23 réponses à ce sujet

[Kenny Bania]

I haven't tried it out yet unfortunately, but I wouldn't be surprised if it had.

 

I'm also not going to waste an opportunity to post this...

 

[ALTBOULI]

Pretty sure its still broken (at least on console), I wasnt getting any stamina back on kill. In fact with the second hit from deathblow I acctually seem to be consuming double the ammount of stamina. I often found myself with no stamina despite having a stamina amulet

[ALTBOULI]

I never saw it do that, but Death Blow having no cool down on kill, yet getting no stamina back as a result means you only really can spam it two or three times at most anyway, making the Assassin a really poor clean up class (something for which she seemed to be designed).

Yup it seems like others have had the same issue based on what ive read online. Not sure whats causing it (can only assume its the second hit) but your left with next to no stamina after use

[Eldial3los]

On pc sometimes it works sometimes and not other. It seems to depend on the host and your connection to it.

Its really weird

[konfeta]

If it makes you feel better, Bioware fixed double Full Draw, but didn't fix Full Draw not working with dance of death either.

 

They don't discriminate against just stabbity.

[actionhero112]

It's super buggy. Half the time the second hit doesn't go through and most of the time dance of death doesn't work with it.

 

I think Flank Attack - Twin Fangs - Hidden Blades - Stealth is better until it's fixed. In fact I think it's better the majority of the time, but w/e. 

[Drasca]

Good question. I want to know too.

 

 

Half the time the second hit doesn't go through and most of the time dance of death doesn't work with it.

 

As opposed to Twin fangs missing upon movement / positional issues? Choose your favorite downside.

[actionhero112]

 

As opposed to Twin fangs missing upon movement / positional issues? Choose your favorite downside.

Don't use twin fangs on targets not running directly at you, or not moving at a certain speed. You get a feel when you play a lot of the rogue class what Twin Fangs will hit and what it won't. 

 

But why would you ever replace twin fangs in favor of death blow. This isn't single player, you don't need to optimize to completely one shot most classes with twin fangs. With the Isolation bonus, and KftS you can easily kill every mook in one twin fangs. (Yes even on perilous)

 

Plus when you're flanking you do 200% more damage with twin fangs than a death blow at 100%. Let's say you're missing 50% of your health, it still only does 150% extra damage (not better than the 200% flanking bonus). For it to be worth using over twin fangs would have to not be extremely buggy, and have a better % damage bonus. 

 

I think percentage wise enemies have to be below something crazy like, have only 34% of their health remaining for deathblow to do more damage than a flanking twin fangs. In most cases (unless your damage is gimped for some reason) that situation only applies to the boss or giants. 

 

I mean you have a slight argument if you were arguing Deathblow is better than Flank Attack (I'd still disagree because of how buggy Deathblow is just from a normal activation, plus the KftS proc and infinite stealth duration is really nice) But to say Deathblow is better than Twin fangs? Nope. Nopenopenope. 

[actionhero112]

 

I personally have never had an issue with Death Blow not connecting. Dance of Death, as far as I know, does not work even the second strike does not trigger and the enemy is killed.

 

Both Twin Fangs and Flank Attack are good abilities, but they are not much better with their poor target tracking, as others have already said.

Furthermore, I spent a long time building the Assassin in various ways. I have yet to find a build that is outright inferior except maybe if you made a build using Spinning Blades, Hook and Tackle, Poison Weapons, and Fallback Plan. Hell, I might try that out, because even that might be good. Who knows?

 

 

 

Death Blow's only "bug" is with Dance of Death. The ability itself works flawlessly aside from that.

Flank Attack has it's benefits, and it unlocks Knife in the Shadows, which is great for newer players. Veteran players with a handful of Cunning promotions tend to forgo Flank Attack and Knife in the Shadows for a Death Blow / Twin Fangs / Hidden Blades / Stealth Build, as they get almost guaranteed critical hits anyway.

Flank Attack also has down-sides, like the target tracking like I said above. It also has an issue with being regularly auto-blocked by Venatori Zealots and Red Templar soldiers, even if using it from Stealth. Sometimes it's Stealth does not trigger as well.

 

You've never had a problem with deathblows second hit when used above 50% enemy health? Half the time it doesn't go through and when it does it costs an extra 50 stamina. I've spent almost 700 hours in this game (mostly single player) and I almost always play the DW rogue. The ability is buggy as hell.

