Of course you and your buddy The Krit knew that even before NWN was released. Yet you kept that for yourselves.
I don't see how discussing this on the old old forums was "keeping this to ourselves." BioWare never gave an official response as to their release, and since the patches were still coming, these classes did seem on the horizon.
I thought, that since this is actually standard content you or The Krit will write an article about it. But I guess you are ignoring that on purpose since it was me who brought that info.
If the content requires 2da editing, or anything else that would be present in a hak, then it is not "standard content," as one must customize the game to implement it. But, I am not sure why you are constantly focusing on the Krit and I as being your two main obstacles and when questioned about it you give these answers:
Actually, it seems to me from your responds that you fixed all issues I am working on already yourself long time before I even thought of them (never used horses, learned these issues from Proleric's guide). Same with any knowhow I happen to share on these forums. Which is not just you, seems you all knew/fixed that already lol.
I understand sarcasm and hyperboles, but what I do not understand is the way you go from specifically targeting me in some places, and then saying I am just a member of a huge crowd in others. Is there a specific argument you have against me? Or do you need an adversary just to say that you have made it through significant opposition?
Back to the main point ~ gentlemen please kindly retire to your corners. <cheers>
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Quote" What do you mean by "need an arcane henchmen" in this case, though? I mean, you could easily solo HotU with a pure fighter or pure rogue if you wanted. Which sort of becomes a general question: what "should" an arcane companion provide? Summons? Buffs? AoE? Single target nukes? A bit of everything?"
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Truly its not that you actually need any henchmen in any OCs. Within 5 minutes of any OC game launch I see the inevitable "how to solo" thread in a forum ~ LOL. It was true of NWN (1 and 2) BG (1 -3) KOTOR and Dragon Age... and many others..
But I think that is the point. "Tactics mods" and game challenge enhancements appeal to a certain type of player. Especially those that seem to be driven by the need to solo on "insane level".
I would not play a tactics mod HoTU solo just because I could. I am not one of those type players. I suspect there are more of "my type" but I have no proof just because I say so...
I would play a tactics mod HoTU game if my "classic D&D party was robust" and contained some banter / interaction that was mature, witty, potentially even "adult" with the proper disclosures.
The fun of community mods and OCs in my opinion lies in the quality of the "immersion as a function of logic of the situation" and the "henchmen/companions either contributing to that immersion or being at paradox to it".... the paradox henchman can be very very interesting if handled correctly.
I refer you to your other project... Aielund. Aielund is so great not "just" because of its level span 1 - 36 ; but because Robert Black, Criosa, The Dragon, The Barbarian shield maiden, the Druidess, the Ranger, the Cleric were so well written and provided any character build the potential "classic party" of the D&D genre...Fighter - Mage - Cleric - Thief.
Complimentary balance and dialogue... NPCs having their own motivations make a great game.
So in HoTU we had a Bard/RDD that "could fill in for mage". Nathy who ineffectively could fill in for "mage or thief". Valen who could fill in for Fighter effectively.
No pure divine caster/ cleric - no pure mage unless the PC antagonist was one.
My suggestion is merely that if re-tooling consider the above.
This was in fact one of the single criticisms of HoTU and frankly the loudest criticisms of SoU.
As I suggested (though other may have many better ideas)...
A Cleric of Waukeen the merchant god trapped in the Underdark by events ; commanding by divine mission to open new epic markets he or she is suddenly involved in the antagonists plight if only to profit from events...
A Mage seeking a drow gem as his/her final magical "ingredient" to complete their research into casting Melf's Acid Rainstorm ~ trapped by events... reluctant to join...
etc
HotU is where the basic crafting was added (weapons, armor), and that might need a bit of focus in order to make sense in the module. For example, if PC crafted weapons were created with an item property (such as an on-hit) - one that would not be part of the forge upgrades - then PCs in chapter 2 and 3 can upgrade the weapons they crafted to add more variety.
Could I ask you to introduce new classes/races/subraces/domains as well?
You could use Eye of Gruumsh and the other class(disciple/monk of sth) that was partially developed by Bioware (which shadooow discovered and included in his patch) or even include some classes from PRC (those would need to be balanced though).
I'd have to look at Eye of Gruumsh and anything else potentially being added, class-wise. It would definitely be a lower priority.
What new races/subraces would even be added? The main problem I have with those is that they're usually code for "I want more power! Er, I mean I think we need a Half-Orc subrace that gains 4 str at the cost of 2 wis/2 cha. Balanced."
By domains you mean cleric domains? What would even be added?
Truly its not that you actually need any henchmen in any OCs. Within 5 minutes of any OC game launch I see the inevitable "how to solo" thread in a forum ~ LOL. It was true of NWN (1 and 2) BG (1 -3) KOTOR and Dragon Age... and many others..
