1664 réponses à ce sujet

[Jeffry]

Oh and I agree on that. Both game's main quests are similar in length, but in DA:I you waste much more of it for things like traveling from one point to another (because of larger world) or on a grinding.

 

So if they both are equal in length there is only one logical conclusion. There is more meneingful content in DAO main quest than in DA:I.

 

I base it on my logical logical conclusion to given facts. 

(just my theory - it is open for pointing flaws in it of course)

 

[MC] - Meaningful content

==== - Travel Time.

[GG] - Grinding

 

DAO Start:  [MC]====[MC]====[MC]====[MC]====[MC]====[MC]  : 41 hours

DAI   Start:  [MC]======[GG]======[MC]======[MC]======[GG] : 42 hours

 

For me vandering miles from one point to another to get another quest ... not to my liking.

Grinding mobs Is just no-no ( as in - no JRPGS for me). My fav game of all the time VTMB has like zero mobs grinding - there is no point in doing that cause you simply not getting any XP for killing them. All of the XPs comes from finishing the quest. Great game design.

 

 

Yeah, I completely agree. Meaningful content is imo more important than the sheer amount of content which is mainly comprised of filler. And in DAI it pisses me off that much more when looking at past BW story-driven games. If the filler was completely optional and I mean you wouldn't have to do even one silly FedEx quest in order to progress the main story further and the main story would be longer (and more interesting), I would have very little problem with the filler being in the game. Or just take the Bethesda way and give us a short story with huge moddable playground.

 

 

DAO had plenty of filler integrated into its main quests too, though. All those undead in the Brecilian Forest ruin, for instance.

 

There were not that many and it was not filler, they were simply your enemies there as they were during the Arl of Redcliffe quest for example. You can say parts of some main quests were not really interesting and could be done better, but they were not filler (especially when compared to the kind of filler DAI brought). The Fade section was questionable though, since it required a lot of backtracking, which is not fun if one is forced to it.

[NasChoka]

So I'm NOT the only one who liked exploring The Deep Roads and discovering abandoned thaigs?

(edit)

You are definitly not the only one

I didn't like the fade part and skipped it since my 2nd playthrough thanks to a mod.

[durengo]

Both games are similar when it comes to main quest's time-needed-to-finish.

 

More than hundred sampled playthroughs should be enough to find the average time.

You can find it on howlongtobeat.com

41 hours for Origins http://howlongtobeat...ame.php?id=2760

42 hours for Inquisition http://howlongtobeat...me.php?id=11627

what to hell? wtf ?

at least i call that more a proof as all the ..(quote of anyone):.'a proof is a proof is a proof because i say so.'.....'and all the other crap '...

 

let me take a good guess .... next discussion (not my anyways) will be that its meaningless because anyone say so...because bioware bought the homepage howlongtobeat because anyone say so.because bioware is a liar  yada yada yada

 

well then i guess that... that is right too .. no matter how old it is:

 

http://www.forbes.co...tal-completion/

[Cobwebmaster]

That would be perfect, for me the DA2 combat was the best out of the 3. It was in fact how I envisioned DAI might turn out to be. I believe it was Mike Laidlaw who said they want to take the best of both Dragon Age games and combine it for DAI. Then I heard how much they liked Skyrim and how they want to incorporate something from it into DAI. So now I was looking at a mix of BW's storytelling, interesting well paced party based combat and Skyrim's open world... Boy how was I wrong

 I got fun out of the combat in DAI if I ignored the tactic option. I agree DA2 particularly   improved combat options greatly and during the fight with the Arishok having a warrior as opposed to a mage was a disadvantage. I first started looking at a mage then as something more than a vulnerable resource during combat. I think DA I improved melee skills for a mage  with Fade Step and the Knight Enchanter path. I think care needs to be taken with turning mages into warriors less you start to remove the need for tanks or 2h warrioers who are front line troops. Not that I disliked DAO combat as I enjoyed it very much particularly the continuance of the tradition of having classes able to switch weapons during combat. Having a warrior type able to switch from ranged to meleee when necessary changed tactics greatly and I thought it a mistake to remove that option for DAI

I agree what started off for me as a game eagerly anticipated ended up as a product that nearly collapses under the weight of it's ambitions. It doesn't actually fold because of the integrity of the core questline , but in terms of being a traditional Bioware fan this has to be a disappointment

According to the PR blurb this game is the best launch that Bioware have ever experienced. Whether or not that is true is beyond me, if it is I fail to understand why! Skyrim is a much better experience, and the forthcoming Witcher game if consistent with the previous 2 will totally rock for me. I'm now looking forward to that in anticipation that there is still hope for totally immersive rpg action games

[Cobwebmaster]

what to hell? wtf ?

at least i call that more a proof as all the ..(quote of anyone):.'a proof is a proof is a proof because i say so.'.....'and all the other crap '...

