130 réponses à ce sujet

[Felya87]

I think it's a leprechaun in English. Or better yet a gnome.

 

uhm...i don't know...Gnome is translated with Gnomo...maybe leprechaun is the right term, but I'm not sure...

[Maconbar]

I think it's a leprechaun in English. Or better yet a gnome.

or a brownie?

[HuldraDancer]

I really want the option to have elf ears like this I know not a lot of people like them (think I've heard them referred to as donkey ears before) but I dig them and would really enjoy an option to get my elf's ears more like this in a future game.

[tmp7704]

I don't get it. We have an idea of what elves and dwarves look like as they have a common appearance across different forms of media and thousands of stories, why make something weird and random and call it an elf?

We have an idea how Batman looks and behaves formed over decades of comics, why then make movies with Batman reimagined in both appearance (costume) and behavior? And even more shockingly, why then people flock to see them?

Why do albino animals attract so much more attention than the thousands of their regular looking brethren?

The simple answer is, we get bored easily of seeing exactly the same over and over and over. It's why we keep trying new things. "X that isn't like X everywhere else" can make the story appear different from the others, and so extra interesting.

edit: also, breaking a trope can be more interesting than just replacing it with something completely different. If you have only stories about good, wise kings, then a story about evil, dumb king can feel deeper and more interesting than a story about evil, dumb CEO... because not only it presents a story, but it's a story that challenges our expectations.

[Felya87]

We have an idea how Batman looks and behaves formed over decades of comics, why then make movies with Batman reimagined in both appearance (costume) and behavior? And even more shockingly, why then people flock to see them?

Why do albino animals attract so much more attention than the thousands of their regular looking brethren?

The simple answer is, we get bored easily of seeing exactly the same over and over and over. It's why we keep trying new things. "X that isn't like X everywhere else" can make the story appear different from the others, and so extra interesting.

edit: also, breaking a trope can be more interesting than just replacing it with something completely different. If you have only stories about good, wise kings, then a story about evil, dumb king can feel deeper and more interesting than a story about evil, dumb CEO... because not only it presents a story, but it's a story that challenges our expectations.

 

Batman may have a different style, but he always have the same bat-symbolism, the same story, he is in the same town, have the same butler, he is the same millionaire. You can change tone of the story, and style of car, but he is always Batman.

If let's say, to break the trope, the bat symbolism is taken away. What you have? not Batman. Same if you take away any of the classic things about his story.

 

DA elves already break the trope with their culture and lives: they are not the ethereal, immortal, magical, in contact and communion with the nature elves the usual trope ask. They are a disgraced, mortal, enslaved, mistreated race. They have only some distant piece of past lore that have something in common with the usual elf trope. Take away from them even the beauty (or at least attractiveness) and what have you of elven left?

[The Antagonist]

DA2 had a better elf design; the main elves looked especially good.

[rene211285]

They are not ugly! They represent alien beauty. They are not supposed to look like mannish races. They are first and foremost 'Mer' and they do not enjoy being called 'elves'. If they are ugly to some then well, nobody said that 'elves' must be pretty.

 

hm not much difference....

[rene211285]

like this pic that somebody posted in the DA2 thread

thats really hitting the spot.only blue colour is missing  

 

I don't get it. We have an idea of what elves and dwarves look like as they have a common appearance across different forms of media and thousands of stories, why make something weird and random and call it an elf? Why not just make up your own races and be as creative as possible? I thought all the races in Mass Effect were great and looked well designed (rather than blatantly ripping off Avatar which was very popular at the time and calling yourself original).

Thats a good point. i didnt get it why there must be much differences as possible???  in humanity there are asian, african, european...which are not much differences in appearance. (and that is what is called "race"). so the elven have another body and their ears. Isn´t that enough? Instead of their nose and head they better should have another skin tones like in the ArtCard...Give them green, blue, dark,...skin-tones like the qunari have...

