1664 réponses à ce sujet

[durengo]

 

 

 

 "Single player MMO" isn't meant to insult to actual MMORPGS (which can be very well done and break this mold), it's an insult to DA:I which mimics the lowest baseline generic MMORPG that has you fetching 10 rat tails then 8 slimes then 20 bear teeth, etc...(with very weak reasons like "I need them to make soup for the village warriors") grinding to level up, little to no music, and a weak main plot if any.

if you try to compare any chinese or japanese xp grinding mmorpg they havent a real storyline but are to 90 percent full of fetch quests with dai then is that wrong too.

 

the main plot of dai isn't weak.maybe you don't like it.. thats your point of view.

 

i don't know which game you played but i heard enough music in dai.every epic battle and scene had music.

 

maybe you should also visit the pub in skyhold.this is how little to no music sounds like in dai :

 

 

this isn't enough music for you .... well we go on:

 

ok with your gameplay of dai you was forced to make thousands of quests where you have to fetching 10 rat tails then 8 slimes then 20 bear teeth? this is how all the nonsense talk about fetch quests in dai sounds.

 

i played on templar side and had not much fetch quests...maybe 10+/-.

aside the fact that you are not forced to make them to get that what you need.

 

 

 

obviously you didn't played dai.

[Regan_Cousland]

ok with your gameplay of dai you was forced to make thousands of quests where you have to fetching 10 rat tails then 8 slimes then 20 bear teeth? this is how all the nonsense talk about fetch quests in dai sounds.

 

obviously you didn't played dai.

 

You're taking her too literally, Durengo.

No, we didn't literally have to fetch dozens of rat tails in Inquisition, but the quests we did get -- planting flags, delivering items, collecting shards, clearing out random groups of bandits, finding keys, etc., felt just as pointless as MMO quests because they were completely disconnected from the story -- and even when they were relevant to the story, they required far too much travelling for far too little reward.

If the quests had at least given us brief opportunities to roleplay our characters, to make important choices, or to hear our companions speak, they would have been far more appealing ... but they didn't. At least eighty percent of all activities in Inquisition feel like pointless busywork.

But everyone knows my opinion now. I'm just gonna shut up, do something constructive, or play Tomb Raider: Definitive Edition.

 

Now that's a great game that knows exactly what it wants to be. lol

P.S. In fact, Tomb Raider is a good example of how to handle side-content correctly. None of the areas are so large that they feel extraneous to the story the game is telling, and yet they all offer scope for additional exploration ... exploration which is actually fun because it incorporates environmental puzzles that stimulate you intellectually, and rewards in the form of weapon and skill upgrades that actually feel meaningful.

Of course, Inquisition is a different kind of game -- an RPG -- so I'm not saying it should include environmental puzzles. What it should do is include activities that appeal to RPG fans (more specifically, to BioWare fans), such as conversations with NPCs who have personalities, and the harvesting of powerful equipment that we can actually equip at our current level.

 

Instead of "adventuring" for several several dull, silent hours to find a powerful axe that I can't equip until my character ascends two more levels, I should be adventuring for forty thrilling minutes, in a cool environment with story content, to acquire a powerful axe that I can equip right now. lol

 

[Elhanan]

You're taking her too literally, Durengo.

No, we didn't literally have to fetch dozens of rat tails in Inquisition, but the quests we did get -- planting flags, delivering items, collecting shards, clearing out random groups of bandits, finding keys, etc., felt just as pointless as MMO quests because they were completely disconnected from the story -- and even when they were relevant to the story, they required far too much travelling for far too little reward.

If the quests had at least given us brief opportunities to roleplay our characters, to make important choices, or to hear our companions speak, they would have been far more appealing ... but they didn't. At least eighty percent of all activities in Inquisition feel like pointless busywork.

But everyone knows my opinion now. I'm just gonna shut up, do something constructive, or play Tomb Raider: Definitive Edition.
 
Now that's a great game that knows exactly what it wants to be. lol

Plenty of opportunity for RP and dialogue; simply fewer cinematics which has little to do with the former. Thanks for making this point.

[Rawgrim]

ooh jesus now the 10 hours story .. story again   this is simply not true . i already answered to you because of this ..pages before with a little link to a page where you can read how many main story playtime all dragon age games have. dao .. dai .. da2 all between 20-40 hours.. deppends how you play the games and of course without  dlc and expansions.

