^^ Yeah, I've seen some of that in the youtubes.
I get the humor, and I think we all need to be reminded to not take ourselves so seriously from time to time - yet it seems to me like he is trolling her at a time when she is already in a lot of pain, and it seems really cruel to me.
JMHO for now, and subject to change.
I don't disagree with your view but will point out that he doesn't act any harsher or more insensitive than a renegade Shepard can in many situations.
^^ Yeah, I've seen some of that in the youtubes.
I get the humor, and I think we all need to be reminded to not take ourselves so seriously from time to time - yet it seems to me like he is trolling her at a time when she is already in a lot of pain, and it seems really cruel to me.
JMHO for now, and subject to change.
When is he being cruel to Liara?
When is he being cruel to Liara?
Given the context of the post I'm going to go out on a limb here and and say that Pas means to say that Javik's attitude towards Liara after the Thessia mission seemed cruel in their opinion.
I'd agree. Though context is key, its presented as opinion, not fact. I found it to be cruel. I imagine Pas did too.
Given the context of the post I'm going to go out on a limb here and and say that Pas means to say that Javik's attitude towards Liara after the Thessia mission seemed cruel in their opinion.
I'd agree. Though context is key, its presented as opinion, not fact. I found it to be cruel. I imagine Pas did too.
I didn't find it cruel.
From the ashes - should have been part of the main game
Leviathan is garbage.
Omega is a tangent - fun, but wouldn't be out of place in ME2 before the reaper war.
Citadel - fun, but its just the ME2 squad interaction the main game was missing.
Extended Cut - waste of time for the same reasons as leviathan and the original ending.
Multiplayer - The dlc i spent the most time on, but all of that progress is lost now im on PC.
I didn't find it cruel.
She had no reason to yell at Javik when he had nothing to do with what happened on Thessia.
Well of course you don't. You wouldn't had asked if you did. I'm confident you knew what what scene she was referring to given the provided context, you just didn't agree with her opinion. Frankly, I feel you asked a needless rhetorical question in such a way to suggest that the opinion of it being rude is completely invalid.
She wasn't yelling at Javik for what happened on Thessia. That bit only comes up near the end when Shepard intervenes. She was angry at him gloating about his species' influence over the Asari. You may not find it cruel but surely you're able to understand why someone might view it as such given the circumstances. It's not exactly the best time to be gloating about how your superior race were gods to the primitive animals. It isn't exactly outrageous for someone to find it rude, is it?
That being said, I generally side with Javik in that argument, simply because the nonsense Liara sprouts after Shepard shows up. I'll agree it was insensitive to gloat after what Liara just went through but the turn Liara took in her little drama session went too far.
Well of course you don't. You wouldn't had asked if you did. I'm confident you knew what what scene she was referring to given the provided context, you just didn't agree with her opinion.
I would've disagreed regardless of which scene was been talked about. I did not know exactly which scene.
Frankly, I feel you asked a needless rhetorical question in such a way to suggest that the opinion of it being rude is completely invalid.
And you're making an assumption based on feelings.
She wasn't yelling at Javik for what happened on Thessia. That bit only comes up near the end when Shepard intervenes. She was angry at him gloating about his species' influence over the Asari.
He's gloating. So what. Javik doesn't give a flying crap about her or anyone else in this cycle. He's in a time he doesn't belong and the last of his species. The only thing he cares about is defeating the reapers.
It's not exactly the best time to be gloating about how your superior race were gods to the primitive animals.
She didn't have to go see him, but she did. Had she not.....
That being said, I generally side with Javik in that argument, simply because the nonsense Liara sprouts after Shepard shows up. I'll agree it was insensitive to gloat after what Liara just went through but the turn Liara took in her little drama session went too far.
I just ignore that garbage and head to the next mission when I gain control of Shepard
I did not know exactly which scene.
I find that sincerely hard to believe coming from someone who has played the game as many times as you and given the context provided. I would be absolutely /shocked/ if she was referring to any other scene, or in the very least thessia in general.
And you're making an assumption based on feelings.
No, my assumption is based off the evidence before me. On one hand we have the context provided that points to that scene and we have you, someone I know has played ME3 many times and would definitely know of that scene. Do you know of another time where Javik has a conversation with Liara while she's in distress? I'm fairly confident, arrogant as it may seem, that anyone who's played From Ashes, let alone as many times as you, would be able to make that connection to thessia. Even on the off chance she meant another scene. I'll submit that perhaps there IS another scene that is relevant to the context provided but I'm quite skeptical of it.
