21 réponses à ce sujet

[AlainSki]

Having clocked over 80 hours in Dragon Age: Inquisition (“DA:I”) and I’m sincerely hoping that the Mass Effect development will not in any way copy its way of storytelling or overall in-game atmosphere. Increasingly I’m getting the feeling I’m just completing quest after quest with relatively few ulterior goals and lacking any sense of personal connection to the main character, storyline. This is especially the case for each of the sidequests/sidestories. What I loved about the mass effect series (and made me replay the series several times) was the way it presented "in your face cinematics" and the personal touch nearly every quest had (especially in ME:2). A nice example is the sick batarian you meet in the quarantined section on omega which you see in mordin’s clinic after you set the blood pack ‘straight’ in the environmental section. Even this tiny little blimp in the storyline had a magnificent personal touch which made me fall in love with the series and made want to replay it over and over just to find out if I had missed anything. In my opinion it was a small, linear but extremely touching and personal world. I sincerely believe that this enabled the producers/writers to more or less guide (or 'force' if you will) you through the story.

 

Even though I’m sincerely impressed with the world that Bioware created in DA:I) I find that the above is completely lacking. I’m sure that part of this related to personal preference and the like but I’m getting the sincere feeling that the game is too big and too easy to (literally) get lost in. Perhaps games which are set in a massive open world like DA:I need some linearity in its gameplay just to force players to stay connected to the overall storyline and various NPC sidestories (which I am expecting ME:X to have a lot of). I’m sincerely hoping that Bioware takes this course for ME:X and makes a large explorable world but with a much more personal touch.

 

Was wondering if any ME fans have the same (impersonal) experiences with DA:I

[fraggle]

Personally I loved DA:I, and didn't mind the huge areas+fetch quests at all, since it's always your own choice to do them.

However, I do understand your concerns and back up some of them. I wish the main quests would've been longer, or that more of the various quests in areas would've been tied to the story (a good example would probably be the mayor quest in Crestwood, I really liked that part).

Also there was a lot of stuff scrapped it seems, when the first trailers appeared they had so many good ideas (like burning Templar boats so they couldn't get away, or choosing to sacrifice either a village or soldiers, which would have a big impact on your companions' reactions), but almost none of them made it into the game.

 

So generally saying, less is more, and while I do believe that DA:I had these huge areas because everyone whined about the re-used locations in DA2, I think a few less areas, or smaller areas, would've done. I hope for the next DA game the world will still be very large, but with more/longer significant quests to the story, because let's face it. Being done with the main quests in around 15 hours is not exactly much.

 

The same applies for the next ME then

[Linkenski]

Thank you OP. So many people seem to be ignorant for all ME2 did right and you're absolutely spot-on that those little "personal touches" in action levels you could find on the side were a big part of what made the game so enjoyable and immersive and probably why it ended up being my favorite. It's like ME1 had too much talking sometimes or just too convoluted level designs and ME3 had TOO much action in long stretches with almost no variety to gameplay types but ME2 kept mixing it up with maybe 10 minutes of shooting gallery, conversation with choices and cinematic, another gameplay segment and a secret area with extra conversation.

 

That's what made ME2 so good IMO. That, and the suicide mission in how it was executed, and you're absolutely right: DA:I didn't have that despite superficially mimicing that ME2 feel. I did like the action stages a lot in DA:I though and I loved the opt-in dialogues. It was a different kind of experience than any Mass Effect which is good but I could've done with more action stages instead of 5-7 exploration stages with nothing but exploration and time-sinks if those extra action stages had more variety and extra side-content within them which was cinematic and contained player choice.

[MattH]

ME2 is the most successful, in my opinion, because it's the most character driven. The majority of the quests are around your squad,(which is arguably the best in any Bioware game) the game makes you care for them and have opinions on them. Nobody is safe in the last mission, these characters you've come to care for, and that raises the stakes.
The problem with massive, open world games is that the focus becomes the surroundings and not the characters and story. The next ME needs to watch for this.

