45 réponses à ce sujet

[Neon Rising Winter]

Anora struck me as a pragmatic woman. Let's assume we have an Anora married to a Cousland warden. Widow of the previous king, daughter of a now controversial figure whose family were only recently elevated to nobility, currently married to a renowned hero of an established house. She wishes to establish her authority to rule. What are her options:

 

1. Therin. Gives her the continuity of rule argument, family has an excellent recent history, and no major controversy to contend with. Looks promising.

2. Mac Tir. Doesn't bring much to the table. You've got the war hero line, but that's all. No family history to fall back on, nothing in their past to give them a right to rule. Then add on this is now a controversial name associated with someone considered by many to be a traitor. It'd be inviting continual challenge. Definite reject.

3 Cousland. Good established name, excellent recent history. Very workable.

 

So Therin or Cousland. The downside with Cousland is it does imply claiming the right to rule through the Cousland side of the marriage. Now I think the Cousland name has enough power to do this, but from Anora's point of view what's the upside to that? She's got the Therin name to give her power in her own right, why concede that for one that would invest equal authority in her husband?

 

As for what's custom. Within reasonable limits, custom is what happens to the little people. She's not little people.

[Andraste Take the Wheel]

Why would Anora take the Warden's name? They're Prince Consort, not King. The Warden is below her.

[BobZilla84]

Well the Warden is a Noble by blood the Couslands are 1 of the 2 most powerful families in Ferelden after the 5th Blight the other being the Guerrins and in Ferelden Bloodlines seem really important to the Nobles and as much as I love Anora she is a Commoner the Mac Tir Line is not as respected as The Cousland Line is.

And after the 5th Blight the Hero of Ferelden can potentally be the most powerful individual in Ferelden I mean my own turned out as.
1.Prince/King Consort
2.Teryn of Gwaren
3.Warden Commander of Ferelden
4.Arl of Amaranthine
And add the fact Fergus is the only other Teryn in Ferelden the Couslands are a the most powerful Family in Ferelden after the 5th Blight.

Thats why I loved my Warden marrying Anora she had no damn idea how influential he was going to be as I mentioned above he was vastly more powerful and influental than Anora and I think her being as savvy as she is she would figure out that taking the Cousland name would help solidify her position.

[Eliastion]

Well the Warden is a Noble by blood the Couslands are 1 of the 2 most powerful families in Ferelden after the 5th Blight the other being the Guerrins and in Ferelden Bloodlines seem really important to the Nobles and as much as I love Anora she is a Commoner the Mac Tir Line is not as respected as The Cousland Line is.

And after the 5th Blight the Hero of Ferelden can potentally be the most powerful individual in Ferelden I mean my own turned out as.
1.Prince/King Consort
2.Teryn of Gwaren
3.Warden Commander of Ferelden
4.Arl of Amaranthine
And add the fact Fergus is the only other Teryn in Ferelden the Couslands are a the most powerful Family in Ferelden after the 5th Blight.

Thats why I loved my Warden marrying Anora she had no damn idea how influential he was going to be as I mentioned above he was vastly more powerful and influental than Anora and I think her being as savvy as she is she would figure out that taking the Cousland name would help solidify her position.

Everything you just wrote only proves that taking the name Cousland would threaten her position as the sole ruler of Ferelden. She was NOT going to give her power away to her husband. Taking his name, ESPECIALLY if he managed to accumulate so much power, would pretty much mean surrendering her crown to him. That's not gonna happen. 

[BobZilla84]

Everything you just wrote only proves that taking the name Cousland would threaten her position as the sole ruler of Ferelden. She was NOT going to give her power away to her husband. Taking his name, ESPECIALLY if he managed to accumulate so much power, would pretty much mean surrendering her crown to him. That's not gonna happen.

True Enough but in the end it doesnt matter because in a way she already has done the one thing she didnt want to do she finally got out of Cailans Shadow only to be swallowed by the Hero of Fereldens.

[Neon Rising Winter]

True Enough but in the end it doesnt matter because in a way she already has done the one thing she didnt want to do she finally got out of Cailans Shadow only to be swallowed by the Hero of Fereldens.

 

Hrmm, point. That's not a bad argument that she could use the Cousland name to give herself more power, simply because it then gives her a popular figurehead to fly the flag for her decisions. What, you wish to object to the new window tax? But your Hero says it is a necessary and worthwhile sacrifice that must be made for the good of our country. Push the Hero into the limelight as a bulletproof target for both the praise and vitriol generated by any decisions. That's leeway she wouldn't have if everyone was looking at the throne and just seeing her.