 

And yeah they could have be more creative...  The only race were the Qunari what is "new".  By the way, i would have ignored the fact that Sten had no horns in DAO because of the later improvement/evolution... That there are Qunari born without horns make them like bigger humans, because only the horns makes the real difference, make them special. so the tal vashoth cut down their horns because even amongst the qunari a hornless qunari is special...i think thats unlogical. It would make more sense opposite. (Qunari with no horns are NOT a real Qunari and were treated like a failure like the Tal Vashoth.) So also the Tal Vashoth like to be a special Qunari and will not be a Qunari at the same time and like to "define?" they want to be other like the Qunari...make not really that much sense

[februarywar]

elves should look like Orlando Bloom and Liv Tyler

.

[Nefla]

We have an idea how Batman looks and behaves formed over decades of comics, why then make movies with Batman reimagined in both appearance (costume) and behavior? And even more shockingly, why then people flock to see them?

Why do albino animals attract so much more attention than the thousands of their regular looking brethren?

The simple answer is, we get bored easily of seeing exactly the same over and over and over. It's why we keep trying new things. "X that isn't like X everywhere else" can make the story appear different from the others, and so extra interesting.

edit: also, breaking a trope can be more interesting than just replacing it with something completely different. If you have only stories about good, wise kings, then a story about evil, dumb king can feel deeper and more interesting than a story about evil, dumb CEO... because not only it presents a story, but it's a story that challenges our expectations.

Then why not go all out and make something completely different? Why keep the name of something we have a certain image of in our minds? Most importantly though, why completely change the established look from the traditional expected look in DA:O to a Na'vi ripoff in DA2 (at least come up with your own design BW)? "Breaking a trope" isn't about randomly making something look weird. DA:O took the typical fantasy races and mixed them up culturally, making them different and interesting. I guess that was lost on a lot of people since so many whined about "humans with pointy ears" and ignored the cultural changes. In DA2 and DA:I those interesting cultural differences were just glossed over and ignored, being mentioned occasionally in passing at best. But hey you got your freaky looking elves...with nothing unique about them aside from their appearance (if you can call blatantly copying Avatar unique...).

[Meave]

I really want the option to have elf ears like this I know not a lot of people like them (think I've heard them referred to as donkey ears before) but I dig them and would really enjoy an option to get my elf's ears more like this in a future game.

 

ears such as massive and large as this serve no purpose and are physically impossible unless you would have some extra bone holding them (as Dr. Sheldon C. said Oh gravity you heartless bi...). That would mean no typical helmets for them but that's fine. What would be common is broken ear. You get into a fight and bam even if you evade being hit in the face you would still get your ear bone broken. And majority of elves would miss some parts of their ears due to various injuries. And that makes me wonder how much blood would an elf loose if someone cut his ears off and if it could be fatal

[Gileadan]

Then why not go all out and make something completely different? Why keep the name of something we have a certain image of in our minds? Most importantly though, why completely change the established look from the traditional expected look in DA:O to a Na'vi ripoff in DA2 (at least come up with your own design BW)? "Breaking a trope" isn't about randomly making something look weird. DA:O took the typical fantasy races and mixed them up culturally, making them different and interesting. I guess that was lost on a lot of people since so many whined about "humans with pointy ears" and ignored the cultural changes. In DA2 and DA:I those interesting cultural differences were just glossed over and ignored, being mentioned occasionally in passing at best. But hey you got your freaky looking elves...with nothing unique about them aside from their appearance (if you can call blatantly copying Avatar unique...).

Oh, I know! Make some fat, hairless, hippo-like werecreatures and call them werewolves... just to make sure no one complains that they look like upright walking dogs.

[Elfyoth]

agreed, and wth is this?

 

I found this npc and I was like eee? it looked kinda weird so I came closer and bam

 

Found him as well took a pic as well 

[Chardonney]

I really want the option to have elf ears like this I know not a lot of people like them (think I've heard them referred to as donkey ears before) but I dig them and would really enjoy an option to get my elf's ears more like this in a future game.

 

*cut*

 

I'm one of those who don't like ears like that (or the whole manga style). Uh, to be honest, I can't stand them. Everytime I make an elf, I make the ears as much like... say... Tauriel's and Legolas' ears...

