23 réponses à ce sujet

[GilgameshX]

I'm thinking of using the dragon mats on my tanks armor, but is it really worth it? Or should it best be used on weapons? Side question - what is the best armor leather for a tank?

[Arvaarad]

I'd upgrade daggers and bows first, because killing enemies faster helps your whole party survive. Then move on down the line of weapons in descending order of dps.

Once all that is done, use any leftovers for armor.

[DarkAmaranth1966]

I drop it on my tank armor then, my own weapon, or be a smart arse and use CE to give me unlimited crafting mats and drop it on everything LOL.

[actionhero112]

I drop it on my tank armor then, my own weapon, or be a smart arse and use CE to give me unlimited crafting mats and drop it on everything LOL.

Make it rain dragon bone!

 

 

Actually that sounds like it would hurt. 

[DarkAmaranth1966]

Yeah, Bull moans and groans when I drop piles of dragon bits on him and tell him to tote it all to the Undercroft.

[SpazzticZeal]

Make it rain dragon bone!

 

 

Actually that sounds like it would hurt. 

 Sounds a lot more like it would make an easy game even more trivial.

[DarkAmaranth1966]

Yeah but, hey by play 10, it's fun to run about one hitting everything, blasting lev 12 rifts at lev 4 and so on, just because you can.

[Exalus]

bows

daggers

armor for tank

 

rest is irrelevant and far far overkill.

[Biotic Flash Kick]

worst idea: Staff

wow a +2 damage from the T3's and its fire 

[JaegerBane]

worst idea: Staff
wow a +2 damage from the T3's and its fire

If you were using a fire staff on your inquisitor already then it's worth it. Extra damage is extra damage. I agree that it's not worth using on your squadmates.

[Farangbaa]

1: tank's armor and weapons (Dragonbone)
2: everybody else's armor (webbing and leather, maybe some dragonbone if you have a second warrior. I'd think about tier 3 matst there though).
3: BIANCA.
Seriously. A fully modded Bianca (with tier 3 masterwork upgrades) is unbelievably sick. (mostly dragonbone and leather)
Pay attention though, as with every upgrade: not all upgrades produces better results with dragon mats. Some categories get the exact same value with tier 3 mats. Use tier 3 mats there, obviously
4: Player Character weapons
5: weapons for rogues
6: upgrades, for as much as they are better with tier4 and for as much as your have tier 4 mats left.

Dragonmats are useless in any case they give fire resistance btw, in my opinion.
There are good enough staff drops in the game, only a fully upgraded Masterwork Archon Staff with a good proc is worth your dragonmaterials (and I'd use tier 3 for the con/str modifier you don't really need)

But really people, try using dragon mats on Bianca and see that DPS and crit chance/armor penetration/crit damage skyrocket

[JaegerBane]

Pay attention though, as with every upgrade: not all upgrades produces better results with dragon mats. Some categories get the exact same value with tier 3 mats. Use tier 3 mats there, obviously

Indeed, and consider that the crafting system rounds bonuses up. Add Dragon Webbing (+1 willpower/magic) or Plush Fustian Velvet (+1 magic/+0.75 willpower) to a 3 cloth utility slot and the results will be both +3 magic and willpower.

I don't agree with your point on staff drops though. Given the staff's importance, the standard drops are pretty awful and not really competitive. Of course, you can get away with tier 3 materials to make an extremely powerful staff.

[Orian Tabris]

I'd upgrade daggers and bows first, because killing enemies faster helps your whole party survive. Then move on down the line of weapons in descending order of DPS.

Once all that is done, use any leftovers for armour.

 

Actually, it depends on a combination of the player's capability and the game's difficulty. A half decent player playing on Nightmare, would require focusing on armour, then weapons, since they will most likely be unable to win longer fights.

[Orian Tabris]

Indeed, and consider that the crafting system rounds bonuses up. Add Dragon Webbing (+1 willpower/magic) or Plush Fustian Velvet (+1 magic/+0.75 willpower) to a 3 cloth utility slot and the results will be both +3 magic and willpower.