 

and here another link because of the 20-40 hours main story playtime from dai:

http://www.forbes.co...tal-completion/

 

 

thats exactly!

 

And yet everyone who has completed the game states that the main story takes 10 to 12 hours to get through.

 

The devs also promised us to be able to customize our keeps after we captured them. Kind of proves they can't really be trusted when it comes to promises.

 

But lets say the game takes 20 hours to complete, and 200 if you do evrything in the game. That is still only 10 percent story.

[Elhanan]

And yet everyone who has completed the game states that the main story takes 10 to 12 hours to get through.
 
The devs also promised us to be able to customize our keeps after we captured them. Kind of proves they can't really be trusted when it comes to promises.
 
But lets say the game takes 20 hours to complete, and 200 if you do evrything in the game. That is still only 10 percent story.

Perhaps your story; mine lasts 250+ hrs.

[durengo]

You're taking her too literally, Durengo.

No, we didn't literally have to fetch dozens of rat tails in Inquisition, but the quests we did get -- planting flags, delivering items, collecting shards, clearing out random groups of bandits, finding keys, etc., felt just as pointless as MMO quests because they were completely disconnected from the story -- and even when they were relevant to the story, they required far too much travelling for far too little reward.

If the quests had at least given us brief opportunities to roleplay our characters, to make important choices, or to hear our companions speak, they would have been far more appealing ... but they didn't. At least eighty percent of all activities in Inquisition feel like pointless busywork.

But everyone knows my opinion now. I'm just gonna shut up, do something constructive, or play Tomb Raider: Definitive Edition.

 

Now that's a great game that knows exactly what it wants to be. lol

did you realy know what roleplay is or mean ? i doubt that you would make roleplay if you even too comfortable to travel around into a world who calls 'please  iam large  make roleplay wherever you wanna.. enjoy me.. explore me and roleplay with me and into me'.

 

 you didn't need special game mechanics to be able to roleplay.you can do it without quests (no matter how the quest gameplay is or not)

 

do you know what a large open world area mean? it mean that you must travelling around and that a lot.

 

this is not new...this wasn't a big secret and you should already know that before you bought  dai.

 

but it sounds that you try to prevent to travel unless you get a big reward for it .

it looks like that every non rewarded step is one too much for you.

 

i can't remember a rpg where you get for every breath a reward.

 

 

 

 

i have to quote myself :

 

 

 

maybe its only me who think so.. but i have the feeling that..... the people wanna have every side quest as own epic bombastic action firework with the content for a own action movie with sylvester stallone or arnold schwarzenegger.

 

and if the quests are otherwise (like they are)  then all think that they are dull .. meaningless ..and boring.

 

i think  that people think that its the same with the large area world from dai... if there is no epic action with every step you make then it is dull and  waste content or aimless wandering.

 

 

(quote end)

[200Down]

Everyone has valid points. That's kinda the issue isn't it...., everyone may approach the game differently expecting something different. Not our freekin fault they keep using the game as a Test Platform ... At least it sure feels like that's what they've been doing. More so on this game than any other game from what other users have stated . Haven't played da2 yet so don't really know.

 

Just saying..... Don't let that stop you from saying what you feel. No matter how screwed up everyone else may think it is. How the majority of players perceive the game DOES and very much SHOULD matter to Devs. If their game isn't being played like they entended then they need to be made aware of that.

 

Heck I think they give you tooo much freedom to be honest but not everyone is gonna think that way. Why? Feels like lazy delivery compaired to DAO, ME, and previous BG games to me. Open A Large/Vast World can SUCK IT IF I'm gonna loose quality of content that I'm used to from BW.

 

But dude.... HOW DO YOU REALLY FEEL???? lmfao

[Regan_Cousland]

Plenty of opportunity for RP and dialogue; simply fewer cinematics which has little to do with the former. Thanks for making this point.

 

It's not only the camera angle that's changed, Elhanan. Most of the conversations you have in Inquisition's open-world locales let you ask NPCs questions and nothing more. Most of what you say might as well be auto-dialogue.