[RVallant]

The squad-quest gameplay was one of the most criticised parts of ME2 iirc.^

 

Anyway, they just need to do what they've usually been doing. Main quest focus with side-quests adjoining. DA:I was the other way around.

 

Shouldn't be an issue seeing as the two teams are different and that the ME team has been a lot more consistent and reliable than the DA team.

[MattH]

The issue with the companion quests was that there weren't, really, that many other quests too do in ME2.

[Alya_]

i so agree with you, my Inquisitor didn't really feel there, i didn't care much about her like i cared about Shepard and hawke, DA:I was an amazing game definitely but not as personal and intimate as bioware games used to be  

[InterrogationBear]

i so agree with you, my Inquisitor didn't really feel there, i didn't care much about her like i cared about Shepard and hawke, DA:I was an amazing game definitely but not as personal and intimate as bioware games used to be  

That's because the Inquisitor doesn't really have a name. The race selection comes at a price. That's why I hope ME:Next will be human only.

[ForgottenWarrior]

I feel opposite. I do hope ME team will use expirience of their collegues. Specifically, the way DA handles player characters. With each new Mass Effect game it was becoming more and more about PC, and less and less about world arround it.

While ME was busy dealing with Shepard's personal "Sanata Barbara", DA have been building its world each game. Differenth PC not only gave to the world of DA a differenth and unique perspectives on it, but also allowed the storys in each of games be more diverseness. And it's just feels that while both IP's have 3 games each, DA have told much more than ME.

You have no idea how sick i am of Shepard already, and a single tought, that Grey Warden from DAO could have become another Shepard, terrifys me.

[Arppis]

It's only because of the fact that you can make Inquisitior into so many races.

 

That's why he couldn't have had many personality traits.

[guntar74]

The problem I had with Inquisitions approach was none of the main quests or companion quests were really part of that open world they crafted. And the side quests that are in the open world do lack that cinematic and personal feel that the other parts have. The only one I can think of is the warden part in the approach. When I look at Mass Effect 1 and 2 you had world hubs you mostly landed on first and could explore a bit, talk to npcs, do side quests and then there was a spot in that area you would work to and go to the quest zone or mission. It helped draw me more into the world when i could go from place to place to get to the missions like that and not just click an icon on the map or teleport from the war table. Though sure the galaxy map did have this for a number of missions as well but it wasn't for all of them. And hell some of inquistions zones had that with caves, dungeons or castles so I think they just missed the opportunity to work the other main missions in the zones in a similar fasion.

 

So I guess for me the best approach i'd like them to go for is to go back to the more inter connected feel of Mass Effect 1 and 2's areas and story, then 3 and Inquisitions seperated level/mission select feel if that makes sense.

[AlainSki]

The problem I had with Inquisitions approach was none of the main quests or companion quests were really part of that open world they crafted. And the side quests that are in the open world do lack that cinematic and personal feel that the other parts have. The only one I can think of is the warden part in the approach. When I look at Mass Effect 1 and 2 you had world hubs you mostly landed on first and could explore a bit, talk to npcs, do side quests and then there was a spot in that area you would work to and go to the quest zone or mission. It helped draw me more into the world when i could go from place to place to get to the missions like that and not just click an icon on the map or teleport from the war table. Though sure the galaxy map did have this for a number of missions as well but it wasn't for all of them. And hell some of inquistions zones had that with caves, dungeons or castles so I think they just missed the opportunity to work the other main missions in the zones in a similar fasion.

 

So I guess for me the best approach i'd like them to go for is to go back to the more inter connected feel of Mass Effect 1 and 2's areas and story, then 3 and Inquisitions seperated level/mission select feel if that makes sense.

 

I think you've struck something here. The way world design worked in ME:2, and to a lesser extend ME:1/3, was that you were always guided via hubs or the normandy (via the galaxy map). Thus, if you visualize the progression through the game in lines, these lines were elegantly knotted together by the hubs. You were always forced back through 'the common area', which for me personally greatly enhanced the feeling that Normandy was a mobile home. Also, I believe that the dialogue cinematics are underrated. They can cut you off from whatever is happening around you and force you to focus on the NPC character/companion, and the ultimately the story, at hand. 