 

I would never go for Deathblow for the aforementioned reasons. The extra Knife in the Shadows proc is extremely helpful because you're very reliant on crit damage due to how dexterity from your stats applies and the extra way to get into stealth is literally a life saver when soloing threatening. In fact, I anticipate when people start producing videos for soloing perilous with the Assassin they will be using flank attack.

 

For example on the RTC. When you unload your Hidden Blades and Twin Fangs, in the build you're using , you're vulnerable, because you didn't get a stealth reset from Iwnh. However with flank attack, while RTC is doing his little dance, you can immediately go back into stealth. This is everything on the boss wave because when you're stealthed, you might as well have stopped time, because enemies literally freeze in place. This makes it easier to pick them off one by one, which the assassin excels at. 

 

Plus let's be  honest do you really need more damage on the assassin when everything dies in 4 autos? I tend to favor the aggro drop and the infinite stealth duration as well as the additional KftS proc. 

 

Even if Flank attack is blocked by mook (this is honestly a non issue because who you target with the ability is completely under your control) you still go into stealth, which means you can easily re-position. Not to mention Flank attack actually hits all enemies that you move through when using, making it one of the few multitarget dw rogue abilities. 

 

I used to be like you. I looked down on flank attack. Not enough damage I told myself. But flank attack found it's way back into my heart. Flank attack is love, flank attack is life. 

 

I mean sure you can play the game the way you want. I'm just sharing my opinion on why I use certain abilities. Except for that thing about deathblow being better than twin fangs. Nopenopenope.

 

Also I don't promote unless I want to rebuild. I think the stat bonus trivializes gameplay. How much cunning have you farmed out that you don't need KitS? Lmao. 

[pepe5454]

Not sure if it's related but I noticed allot of the times my stamina will get stuck and not regenerate until I spend more on another skill then it will start to replenish again.  I don'but I do use deathblow though so not sure but could be related.

[pepe5454]

Meh meant to say " I don't use deathblow though so not sure it could be related though."

[Drasca]

You've never had a problem with deathblows second hit when used above 50% enemy health? Half the time it doesn't go through and when it does it costs an extra 50 stamina. I've spent almost 700 hours in this game (mostly single player) and I almost always play the DW rogue. The ability is buggy as hell.

 

SP is the reason why you don't use DB. It is terrible on SP, and really shines in MP. Twin fangs doesn't consistently AoE as DB does. DB into a pack of mobs from Static Cage or Pull of the Abyss = Dead pack.

 

 

 need more damage on the assassin

 

Yes, always, because it is fun to see big numbers. That's half the appeal of assassin.

 

 

I looked down on flank attack.

 

No one here is disparaging FA, but it is not without its own issues that need to be recognized.

 

 

deathblow being better than twin fangs

 

They're about equal overall, but differ on details. TF better on front attacks, DB better from behind. TF for single targets, DB for multiple targets under CC. I have both on my build, and skip out on FA because I don't need it.

 

 

you don't need KitS

 

That's correct. There's lots of ways to achieve 100% crit on the assassin. Mercy Killing, Sneak Attack, KitS, etc. Choose.

[actionhero112]

Snip

Death blow shines on SP because enemies have more health so it's not overkill and redundant like it is here. It's really good in SP because a Tempest can continually shatter enemies with Deathblow for a quick finish to freeze vulnerable enemies. It's not as good in multiplayer because enemies have less health. Why use an ability that is barely better than flank attack when an enemy is at full health and half the time a lot of it's damage doesn't go through?

 

Flank attack's issue is that it screws up when enemies are lower than you, and you go flying over their head. This is again something, however that you can control. Just don't use it from a higher elevation. This is different than Deathblow, whose second hit will not activate unless the enemy has under 50% health at the end of the first hit, which will not reliably bring an enemy down to half on perilous. I cannot stress this enough to you. This ability is worse than flank attack from a damage perspective if the second hit does not go through. This is not variable you can reliably control through positioning. 

 

 

They are not equal. They are not even close to being equal. Twin fangs will do more damage a majority of the time, the second hit of it isn't bugged and it can be used at full effectiveness no matter what health level the unit is at. 