He's gloating. So what. Javik doesn't give a flying crap about her or anyone else in this cycle. He's in a time he doesn't belong and the last of his species. The only thing he cares about is defeating the reapers.
So what? So you honestly cannot comprehend why someone, anyone, might consider that gloating a bit rude when done towards someone in Liara's current state? Not even a little bit? Do you truly have that little grasp of others feelings? I understand why you may not feel it yourself, I get that. The argument you make isn't untrue. But to act as though NO ONE could ever or should ever feel like that was rude? Come on now. Even if you yourself disagree can't at you at least see why some people might consider that boasting rude?
Hell, even Liara wasn't in such a distressed state at the time him walking around calling everyone primitives and acting like he's better than everyone else is pretty rude in its own right. Justification doesn't make it less rude.
I just ignore that garbage and head to the next mission when I gain control of Shepard
Personally I hate ignoring content. I like to milk the game of all its worth. That and I consider the story and dialogue to the be main aspect of the game. The combat, while fun in ME3, was always second in my eyes. Plus, given the fact that Javik adds so little to the actual game as it stands, at least for me, it'd seem extra wasteful not to pursue his content. Something has to justify my purchase of this cut day-1 DLC. Lol.
So what? So you honestly cannot comprehend why someone, anyone, might consider that gloating a bit rude when done towards someone in Liara's current state? Not even a little bit? Do you truly have that little grasp of others feelings? I understand why you may not feel it yourself, I get that. The argument you make isn't untrue. But to act as though NO ONE could ever or should ever feel like that was rude? Come on now. Even if you yourself disagree can't at you at least see why some people might consider that boasting rude?
So its rude now? What happened to being cruel?
Personally I hate ignoring content. I like to milk the game of all its worth. That and I consider the story and dialogue to the be main aspect of the game. The combat, while fun in ME3, was always second in my eyes. Plus, given the fact that Javik adds so little to the actual game as it stands, at least for me, it'd seem extra wasteful not to pursue his content. Something has to justify my purchase of this cut day-1 DLC. Lol.
I've heard the all dialogue after Thessia when I first played the game and after I heard it all, I ignore it.
Javik was being sort of cruel, but that's him, he always stating facts in his usual matter of fact way, which does come off as abrasive, and no, he was not "gloating", that would imply that he was taking pleasure over seeing Liara suffer, which he clearly was not, he just did not take her feelings(or anyone else's) into consideration when revealing the true history of the Asari.
This is true. However it is Liara's claim that he was gloating. I may necessarily agree with that assertion (I wasn't even really there for that bit, we walk in after-the-fact) but given how insensitive Javik is and how emotionally distraught Liara is at the time I can understand why she would feel that way.
Though like you said, and I even defended at one point, this is all part of his personality. His attitude and behavior towards Liara is not out of character for him. Which is actually partly why I wouldn't be surprised if he did do some inappropriate, if factually-based, boasting like Liara claims. He's a fairly rude individual in general. It was a pretty sore time for him to be pulling that attitude on Liara.
So its rude now? What happened to being cruel?
It's been "rude" since post #57. You didn't create distinction between the two earlier, I assumed you understood the intended context.
That rude behavior in question, within the context of that situation presented, is cruel. They're interchangeable within this context.
Boating about your species Godhood guiding and ruling the primitive species of someone who was clearly going through a very emotionally stressful time is cruel. I'm not surprised by the behavior, as like I said it is in-character and I do agree with your earlier sentiment that she shouldn't had looked to him for support. That doesn't change the point of the argument though. Is it really that unreasonable to believe someone might find him to be cruel in that situation?
The definition of cruel: willfully causing pain or suffering to others, or feeling no concern about it.
Javik, by your own admission: He's gloating. Javik doesn't give a flying crap about her or anyone else in this cycle. The only thing he cares about is defeating the reapers.
Do you not see any parallels between not having any concern for someones feelings and willfully gloating within the context of this scene to being akin to cruel behavior?
You admit he is gloating. You admit he doesn't care. It's is made very clear that its causing more pain and distress to Liara emotionally. Javik is Honeybadger because he does not give a ****. He himself admits he doesn't care about her feelings. Sure, I get why he doesn't care. Like you said, he only cares about stopping the reapers. I'm not judging him here, he's been through **** and has bigger concerns than sparing the feelings of some asari. But you're acting like theres no reason for anyone to ever view him as being cruel in this scene. I disagree with you. I think its perfectly understandable why someone would view his behavior within the context of this scene as being cruel.