 

 

Even the default ears the elfs in DAI have are too long and droopy for my taste and often positioned too low. Luckily we have the sliders to correct that in some degree in character creation. I just don't want my elf to look like she is about to take flight. Otherwise I'm not disappointed how female elfs look and I prefer them over female human. The male elf... I use human male, instead.

 

But - like you said - many do like droopy ears and I don't see why BW couldn't have included a slider for that purpose. It certainly wouldn't have bothered me at all and would have made many other players happy. 

[Lord Surinen]

like this pic that somebody posted in the DA2 thread

She looks quite ravishing after the edit.

[HuldraDancer]

ears such as massive and large as this serve no purpose and are physically impossible unless you would have some extra bone holding them (as Dr. Sheldon C. said Oh gravity you heartless bi...). That would mean no typical helmets for them but that's fine. What would be common is broken ear. You get into a fight and bam even if you evade being hit in the face you would still get your ear bone broken. And majority of elves would miss some parts of their ears due to various injuries. And that makes me wonder how much blood would an elf loose if someone cut his ears off and if it could be fatal

 

Sorry only thing I really took away from that was possible broken ear or nicks taken out of the ear customization options. I don't play elves very often but when I do I like to have the ability to give them larger ears like in the picture of the post you quoted. Clearly its not everyone's cup of tea even said that in the post but still I would like an option to have them.

[rene211285]

Ok now i got the idea of this:

http://forum.bioware...est-experiment/

 

Check it out

[tmp7704]

Then why not go all out and make something completely different? Why keep the name of something we have a certain image of in our minds?

This was addressed in the 3rd paragraph of my post. Breaking a trope and challenging these certain images you have in your mind has a different feel/effect than making something completely different. Some people enjoy this -- if they weren't you wouldn't see so many rewrites, alteration and other modifications of these tropes.

Most importantly though, why completely change the established look from the traditional expected look in DA:O to a Na'vi ripoff in DA2 (at least come up with your own design BW)?

If I remember right the dev interviews from that time, after DAO got criticized for looking "too generic" DA2 was trying to invent a custom, recognizable look for itself. This included modifications to all races but humans -- elves, dwarves, qunari and darkspawn all got new appearances. For better, or worse.

[DanteYoda]

Best i could find on short notice, but different countries had very different Elf legends.

 

http://www.mythicalc...de.com/page/Elf

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elf

 

Many versions were tiny.

 

Found him as well took a pic as well 

If you listen closely those weird head guys have female voices too..

[tmp7704]

Batman may have a different style, but he always have the same bat-symbolism, the same story, he is in the same town, have the same butler, he is the same millionaire. You can change tone of the story, and style of car, but he is always Batman.
If let's say, to break the trope, the bat symbolism is taken away. What you have? not Batman. Same if you take away any of the classic things about his story.

Note that interestingly enough this is something the recent Batman reboot did play with -- there's no "bat signal" but a criminal chained to the spotlight, only vaguely resembling the iconic shape. Bats are only brought up as a fleeting kind of reference, when they flutter around the discovered cave. Even the costume has the symbolism reduced to bare minimum.

And it's also hardly accurate to say that the character is always the same millionaire in the same town, with the same butler etc -- Batman has been reimagined in dozens of variations: from a pirate to police detective, from a medieval genius to a ninja, and from an actual knight to, I **** you not, a fervent Nazi. Have a glimpse at it here: http://en.wikipedia....sions_of_Batman

[Nefla]

This was addressed in the 3rd paragraph of my post. Breaking a trope and challenging these certain images you have in your mind has a different feel/effect than making something completely different. Some people enjoy this -- if they weren't you wouldn't see so many rewrites, alteration and other modifications of these tropes.

If I remember right the dev interviews from that time, after DAO got criticized for looking "too generic" DA2 was trying to invent a custom, recognizable look for itself. This included modifications to all races but humans -- elves, dwarves, qunari and darkspawn all got new appearances. For better, or worse.

