269 réponses à ce sujet

[Hanako Ikezawa]

I was never able to call anyone a filthy knife-ear throughout the series. This injustice has grown intolerable.

You are allowed to call humans Shemlen though, so there are racial slurs in the games. 

[B.A. Broska]

Reading some of these responses, people are acting like the OP wants to be able to go able to walk up to any gay character and be given a dialogue option to shout slurs in their face and kick them off the team or immediately execute them.

 

That's just ridiculous, and a serious failing to understand cause and effect.

 

The relevant point here is that the players did not bring this issue up. BioWare did. By writing a story arc specifically about this issue, BioWare is effectively asking the player "How do you feel about this?"

 

They could have avoided this issue. Nobody asked them or forced them to talk about it. They decided to talk about it. They decided to write a story about it.

 

A story not giving you the option to dislike something and a story asking you your opinion on something and then preventing you from saying you dislike it are two completely different things.

 

My advice is to just sit back and enjoy the shitshow, I mean you could argue with these people but if the BSN has taught me anything the Dragon Age forums are notoriously stubborn when it comes to acknowledging logic and reason, don't even bother arguing, just grab some popcorn and laugh as they rage on, it is the only way to maintain your sanity.

[TheJediSaint]

Or making fun of Dwarves

So unfair!!

They're so short and squat. The look like like fat children with beards!

[MACharlie1]

OP trolling and wrong about so many things aside...

 

It would be a PR disaster if Bioware included the option to be a homophobe. Just saying. 

[stop_him]

I generally find the lack of douchebag options available disturbing. Although since my only male and and douchy character is romancing Dorian, I don't suspect he'd disapprove of Dorian's sexuality.

[MACharlie1]

I agree the Inquisitor is always diplomatic and bland
ruthless options were sadly abandoned no idea what Bioware was thinking

whatever happened to RP?

Sequels happened. Makes it harder for the Inquisitor to appear as an NPC in the sequels. 

[KaiserShep]

You are allowed to call humans Shemlen though, so there are racial slurs in the games.

Yeah but it's not the same. When an elf calls a human shemlen, it's from a generally inferior position.

[Hanako Ikezawa]

Yeah but it's not the same. When an elf calls a human shemlen, it's from a generally inferior position.

Yes it is. A racial slur is a racial slur. There isn't one that is more discriminatory than another due to the target being in a superior position.

[Hazegurl]

I would have loved playing an Elf on my high horse. "Keep your Maker, Human Lord!"  I also would have loved playing a pampered noble. "Solas, be a dear and fetch me water...that is what your kind is good at, yes?"

[Ash Wind]

Hmmmm I must have missed that part where the IQ can rail against heterosexual romances. Its NOT fair!!!!!! waaaaaaaaaaaaaaa! I demand my bigotry be recognized!!

[ComedicSociopathy]

Hmmmm I must have missed that part where the IQ can rail against heterosexual romances. Its NOT fair!!!!!! waaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

 

Thank you for pointing that out. 

[MoonDrummer]

Yes it is. A racial slur is a racial slur. There isn't one that is more discriminatory than another due to the target being in a superior position.

Isn't shemlen just the elvish word for human?

[Jeremiah12LGeek]

That's just ridiculous, and a serious failing to understand cause and effect.

 

I don't think anyone's ability to understand cause and effect has anything to do with the topic at hand. It's an extremely strange thing to bring up.

 

The relevant point here is that the players did not bring this issue up. BioWare did.

 

BioWare didn't bring up this issue, the OP did. BioWare told a story. It would appear that you are the one who has trouble with cause and effect.

 

By writing a story arc specifically about this issue, BioWare is effectively asking the player "How does your character feel about this?"

 

You start a sentence with "writing a story" and then finish with "is effectively asking the player..." You do understand that telling a story is not the same thing as asking questions, I hope?

 

They could have avoided this issue. Nobody asked them or forced them to talk about it. They decided to talk about it. They decided to write a story about it.

 

Yes, they decided to write a story about something. That's what they do every time they make a video game. If they didn't, this conversation would be moot, because there would be no game to discuss.

 

A story not giving you the option to dislike something and a story asking you your opinion on something and then preventing you from saying you dislike it are two completely different things.

