184 réponses à ce sujet

[CosmicGnosis]

If I remember correctly, the only scenario in which Briala gives a speech is the Celene-Briala reconciliation. She gave a very good one. It was the main reason why I decided to stick with that choice. Not even the Gaspard-Briala scenario allowed Briala to contribute to the court announcement, probably because no one can know that she is pulling Gaspard's strings.

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

Gaspard marrying Celene should have been a option

*Barf*

 

Well, it couldn't be any more toxic than Celene-Briala relationship.

[fraggle]

Gaspard marrying Celene should have been a option

 

He already tried that in the book, drew out his weapon when Celene refused and failed.

[Fredward]

*Barf*

 

Well, it couldn't be any more toxic than Celene-Briala relationship.

 

If we're talking on a personal level, sure. If we're talking the Game/governance though... if Celene had swallowed her personal hangups and married Gaspard the entire civil war could have been avoided.

[Eliastion]

On the contrary. I believe I chose the right person to be the Inquisition's puppet as Celene is both treacherous and incompetence, and Briala is no better on treacherous part, she'll likely end up using the Inquisition for her own agenda. On the other hand, if Gaspard is planning to betray me. I can expect to see a dagger in the front not from behind. Of course, I wouldn't underestimate him, but the man is most honest out of all three.

But also unlikely to listen to you in the long run, plain and simple. Celene wants peace and somewhat unpopular reforms, Briala wants very unpopular reforms, seems like they both need Inquisition to stay afloat in the long run. I'm not saying that Gaspard will betray and attack you. He'll accept your help where you agree with him and ignore where you don't. You can have an ally in solo Gaspard, but he is likely to never need you enough to be your puppet in the long run.

[Livi14]

I chose to reunite Celene and Briala. Celene is the political progressive and has proven herself a capable leader - and Briala should ensure that the elves will gain more rights. I am also fine with Gaspard's execution, the last thing Thedas needs is a hypocritical, warmongering jerk like him.

[Warden Commander Aeducan]

If we're talking on a personal level, sure. If we're talking the Game/governance though... if Celene had swallowed her personal hangups and married Gaspard the entire civil war could have been avoided.

On the personal level, it's gross, but it couldn't be any more disgusting than Celene-Briala relationship. You're correct, however, if Celene had swallowed her personal hangups and married Gaspard there will be no civil war in the first place. He tries and failed, and Celene is not someone who'll give up her own power and swallowed her personal hangups easily.

 

But also unlikely to listen to you in the long run, plain and simple. Celene wants peace and somewhat unpopular reforms, Briala wants very unpopular reforms, seems like they both need Inquisition to stay afloat in the long run. I'm not saying that Gaspard will betray and attack you. He'll accept your help where you agree with him and ignore where you don't. You can have an ally in solo Gaspard, but he is likely to never need you enough to be your puppet in the long run.

I beg to differ as the same thing could be said for Celene, or even Briala. The fact that one of the possible endings is Celene forgot her gratitude to the Inquisition prove that she's no differences, she's not always loyal and she's not special, in that case she just uses the Inquisition to ensure her power and safety at Halamshiral. It's depend on circumstances, but all three need the Inquisition to support them in the long run. Even if you eliminated all their rivals, there'll always be new enemy to threaten Orlais's ruler power, and they'll need the Inquisition to support their goal anyway. Oh? And how did you know Gaspard will ignore the Inquisition when we disagree with him, that he doesn't listen to reason, or that he'll never need the Inquisition enough? Is that your opinion or fact? Warmonger like him did accept the result of peace-talk between Orlais and Ferelden, and if you play the card right his gratitude to the Inquisition remain strong. He's not cut and dried like some people made him to be, and like Celene or Briala. He saw the wisdom in alliance with the Inquisition, and as I said before there are always new threat who'll rise to challenge Celene/Briala/Gaspard. Circumstances can force their mind to hold onto the Inquisition, if they feel threatened enough, and this new threat to the ruler of Orlais can be from outside or within Orlesian Empire.

[Barquiel]

I don't understand the hate for Gaspard. He's literally the most trustworthy of the three yet people say the opposite.

Gaspard's first appearance in TME is him trying to anger Teagan to cause a war with Ferelden; he forces Celene to deal with the elven rebellion when she tried to settle things peacefully; he wanted to burn down an entire city in order to find Celene...even though it was obvious she was no longer there; he started a civil war (killing thousands of Orlesians)...and put Orlais in more danger than ever in an effort to seize power for himself (at a time when Orlais' borders were secured and the country was more prosperous than ever before). And his "chevalier honor" apparently can always be warped enough to justify his actions. That's why it is pretty impossible for me to think of Gaspard as anything other than an untrustworthy villain. And as mentioned above, it certainly doesn't help that he told my Lavellan that elves have no place in politics, or that he calls Briala "rabbit". Why should my elven inquisitor trust someone who is openly racist?

Sure, Celene and Briala use questionable tactics too. But they are using violence as a last resort to solve problems rather than the first. And they are both much better leaders in terms of peace and progression.

[MoonDrummer]

Gaspard marrying Celene should have been a option

Why would you do that to the poor man?

