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[CosmicGnosis]

I'm rather disturbed about what I've been reading about the templar path versus the mage path. It almost sounds like the mage path, despite actually showing the doomed future, provides you with an inferior understanding of Corypheus and his larger plans. And Calpernia is apparently a more compelling character than Samson, and even provides insight into Corypheus and his motivations. If this is all true, then my canon revolutionary mage will have to side with the templars just to get the full story, and I hate that. Why can't both sides provide you with the same information, and simply change the context of how you learn it? By the way some people describe it, the mage path is objectively worse and keeps you ignorant of some very important details.

 

But I really enjoyed the mage path. It felt great to finally get somewhere with mage liberation, the time travel scenario was cool, I liked Alexius, and Dorian was directly involved. And Fiona is an important lore character, who is simply killed and discarded on the templar path. 

 

This is an extremely frustrating conflict for me. Must I sacrifice my canon mage's natural inclinations in order to get a better story? 

[AlleluiaElizabeth]

I don't think you have to sacrifice RP. I chose mages first time through.

 

Calpernia may be more compelling than Samson (not sure as I haven't seen her, yet) and I hear the Temple of Dumat thing is pretty cool, but Samson has ties to Kirkwall and Cullen and you get time travel on the mage path so... yeah. Its really about what you like when it comes to decided which is a better story and I can't help you there. I just know I understood Corypheus' motivation just fine on the mage path. He wanted to "fix" the world to be how he felt it should be (aka Tevinter on top) and would supplant the gods who had gone silent on him.

[thesuperdarkone2]

My recommendation is to just stick with the mages. If you only go by what people on the forum say and you really don't agree with the templars, you are going to be massively disappointed. Having played both sides, I have to say the mage ending makes more sense from an RP playthrough. Siding with the mages means that you immediately deal with a hostile foreign power on your doorstep that you know if mobilizing for war and is trying to use a new form of magic to undue your victory. That by itself seems like a more pressing threat than trying to get templars and hoping that not all of them are douchebags like Lucius. Also, the story bits on Corypheus you get arent' really some earthshattering pieces of information that reveal some amazing stuff so you won't miss much by not getting them. Also, how revolutionary are you? Siding with the mages has the potential to result in mages finally getting their freedom and getting widespread acceptance throughout Thedas. If you really care about mages, are a few story bits that really aren't that important in the long run worth sacrificing the mages to enslavement, brainwashing, and death? If you are only siding with the templars due to metagaming which results in you doing something that radically goes against what your character wants, don't do it. The stuff you get if siding with the templars isn't really all that great in the long run. All it does is affect who attacks Haven, who the Nemesis quest is for, and who you fight in What Pride has Wrought. Don't forget how plenty of people believe that the mage mission is far superior to the templar one. If you go outside BSN, you'll see that more people prefer the mage mission to the templar one.

[d-boy15]

Well, I think if you already play Mage especially the revolutionary one. It make much more sense with "In hushed whisper" path.

 

But the thing is you don't need to choose. Reload to decision point if you don't like what you choose, create a new character to go with Templar path.

Also, peoples seem to exaggerate a bit on Calpernia path. It's not really an important detail and "better story" is depend on how your role-play. If it is

conflict with you own preference why go for it? 

[xBloodWardenx]

I agree that Samson definitely is not as interesting and you don't get to go to the temple of Dumat, which I thought was a great side mission, you still get a look into what Corypheus plans to do to the world. Watching what Leliana went through was also heartbreaking. And if you are talking about RP in terms of what your character knows about the Seekers and the Templars, nothing really changes. Lord Seeker Lucius was really a bad guy, even without the Envy demon and a large number of Templars still followed his orders without the red lyrium exposure. Cassandra still learns about the Right of Tranquility I think there is even less confusion for her without knowing about the Envy demon. 

[Siha]

I personally prefer the Templar path, for different reasons, but I do not believe you actually make sacrifices. It is interesting to see both but you also get along well if only picking the same path forever. You do get the basic idea from both: (1) Corypheus manipulates people and uses them by all means necessary to advance his approach to godhood, (2) people will follow him because he offers them an "easy" solution to their respective dilemmas (and even these motivations are basically the same; both groups are stripped of freedom/power and do not feel they receive the respect and appreciation they deserve). The mage path shows you the future of red lyrium, the Templar path shows you a bit of its recent past.

 

I could go on about how the mages can actually benefit from the inquisitor going the Templar path, but that is (fortunately) not the topic of this thread. I only want to point out that nothing is black and white and every path allows to roleplay it with support for either fraction in mind.

[CosmicGnosis]

My first playthrough (with the mage character) ended with Leliana as Divine. I was pleased with this outcome, although I think it strains credibility that southern Thedas is so tolerant of the mages ruling themselves with a softened Leliana. I'm also not completely against templars. I just wish that they would act more as allies and less as impersonal, suspicious "protectors". Thus, I wonder if Cassandra would be a better Divine? The situation in Tevinter is certainly something to consider; mages can indeed be evil and tyrannical. I've yet to decide on which Divine I want to commit to.

