"Stroud/Alistair/Loghain, you're the only remaining Warden of any significant rank. What should we do now?"
So wait, wait, wait a second. The higher ranking Wardens in Southern Thedas are all dead then? At least some of teh Awakening party, like Nathaniel, have no doubt moved up in rank by now, and they're definitely well respected Wardens from their actions in Amaranthine.
So are they all dead?
I MUST KNOW 
The fates of Nathaniel, Oghren, Sigrun, and Velanna are unknown.
Personally I like to think that they are travelling with the Warden on their quest to find a cure for the Calling.
I still think Nathaniel should have been one of Hawke's potential Warden contacts, if alive. Hawke could meet him during DA2, so it'd be less random than Loghain at least, and I've always pictured him being the one to take over as Warden-Commander of Ferelden once my Warden left her post to go west. He seems the best suited to the job. Could've made him butt heads with Clarel's plan as her closest Warden of equal rank or something.
Meh, as of now I just like to think Nate, Sigrun, Oghren and Velanna are with my Warden on her search and thus out of the area.
I still think Nathaniel should have been one of Hawke's potential Warden contacts, if alive. Hawke could meet him during DA2, so it'd be less random than Loghain at least, and I've always pictured him being the one to take over as Warden-Commander of Ferelden once my Warden left her post to go west. He seems the best suited to the job. Could've made him butt heads with Clarel's plan as her closest Warden of equal rank or something.
Meh, as of now I just like to think Nate, Sigrun, Oghren and Velanna are with my Warden on her search and thus out of the area.
Yea, Nate would've made more sense than Loghain
I still feel Stroud should always appear regardless
I still feel Stroud should always appear regardless
Having every applicable Warden contact character showing up at once could have been cool. Have Alistair/Stroud/Loghain, and Nathaniel. Maybe the rest of the Awakening crew too. Get the whole band up in here.
Not sure how the final choice would have worked, though. :S
Having every applicable Warden contact character showing up at once could have been cool. Have Alistair/Stroud/Loghain, and Nathaniel. Maybe the rest of the Awakening crew too. Get the whole band up in here.
Not sure how the final choice would have worked, though. :S
Well if Alistair is a Warden then he would go through with Hawke and Inquisitor, if Loghain is a Warden he would, if neither Alistair or Loghain then Nat would
And if all three are not Wardens then Stroud
Having every applicable Warden contact character showing up at once could have been cool. Have Alistair/Stroud/Loghain, and Nathaniel. Maybe the rest of the Awakening crew too. Get the whole band up in here.
Not sure how the final choice would have worked, though. :S
Remove it. It was an arbitrary choice anyway that made little sense to begin with.
The Inquisitor opened a rift on their own not 20 minutes prior and has control over the thing more and more. And here we're supposed to just accept that we need to make a decision about who needs to stay? Made little sense to me. The rift the Demon's trying to get through now has been progressively growing in size thanks to the rituals the Wardens performed, so it's not like our rifts at all.
I headcanon my Cadash as staying behind since he can move through the Fade at will. As the other characters leave through the Rift and before the Nightmare even really tries to swallow him, he opens up a rift and goes through it. This rift puts him just outside Adamant (to instill some degree of consequence rather then have "Everything is AWESOME!") and he seals it up, fights his way through the remaining Demons, and then seals the main rift just in time.
Deaths are higher, but he had no way of knowing how far the Fade rift would send him.
Remove it. It was an arbitrary choice anyway that made little sense to begin with.
The Inquisitor opened a rift on their own not 20 minutes prior and has control over the thing more and more. And here we're supposed to just accept that we need to make a decision about who needs to stay? Made little sense to me. The rift the Demon's trying to get through now has been progressively growing in size thanks to the rituals the Wardens performed, so it's not like our rifts at all.
I headcanon my Cadash as staying behind since he can move through the Fade at will. As the other characters leave through the Rift and before the Nightmare even really tries to swallow him, he opens up a rift and goes through it. This rift puts him just outside Adamant (to instill some degree of consequence rather then have "Everything is AWESOME!") and he seals it up, fights his way through the remaining Demons, and then seals the main rift just in time.