 

let me take a good guess .... next discussion (not my anyways) will be that its meaningless because anyone say so...because bioware bought the homepage howlongtobeat because anyone say so.because bioware is a liar  yada yada yada

 

well then i guess that... that is right too .. no matter how old it is:

 

http://www.forbes.co...tal-completion/

?????????

Why on earth do you need proof of anything?? You either enjoyed the game or you didn't and have chosen to post here your reasons! My post deals with a concept that the most popular games rarely take longer than around 60 hours. I went on to demonstrate the ratio between core(ish) quest time completion in DAI and my total game hours showing a disproportionate ratio between primary goal completion time and tertiary diversions in a semi vacuum (zzzzz)

Now you can talk about whether that applies in Skyrim or elswhere or you could just get married or something

[9TailsFox]

Why is time so important? I play DA:I for 20h. picking flowers and hunting meat in Hinterlands I get bored, maybe other region will be more interesting but it's not it's same I pick flowers and chasing Hallas. I play DA:I about 150h. this is not compliment opposite, please give me DA:O and DA:2 60-70h story driven RPG, I don't want 100h. flower gathering and running simulator. DA:2 take care of you cave was much better my cave have side quests.

[Darkly Tranquil]

So I'm NOT the only one who liked exploring The Deep Roads and discovering abandoned thaigs?
 
(edit)

Definitely not. I'd play a Deep Roads dungeon grinder in a heartbeat.

[Lee T]

You are definitly not the only one

I didn't like the fade part and skipped it since my 2nd playthrough thanks to a mod.

And I liked (and still like) both . To each is own.

On the other hand of the spectrum, when Wicked Hearts appeared on my map I needed 30 power points to open it. I had exactly 0 at that moment. Story should go at the speed of plot, roadblock like that are a very bad idea.

[PhroXenGold]

I like the Deep Roads. The Fade was cool the first time though, but tedious when replaying.

[TaHol]

And I liked (and still like) both . To each is own.

On the other hand of the spectrum, when Wicked Hearts appeared on my map I needed 30 power points to open it. I had exactly 0 at that moment. Story should go at the speed of plot, roadblock like that are a very bad idea.

My thoughts exactly. Obviously they had to do this to make game longer and to force people to actually go to zones that has zero meaning for the game otherwise. You have to grind powerpoints. To be able to do main quest. I find this system so frustrating I seriously would not finish the game at all but I have to for reasons that are related to Dorian. Great guy btw.

[Elhanan]

Simply because content does not apply directly to the MQ does not equate it to being dull. While some may find it such, others find the side-quests enjoyable. Matter of opinion.

But more cinematics are not required for it, esp if it has nothing to do with the MQ. Lessens gameplay for watching films; not the purpose of a cRPG.

[AlanC9]

There were not that many and it was not filler, they were simply your enemies there as they were during the Arl of Redcliffe quest for example. You can say parts of some main quests were not really interesting and could be done better, but they were not filler (especially when compared to the kind of filler DAI brought). The Fade section was questionable though, since it required a lot of backtracking, which is not fun if one is forced to it.

This depends on your definition of filler, of course.I susoect we use different ones.

[Farangbaa]

There is no grinding in DA:I.

Do you guys even know what grinding is???

[Farangbaa]

Why is time so important? I play DA:I for 20h. picking flowers and hunting meat in Hinterlands I get bored, maybe other region will be more interesting but it's not it's same I pick flowers and chasing Hallas. I play DA:I about 150h. this is not compliment opposite, please give me DA:O and DA:2 60-70h story driven RPG, I don't want 100h. flower gathering and running simulator. DA:2 take care of you cave was much better my cave have side quests.

60-70 hours story driven?

I must have a really odd copy of DA:O then, cause I never even came close to 60 hours.

[Draining Dragon]

There is no grinding in DA:I.Do you guys even know what grinding is???

Performing a repetitive task over and over. The requisitions are a textbook example of this, as are fade rifts.

