1602 réponses à ce sujet

[Steelcan]

So, you're saying that the elven civil resulted in them allowing themselves to be enslaved by an empire that practiced blood magic and conquered everyone else as well as them, and also enslaved them, and the loss of technology and culture is entirely the fault of the elves and has absolutely nothing to do with Tevinter?

 

Do I understand that that is the argument you guys are presenting?

its not as far fetched as you make it out to be, we know the wars between the elven gods were on a size and scope unparalleled in the real world, after the destruction of the empire's infrastructure and most of its population in war, Tevinter could easily move in and enslave the survivors and destroy what was left, but given Abelas's dialogue its unlikely there was much left for Tevinter to conquer

[Addai]

its not as far fetched as you make it out to be, we know the wars between the elven gods were on a size and scope unparalleled in the real world, after the destruction of the empire's infrastructure and most of its population in war, Tevinter could easily move in and enslave the survivors and destroy what was left, but given Abelas's dialogue its unlikely there was much left for Tevinter to conquer

If you want to exaggerate what Abelas said, sure.

[dragonflight288]

its not as far fetched as you make it out to be, we know the wars between the elven gods were on a size and scope unparalleled in the real world, after the destruction of the empire's infrastructure and most of its population in war, Tevinter could easily move in and enslave the survivors and destroy what was left, but given Abelas's dialogue its unlikely there was much left for Tevinter to conquer

 

I get that the elves civil weakened them, but that alone is not enough to destroy all traces of their culture or make them forget how to make or use their own technology. 

 

Weakened by the civil war allowed the human ruled Tevinter to take over, but it was the actions of the humans that utterly destroyed what was left of their culture as they tried to take and use elven artifacts for themselves, and even then couldn't get them all right. 

 

Using eluvians as long range communicators because they couldn't unlock their actual functions as a rapid transit system being one such example. Duncan even thinks that the eluvians are tevinter in origin in the Dalish Warden's story as a direct result of Tevinter's interference. 

 

Yes, the elves weakened themselves, but they did not destroy their own culture and history. It was humans who did that. 

[Steelcan]

Abelas's exact wording is "the war of carrion feasting on a corpse" when asked by Dorian to explain

 

link:

 

that to me implies that the Elven Empire was beyond recovery at that point

[Bad King]

IIRC, weren't there supposed to be veil-shattering battles between the ancient elves and the Tevinters in the Brecilian Forest (which is the main reason that forest is so haunted at the time of DA:O)? Abelas' corpse metaphor is likely a highly simplified representation of a war that likely consisted of cataclysmic events.

[Master Warder Z_]

Actually the lore on those battles is muddled.

The veil could have been torn pre Tevinter expansion.

It's hinted at by pre imperium humans and elves fighting something horrific together.

[Bad King]

Actually the lore on those battles is muddled.

The veil could have been torn pre Tevinter expansion.

It's hinted at by pre imperium humans and elves fighting something horrific together.

 

True, I just looked up Sarel's dialogue in DA:O and he seems uncertain as to what actually happened there. Nevertheless, the wiki appears to have a relatively detailed account of the end of Arlathan (even suggesting that the siege lasted for a period of six years) most of which apparently comes from TWoT (which I have not yet read). Such sources could be highly biased as the Imperium probably wanted to turn the event into a large and glorious conquest to paint themselves in a positive light, but I do believe that the large amount of elven slaves that were taken and kept by the Imperium had to come from somewhere.

 

We don't really know what criteria Abelas uses to brand the post civil war elven civilisation as a corpse - it could simply be that its fragmentation into smaller polities and loss of gods was enough to make it dead to him. Or it could have indeed been a highly depopulated ruin (but the continuation of large numbers of elves as slaves in the Imperium and the apparent six year siege of Arlathan call this into question).

[Addai]

Abelas's exact wording is "the war of carrion feasting on a corpse" when asked by Dorian to explain

*snip*

 

that to me implies that the Elven Empire was beyond recovery at that point

Well, you know. Abelas is a bit emo.

[MoonDrummer]

Actually the lore on those battles is muddled.

The veil could have been torn pre Tevinter expansion.

It's hinted at by pre imperium humans and elves fighting something horrific together.

I have always wondered what was going on there. I always thought that the great darkness they talked about was the blight, but I suppose that doesn't really make sense. Maybe it was Tevinter  attacking. 

 

Do you think Humans could have lived in Thedas at a time when Elven gods still ruled? Maybe it was Andruil or whatever she unleashed. 