 

This sentence makes no sense. Stories can't prevent you from disliking anything - they are stories, you are a person. And stories don't ask anyone's opinion of anything, they present scenarios, and you have an opinion on those scenarios. No one prevented anyone from saying they dislike something: after all, the OP is here, saying he didn't like it.

 

If your implication is that stories are required to give you the option to express your opinion about every possible scenario while you experience the story, then you are going to spend your life disappointed about most things, because that is neither possible, nor a reasonable thing to ask for.

[leaguer of one]

Gee Thedas sure is progressive for what is supposed to be a dark fantasy universe!

In contrast both male and female elves have a fear of being forced on.

[Chiramu]

This.

 

If it bothers you so much, you can always reject his subsequent offer of becoming friends with him. That actually affects how he interacts with you to some extent.

 

The OP is not bothered by the fact that Dorian is homosexual if you've bothered to read the post, he is upset with the fact that there is no other options aside from acceptance. 

 

Rejecting his offer to join the party has nothing to do with him being homosexual so how is that a fix? 

[Jeremiah12LGeek]

My advice is to just sit back and enjoy the shitshow, I mean you could argue with these people but if the BSN has taught me anything the Dragon Age forums are notoriously stubborn when it comes to acknowledging logic and reason, don't even bother arguing, just grab some popcorn and laugh as they rage on, it is the only way to maintain your sanity.

 

What was presented in the post that you quoted really had nothing to do with logic or reason.

[Shechinah]

(to MoonDrummer) It is a term that means "quick children" in elvish and was used by the ancient elves to describe humans because of their shorter lifespans. I cannot remember if it was confirmed or indicate to have been used as a slur in ancient times but it likely was as the ancient elves seemingly believed the humans caused the elves near them to lose their immortality. It is used by modern elves as a slur.

 

As an interesting note, Abelas refers to the elven Inquisitor as a "shemlen" because they too are not immortal and from how he talks about the Dalish, it seems to hold negative connotations.

[Fiery Phoenix]

The OP is not bothered by the fact that Dorian is homosexual if you've bothered to read the post, he is upset with the fact that there is no other options aside from acceptance. 

 

Rejecting his offer to join the party has nothing to do with him being homosexual so how is that a fix? 

Never said it was a fix. What I meant is it can be used as a means of indirectly illustrating the other option that the OP desires.

[phaonica]

I would have loved playing an Elf on my high horse. "Keep your Maker, Human Lord!"  I also would have loved playing a pampered noble. "Solas, be a dear and fetch me water...that is what your kind is good at, yes?"

Yeah, I don't remember my human having options to treat the elves like inferiors. I do personally like being able to play characters with "flaws" such as being racist towards the elves, but you just aren't given full freedom to play certain types of a$$holes.

[PCThug]

Given that Bioware has been one of the more progressive developers when it comes to portraying different sexualities (with some missteps along the way, admittedly) I'm amazed by some of the players they attract.

[ComedicSociopathy]

The OP is not bothered by the fact that Dorian is homosexual if you've bothered to read the post, he is upset with the fact that there is no other options aside from acceptance. 

 

Rejecting his offer to join the party has nothing to do with him being homosexual so how is that a fix? 

 

Why would the PC not accept Dorian and his sexuality if homosexuality is almost universally accepted every culture in Thedas? It's like being angry that you can't reject Vivienne because she's black. 

[Sylvianus]

Hmmmm I must have missed that part where the IQ can rail against heterosexual romances. Its NOT fair!!!!!! waaaaaaaaaaaaaaa! I demand my bigotry be recognized!!

 

I don't quite understand this joke as a comparison , and that doesn't even make sense. 

 

It's easy. Dorian is bringing the fact that he is gay as an issue in his personal quest. It isn't the player, it's Dorian. The whole affair is I'm gay and my family does not like it and tried to change me. And after obviously he is asking help, and you have variety of choices and dialogue options. Did you have any of that or close with an hetero character ? No. That's probably why then, you never had to figure out about something like that. The fact is that dragon ag is an RPG, if there is a specific issue that the player has to deal with, an issue brought by Bioware, it's probably better to have different possibilities to react for the sake of RP. 