 

That's wrong, actually. Either it rounds to the nearest whole number, or it rounds down. In the case of 3 Plush Fustian Velvet, it would be +3 Magic and +2 Willpower. (Assuming I remember correctly.)

[Farangbaa]

Indeed, and consider that the crafting system rounds bonuses up. Add Dragon Webbing (+1 willpower/magic) or Plush Fustian Velvet (+1 magic/+0.75 willpower) to a 3 cloth utility slot and the results will be both +3 magic and willpower.

I don't agree with your point on staff drops though. Given the staff's importance, the standard drops are pretty awful and not really competitive. Of course, you can get away with tier 3 materials to make an extremely powerful staff.

Not speaking of standrad drops. Ferelden Frostback drop, Tyrda's Staff, etc. The really cool purple staves. There's one that gives +36 magic or something with a Mind Blast proc, I think, which is way good enough for a squad member.

Though Tyrda's Staff technically isn't a drop, I suppose. You get it via war table mission (get all Landmarks in Hinterlands and it unlocks)

[Arvaarad]

Actually, it depends on a combination of the player's capability and the game's difficulty. A half decent player playing on Nightmare, would require focusing on armour, then weapons, since they will most likely be unable to win longer fights.

IMO, focusing on defense is almost always a trap. It makes people feel safer, but with many enemies, especially bosses, you get a big survival boost if you kill them before their "**** you attack" cools down. And with many enemies raising guard or barrier, doing a little bit more dps results in them dying a lot faster.

Consider the Highland Ravager. With a very defensive team, she'll summon dragonlings about a half dozen times, and she'll extend the fight even longer by stomping for guard. However, against a single non-cheesy DW rogue, she'll get about 2 chances to raise guard, and she'll summon only one batch of dragonlings (against a cheesy rogue, she won't raise any guard or summon any dragonlings, but where's the fun in that?).

Playing defensively lets you endure a little more damage, but it also means you take a lot more damage before the enemy dies. For many enemies, it doesn't result in a net gain in survivability.

[JaegerBane]

That's wrong, actually. Either it rounds to the nearest whole number, or it rounds down. In the case of 3 Plush Fustian Velvet, it would be +3 Magic and +2 Willpower. (Assuming I remember correctly.)

Nope, just done it with a Blunt Staff Edge attachment (6 cloth utility, 3 cloth utility). Putting 6 plush + 3 plush gets you +9 magic and +8 willpower. Putting 6 dragon webbing and 3 plush gets you +9 to both magic and willpower. I think this tends to happen with odd-numbered slots.

[JaegerBane]

Not speaking of standrad drops. Ferelden Frostback drop, Tyrda's Staff, etc. The really cool purple staves. There's one that gives +36 magic or something with a Mind Blast proc, I think, which is way good enough for a squad member.Though Tyrda's Staff technically isn't a drop, I suppose. You get it via war table mission (get all Landmarks in Hinterlands and it unlocks)

That's what I assumed you're talking about - aside from tyrdda's and its +25% Attack rating on a level 11 staff, the rest are naff. The Grand Enchanter's staff (hinterlands dragon drop) is 95 DPS on a staff you can't use until level 15.... I.e. Not competitive.

[Duelist]

IMO, focusing on defense is almost always a trap. It makes people feel safer, but with many enemies, especially bosses, you get a big survival boost if you kill them before their "**** you attack" cools down. And with many enemies raising guard or barrier, doing a little bit more dps results in them dying a lot faster.

Consider the Highland Ravager. With a very defensive team, she'll summon dragonlings about a half dozen times, and she'll extend the fight even longer by stomping for guard. However, against a single non-cheesy DW rogue, she'll get about 2 chances to raise guard, and she'll summon only one batch of dragonlings (against a cheesy rogue, she won't raise any guard or summon any dragonlings, but where's the fun in that?).