Remember meeting the prisoner in the cage in Origins? There were so many ways that conversation could go. You could get him some food, just to be nice; you could persuade the guard to give him his food if you had the necessary charisma; you could use the food as a bargaining tool to acquire the key he'd stolen; you could kill him and take the key -- or you could completely fail to recognize that he had a key if you didn't say the right thing.

There was also funny banter from both the prisoner and Alistair, if you'd recruited him by then.

And this prisoner was an absolute nobody in the game. 

Inquisition introduces you to characters with much more potential, and all it allows you to do in most cases is ask them polite questions, accept their quest, and then say, "Farewell."

[SwobyJ]

To be 'fair', this is kinda more appropriate for a person of such authority.

 

"Hey what's the situation. What can you tell me about ___."

"Blah blah"

"Yes. Very well."

 

Its more bland and I completely get complaints of it being an excuse for not having better RP, but I do understand it working with the 'Inquisitor' role.

[Regan_Cousland]

To be 'fair', this is kinda more appropriate for a person of such authority.

 

"Hey what's the situation. What can you tell me about ___."

"Blah blah"

"Yes. Very well."

 

Its more bland and I completely get complaints of it being an excuse for not having better RP, but I do understand it working with the 'Inquisitor' role.

 

I'm not asking for every conversation to be thrilling, SwobyJ. That'd be impossible in a game so large.

But there's just not enough good stuff in Inquisition. It's as if, outside of the main story and Skyhold, no effort was made in this regard.

P.S. I said I was going to shut up a couple of longwinded posts ago, and now I am. lol

[SwobyJ]

I'm not asking for every conversation to be thrilling, SwobyJ. That'd be impossible in a game so large.

But there's just not enough good stuff in Inquisition. It's as if, outside of the main story and Skyhold, no effort was made in this regard.

P.S. I said I was going to shut up a couple of longwided posts ago, and now I am. lol

 

Yeah I get you.

 

It went over the line, basically. I don't mind a shift in design, but... maybe Bioware killed too many babies with the release of DAI.

[durengo]

And yet everyone who has completed the game states that the main story takes 10 to 12 hours to get through.

 

But lets say the game takes 20 hours to complete, and 200 if you do evrything in the game. That is still only 10 percent story.

everyone ? who ? you speake now for all player ? come down from your large horse.

 

first of all.....the dai main story is not only 20 hours long... it is between 20 and 40 hours long...

the main story from dao is also between 20 and 40 hours long

 

but ok did we play your game.. did we say dai main story= 20 hours long

but then we could also say dao main story = 20 hours long

 

and now ?

 

maybe it makes something better if we say both games have a main story playtime of 40 hours .

 

rawgrimm quote:

but let us say the game takes 20 hours to complete and 200 if you do everything in the game ?

quote end:

 

whats that for a nonsense? complete= you do everything what you can do in the game

did you know what you are writing about?

[Rawgrim]

Perhaps your story; mine lasts 250+ hrs.

 

Picking flowers isn't a story. Talking about the main story here. the one with dialogue, cutscenes, and that is required to get to the end of the game.

[Elhanan]

It's not only the camera angle that's changed, Elhanan. Most of the conversations you have in Inquisition's open-world locales let you ask NPCs questions and nothing more. Most of what you say might as well be auto-dialogue.

Remember meeting the prisoner in the cage in Origins? There were so many ways that conversation could go. You could get him some food, just to be nice; you could persuade the guard to give him his food if you had the necessary charisma; you could use the food as a bargaining tool to acquire the key he'd stolen; you could kill him and take the key -- or you could completely fail to recognize that he had a key if you didn't say the right thing.

There was also funny banter from both the prisoner and Alistair, if you'd recruited him by then.

And this prisoner was an absolute nobody in the game. 

Inquisition introduces you to characters with much more potential, and all it allows you to do in most cases is ask them polite questions, accept their quest, and then say, "Farewell."

DAI has Agents, some of which can go varied paths depending on the conversations. Some may join the Inq, or remain to do other things. One even comes in a box, and even has a cut-scene, which leads of course to the varied trials and their characters. Etc.

Imagination is a better way to meld stories than cut-scenes and vids will ever be.

[Rawgrim]

everyone ? who ? you speake now for all player ? come down from your large horse.