[turuzzusapatuttu]

what to hell? wtf ?

at least i call that more a proof as all the ..(quote of anyone):.'a proof is a proof is a proof because i say so.'.....'and all the other crap '...

 

let me take a good guess .... next discussion (not my anyways) will be that its meaningless because anyone say so...because bioware bought the homepage howlongtobeat because anyone say so.because bioware is a liar  yada yada yada

 

well then i guess that... that is right too .. no matter how old it is:

 

http://www.forbes.co...tal-completion/

 

Sir, you really don't know how and when to use suspension points.

[Elhanan]

There is no grinding in DA:I.

Do you guys even know what grinding is???

AFAIK, Grinding seems to apply to killing the same or similar spawns repeatedly to gather XP, loot, etc. And to be fair, this is an option for the Player if they wish to use it.

However, as there are other options to bypass spawns, complete quests that activate such spawns, use other methods for acquiring XP, loot, etc, there appears to be ways to skip it if one does not like it. I do. But to choose to do this, then complain about it being an option makes little sense, to me at least.

[Farangbaa]

Performing a repetitive task over and over. The requisitions are a textbook example of this, as are fade rifts.

And both you can avoid almost entirely if that's not your thing.

And seriously, grinding is killing the same damn creature over and over again for a 0.001% chance to get the drop you want, of which you need 5 or something. Or even worse, not even doing it for a drop, but just for the experience.

That, is grinding. Delivering some materials you were going to pick up regardless hardly qualifies, nor are they in any way whatsoever necessary to progress.

[Jeffry]

what to hell? wtf ?

at least i call that more a proof as all the ..(quote of anyone):.'a proof is a proof is a proof because i say so.'.....'and all the other crap '...

 

let me take a good guess .... next discussion (not my anyways) will be that its meaningless because anyone say so...because bioware bought the homepage howlongtobeat because anyone say so.because bioware is a liar  yada yada yada

 

well then i guess that... that is right too .. no matter how old it is:

 

http://www.forbes.co...tal-completion/

 

And you are wrong yet again. Not at all surprising, really.

 

If you actually bothered to read our posts instead of being too busy riding here on your high horse, you would know why exactly the main game for DAI appears to be 1 hour longer on that site. It is simply because it takes into account all the filler you have to complete in order to being able to advance to the next main quest. You didn't have to do that in DAO, you were able to just go from one main quest to another, meaning there is more of main story in DAO than there it is in DAI and that is a fact confirmed by those 2 links.

 

Again, that forbes article means nothing, it is right tho that the main story takes somewhere between 20 and 40 hours to complete but that is the same like saying a Porsche 911 can go somewhere between 300 and 600 kms per hour Both statements are correct, but we both know the reality is much closer to the lower value. PR manipulation with numbers for the win And you can't disprove that.

 

 

Simply because content does not apply directly to the MQ does not equate it to being dull. While some may find it such, others find the side-quests enjoyable. Matter of opinion.

 

We are calling the content dull not only because it doesn't apply to the MQ, but because it is in fact dull People can still enjoy it, which is not that much surprising, many people enjoy doing dull things like for example playing Farmville or Clash of Clans (for reasons unkown to me).

 

However, as there are other options to bypass spawns, complete quests that activate such spawns, use other methods for acquiring XP, loot, etc, there appears to be ways to skip it if one does not like it. I do. But to choose to do this, then complain about it being an option makes little sense, to me at least.

 

But for that one has to know what he can skip and won't miss something of some value. And if one does not read it on wiki or in some other way deliberately spoils the game for himself, he can't know that. And for progressing the story, you have to grind something, but you don't know what is more dull without first playing the game. That is the problem. After my full playthrough I can now with certainty say that if I had skipped some content, the game would have been less boring for me, but I know that only because I have played it first.

 

 

According to the PR blurb this game is the best launch that Bioware have ever experienced. Whether or not that is true is beyond me, if it is I fail to understand why! Skyrim is a much better experience, and the forthcoming Witcher game if consistent with the previous 2 will totally rock for me. I'm now looking forward to that in anticipation that there is still hope for totally immersive rpg action games

 

I have no problems believing that statement. Marketing hyped the game like crazy, every player was promised he will find exactly what he is looking for. Also, BW is still a strong brand and DA is a popular franchise and it really looked like BW learned from their mistakes (in reality they have not, but PR had us believe otherwise). Yup, Skyrim is much better open world game, with much higher replayability thanks mainly to mods, BW failed to realize that. I too hope for Witcher's success, because we can get a great game out of it and at the same time everyone can know that AAA RPGs can be done a bit differently.