[thesuperdarkone2]

My first playthrough (with the mage character) ended with Leliana as Divine. I was pleased with this outcome, although I think it strains credibility that southern Thedas is so tolerant of the mages ruling themselves with a softened Leliana. I'm also not completely against templars. I just wish that they would act more as allies and less as impersonal, suspicious "protectors". Thus, I wonder if Cassandra would be a better Divine? The situation in Tevinter is certainly something to consider; mages can indeed be evil and tyrannical. I've yet to decide on which Divine I want to commit to.

If you side with the mages, Cass isn't that good considering her endings either result in an open mage civil war or a shadow civil war.

[Korva]

The templar path presents its own "go with what I want to do or with what the game seems to want me to do" dilemma for many people, because the initial setup for both missions is so uneven. While the situation with the templars is one huge mystery, you get to meet various people from the mage mission and learn WTF is going on there before you lock into either mission. With Redcliffe being so close to Haven, this results in a threat that feels much more urgent and personal -- and, for me, the feeling that the game really wanted me to go for the mages. That was extremely irritating.

 

At any rate, while I did enjoy the Temple of Dumat, I found Calpernia a lot less interesting than I'd hoped she would be. Just go with what you think suits your character. It's not like either mission hides game-changing secrets. The entire main story of the game and its villain are, unfortunately, too thin for that.

[Cobwebmaster]

So far I have only taken the Templar path. My reasoning? While not particularly sympathetic to Cassandra's brutal idea of  putting Thedas to rights, I am alert to the need that Thedas has for a solution to "wizardry excesses". The mages do need to be policed to guard against the return of Tevinterism and slavery, and of course too much messing about with things they have little understanding of. Even though the current police force is largely a bunch of drug dependant thugs ostensibly working for religious fanatics, something needs to be in place to counter the potential mage threat whether fromwithout or within a circle. How you go about achieving that without reverting to the "Stalag" concept of Templar governed mage towers I don't know, but as taking the Templar path in my game (Knight Enchanter)resulted in  Vivienne becoming the Divine, I thought it got off to a good start. Personally I couldn't see either Leliana's assassin or Cassandra's butcher characters as being "right" for the job. Mother Gisselle on the other hand is much more pastoral for my taste

Either way, I agree with Korva's closing comments, and would have appreciated one or maybe 2 less mini world's to grind through in favour of a greater depth to the main story, Calpernia and the villain of the piece

[Cobwebmaster]

The issue about the Tevinter threat and presence in Ferelden is a serious one, but initially I would have thought one for the monarch of Ferelden, his Teyrns, Arls and Banns to deal with. In my DOA game I save the circle tower and First Enchanter Irvine, so that is a nearby resource, but the Dalish clans would be potential allies in that fight too. 

As has been said a difficult choice either way, but the idiocy of the grand Enchanter, gave me the gut reaction of leaving her and her followers to the Tevinters, while I got on with building a defence against the dark arts

[Ieldra]

OP, I can empathize. I'm having the same problem. I would really like to have Calpernia and her story in my main Inquisitor's story, but it is impossible to side with the templars with her. However, I imagine that Calpernia and Corypheus' motivations as presented in Under Her Skin still exist if you ally with the mages. Calpernia just never becomes prominent and never becomes the "vessel", and these things stay offscreen. I just pretend I come to know those parts which don't depend on Calpernia being the Venatori leader or the vessel anyway.

 

I have to contend with seeing all this with a different Inquisitor. If my main Inquisitor sided with the templars, that would damage her character - and thus her story - much more than the absence of Calpernia and her quest. 

[d-boy15]

My first playthrough (with the mage character) ended with Leliana as Divine. I was pleased with this outcome, although I think it strains credibility that southern Thedas is so tolerant of the mages ruling themselves with a softened Leliana. I'm also not completely against templars. I just wish that they would act more as allies and less as impersonal, suspicious "protectors". Thus, I wonder if Cassandra would be a better Divine? The situation in Tevinter is certainly something to consider; mages can indeed be evil and tyrannical. I've yet to decide on which Divine I want to commit to.

 

It depend on how much freedom do you want for mages.

 

Leliana give an absolute freedom for mages, they are now decide their own future. Cassandra allow mages to govern themselves in Circle.

Re-purpose Templar in to Thedas protector. So, for me. Cassandra more "safer" choice than Leliana but pay-off less if you want mages freedom.

 

Anyway, no divine better than other. It's entirely on your ideal for new Southern Thedas. 

[Korva]

If my main Inquisitor sided with the templars, that would damage her character - and thus her story - much more than the absence of Calpernia and her quest. 

 

Staying true to your character always beats a miniscule amount of extra information that doesn't have the slightest impact on the main story or its villain, yes. I had the same issue in reverse since my canon Inquisitor was always meant to recruit the templars despite feeling the game pushed me towards the mages.