DA2 didn't invent a custom look for elves, they straight up copied Na'vi from Avatar and just made them flesh colored instead of blue. Dwarves didn't get a new design, they got smooth plastic skin and neon bright eyes like all the races. Why didn't they make dwarves tall and completely hairless but with a ridge of spikes going down their backs and just call it a dwarf? It would be "original" wouldn't it? Whoever thought making darkspawn into mimes in bonnets was a good idea was obviously smoking something. I don't get the appeal of mangling something recognizable just to be "edgy" or "original" (lol). If I decide to make a comic book about fantasy creatures and I have "dragons" that are miniature purple cats with nothing outstanding about them aside from their color, "unicorns" that are big burly women with 6 arms and green hair, "fairies" that are simply medicinal plants, etc...am I super unique and awesome? No. That time and energy would be much better used making each new race new and interesting rather than just taking an existing thing and going "how can I randomly make this as weird looking as possible?"  

 

I repeat that making something look deformed doesn't make it interesting. The portrayal of the elf and dwarf culture, religion, treatment by and of humans and each other, their history, etc...is what made them interesting. Elves looked as you would expect, beautiful magically inclined humans with ageless features and pointy ears. You'd expect them to be a lofty, wise, aloof and superior race that looks down on humans and at one time they were. Their fall from grace, enslavement by humans, the loss of their culture, their lands and even their language and their struggle to try to piece together their past and eke out an existence in a human dominated culture who still oppresses and abuses them...that's what made elves in DA interesting, not baby shoulders and fish eyes. In DA:O you got to see these cultural nuances, in DA2 the elves were just kind of there. Occasionally one would say something along the lines of "elves like me are treated badly!" but you never see it, you never see any part of their culture. I wonder if making the elves in DA2 look like Na'vi clones was a ploy intended to make certain players distracted by the "ooh so original!" and not notice the fact that elves no longer had a distinct culture.

[Felya87]

 

In DA:O you got to see these cultural nuances, in DA2 the elves were just kind of there. Occasionally one would say something along the lines of "elves like me are treated badly!" but you never see it, you never see any part of their culture. I wonder if making the elves in DA2 look like Na'vi clones was a ploy intended to make certain players distracted by the "ooh so original!" and not notice the fact that elves no longer had a distinct culture.

 

It's something I don't get. In DAO was very well implied City Elves had their own traditions even if their main religion was the Andrastianism. In DA2 and Inquistion all that have been taken away or forgotten. Why that? Even Solas says they don't have anything, just some ritual, but is not true! In DAO we see the Alienage have an Hanren, but we never saw anything like that ever again! Where was the Hanren in the DA2 alienage? He/she should have been a figure just as important as the Keeper for the CE. But is never ever mentioned that figure again!

 

I hate this rewrite of the Alienage elves, when there was so much more about their culture in DAO. I was hoping with Briala and the Elven rebellion we would have seen some more about the CE, some of the culture we had seen in DAO. Instead nothing. Again.  why build an interesting culture, if you ignore it?

[tmp7704]

DA2 didn't invent a custom look for elves, they straight up copied Na'vi from Avatar and just made them flesh colored instead of blue.

I'm sorry, but this is reaching level of hyperbole I'm not really interested discussing.

You can keep repeating that deforming something doesn't make it interesting, that repetition won't make your belief any more universal -- you only need to remember post-DA2 threads in which a number of people did defend the new design as improvement over the old one. Apparently this does make it interesting for some, whether you can understand it or not.

[tmp7704]

It's something I don't get. In DAO was very well implied City Elves had their own traditions even if their main religion was the Andrastianism. In DA2 and Inquistion all that have been taken away or forgotten. Why that? Even Solas says they don't have anything, just some ritual, but is not true!

Solas is an old bigot looking down his nose on everything that isn't the Ancient Elves of the Good Old Days, with pretty ignorant views of every other race. The "but you, you are something special" talk he gives you if you get his approval is pretty enlightening in this regard.