 

Yeah you're right. Sneak attack which only doubles your crit chance. I have it too. However in multiplayer you can't craft so unless you farm it out through prestiging 50 cunning for 50% crit chance. (lol really) you won't crit as effectively as using KitS. Mercy Killing isn't something you can proc yourself so I'm not sure why you brought it up. Unless your in a group communicating over a mike I don't see how it can be half as useful as KitS. Plus both sleep and fear are removed after one hit. That's hardly comparable to the 4-6 hits I get out of every KitS proc. And I only need 4 hits to kill with autos on every difficulty. So essentially I always crit.

 

Neither of those options are appealing to me. I'm not going to farm out 50 cunning so you can forget about Sneak Attack boosting me to 100% crit. While I do play with friends when they're online, a lot of my matches are with pugs. Their is no guarantee that they are going to have an ideal party to make use of Mercy Killing which is inferior anyways to KitS because the latter works on several hits. 

 

I don't really know how to make it clear to you that Deathblow isn't as good as you think it is and it certainly isn't as good as Twin Fangs. 

 

Oh uh mortiel, I just tested this for you. It's still bugged with dance of death. The second hit takes additional stamina.

[Drasca]

 Deathblow, whose second hit will not activate unless the enemy has under 50% health at the end of the first hit, which will not reliably bring an enemy down to half on perilous

 

So that's why it doesn't trigger sometimes. Interesting. However whether it'll kill the enemy is highly dependent on positioning, gear, current enemy state, and other stats. Just as TF won't necessarily kill an enemy from the front, so I don't always bother with TF.

 

Your numbers are completely wrong for amount of cunning required for 100% sneak attack, and other things.

 

ability is worse than flank attack from a damage perspective

 

FA does not Detonate. DB triggers detonate. Have you ever done Discharge under static cage, and on multiple enemies? Try it.

 

 

when enemies are lower than you, and you go flying over their head.

 

The same is true for most other activated melee abilities... otherwise known as the funnest bug ever.

TBH, the biggest problem with MP Melee classes isn't the class balance or any of the issues with skills. It is the off-host rubberbanding / lag. It breaks the game more than anything else. Not so much an issue for ranged classes, since they don't have to move nearly as much, but melee classes are hosed.

[actionhero112]

What are you talking about? The second hit of Death Blow doesn't trigger if the target is above 50% health before the first hit by design... I'm not sure what "bug" you are talking about.

 

If four auto-attacks are killing enemies, it's likely on lower difficulties. Nothing wrong with that, but I like to look at a build that scales to higher difficulties. Four auto-attacks by no means kill an enemy on Perilous... even a Wraith or an Archer.

 

I would not say that stat bonuses trivialize gameplay. Having a high critical chance will, however, change the way you build a class. If you did not need Knife in the Shadows, that means you have points to spend into other things, right? The game still is a challenge, even for people with tons of promotions. However, you will never know this if you rarely promote. Not to mention, there is a strong possibility there may be a fourth difficult released at some point that makes the promotions almost feel more important.

 

I have not farmed that much Cunning. I promote as I feel like it, but I don't go out of my way to "farm" promotions. Most of my promotions have been rebuilding classes for making my Build Guides, honestly.

With that said, between my handful of Rogue promotions, gear giving bonuses to critical chance / cunning, and the cunning gained from passives you'd be surprised just how easy it is to build a near-100% critical chance Assassin. All it takes is an open mind and some experimentation.

My point is that you should not discount Death Blow, especially if your experience with it is from Single-Player. Twin Fangs and Flank Attack are also good. All three of the skills have some drawbacks as well, but that does not mean you shouldn't try any given one of them in multiplayer. Try everything, I say! I always urge people to go outside their comfort zones and experiment with builds because I love seeing that moment when a person find a new facet of the game to love that they never knew existed.

I am using a dagger of red birth and agony and I am currently 4 shotting most mooks on perilous with my friends by doing around 700- 1k per hit from behind plus rune damage. I'm assuming you do around the same damage. I am using a superb ring of flanking and a enhanced ring of life drain. This isn't really an argument, more a statement of fact.

 

It trivializes gameplay to me by not having a level cap. You're not going to persuade me of this, I'm not going to start promoting my characters, I'm just telling you that I don't prestige and this is reason. I'm not trying to tell you that you should do as I do, I'm telling you that's my opinion on it. 