 

Given that the op has apparently no issues with the lack of douchebag options in DAI, but has suddenly a problem with Dorian and not being able to say ' you are disgusting ' , I am pretty sure that he has zero legetimate reasons to complain.

 

However, Bioware should be careful next time. I didn't like what they did with Krem, where you have zero possibilities to respond to Iron Bull patronizing you about Krem. I hated that part. You are bringing this issue to my character that I should roleplay as I wish ? Then you are going to give me several ways to react in this case. If you don't want that Bioware, then do not bring this issue at all. 

 

More generally. I should be able to play a racist, an evil man, a jerk  if I want to. It should be a possibility. I'm pretty sure that in mass effect I was able to play a racist jerk since I played one, that was a good thing, and I hate racism in real life. People should be able to know the difference between roleplay and irl points of views. This. is. a video. game. rpg. That's it. 

 

Roleplaying isn't supposed to be about irl politics and political correctness. I want that sh*t out of my game. I'm really disturbed that we can hardly be a jerk in DA:I.

 

Now, for Doran, I had zero issues. so, I should probably remain out of that thread, since it is specifically about his quest.

[ComedicSociopathy]

I don't quite understand this joke as a comparison , and that doesn't even make sense. 

 

It's easy. Dorian is bringing the fact that he is gay as an issue in his personal quest. It isn't the player, it's Dorian. The whole affair is I'm gay and my family does not like it and tried to change me. And after obviously he is asking help, and you have variety of choices and dialogue options. Did you have any of that or close with an hetero character ? No. That's probably why then, you never had to figure out about something like that. The fact is that dragon ag is an RPG, if there is a specific issue that the player has to deal with, an issue brought by Bioware, it's probably better to have different possibilities to react for the sake of RP. 

 

Given that the op has apparently no issues with the lack of douchebag options in DAI, but has suddenly a problem with Dorian and not being able to say ' you are disgusting ' , I am pretty sure that he has zero legetimate reasons to complain.

 

However, Bioware should be careful next time. I didn't like what they did with Krem, where you have zero possibilities to respond to Iron Bull patronizing you about Krem. I hated that part. You are bringing this issue to my character that I should roleplay as I wish ? Then you are going to give me several ways to react in this case. If you don't want that Bioware, then do not bring this issue at all. 

 

More generally. I should be able to play a racist, an evil man, a jerk  if I want to. It should be a possibility. I'm pretty sure that in mass effect I was able to play a racist jerk since I played one, that was a good thing, and I hate racism in real life. People should be able to know the difference between roleplay and irl points of views. This. is. a video. game. rpg. That's it. 

 

Roleplaying isn't supposed to be about irl politics and political correctness. I want that sh*t out of my game. I'm really disturbed that we can hardly be a jerk in DA:I.

 

Now, for Doran, I had zero issues. so, I should probably remain out of that thread now, since it is specifically about his quest.

 

My problem with the stance, "I should be able to roleplay however I want" is that Bioware would have to ask itself how far a PC can go in their games. Alright, my character can be racist, sexist, homophobic and horrible sociopathic monster. OK, now how about rape, that's pretty horrible as well, should that be an option in the game? What about domestic abuse in a romance, should that be allowed in the game for the sake of player freedom? It would be realistic, yes, it would certainly make the game darker, sure, and I could possibly see it be done in a tastefully way, but I can also see how it could be cringe-worthy and alienate people from the franchise. You can argue that people don't have to take that dialogue option and thus shouldn't complain about its existence, but the fact of the matter is, people will complain and demand that something so controversial be removed from the game altogether. Bioware has the unenviable task of determining how far they want to take their game in terms of having PC's be nasty and morally disgusting and sometimes they choose to say, "No, were not doing that". That is their right as a creator and while people can argue against that decision it is ultimately the developers right.

 

But hey, perhaps DA 4 will return us to being allowed to make more ruthless characters. I for one hope that we can kill innocent children, flay enemies, beat love interests, sacrifice people for no logically reason and be able to say knife-ear, nug humper, shemlen and oxmen, ******, she-male, he-she, dog lord and halla-rider to whomever I want, because player freedom should come before good taste.