 

first of all.....the dai main story is not only 20 hours long... it is between 20 and 40 hours long...

the main story from dao is also between 20 and 40 hours long

 

but ok did we play your game.. did we say dai main story= 20 hours long

but then we could also say dao main story = 20 hours long

 

and now ?

 

 

 

 

rawgrimm quote:

but let us say the game takes 20 hours to complete and 200 if you do everything in the game ?

quote end:

 

whats that for a nonsense? complete= you do everything what you can do in the game

did you know what you are writing about?

 

I based it on the many reviews from users and professional reviewers. They all say it takes 10-12 hours to complete the main story. That is not me speaking for everyone, it is me pointing out a fact.

 

The DA:O main story is around 30 hours if you don't skip conversations etc. + 10 more hours if you do all the side quests. So yeah....story is the most important part in that game.

 

I was talking about the story. Please try and read the context of other people's posts. Lets say it takes (going to spoonfeed it to you here) 20 hours to complete the MAIN STORY in the game. And 200 hours to do a completionist run with all the side quests etc. That means the game has 10 percent story, 90 percent empty fetch quests.

[Rawgrim]

DAI has Agents, some of which can go varied paths depending on the conversations. Some may join the Inq, or remain to do other things. One even comes in a box, and even has a cut-scene, which leads of course to the varied trials and their characters. Etc.

Imagination is a better way to meld stories than cut-scenes and vids will ever be.

 

You never see the agents again in any case. The game just says you have an agent. That's it. Its not like you can use them for anything.

 

How do you imagine the story is when you pick flowers and fetch rings for 200 hours, anyway?

[durengo]

I based it on the many reviews from users and professional reviewers. They all say it takes 10-12 hours to complete the main story. That is not me speaking for everyone, it is me pointing out a fact.

 

proof? no? then we mustn't talk about.

 

more of the half from your many reviewers and professional reviewers (whoever that will be) drop the game already after few hours without to be close to the end scene.

 

i would say play 200 hours long the game .. and after that play it again .. and again .. and again ... use different races for your inquisitor .. make different choices into each playround ..play all races on templar side and after that all races on mage side...play all possible romances.... and after that you know the full content and all possible cutscenes of the game you could be able to talk about.

[Elhanan]

I based it on the many reviews from users and professional reviewers. They all say it takes 10-12 hours to complete the main story. That is not me speaking for everyone, it is me pointing out a fact.
 
The DA:O main story is around 30 hours if you don't skip conversations etc. + 10 more hours if you do all the side quests. So yeah....story is the most important part in that game.
 
I was talking about the story. Please try and read the context of other people's posts. Lets say it takes (going to spoonfeed it to you here) 20 hours to complete the MAIN STORY in the game. And 200 hours to do a completionist run with all the side quests etc. That means the game has 10 percent story, 90 percent empty fetch quests.

And based on my own gameplay, DAO took about 65+ hrs for a campaign w/ DLC; a tad more than what 'Professionals' ascribe. DAI takes me 250+ hrs per campaign thus; a lot more content overall.

Yet side-quests are not all fetch quests, like some would have us believe. The majority of these may be skipped is desired; XP can be made elsewhere. But some would rather complain about feeding refugees, and cannot understand that one may RP by helping or skipping such content.

[Rawgrim]

proof? no? then we mustn't talk about.

 

and more of the half from your many reviewers and professional reviewers (whoever that will be) drop the game already after few hours without to be close to the end scene.

 

i would say play 200 hours long the game .. and after that play it again .. and again .. and again ... use different races for your inquisitior .. make different choices into each playround .. and after that you know the full content of the game you could be able to talk about.

 

Actually most reviewers has to make a playthrough to write a review. Its their job.

 

Why would I pick flowers as all 4 races, for over 800 hours?

 

But are you saying that all of those 9 out of 10 score reviews DA:I got were worthless? The same reviews you were praising some days back?

[Elhanan]

Actually most reviewers has to make a playthrough to write a review. Its their job.
 
Why would I pick flowers as all 4 races, for over 800 hours?
 
But are you saying that all of those 9 out of 10 score reviews DA:I got were worthless? The same reviews you were praising some days back?

Considering some of these professionals were eager to replay the game; perhaps they like picking flowers, but am guessing they enjoyed the immersive nature of the game.