[K2LU533]

Gotta say, I really missed the cinematic feel of conversations in ME and previous DA games. It started becoming more common in ME3, with DA:I almost dropping it entirely outside of main character dialogue. 

[Linkenski]

I have to say I cared way more about my inquisitor than I ever did with Hawke. I just think the lack of looming doom (why do we close the breach before we even get to see how bad it gets?) and lack of interesting dynamics between hero and villain made it feel less personal. Solas and my inquisitor had kind of the same relationship as Hawke and Anders in DA2, very suspicious and tense. I think that added some to my plot.

[katamuro]

I think I liked how DAI had more organic character relationships. Plus the talk while you run around, its quite well done and I hope they implement something like that in the ME4.(yes I call it ME4, dont get excited). 

Because both in ME1 and 2 and 3 to some extent being nice somehow always lead to the romance. I was surprised by the confrontation that both Liara and Ashley made in ME1. In ME2 talking to Jack always seemed like a stepping around a minefield and in the end I still have no idea which choices are supposed to make her better. 

Plus I kinda miss the funny dialogue options from DA2, I loved my snarky Hawke, made the game worth playing. 

[Linkenski]

I don't see how the conversations with crew mates was more organic.

I hated how artificial a lot of it was with the constant warping around Skyhold when approaching a companion in his quarters. In ME3 they always ensured to place characters the places you'd find them on the Normandy so the gameplay - cut scene transition didn't feel like there was a timeskip.

[Sion1138]

Also, I don't want to have to nag the characters to get story out of them. Have them approach me.

 

You miss a whole lot of stuff if you don't randomly speak to everyone all the time.

[katamuro]

Yeah those parts could be made better. What I meant by organic is that they seemed to have more to talk about than characters in ME1-2. They had dialogue throughout the game evolving as the game progressed. Most characters in ME1-2 exhaust their dialogue pretty soon.

[KaiserShep]

Also, I don't want to have to nag the characters to get story out of them. Have them approach me.

 

You miss a whole lot of stuff if you don't randomly speak to everyone all the time.

 

I would love to have companions actively seek you out. It makes them seem livelier and gives them a better presence to me. You just know that people will complain about X being forced on us though. The only way to really counteract this is to have optional recruitment, as well as an approval system so that they don't automatically do this at some point.

[KaiserShep]

I don't see how the conversations with crew mates was more organic.

I hated how artificial a lot of it was with the constant warping around Skyhold when approaching a companion in his quarters. In ME3 they always ensured to place characters the places you'd find them on the Normandy so the gameplay - cut scene transition didn't feel like there was a timeskip.

 

I feel as though this was a bit of a compromise. It was easy to do this with the Normandy, because it's really small and companions are basically restricted to one or two levels. And even then, it's easy to miss Javik roaming about the Normandy. I once came across him standing around where Jack used to be in ME2 and never saw him there again. I'm just never quite sure when he does it, and it's easy to forget to check after each and every mission.

 

With Skyhold, if the companions moved about, players would probably get a little frustrated wondering where they were.

[Vazgen]

I would love to have companions actively seek you out. It makes them seem livelier and gives them a better presence to me. You just know that people will complain about X being forced on us though. The only way to really counteract this is to have optional recruitment, as well as an approval system so that they don't automatically do this at some point.

I don't think it will feel forced. Take, for example, "Invite to cabin" scenes in ME3. Those were forced because you had to call one squadmate to be able to call another. Now look at Citadel DLC with its meetups. You can choose when to invite someone to the apartment. That's not forced IMO. Someone like Kelly would need to remind you of people wishing to speak with you "in private", so people who generally don't bother with reading messages still get the notification about that content

[The Arbiter]

Lmao reminds me about Skyrim when it hot repeatative but mods and dungeons saved it