The definition of cruel: willfully causing pain or suffering to others, or feeling no concern about it.
Would that definition apply to Liara for not telling Shepard's mother, for those that play as a spacer, that she gave his/her body to Cerberus? I mean if my kid died and someone gave my child's body to Cerberus, who suppose to be a friend, I would want that someone to tell me. Or even inform Ashley/Kaidan, if a LI, which I'm sure she would know the two were having a relationship.
Yes I know this is far from the discussion, but still I'm curious
Would that definition apply to Liara for mot informing Shepard's mother, for those that play as a spacer, for not telling her that she gave his/her body to Cerberus? I mean if my kid died and someone gave my child's body to Cerberus, who suppose to be a friend, I would want that someone to tell me. Or even inform Ashley/Kaidan, if a LI, which I'm sure she would know the two were having a relationship.
Yes I know this is far from the discussion, but still I'm curious
I'm not sure. That's a more nuanced situation. I definitely think she was wrong to keep it secret. I definitely believe Shepard's LI or at least the mother should had been informed. That being said, whether or not it should be called "cruel" I'm not sure.
From a gaming perspective I can kinda understand why they wouldn't: Liara was probably the main LI already (you only had two choices per gender, each including her) so not making content of her informing the LI makes a degree of sense. Shepard only has family if you play spacer so that cuts it down another percentage. While I can understand all that I still think they should have at least did SOMETHING to suggest family/squad were informed.
I can see both sides of that though. On one hand, it would b a scene for such a relatively small crowd and not worth the effort. On the other hand since its just two or three scenes why not make it? They've done similar things before in regards to subtle nods to Shepard's background and past choices. Whats a few more here?
It certainly would had made the reunions flow a bit more naturally, I think. No "I thought you were dead. Well, lets ignore that now and pretend like its old times." The VS is the only one that behaves naturally in the situation but the context of the situation made it ridiculous. If they all knew Shepard was at least potentially being revived the quick dismissal of the whole "two years dead" thing would feel better to me, personally.
Ah, I'm getting away from the question: is it cruel not to inform them. Difficult, very difficult. I mean, she doesn't KNOW what is going to happen. The revival isn't certain. Infact, doesn't TIM originally lead her to believe that they want the body for human burial tradition or something? I'm not sure just what Liara expected to happen, the story was a bit... iffy about that. On one hand they say its for "human customs" and then you hear talk about restoring Shepard's body but then Liara still seems confused and think its just human customs. At the end of the Redemption Miranda points out that they may not be able to do anything with the body due to the damage.
The way Liara reacts throughout the comic I suspect she believes this is just some weird human custom of making the dead presentable or something. She seems pretty lost in the whole ordeal. Though this could just be poor writing. At anyrate, I'm not certain what Liara thinks she was doing in giving Shepard's body to Cerberus. I'm not sure she knows its for the purpose of actually reviving him. In ME2 she hears from her sources that he's alive but didn't really believe it. So again, I'm not sure.
If Liara just thought she was giving the body to Cerberus for some human burial custom or what-have-you, what incentive is there to tell anyone? It's just a dead body. Granted, I'd still want to know, but she is an Asari. I'm not even sure what their customs are when it comes to death (burial robes are a thing, if I remember the advertise on Illium right). Would she think of informing the family of the body? Does the corpse hold any real significance to Asari? She seemed rather confused by Cerberus' desire for the body in the first place. Maybe she expected Cerberus, a pro-human group claiming the want the body for their human customs, would take care of the formalities such as informing the family and friends?
Does she even know humans like to know about this stuff? Liara had practically no interaction with humans before meeting Shepard. She was a recluse. She seems equally confused by "human customs". Do I think she should have told the family and squad? I do. However, because she's an Asari, a very awkward, confused Asari that isn't the brightest star in the bunch when it comes to social matters in the first place... The real question is would she know any better? I'm skeptical. Though, to admit my open bias, I don't have much confidence in Liara's ability outside prothean research and (for some strange turn of events in ME2 onward) combat ability. Her goofing up on this doesn't seem out of character to me.