[Cobwebmaster]

Something is bugging me off, while Anora codex says her suname is Mac Tir, all her letters to the Inquisition are signed as Anora Theirin, even if she is Married to the Warden, somene know why? Is it a overlook or there is another explanation?

Isn't it true that she was the wife of Good KIng Cailan, Alstair's half brother. Under our conventions in the UK she is still entitled to use his name. In terms of politicking it doesn't hurt to remind everyone that she was the chosen wife of the Theirin clan in the first place. Besides, the Couslands got well and truly shafted in Awakening when the Wardens got given a huge chunk of their estates (Arl Howe was a vassal of the Couslands). Had I been Fergus I would not have been a happy bunny at all.

Whatever, The key is what (if any) names are given to  offspring which there must be else Ferelden descends into civil war AGAIN

[Br3admax]

Fergus is the one who gave Amaranthine away in the first place. 

 

As for this last name business, Anora married into House Therin, making her Therin. And I doubt she can become a member of House Cousland regardless. The Hero of Ferelden cannot legally inherit any titles as a Grey Warden. 

[Ashelsu]

Queen Cousland also keeps her family name when marrying Alistair, and she is inferior to him in the hierarchy. I think it was made so just for convenience (resources, less fuss with name changes), even if it sucks for Cousland players.

[BobZilla84]

Hrmm, point. That's not a bad argument that she could use the Cousland name to give herself more power, simply because it then gives her a popular figurehead to fly the flag for her decisions. What, you wish to object to the new window tax? But your Hero says it is a necessary and worthwhile sacrifice that must be made for the good of our country. Push the Hero into the limelight as a bulletproof target for both the praise and vitriol generated by any decisions. That's leeway she wouldn't have if everyone was looking at the throne and just seeing her.

I think the entire thing about her name is irrelevant in the end she can keep the Theiren name or use Mac Tir in the end her marriage to the Hero of Ferelden gives her legimaticy and a stronger hold on her throne I mean name or not shes married into one of the most respected and powerful families in Ferelden.
In Awakening I got the impression Anora & my Warden were a happy married couple she didnt want him to leave court and she welcomed him back with a smile I was happy they did that.

Slighty off topic:
After Inquisition showed the opinion of marriage that the Nobility have I am not feeling as guilty about keeping Leliana as my Mistress or my threesome with Leliana & Isabella.

[riverbanks]

Whatever, The key is what (if any) names are given to  offspring which there must be else Ferelden descends into civil war AGAIN

 

The way they insist that Alistair/Anora, Alistair/Cousland or Anora/Cousland still haven't been able to produce an heir ten years into their marriage, it looks like they fully intend to wipe away any ramifications of this storyline, one way or another. At the turn of the next generation, both the Theirin and the Mac Tir lines will be spent, and the next monarch of Ferelden will be elected by the Landsmeet.

 

It doesn't have to be civil war again, though. Fergus and Teagan are the ones with the most claim to the throne, and they're both reasonable enough men that they could probably settle the matter without sending the whole country into yet another war.

[Eliastion]

Fergus is the one who gave Amaranthine away in the first place. 

 

As for this last name business, Anora married into House Therin, making her Therin. And I doubt she can become a member of House Cousland regardless. The Hero of Ferelden cannot legally inherit any titles as a Grey Warden. 

This could be it, but I think that while being a Gray Warden should generally end your claim for famili titles, it in reality only weakens it somewhat and it indeed has more to do with wardens' code and non-involvement policy (and breaking this policy has historically led to disastrous consequences, including wardens being kicked out of Ferelden...)

After all, Alistair retains his claim for the throne and wardens can be given noble titles. It's not as bad as being a mage or joining Ash Warriors.

[Br3admax]

The difference being Alistair isn't a Grey Warden still. 

[MimiTheFirst]

It could be that Anora signs her name "Cousland" or "Theirin" in letters to remind others of her monarch status...but in private, she considers herself "Mac Tir". So the codex refers to her as such.

[BobZilla84]

The difference being Alistair isn't a Grey Warden still.

Based on what Biowares cannon because if you are baseing it that your statement is really onesided considering not everyone made Alistair King.
And also someone mentioned Grey Wardens not having titles wouldnt that apply to Alistair as well you cant refuse a Cousland Titles/Positions of Power and allow Alistair to have them.
Thats why I hate when Game Companies put Cannon in Choice driven games leave that crap out plz.

[ShadowLordXII]

If Anora marries a male Cousland that does not mean Alistair is executed, if that's what you mean. He's more likely to be drunk in The Hanged Man.

 

And as for the last name business, well, a male Warden can just, you know, get over it, and I guess have to live with being King-Consort.