[Jeffry]

Ok, Elhanan and durengo, this is getting even more ridiculous. I know you loved the game, but please, when there are facts presented before you, accept them, don't deflect them. Rawgrim was talking about how much time the MAIN STORY alone takes. And he is right that the sum of all main quests in DAO is a higher number than the number for DAI's main quest (at least two or three times more). You can't disprove that, it is a fact. Use a stopwatch for your next playthrough if you wish.

 

Yeah, a completionist run of DAI takes more time than DAO (for me personally it is roughly 170 vs 100 hours if I substract from the time the game tells me my afk sessions or modded content in DAO). But the problem of those raw numbers is that they are saying nothing about the quality of the content. They are only saying in which game there is more of it.

 

And quantity alone is not better than quality.

[Rawgrim]

Ok, Elhanan and durengo, this is getting even more ridiculous. I know you loved the game, but please, when there are facts presented before you, accept them, don't deflect them. Rawgrim was talking about how much time the MAIN STORY alone takes. And he is right that the sum of all main quests in DAO is a higher number than the number for DAI's main quest (at least two or three times more). You can't disprove that, it is a fact. Use a stopwatch for your next playthrough if you wish.

 

Yeah, a completionist run of DAI takes more time than DAO (for me personally it is roughly 170 vs 100 hours if I substract from the time the game tells me my afk sessions or modded content in DAO). But the problem of those raw numbers is that they are saying nothing about the quality of the content. They are only saying in which game there is more of it.

 

And quantity alone is not better than quality.

 

Elhanan has been defending the game non stop for almost 24 hours straight. Cut him some slack, he is probably tired.

[Rawgrim]

Considering some of these professionals were eager to replay the game; perhaps they like picking flowers, but am guessing they enjoyed the immersive nature of the game.

 

I am sure. But I would think the main draw in an rpg would be the story, choices, and whatever else. Not doing chores for people.

But yeah, watching the lore get ignored at every turn, and have the game take control of your character constantly is very immersive.

[durengo]

 

But are you saying that all of those 9 out of 10 score reviews DA:I got were worthless? The same reviews you were praising some days back?

Why would I pick flowers as all 4 races, for over 800 hours?

did you realy care about score reviews ? didn't you said that the game is so bad that there are only bad score reviews?

 

did you realised that your choice which race and class you play effect the gameplay? your race effect also how the world react. did you realised that your choice on which side (templar or mage) you play effect the storyline and quests.. and also cutscenes? did you realised that every romance with different companions use a own cutscene and own quest? did you realised that some quests are only playable if you make the right choice ? did you realised that if you let the stormbulls die you get quests about other qunari characters? that if the stormbulls stay alive you get totaly different quests? did you realised that  based on your choices the end prolog could be different each new playround? did you realised that deppends which companion you will take for the well of sorrows mission the story can be changed a little bit? did you realised that your choice who drink from the well will change the story a little bit?  there are much more choices they have influence to the story.

 

did you realised that you can't know the full content of dai if you play it only once?

[Elhanan]

Ok, Elhanan and durengo, this is getting even more ridiculous. I know you loved the game, but please, when there are facts presented before you, accept them, don't deflect them. Rawgrim was talking about how much time the MAIN STORY alone takes. And he is right that the sum of all main quests in DAO is a higher number than the number for DAI's main quest (at least two or three times more). You can't disprove that, it is a fact. Use a stopwatch for your next playthrough if you wish.
 
Yeah, a completionist run of DAI takes more time than DAO (for me personally it is roughly 170 vs 100 hours if I substract from the time the game tells me my afk sessions or modded content in DAO). But the problem of those raw numbers is that they are saying nothing about the quality of the content. They are only saying in which game there is more of it.
 
And quantity alone is not better than quality.

And I am indicating that the same player with the same games has data (ie; recorded facts) that indicates differently. While my first DAO campaign lasted 97+ hrs, it was spent learning and exploring, and is somewhat longer than the remaining sessions at 65+ hrs. My time in DAI for both sessions has lasted more then 250+ hrs. While this may not indicate the quality, it does appear to indicate the amount of possible content, with some remaining.

And I agree that DAO is a better game overall; my second fave game of this century. But DAI is a great game too, IMO; worthy of the accolades it has been granted.