[SerBlacky]

On the personal level, it's gross, but it couldn't be any more disgusting than Celene-Briala relationship. You're correct, however, if Celene had swallowed her personal hangups and married Gaspard there will be no civil war in the first place. He tries and failed, and Celene is not someone who'll give up her own power and swallowed her personal hangups easily.

 

Come on let's be serious here, they have vastly differing opinions on what Orlais should be. They would have killed eachother at some point or disrupt eachother constantly.

I would also point out that the previous empreror wanted to avoid scandal because he was rumored to have an affair with his cousin. I don't see why political mariage (which at one point implies producing an heir) would not be as frown upon as an affair with close family member. Or Bioware retconned it.

 

Plus this argument is kind of moot. I too could say the Civil War would never have happened if Gaspard wasn't such a cry baby. Hell, I could say the Civil War would never have happened if one of them choked on their food and died before it all started.

[Master Warder Z_]

Why would you do that to the poor man?

Think of the golden haired pure blooded children.

[CathyMe]

Since I despise both Gaspard and Celene (along with Orlesians in general),I like the Gaspard-Briala solution most, because it punishing both of them by killing one and putting the other under the thumb of an elf

[jlb524]

If I remember correctly, the only scenario in which Briala gives a speech is the Celene-Briala reconciliation. She gave a very good one. It was the main reason why I decided to stick with that choice. Not even the Gaspard-Briala scenario allowed Briala to contribute to the court announcement, probably because no one can know that she is pulling Gaspard's strings.

That speech was pretty awesome (it's a good reason I tend to favor that ending. An elf addressing the Court like that is a big deal, IMO).

[MoonDrummer]

Think of the golden haired pure blooded children.

Oh god those poor children with Celene as a mother

[Master Warder Z_]

Oh god those poor children with Celene as a mother

o.o And Gaspard a father

[Xilizhra]

Hmmm.

 

I wonder if the Black Emporium would have an item that would give Briala the... equipment necessary for forming a child with Celene.

[Fiery Phoenix]

Gaspard marrying Celene should have been a option

If you mean as an uneasy alliance for the sake of peace, then no, I don't think it would necessarily change much besides what happens if you reunite them.

Hmmm.

I wonder if the Black Emporium would have an item that would give Briala the... equipment necessary for forming a child with Celene.

Would be neat!

[MoonDrummer]

o.o And Gaspard a father

Yeah they shouldn't have kids

[Eliastion]

Hmmm.

 

I wonder if the Black Emporium would have an item that would give Briala the... equipment necessary for forming a child with Celene.

You watch too much anime  

[Xilizhra]

You watch too much anime

Actually, I don't watch anime at all. I do, however, read porn.

[Eliastion]

(...)

I beg to differ as the same thing could be said for Celene, or even Briala. The fact that one of the possible endings is Celene forgot her gratitude to the Inquisition prove that she's no differences, she's not always loyal and she's not special, in that case she just uses the Inquisition to ensure her power and safety at Halamshiral. It's depend on circumstances, but all three need the Inquisition to support them in the long run. Even if you eliminated all their rivals, there'll always be new enemy to threaten Orlais's ruler power, and they'll need the Inquisition to support their goal anyway. Oh? And how did you know Gaspard will ignore the Inquisition when we disagree with him, that he doesn't listen to reason, or that he'll never need the Inquisition enough? Is that your opinion or fact? Warmonger like him did accept the result of peace-talk between Orlais and Ferelden, and if you play the card right his gratitude to the Inquisition remain strong. He's not cut and dried like some people made him to be, and like Celene or Briala. He saw the wisdom in alliance with the Inquisition, and as I said before there are always new threat who'll rise to challenge Celene/Briala/Gaspard. Circumstances can force their mind to hold onto the Inquisition, if they feel threatened enough, and this new threat to the ruler of Orlais can be from outside or within Orlesian Empire.

I don't metagame. If I were to, I'd say it doesn't matter at all since everyting will be the same next installment (as it was with new Dalish homeland in DA:O or choice of the monarch for Ferelden that ended up pretty much decorative). Celene forgetting heer friendship with Inquisition is making her more dependant on her court while Gaspard seems to be a person that will stay independent AND his ideas seems to have many advocates, Orlais does care about its imperialistic pride more than it should. Basically, in the long run Celene is going to need Inquisition or go full conformist with her court, so the Inquisition will have potentially a lot of influence over her decisions. Gaspard will work with Inquisition as long as it suits his goals - I don't say he'll turn on you on first occassion, just that he has less reasons to remain obedient. And obedience is the first thing you need from your puppet. While it seems plausible that the Inquisition can force Celene to do something, forcing Gaspard to anything seems much less likely. Of course if you like his ideas, he can be a valuable ally. But ally doesn't mean a puppet.

[Delphine]

And why shouldn't the Divine Leliana ending exist?

I'll chose an unhardened Divine Leliana anytime of the day over everybody else, in all my playthroughs.

(But if she's hardened, then Divine Cassandra it is.)

[Master Warder Z_]

Yeah they shouldn't have kids

I think he would be a devoted parent.

[kimgoold]

I keep thinking about a comment Briala made, " I'll do whatever I can to help my people", like sleep with/seduce the empress even if I despise her? Pretend I forgive her to get a title and recognition for the elves? I dislike Celene after reading TME but after hearing that comment I always reconcile the two, it's just too good to think that Briala has been playing the game better than anyone else all along.