you, which is why the only options are to accept it, reject it, or be conflicted. In the end it's not about what you are calling yourself, but about how other people see you. You (or your character) may think how they see you is offensive and that's your prerogative, but it likely won't change their behavior.

 

I'm not sure why that's relevant? The goal isn't necessarily to change their behavior, but to role-play a specific type of character. It's no different than how the game gives the PC the ability to deny belief in the Maker. If you have the ability to say "There is no Maker", why shouldn't you alternatively be able to say "I'm the Herald of the Elven Gods!". Role-playing isn't just about changing others' behavior. 

[Il Divo]

The 'feminine' figure who pulls you out of the hole is wearing Chantry garb.  It's kinda hard to miss that hat.  If she'd just been a feminine figure you could put any interpretation on it.

 

The first time we see her, she's just a growing green figure. Looking at her, my first thought wasn't "That's obviously the Divine". She could just as easily have been a Desire Demon of some kind. 

[Wulfram]

I do think they could have done more with Dalish faith, considering faith is supposed to be a theme of the game.

[Navasha]

Sorry, but you don't get to directly control what others think about you.    Herald of Andraste is what everyone thinks you are, not about what you claim yourself to be.  

 

Depending on your choice in the game, you could quite accurately claim later on that you are the Herald of Mythal.   However, you would still be a drop of elven belief in a sea of Andrastianism.   People are going to have their own beliefs about you no matter what you say or do. 

[Abyss108]

I mean to the game world, not your inner circle.....but the guy above you said latter its possible, i haven't got there yet. I know about those option playing as dalish supremacist, i used every one of them . you can belive all you want, but the inquisition force you to play as the herald, but aparently later on, you can change that.

 

You can tell Josephine to tell everyone you are not the Herald near the beginning. Just because you tell the world you are not Andratian, doesn't mean they have to listen. They just don't care what you think.

[Satinalis]

You can tell Josephine to tell everyone you are not the Herald near the beginning. Just because you tell the world you are not Andratian, doesn't mean they have to listen. They just don't care what you think.

 

I think it is kind of a shame that you can be ragingly sarcastic about the fact you are the Herald, particularly if you are not playing as a Human, but then I suppose you can always fill that gap. I play my Dalish Mage in such a manner, just a shame it can't be picked up on really. But then, I suppose, where do you put the limits. 

[Paragonslustre]

The first time we see her, she's just a growing green figure. Looking at her, my first thought wasn't "That's obviously the Divine". She could just as easily have been a Desire Demon of some kind. 

 

She's definitely got the Chantry hat shaped head from the outset.  Heck, even I played as a skeptic, but the idea is set from the beginning.  If the story-line was intended to be more ambiguous they'd have made the figure look less 'Divine-shaped' imo.  In any case we know it's a spirit who took the form of the Divine, if it were for the purpose of encouraging you out of the jaws of the spiders (and you are playing a Dalish Elf) why didn't the writers make the figure look more Elvish?  I suppose to promulgate the whole Herald of Andraste angle despite what race you play and what your beliefs may be.

[DarkAmaranth1966]

Yes you can tell everyone you are NOT the Herald but, it makes no difference, people won't stop calling you the Herald so, it doesn't matter what you say.

[Poledo]

I was really hoping for some unique dialogue or even extra plot even for being a Qunari Mage. Oh well.

[Vilegrim]

You wanted the Inquisitor to publicly decree to all the Kingdoms that you don't give a damn about Andraste or the Maker? A bit presumptuous that they would care about your personal opinion on the matter. I hate the tittle as well, but I don't go around telling people not to call me that or I hate being called that.

I want to be a devout Dalish. That actually talks about his faith.