Deaths are higher, but he had no way of knowing how far the Fade rift would send him.
Suppose so, though I'd say it should have just been presented in a more believable manner than scrapped entirely. I like a little spice of tragic choices here and there and Varric's reaction to Hawke's death certainly qualifies.
Suppose so, though I'd say it should have just been presented in a more believable manner than scrapped entirely. I like a little spice of tragic choices here and there and Varric's reaction to Hawke's death certainly qualifies.
Oh I like tragic choices myself as well as long as they're believably done, though it doesn't necessarily have to be put in the same spot for this one. I'm sure that one could find another place in the narrative where the idea of picking one or the other could come into play that doesn't strain credulity.
And that Varric reaction..... FEELS
I want to believe that the Awakening companions are with the Hero of Fereldan or even by themselves looking for a cure to the Calling.
The alternative is that, since they could all die, Bioware's going to kill them off because it's "easier".
I don't relish that thought.
The alternative is that, since they could all die, Bioware's going to kill them off because it's "easier".
I don't relish that thought.
Neither do I.
Why do I fear BioWare will choose to go with that decision, kill them off, no loose end because it's "easier" and more "convenient" for them. 
Neither do I.
Why do I fear BioWare will choose to go with that decision, kill them off, no loose end because it's "easier" and more "convenient" for them.
Bioware's vision is remarkably limited, in my view.
Ironically if they did that it'd make them like the Seekers, who went with what was expedient.
Bioware's vision is remarkably limited, in my view.
Ironically if they did that it'd make them like the Seekers, who went with what was expedient.
If only they remember their original goal was to create a great story-driven game like they used to do in the past.
Now, now. We need someone like Cassandra in BioWare to set things right. 
The fates of Nathaniel, Oghren, Sigrun, and Velanna are unknown.
Personally I like to think that they are travelling with the Warden on their quest to find a cure for the Calling.
You know the being with the Warden is probably the best thing the writers can do for themselves when considering any future interactions with the warden. I mean the amount of issues to be tackled to put the warden in game in the flesh are absurd, it's not going to happen. But if the awakening crew are still with him/her they could easily show up somewhere to fill us in or act as representative of the warden in w/e adventure requires us contacting them again.
, and Anders was muderknifed
Speaking of our companions in Awakening, and the entire chapter of Ferelden Wardens is missing. Anyone wonder what happen to the order as a whole? I thought the Wardens supposed to have a presence and strongholds throughout Thedas. We also know there are wardens in Free Marches, and they have a fortress in Ansburg, but suddenly the order is on the brink of extinction, and not to mention the infighting.
I think the line was meant to be about seniority or rank within the Orlesian Wardens, not all the Wardens in all Southern Thedas.
Since the order in Ferelden is small and there current Warden-Commander is indisposed elsewhere, it makes me suspect that they didn't involve themselves at Adamant because they had neither the numbers, nor were suffering from the Calling and thus weren't prey to Corypheus' machinations.
Incidentally, the game really should have addressed whether or not the Fereldan chapter were also (possibly) exiled by the Inquisition, given that they had nothing to do with what happened at Adamant and indeed, weren't even there at the time?
After all, the Wardens in Ferelden are the ones who actually did save Thedas from the Blight, while the Orlesian Wardens sat and watched from over the border (yes, the border was closed, but the real Blackwall's reaction was basically "F**k 'em"), so why would anyone in Ferelden allow the Inquisition to exile them over the actions of their compatriots in Orlais? I find it hard to believe they would, especially Alistair if he's the King?
I think the line was meant to be about seniority or rank within the Orlesian Wardens, not all the Wardens in all Southern Thedas.
Since the order in Ferelden is small and there current Warden-Commander is indisposed elsewhere, it makes me suspect that they didn't involve themselves at Adamant because they had neither the numbers, nor were suffering from the Calling and thus weren't prey to Corypheus' machinations.
Incidentally, the game really should have addressed whether or not the Fereldan chapter were also (possibly) exiled by the Inquisition, given that they had nothing to do with what happened at Adamant and indeed, weren't even there at the time?