 

Ok so I have 49% crit chance with sneak attack. This is with relatively top tier gear as you should agree. I have the two best daggers in the game to my knowledge. I would need 50 cunning to boost me to the level of crit chance that I get flat out through KitS. This isn't something to be argued either it's just a statement of my situation. I'm not going to farm out 50 rogue promotions. This is at level 20, so all my little cunning bonuses I get from passives are counted into that. The only way I could boost it is through a crit chance ring drop. But in that scenario, in which I have access to all the gear of my wildest dreams, I would take a superb ring of life drain and a superb ring of crit damage, because they're both arguably better.

 

I don't see how you can get 100% crit chance through sneak attack unless I farm out something ridiculous like 30-50 cunning.

 

And really it doesn't matter as again I would only have the bonus from behind. I'm not always behind mooks. Knife in the Shadows works on every hit I make and the best part is, even if I didn't kill an enemy in 4 hits, I would still have access to it all the time because I have 2 ways to proc it and they both have extremely short cooldowns. 

 

And if that's the way deathblow is designed and it will never get fixed then it's even worse than I thought. And I've tried deathblow on the assassin. I've explained to you why I don't think it's good. It doesn't do as much damage as twin fangs the majority of the time, the second hit only procs when the first hit only brings the unit down to half (or the unit is at half) and it takes far too much stamina. It's a pain to use. 

 

These are the reasons why it's bad to me and they're all things that are fundamental to the ability. 

[Drasca]

I don't see how you can get 100% crit chance through sneak attack unless I farm out something ridiculous like 30-50 cunning.

 

Crafting, Gear. Cunning on armor upgrade, Cunning on Weapon Upgrade, possibly cunning amulet. I had very high SA while my own promoted cunning was around 20, due to crafting.

 

There's other passives too, like mercy killing. If you take advantage of team party builds, keepers, AW, Ele, and Necros panic and sleep everything around you for auto crits.

 

Of course if you don't want to take advantage of your team's abilities, that's your loss.

[actionhero112]

Crafting, Gear. Cunning on armor upgrade, Cunning on Weapon Upgrade, possibly cunning amulet. I had very high SA while my own promoted cunning was around 20, due to crafting.

 

There's other passives too, like mercy killing. If you take advantage of team party builds, keepers, AW, Ele, and Necros panic and sleep everything around you for auto crits.

 

Of course if you don't want to take advantage of your team's abilities, that's your loss.

I've done all of these things. I still only have 49% crit chance with sneak attack. The dagger of red birth doesn't provide any, agony only provides like 3% which turns into 6%. I have 9 cunning in my arm slot which turns into 9% crit. That's not a lot. I told you my gear set up. The best two daggers in the game give me barely any cunning. 

 

The truth is to gain substantial cunning you either have to sacrifice offensive stats for it (a superb amulet of dexterity > cunning) or just promote a crap ton. 

 

I've addressed the panic and sleep thing you keep saying. They only last for one proc, and then mercy killing no longer works. KitS works for several hits after you leave stealth (so does your stealth bonus to damage for that matter). Half the time Necromancers aren't running horror.

 

Also please don't tell me that you consider ele's to be reliable sleep machines. By the time they stonefist and complete their lightning staff combo, that unit is dead. 

 

actually the best way to get constant crits through mercy killing would be through the Reaver. They have the fear on kill and war horn. Even then however, it only lasts one hit, and I'd have to force one of my friends to play the Reaver on perilous. They like me, but they don't like me that much. 

[Drasca]

 They only last for one proc, and then mercy killing no longer works. KitS works for several hits after you leave stealth (so does your stealth bonus to damage for that matter). Half the time Necromancers aren't running horror.

 

You need more than one hit to kill? I don't have end game daggers, but attacking from behind from stealth ends enemies very quickly.

 

 

 please don't tell me that you consider ele's to be reliable sleep machines

 

Sure thing. Ele's aren't sleep machines. Eles constantly refresh panic via fire wall. Reavers benefit too. It is the other classes that refresh sleep via weaken + shock combos.

[Catastrophy]

Good question. I want to know too.

 

 

As opposed to Twin fangs missing upon movement / positional issues? Choose your favorite downside.

I had some success in making Twin Fangs connect after using the hook and tackle thing right out of the animation.