 

A King-Consort who basically has more love, respect, connections and power than the Ruling Queen.

 

But I digress.

[Br3admax]

Based on what Biowares cannon because if you are baseing it that your statement is really onesided considering not everyone made Alistair King.

 

I'm sorry, how is this relevant. We're talking about King Alistair here. Alistair isn't a member of House Therin until he is made king, unlike the Warden who was born into their family. The Warden continuing to use their legal name is one thing, compared to another. That said, Prince-Consort Cousland is a still a Warden, unlike King Alistair who leaves the Wardens, per Loghain's words. 

And also someone mentioned Grey Wardens not having titles wouldnt that apply to Alistair as well you cant refuse a Cousland Titles/Positions of Power and allow Alistair to have them.
Thats why I hate when Game Companies put Cannon in Choice driven games leave that crap out plz.

 

What is this supposed to mean. I really don't understand it. 

[ShadowLordXII]

 

What is this supposed to mean. I really don't understand it. 

 

 

Meaning: It's annoying when developers create a game where a player is given the option to make different heavy choices only to have later games invalidate that choice or make it ultimately worthless. Especially note-worthy in a sweeping epic where choice and consequence is the keystone of the whole experience.

 

For example, Anora's role is completely identical to Alistair's without anything extra to set it apart or to make picking her as queen (solo or with King Cousland) seem satisfying in the long-run. She gets the same "hi-bye" scene that Alistair gets and if they're married then they'll share the "hi-bye" scene, but otherwise, nothing of importance.

 

We don't even get a scene where we see what happens to Anora if she wasn't made ruling queen at the Landsmeet. I was looking forward to seeing if she inherited her father's lands or perhaps became an accomplice of the Elder One to take back what she sees as her rightful throne or maybe she came to terms with the Landsmeet's decision and has put the whole Civil War mess behind her.

 

Why? Because BW doesn't appear to care about putting equal stake or measure into choices or variables that stray too far from BW's own Canon (despite stating that they're not forcing their canon on the players).

 

A few more examples:

 

Warden doesn't die? He's sent off-screen on another adventure.

 

Did the Dark Ritual? OG Soul is removed from Kieran and rendered moot.

 

Made your Hawke a Blood Mage? Silly Player! Hawke hates all Blood Magic now. (Despite potentially hitching with a blood mage elf and knowing full well that any type of magic can be just as evilly used if the mage is crazy enough)

 

Killed Leliana? Too bad, she had a phoenix down in her pocket. (Or however else she survived)

[BobZilla84]

A King-Consort who basically has more love, respect, connections and power than the Ruling Queen.
 
But I digress.

My thoughts exactly King-Consort Cousland essentially dwarfs Anora in every aspect she is going to be Queen just as she wants but she will be in her King-Consorts Shadow and thats funny to me that a cautious,shrewd woman like her thinks she can control her new husband like her previous one not gonna happen.

I'm sorry, how is this relevant. We're talking about King Alistair here. Alistair isn't a member of House Therin until he is made king, unlike the Warden who was born into their family. The Warden continuing to use their legal name is one thing, compared to another. That said, Prince-Consort Cousland is a still a Warden, unlike King Alistair who leaves the Wardens, per Loghain's words. 

What is this supposed to mean. I really don't understand it.

Overall my point was B-Ware establishing Cannon in a players choice driven game sucks.And Alistair isn't a Warden anymore to fit the B-Ware Cannon and their ideal outcome for their story but thats were they lose me my King-Consort Cousland left The Wardens as well after Witch Hunt in fact he returned to Denerim after saying good bye to his Old God Baby Mama Morrigan.

[Eliastion]

My thoughts exactly King-Consort Cousland essentially dwarfs Anora in every aspect she is going to be Queen just as she wants but she will be in her King-Consorts Shadow and thats funny to me that a cautious,shrewd woman like her thinks she can control her new husband like her previous one not gonna happen.

She doesn't have to. She has the power, she just needs to avoid being controlled by him. Unless he tries to depose her (which might not be easy regardless of whatever you think) all decision-making power (at least where it comes to state affairs) rests with her.

Controlling her husband would be redundant.

[Br3admax]

Overall my point was B-Ware establishing Cannon in a players choice driven game sucks.And Alistair isn't a Warden anymore to fit the B-Ware Cannon and their ideal outcome for their story but thats were they lose me my King-Consort Cousland left The Wardens as well after Witch Hunt in fact he returned to Denerim after saying good bye to his Old God Baby Mama Morrigan.

The Warden is never given the option to officially leave the Wardens. Epilogues only hint they never went back to Amaranthine, and it's not like epilogues have ever been 100% anyway.