After all, the Wardens in Ferelden are the ones who actually did save Thedas from the Blight, while the Orlesian Wardens sat and watched from over the border (yes, the border was closed, but the real Blackwall's reaction was basically "F**k 'em"), so why would anyone in Ferelden allow the Inquisition to exile them over the actions of their compatriots in Orlais? I find it hard to believe they would, especially Alistair if he's the King?
I want to believe that, but I'm still skeptical after seeing how it turned out for the entire order if you exile the Orlesian wardens from Orlais.
I know that the Ferelden chapter is small (compared to Orlais or Anderfels), but as mentioned in Awakening's epilogue. They have replenished their numbers when the crisis is dealt with. I don't think the Ferelden chapter is that small anymore, especially when the Warden save Ferelden in the Fifth Blight, the order is no longer shunned by people, and they'll be able to recruit people easier. Hmm, I haven't seen any mention of current Ferelden Warden Commander, and that he or she is indisposed elsewhere. Was this mentioned in the Last Flight? I suppose the safest assumption is that they didn't involve themselves at Adamant, and correct me if I'm wrong, but since you mention the lack of Ferelden chapter involvement at Adamant. I remember a Grey Wardens Journal in the Storm Coast now, perhaps they have a special mission of their own, but why does it take the whole chapter of Ferelden wardens to participate since Leliana mentioned they all vanished.
The problem with Awakening's epilogue is that it seems counter to the game itself, since Ferelden required Orlesian Wardens to bolster their numbers at the start of the game, all of whom were then killed by the Withered when he assaulted Vigil's Keep after misinterpreting the Architect's orders.
The game itself also seems that recruiting isn't particular high even after the accolades won by the Wardens after the Blight, as only Mhairi wanted to be recruited and we were forced to conscript most of our companions, simply because we needed any Wardens we could find to help us.
To be fair, it was the Warden aka Hero of Ferelden who did most of the work, since all wardens was wiped out at Ostagar, except the Warden and Alistair who's hardly contributed any real effort to defeat the Blight, although Duncan and other wardens in Ferelden play their part as well. May their sacrifice will always be remembered. You're absolutely correct, though, about the Orlesian wardens who's basically sat and watch Ferelden burned, watch as the Darkspawn ravaging Ferelden from over the border. I wouldn't say what the real Blackwall did is right, but I can understand why he chooses that. I was wondering that myself why would people of Ferelden allow the Inquisition to exile them over the actions of other chapter, and I'm still baffled that the Inquisition can simply exile Orlesian wardens. I thought Orlais monarchs, and the people suppose to have a say in big decision like this. Then again, I find many things in DAI hardly believable, Ferelden's monarch take their time to respond to Mage-Templar war crisis, and they let the Inquisition annex a portion of their land to build camp or fortress like it was nothing.
Yeah, the real Blackwall was a tad callous to let Ferelden burn, but you're right, what could he do given that the Wardens aren't meant to get involved in politics at all... something that our own dear Warden kept breaking every chance they could get?
And this has been bugging me as well, because the Inquisition, as powerful as it is, simply doesn't have the authority to exile an entire order from a country (or countries), since they don't actually rule anywhere and are just a Non-Governmental Organisation at it's core.
It only makes sense if we assume it was just Orlais, because the country is screwed six ways to sunday with the Civil War? Depending on when you do HLTA, Celene/Gaspard might either be too busy dealing with the war, consolidating power in the aftermath, or too deep in the Inquisition's pocket to speak up against them clearly overstepping their bounds?
The problem with Awakening's epilogue is that it seems counter to the game itself, since Ferelden required Orlesian Wardens to bolster their numbers at the start of the game, all of whom were then killed by the Withered when he assaulted Vigil's Keep after misinterpreting the Architect's orders.
The game itself also seems that recruiting isn't particular high even after the accolades won by the Wardens after the Blight, as only Mhairi wanted to be recruited and we were forced to conscript most of our companions, simply because we needed any Wardens we could find to help us.
The line about the Warden-Commander being elsewhere is if they are still alive post-Origins, that they are on that mission to cure the Calling, somewhere in the West. While I don't know if that involves the entire order going along with them, since it would seem dangerous to leave Ferelden undefended for so long, it could be that the nature of the mission required them to go dark to maintain secrecy? Alternatively, they went dark to hide their presence when they discovered about the false Calling in Orlais, fearing what it could mean?