[TK514]

So, you're saying that the elven civil resulted in them allowing themselves to be enslaved by an empire that practiced blood magic and conquered everyone else as well as them, and also enslaved them, and the loss of technology and culture is entirely the fault of the elves and has absolutely nothing to do with Tevinter?

 

Do I understand that that is the argument you guys are presenting?

 

Nope, I'm saying elven locks were too busy unlocking each other to stop the human locks from expanding and dominating the lock market in Thedas.

 

Someone else brought up intraracial wars, and I mentioned that none of the human wars had anything like the effect on humanity that the elven war(s) did on the elves.  The elves shattered their empire and race so completely that they were ripe for conquest and enslavement by upstarts that never should have been able to challenge them.  So yeah, I guess humanity has quantity of wars, but nothing beats the elves for quality self-destruction.

[stop_him]

I saw this article, and thought, "It's like real-life Dalish":

 

http://www.sliptalk....ongolian-tribe/

 

The Dukha train reindeer, wolves, and eagles!? Amazing people.

[Aimi]

I saw this article, and thought, "It's like real-life Dalish":
 
http://www.sliptalk....ongolian-tribe/
 
The Dukha train reindeer, wolves, and eagles!? Amazing people.

the dukha actually like foreign tourists and traders though

and they eat their reindeer

[Master Warder Z_]

the dukha actually like foreign tourists and traders though

and they eat their reindeer

Deer and elk are delicious!

[Elfyoth]

I saw this article, and thought, "It's like real-life Dalish":

 

http://www.sliptalk....ongolian-tribe/

 

The Dukha train reindeer, wolves, and eagles!? Amazing people.

Wow nice. Though I still think that the Dalish have jewish combination in there. The dream of a homeland, the redemption style speech, the keepers say "When the time is right we will have a homeland" Like what the Haredic said. And STILL some of them say it. And Elves in total cant have an elven child with other races. Like if a jewish man is having a child with a woman that is not jewish, then his child will not be a jew, though it does not apply to a jewish woman. 

[Master Warder Z_]

No comment

[Elfyoth]

Can you bake a cake with honey?

 

Seriously curious

Yep in Israel at the Rosh Hashana, (The start of the new jewish year) We have lots of honey cakes. Its some kind of a tradition, like Easter Eggs in Easter. 

[Elfyoth]

 

Not sure about you guys, but I don't think Dalish rogues should have the ability to unlock doors in this game.

Dalish clans avoid going near human settlements as a general principle. "But clan Lavellan..." no, they just trade with them. That's different from spending time in a town.

I'm pretty sure Inquisitor Lavellan never had to deal with a locked door in his/her life. Or doors in general.

Well there ARE some aravalls that have doors you know. 

 

At least in DAO. God I miss the DAO Aravals just look!: 

 

 

They could sleep in there, how awsome is that?! 

 

Now we have this....  its not bad but...

[TK514]

A wheelbarrow with sails.

[Master Warder Z_]

A wheelbarrow with sails.

Honestly they are called landships but...

[SgtSteel91]

A wheelbarrow with sails.

 

I dunno if you jest but that's how I see those small aravals. Like small crates to hold tools, food, small things. And either the Dalish sleep outside, in makeshift tents, or in those big aravals you see in Origins.

[Assassino01]

The Old Big Aravels looked more practical for the purpose of actually living in, however, I always thought it odd they seemed so heavy and cumbersome. They didn't seem as if they would be able to move very fast on roads, much less in the woods. The new ones look a bit useless for the purpose of living in, but I can buy that they are able to move swiftly on uneven terrain. 

[Vit246]

I think they should redesign the aravels again and make them look something closer to viking longships

[TK514]

I dunno if you jest but that's how I see those small aravals. Like small crates to hold tools, food, small things. And either the Dalish sleep outside, in makeshift tents, or in those big aravals you see in Origins.

 

I just described what they look like to me.  I certainly wouldn't call them 'land ships'.  I realize there's probably an engine limitation here, but when I hear 'land ship' and am told they're what clans live in etc, I expect something a little bigger than a hot dog stand.

[In Exile]

If you want to exaggerate what Abelas said, sure.

 

I don't know about the god bit, but at least Abelas would suggest that Tevinter didn't do anything of worth. But at the same time, like Solas, he is a bit of a racist. So it's hard to say just how much of what he doesn't attribute to elves is appropriate. 

[Addai]

The Old Big Aravels looked more practical for the purpose of actually living in, however, I always thought it odd they seemed so heavy and cumbersome. They didn't seem as if they would be able to move very fast on roads, much less in the woods. The new ones look a bit useless for the purpose of living in, but I can buy that they are able to move swiftly on uneven terrain. 

And, they would be much harder to fly.