I wasn't even trying to spark a discussion about soloing, I was more wondering what particular benefit an arcane caster would be considered "essential" for compared to a fighter, rogue, or cleric (or whatever). I mean, if the arcane caster does nothing but summon (more powerful) creatures and snipe with a crossbow, I'm guessing people wouldn't be thrilled (even if the mage's summons were so powerful they were better than a fighter). They probably expect AoE spells and/or IGMS and/or things like dispels/spell breaches. But what ratio?
This was in fact one of the single criticisms of HoTU and frankly the loudest criticisms of SoU.
Lack of a pure cleric/mage specifically or lack of companions overall?
As I suggested (though other may have many better ideas)...
If anything I'd be more concerned about writing/integrating them well enough than the idea itself. Like rogueknight said, I wouldn't want a situation where a default companion is better lore/story/dialogue wise but people feel compelled to bring a more powerful "added" companion.
HotU is where the basic crafting was added (weapons, armor), and that might need a bit of focus in order to make sense in the module. For example, if PC crafted weapons were created with an item property (such as an on-hit) - one that would not be part of the forge upgrades - then PCs in chapter 2 and 3 can upgrade the weapons they crafted to add more variety.
I'm not sure if it's even worth trying to make crafting good/useful, frankly.
Nathyrra could be tweaked to level properly as wizard, I'm sure. And Linu is already a pure Cleric. Another idea would be to introduce hireable mercs in Lith My'athar, who wouldn't need wordy dialogue and personalities; just heavy payment.
I'd have to look at Eye of Gruumsh and anything else potentially being added, class-wise. It would definitely be a lower priority.
What new races/subraces would even be added? The main problem I have with those is that they're usually code for "I want more power! Er, I mean I think we need a Half-Orc subrace that gains 4 str at the cost of 2 wis/2 cha. Balanced."
By domains you mean cleric domains? What would even be added?
I dont think this is good idea. Player can always install my patch which give him access to the Eye of Gruumsh and Shou Disciple. Or he can instal PRC which give him access to biggest custom character building selection ever. No need to add it into campaign, unless it would be needed for a plot like Purple Dragon Knight was.
*spoiler*
I have a little oddball suggestion:
Once the PC reaches Lith My'athar, I don't believe there's a cleric/druid henchman available. Hence:
In the Ale Gardens is a svirfneblin being forced to participate in a drinking game. What if the gnome is actually a defrocked cleric (or druid) of Segojan Earthcaller who came from fallen Blingdenstone? He was on a pilgrimage seeking penance to regain favor with his deity, when he was captured and enslaved. (He has lost his priestly spells and is psychologically shattered by being outcast.) If the PC is able to gain his freedom and aid him in his quest for penance, then the svirfneblin could join as an angst ridden henchman cleric who abhors alcohol.
*shrug*
I dont think this is good idea.
Interesting points, something to consider.
I think this is a great idea, but not sold on requiring HAKs for it.
If you want a graphical overhaul, that could be handled with a Patch HAK side project. Basically you'd be using standard assets, and tell your players that if they want the HD version, all they need do is install the optional Patch HAK to facelift the whole thing.
How would that work with something like, say, Project Q?
One word on making the game harder: I think that will only appeal to a certain type of gamer. Most RPGs are easy because most players have more fun when they feel successful. If this overhaul is to have a wide appeal, I think you'll want to be careful about making it too hard.
The goal isn't to make it nightmarishly hard or anything...the default game is simply a snoozefest 98% of the time. Trying to not make things too hard was a huge part of the design for Siege of the Heavens, for example -- nerfed a lot of stuff because while I could beat it easily, I didn't think most people could.
Companions overall were the complaint...
SOU : Barbarian Sorcerer/Fighter and the Dwarven Cleric/Thief... ineffective and unloved.
HOTU : Drow (female romantic interest) Thief / Assassin / Mage ... ineffective and illegal character build as I recall... but loved.
HOTU : Fighter Weaponmaster. Legit build ... effective.
If ~ as you say you enhance the A and increase a henchmen slot ~ I a pure caster Mage and pure caster Cleric would in fact be "effective within the context of the game". Even with Tony K AI henchmen are legitimately better.
More to the point roleplay wise (not just combat) party choices of :
Thiefling Fighter weaponmaster.
Drow Rogue Assassin (ignore the mage part)
Kobald Bard / RDD
additionally
Pure Cleric
Pure Mage
...Would give the protagonist the ability to create the archtype party of 4 (Fighter type, Mage Type, Rogue Type, Cleric Type) regardless of what class they optioned for.
Simply pick and choose 3 of the above.
Hah! I love Xanos. Normally I tell him to level as Barb, though (he takes Cleave at ninth level).
How would that work with something like, say, Project Q?
It wouldn't. Project Q isn't setup as a Patch HAK.
While you can extend the game with a Patch HAK, this method is better applied to overriding content like Zwerkules did with his Facelift. I also did this by making use of Zwerkules' stuff and adding much more stuff.
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