Indeed, but perhaps by the time the crisis in Amaranthine is dealt with. We can assume the new recruits are mostly from Ferelden. I thought there are npcs mentioned that Ferelden people favor the local fighter or anyone who isn't Orlesian. Nevertheless, it was mentioned in Awakening's epilogue regardless of your decision. I'm not saying that Ferelden chapter is that big, though, but I don't believe it was just dozens of people.
That's also true, since only Mhairi and Oghren wanted to be recruited, and we were forced to conscript the rest. From the beginning the game makes it clear that we simply need to replace what was lost quickly. I guess what happens in the epilogue is contradicted with the main story. I still believe that they have more luck recruiting people into their ranks though.
Wait, you mean the Warden-Commander who's also our Warden? Oh my, I feel dense now. I thought you meant the new Warden-Commander who was put in charge of Ferelden Chapter because the (our) Warden was absent, as he/she never return to the Vigil's Keep, the First Warden put this new commander in charge. I doubt that it involves the entire chapter of Ferelden Wardens, and I even doubt the Warden has anyone accompanying him/her beside our loyal mabari war-hound. It's very dangerous, and you could say downright stupid if the entire chapter leaves Ferelden unguarded. Possibly, the Wardens are known for their secrecy even among themselves, or it could involve the Architect or his Disciples.
Yeah, the real Blackwall was a tad callous to let Ferelden burn, but you're right, what could he do given that the Wardens aren't meant to get involved in politics at all... something that our own dear Warden kept breaking every chance they could get?
And this has been bugging me as well, because the Inquisition, as powerful as it is, simply doesn't have the authority to exile an entire order from a country (or countries), since they don't actually rule anywhere and are just a Non-Governmental Organisation at it's core.
It only makes sense if we assume it was just Orlais, because the country is screwed six ways to sunday with the Civil War? Depending on when you do HLTA, Celene/Gaspard might either be too busy dealing with the war, consolidating power in the aftermath, or too deep in the Inquisition's pocket to speak up against them clearly overstepping their bounds?
I'm not agreeing with his decision either, but I can understand why he did that. I don't even know if the man feels sorry for what he did, but unfortunately it did no good to the order when they involve themselves in politics. The irony is they pretty much let Orlesian monarch leash them instead of risk it all and marching to Ferelden on their own. Either way they're already involve with politics more than they know. Our own dear Warden happens to break this, and ironically he could be the heroic warden who honored his/her own oath like in the old tales. At least our own dear warden didn't try to involve themselves, and take Anderfels's throne for him/herself.
I know, BioWare wants to give us a sense of power and authority, but this is hardly believable and it hardly makes sense. I know the Inquisition act in the name of her holiness, and the Inquisitor can fully embrace the role of the Herald of Andraste, but who grant us the authority to exile an entire ancient order who save the world for many times. They don't have that much of power and authority until the end, after you defeat Corypheus.
Well, I know we can help resolve the Civil War before marching to Adamant, but now that you mention it. Perhaps, it's the reason why they don't say anything when we have to make a big decision that affecting their country. I think you're right on this, but still trying to find a sense that the Inquisition can simply exile the entire order like that is...I guess I should blame the writing on this one.
The whole Warden plots stretches credibility, particularly if you read Last Flight. The Commander back in the Anderfels stops hearing from his entire squad in Orlais and yet doesn't seek to investigate? Just how far can Corypheus affect Wardens if those in Ferelden and Freemarches are involved? If not, then why do the activities of the Orlesian Wardens have a bad affect on the entire order? When the Wardens were chucked out of Ferelden for meddling in politics, did that impact on them elsewhere?
I felt that in view of the influence that Cory could have on any Warden, not just mages, that the wisest course would be to exile them from Orlais but that was never intended to be either permanent or reflect on the order as a whole, although I did feel they should review their no holds barred approach to blood magic and other suspect means of combating the Blight. Yet we have the option to say, "Let's capitalise on this" and we are then allowed a war table mission that basically allows us to rubbish the Wardens throughout Thedas and everyone seems to suddenly agree with us. This is not after 400 years of relative peace from darkspawn but only 10 years after Ferelden, plus darkspawn do still erupt from time to time.