[Farangbaa]

I personally can not wrap my head around why anyone would like Skyrim. I have never played a more boring game in my life.

But it apparantly did really well. I think this is what we call opinions

[Elhanan]

But for that one has to know what he can skip and won't miss something of some value. And if one does not read it on wiki or in some other way deliberately spoils the game for himself, he can't know that. And for progressing the story, you have to grind something, but you don't know what is more dull without first playing the game. That is the problem.

Perhaps it is me, but I contend that most mature gamers will comprehend this idea quickly. Or is this something that requires 'Dumbing Down' for todays audience? *Rhetorical*

Sorry; not buying it. Tis optional.

[Elhanan]

I personally can not wrap my head around why anyone would like Skyrim. I have never played a more boring game in my life.

But it apparantly did really well. I think this is what we call opinions

During my first campaign, I missed the story-driven content that I was used to playing, and was somewhat disappointed initially. However, when I played the content as a way to craft and create my own character set in a game of multiple stories, areas, quests, etc, it soon became an addiction.

Try scanning through the Skyrim thread in OT for some other insights. Also, highly recommend looking at Gopher's Vids. The tutorials are extremely informative and helpful, and the Let's Play Skyrim series is quite entertaining:

https://www.youtube....DubQ4rcYCpX40Eg

[Farangbaa]

During my first campaign, I missed the story-driven content that I was used to playing, and was somewhat disappointed initially. However, when I played the content as a way to craft and create my own character set in a game of multiple stories, areas, quests, etc, it soon became an addiction.

Try scanning through the Skyrim thread in OT for some other insights. Also, highly recommend looking at Gopher's Vids. The tutorials are extremely informative and helpful, and the Let's Play Skyrim series is quite entertaining:

https://www.youtube....DubQ4rcYCpX40Eg

Believe me, it is not for lack of trying. I own the game. I have tried to get into it because people kept saying it was the best thing ever.

It just doesn't work for me.

[Jeffry]

Perhaps it is me, but I contend that most mature gamers will comprehend this idea quickly. Or is this something that requires 'Dumbing Down' for todays audience? *Rhetorical*

Sorry; not buying it. Tis optional.

 

You can't do only main story missions, that is a fact. You have to acquire the power resource somehow. And you have to grind for it somehow. But do you know which zones and quests are more dull than others before or playing the game? Or during the early portioins of the game? No, you don't know that. You don't know where the somewhat enjoyable side quests are, because how could you if they are in a middle of one out of 10 optional zones? You enjoy all of the dull content and that is fine, but you can't seem to understand that some people don't want do to dull stuff in a game and don't want to be forced to do them. Yet here, they are forced to do at least some of them and you can't disprove that.

 

All side quests and side activities were completely optional in DAO, you didn't need them in order to finish the game. You have to do some of them in order to finish DAI.

[Elhanan]

You can't do only main story missions, that is a fact. You have to acquire the power resource somehow. And you have to grind for it somehow. But do you know which zones and quests are more dull than others before or playing the game? Or during the early portioins of the game? No, you don't know that. You don't know where the somewhat enjoyable side quests are, because how could you if they are in a middle of one out of 10 optional zones? You enjoy all of the dull content and that is fine, but you can't seem to understand that some people don't want do to dull stuff in a game and don't want to be forced to do them. Yet here, they are forced to do at least some of them and you can't disprove that.
 
All side quests and side activities were completely optional in DAO, you didn't need them in order to finish the game. You have to do some of them in order to finish DAI.

The context was Grinding; not side-quests, but much the same applies.

Grinding for me is dull, so I choose not to do it. Finding a solution to ending the spawns, exploring alternative routes, and forging ahead are all entertaining options for dealing with them. I avoid having to do so again.

Sometimes it is easier than some others, but is hardly difficult. There are quest markers for those that use them. The maps continue to evolve revealing clues and locations. Etc. And as indicated, there are walkthroughs available for those that choose to use them; tend to use this on puzzles when I choose to skip past them.

Now if one finds all of the non-MQ content dull, then that is a problem I cannot address as I strongly disagree. But to simply offer feedback to add cinematics which can lessen the RP value for many including myself, I choose to contend that idea.