Still I'm dodging the question - is it cruel? Personally... I'm going to say no. I understand why others will see it as cruel. The mother and friends would probably view at as cruel. Though again, the definition of cruel is to willingly cause harm without care. Unlike Javik, who willing caused pain and didn't give a flock, by his own admittance, Liara didn't seem to understand anything going on so she wasn't willingly hurting anyone. It was inadvertent. Also, credit where credit is due, for all I rag on Liara I do believe that if she actually thought not knowing this would hurt Shepard's mother (if she even knows about her - though she should) or LI or squad... I believe she would have told them.
Though, again, like I mentioned, I'd understand why someone would view it as cruel. I can see two sides to this. Just like I can see two sides to Javik, believe it or not. I still think he was cruel since he willingly and knowingly hurt Liara with his gloating without any tact or care but at the same time I understand why people would wave this off due to the nature of Javik and all the **** he's been through. I actually sit in both camps on this one. I acknowledge that Javik was being cruel and I still side with him being right in the argument. Liara didn't have to come to him and the nonsense she sprouted at him at the end was uncalled for. Javik was just being Javik, Liara was just stirring up melodrama.
My personal policy when it comes to DLC in general with any game is that it is dependant on the game itself and how much I like the game I am purchasing the DLC for. If it is a game I love and a game I know I am going to play over and over again then I will go ahead and purchase all the DLC for the game since in my opinion I am just extending a game I already love playing and if it is a game I am willing to play over and over again then I will get the value for my money. If it is a game I don't plan on doing multiple playthroughs for then I will normally hold off on getting the DLC. For ME specifically I have bought all the DLCs in the series and I don't regret it because I have played through and continue to playthrough the series multiple times which means I play through the DLCs multiple times as well.
Still I'm dodging the question - is it cruel? Personally... I'm going to say no. I understand why others will see it as cruel. The mother and friends would probably view at as cruel. Though again, the definition of cruel is to willingly cause harm without care. Unlike Javik, who willing caused pain and didn't give a flock, by his own admittance, Liara didn't seem to understand anything going on so she wasn't willingly hurting anyone. It was inadvertent. Also, credit where credit is due, for all I rag on Liara I do believe that if she actually thought not knowing this would hurt Shepard's mother (if she even knows about her - though she should) or LI or squad... I believe she would have told them.
Hands-down Citadel is worth getting. It may seem pricey but it's of a decent length in terms of missions and even after the main plotline is completed it gives you an entirely new area of the citadel that you can check out to complete various activities- not to mention the fact that it adds some very fun interactions with your party members. I don't want to say much anything else for fear of spoiling the surprises but I highly, highly recommend it. There's a wealth of content there and even if you don't want the other ones I'd suggest you pick it up. You'll find it especially rewarding if you've played the previous games in the series. Really, it might as well be a mini-expansion to ME3.
I quite enjoyed Leviathan but I'll admit that it's not exactly crucial to the ME3 experience. The two main points of credit I can give it are that it's well-paced (it nicely alternates between interactions, combat, and explorative/investigative elements) and it does offer a few new locales- albeit ones that you visit fairly briefly. It's a fun little series of missions that keep you interested because of the mystery that kicks them off but you may not find it has a high replay factor once you've been through it once. (I tend to hit it every playthrough but I'm something of a completionist.) Cost-wise I'd say it's a better investment than Omega for what you're paying versus what you're getting.
From Ashes is a bit harder to rate because it really depends on how early you do it in a playthrough and how much use you make of the special 'asset' you get from the mission. In terms of story it really seems like content that should have been in the main game regardless- would've been an awesome plot twist and one of the surprise highlights of the game if it hadn't come in the form of a little slip in my game case that helpfully spoiled the big reveal. Its DLC status also makes for a rather odd situation where you have something that should be a plot critical element yet has to be written in such a way that it can be omitted entirely since many people won't have it in their game. This is most apparent in the Thessia mission.
Omega...not unless you're a huge Aria fan. The whole thing is pretty much a straight shot of running and gunning with little to switch it up. The story is okay but rather bare bones overall and it feels like the experience was heavily padded out. I'd wait until you've done most everything else and see if you're itching for more content but I'd still prioritize the other ones first. Honestly, even though I usually do all the missions I tend to either skip this one or dread getting into it because it's such a time sink and the whole thing has always felt kind of bland after the first time I played it.
The costume DLCs are cool but of course purely cosmetic. You can find screenshots of them online easily enough if your interest is piqued. Some of the extra gear is pretty good though, again, nothing you especially need.
In short: All but Omega.
Omega is obscenly overpriced and just 1hr railshooting.
The other DLCs add to the main story (From Ashes, Leviathan) or add massive amounts of content (Citadel).
Retour en haut