The decision between Hawke and whatever Warden is applicable did seem like the obligatory, who shall we sacrifice plot. It would have been a harder decision if the choice had been between Hawke and your own Warden but I failed to see why Stroud was the only person who could possibly rebuild the order, even in Orlais, had no real emotional connection to him and reckoned he must only be a short way off his true Calling anyway. Thedas needs some honest to goodness real heroes and since that is what my Hawkes are, Stroud is left in the Fade. After all, bottom line is that Corypheus was the Warden's responsibility; they imprisoned him in the first place, didn't keep a proper watch over the place and then blackmailed Hawke's father into getting involved, which ultimately led to Hawke being sucked in.
Wait, you mean the Warden-Commander who's also our Warden? Oh my, I feel dense now. I thought you meant the new Warden-Commander who was put in charge of Ferelden Chapter because the (our) Warden was absent, as he/she never return to the Vigil's Keep, the First Warden put this new commander in charge. I doubt that it involves the entire chapter of Ferelden Wardens, and I even doubt the Warden has anyone accompanying him/her beside our loyal mabari war-hound. It's very dangerous, and you could say downright stupid if the entire chapter leaves Ferelden unguarded. Possibly, the Wardens are known for their secrecy even among themselves, or it could involve the Architect or his Disciples.
According to Loghain, the HoF is still Warden-Commander as of Inquisition if alive. I'm not sure if Stroud or Alistair mention it, since I've yet to do a playthrough with them as the Warden-Ally, but Loghain definitely confirms that the HoF is still the head honcho over in Ferelden.
Of course, this makes it a little hard to figure out if you had a male Warden who went with Morrigan through the Eluvian, yet still somehow remained in charge of the Wardens? I suppose they could have been relaying orders via letters or commuting back and forth, which is probably how Duncan lead when he was in charge, since we never get any impression that aside from a station in Denerim, they had much in the way of headquarters before the Warden reclaimed Soldier's Peak and was granted Vigil's Keep to use as a base?
The Architect or something involving the Awakened Darkspawn would probably be my bet as well, because I doubt that they'd want it known that they might have made a deal with another creature like Corypheus? I bet that any Wardens from our crowd in Awakening would be panicking at the realisation that the Architect might have been one of the Seven Magisters and first Darkspawn, fearing that they might have been unwitting pawns in some way or worrying that if they killed him, he might have body-surfed like Corypheus?
After what happened in Adamant, I doubt the Fereldan Wardens that level of scrutiny headed in their direction about some of the questionable things their leader might have done over the years. Especially because if you do an OGB import, as this means that the Inquisitor is one of the few people aware that the HoF agreed to preserve the soul of the Archdemon in order to cheat death, a damning piece of blackmail that the Renegade Inquisitor is probably not going to forget or let go to waste?
"Stroud/Alistair/Loghain, you're the only remaining Warden of any significant rank. What should we do now?"
So wait, wait, wait a second. The higher ranking Wardens in Southern Thedas are all dead then? At least some of teh Awakening party, like Nathaniel, have no doubt moved up in rank by now, and they're definitely well respected Wardens from their actions in Amaranthine.
So are they all dead?
I MUST KNOW
Although I also would like to know where they are this game takes place in Orlais which is pretty far from Amaranthine and any of the Ferelden Wardens.
"Stroud/Alistair/Loghain, you're the only remaining Warden of any significant rank. What should we do now?"
So wait, wait, wait a second. The higher ranking Wardens in Southern Thedas are all dead then? At least some of teh Awakening party, like Nathaniel, have no doubt moved up in rank by now, and they're definitely well respected Wardens from their actions in Amaranthine.
So are they all dead?
I MUST KNOW
I doubt there will be an appearance from the Awakening Wardens because Sigrun and Velanna didn't even get a slide in the Keep! 
(Seriously, I find it doubtful that the fate of the Ostagar deserter is more important to the world then the only female dwarven companion in the series!)
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