Playing defensively lets you endure a little more damage, but it also means you take a lot more damage before the enemy dies. For many enemies, it doesn't result in a net gain in survivability.

That is a very Rogue mindset though.

That's not a criticism, just an observation and I say this because I think the exact same way.

[Arvaarad]

That is a very Rogue mindset though.

That's not a criticism, just an observation and I say this because I think the exact same way.

 

Warriors and mages can contribute a lot to combat. Among other things, warriors are great at buffing and mages are great at crowd control, both of which improve the glass cannons' ability to actually land their dps. Heck, my first playthrough of DA:I was a controlly rift mage, and I'd play that class again.

 

I just think that there's generally too much emphasis placed on a character's survivability, when absolute survivability has 0 to do with how good a party is at combat. The question isn't "can these enemies kill me?", because they always can. The real question is, "can these enemies kill me before I kill them?" 

 

If I sacrifice offense (where offense can be DPS, but can also be things like support and control, which improve DPS or help keep targets still) to raise my defense, I'm raising my absolute survivability. But the enemy's absolute survivability goes up too, because they now have more chances to add guard or barrier. Plus, they have more chances to deal long-cooldown, heavy-hitting attacks. So while my absolute survivability went up, my relative survivability stayed the about the same or went down.

 

And relative survivability is what determines whether I actually win the fight.

[Duelist]

Warriors and mages can contribute a lot to combat. Among other things, warriors are great at buffing and mages are great at crowd control, both of which improve the glass cannons' ability to actually land their dps. Heck, my first playthrough of DA:I was a controlly rift mage, and I'd play that class again.

I just think that there's generally too much emphasis placed on a character's survivability, when absolute survivability has 0 to do with how good a party is at combat. The question isn't "can these enemies kill me?", because they always can. The real question is, "can these enemies kill me before I kill them?"

If I sacrifice offense (where offense can be DPS, but can also be things like support and control, which improve DPS or help keep targets still) to raise my defense, I'm raising my absolute survivability. But the enemy's absolute survivability goes up too, because they now have more chances to add guard or barrier. Plus, they have more chances to deal long-cooldown, heavy-hitting attacks. So while my absolute survivability went up, my relative survivability stayed the about the same or went down.

And relative survivability is what determines whether I actually win the fight.

Again, agreed. Particularly with the bolded.

Whenever the topic of Rogues being too squishy is raised, I make it a point to emphasise that offense is the best defence.

[goofyomnivore]

I'd use the bone on weapons always unless you like the gold color armor. Dragon webbing is really good in cloth offense slots the % critical damage is really nice if you have decent crit. Utility slots for cloth you want all willpower anyways. The Dragon scales are pretty meh. I've never used armor penetration in crafting. As a rogue you want to stack dex, so both its utility and offense slots are meh imo. I think dragon scales would be best used as leather armor base armor.

[Arvaarad]

I'd use the bone on weapons always unless you like the gold color armor. Dragon webbing is really good in cloth offense slots the % critical damage is really nice if you have decent crit. Utility slots for cloth you want all willpower anyways. The Dragon scales are pretty meh. I've never used armor penetration in crafting. As a rogue you want to stack dex, so both its utility and offense slots are meh imo. I think dragon scales would be best used as leather armor base armor.

Yeah, armor pen is situational. Useless on staves, but it could be worthwhile on physical-damage weapons if you don't have any sundering abilities in the party. Depends on how much armor pen % you get.

Some enemies can have armor values in the 50s, and that can cut the party's damage in half. Armor is subtracted from the base damage of the weapon before multipliers are applied, so if you have a weapon with 100 base damage (not DPS, the number below DPS), 50 armor is pretty significant.

[Thrasher91604]

Is defense more or less important on harder difficulties, or no? Based on ths reasoning, it sounds like its less important than killing the damage dealers as soon as possible. That's been my experience at least. Healing potions make up for the lack of defense. Offensive is also a much less tedious and timeconsuming way to combat...