 

If it makes sense that your character would do the mage (or templar) mission, and you like the mage (or templar) mission, then that's all that really matters.

[Lukas Trevelyan]

Well I've always sided with Templars, but for different reasons. My story simply makes more sense if my Inquisitor sided with the Templars, both my main playthroughs do. The first one is a pro-circle/law mage who found that restoring the templar order to be a crucial task. The other one is a pro-circle/law warrior who has always admired the templars (his cousins) and wanted to become one, so siding with the templars was quite natural.
 

As much as I actually really like In Hushed Whispers, because I love the whole time travel and meet your doomed companions thing, plus I wanted to learn more about Samson, but I just couldn't..

If you really wanna experience that story, you can always just plan and roleplay a different character, and play the game from a different perspective *shrugs*

[Andraste_Reborn]

Having done both, I think both stories have their merits and are equally worth playing.

 

I personally liked the mage mission more - Dorian! Time travel! - but the Templar mission lets you hang out with Ser Barris and keep him alive. Calpernia may be a more interesting character than Samson, but I thought Cullen's reactions to Samson made up the deficit. (And I love the results of his nemesis mission.)  You learn a little more about Corypheus on the Templar side, but you don't get to interact with Fiona or Alexius. (Which in turn makes Dorian's story less fleshed-out.)

 

If your canon character is pro-mage, side with them. Which path makes the better story is a matter of opinion.

[Carmen_Willow]

I've done both, and they are both interesting paths. Game play is tougher if you side with the mages. Many more Red Templars to deal with.

 

If you don't meta game, your choices come down to the following:

 

1. Which group is most likely to help you seal the breach in the safest manner possible?

2. Which group is most likely not to be "indoctrinated" by an opposing force?

3. Which group is best able to help you win the entire war against your enemy (not just one battle)?

4. Which group do you feel is least likely to betray your or have 5th column agents in its ranks?

5. Which group do you think will be least harmful politically at some future date?

6. Which group left behind as an enemy is the one easiest to defeat once the breach is closed?

 

Another question that comes into your decision is this.

 

1. Which of your advisors' opinions do you most trust?  Do you think Cullen is correct or Leliana on this issue?

 

Depending on the character I am playing my answers are different. If I am the child of a noble family, raised in the art of politics and war, my answers will be different from my mage who spent most of his/her life in a Circle and was a part of the rebellion. My hard-headed dwarf, battle hardened by years in the Carta will reach a different decision from my Dalish hunter who trusts few of the humans around him/her. Neither answer is "better" if you don't meta game. If you make your decision based on what your character knows and who your character is AT THE TIME,  your answers might be very different.

[Addai]

Calpernia's quests are interesting, but it's not worth it to go against what you think your character would do in that situation. In Hushed Whispers is also a better quest, IMO. Roll another PC to do the other side.

[CosmicGnosis]

However, I imagine that Calpernia and Corypheus' motivations as presented in Under Her Skin still exist if you ally with the mages. Calpernia just never becomes prominent and never becomes the "vessel", and these things stay offscreen.

I'm also bothered that we don't know anything about Calpernia if we save the mages, or Samson if we save the templars. Where do these characters go if you save their respective factions? Is Calpernia better off if you save the mages? I would like to know what she's doing if the southern mages joined the Inquisition.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

my canon revolutionary mage

 

You're drinking that kool-aid, Cosmic? Say it ain't so. =[

[Steelcan]

I'm also bothered that we don't know anything about Calpernia if we save the mages, or Samson if we save the templars. Where do these characters go if you save their respective factions? Is Calpernia better off if you save the mages? I would like to know what she's doing if the southern mages joined the Inquisition.

If you don't kill her, you can convince her to betray Corpypheus and she goes to confront him, she says that if she survives she will return to Tevinter to try and shape it to a brighter future

[CosmicGnosis]

You're drinking that kool-aid, Cosmic? Say it ain't so. =[

Hey, he doesn't agree with the pre-Inquisition order of things. He would prefer to see the templars as allies, but the Chantry drugs and controls them, turning them into questionable "protectors". And I'm not even sure if I agree with total mage liberation. There is a reason why magic is feared.

[The Hierophant]

Try both story paths and see what narrative you prefer. If you don't want to make a new character for the Templar narrative make sure that you keep a file before choosing Hushed Whispers, and Champions of The Just so that you'd be spared from playing the prologue again.

[teh DRUMPf!!]

Hey, he doesn't agree with the pre-Inquisition order of things. He would prefer to see the templars as allies, but the Chantry drugs and controls them, turning them into questionable "protectors"

 

Then consider a run where you ally with the Templars as a (human) Circle mage.

 

Also, help Cullen kick the habit.

[CosmicGnosis]

Then consider a run where you ally with the Templars as a (human) Circle mage.

 

Also, help Cullen kick the habit.

I intend to make that character eventually. 

 

So what are your story preferences?