69 réponses à ce sujet

[Altruismo]

Forum software win: double post

[Shelled]

Arcane warrior is not the best class.

 

It can't do more damage than the assassin.

 

It doesn't support the team better than a keeper/ele/necro

 

It doesn't tank like the legionaire

 

It has no CC effects that prevent damage being done to teammates

 

It's definitely the best solo character. But it's hardly the best unit for multiplayer, because you don't have to solo it and there are other classes that specialize better than it. 

it doesn't support the team better than a necro? You're dreaming.

[DrakeHasNoFlow]

It is the BEST class period, there is not a single character that can do all the things cillian can do and survive at extraction. Please tell me a character that solo perilous with a mid level staff without a massive number of promotions? The character was designed as a lone wolf if your trying to debate if he is bad a team player than yes he is but that is what pota is for. There is not one character that survive, dps, and carry like he can. There may be other characters that can do certain things better but not everything at a much lower promotion/skill level.

[Beerfish]

It is the BEST class period, there is not a single character that can do all the things cillian can do and survive at extraction. Please tell me a character that solo perilous with a mid level staff without a massive number of promotions? The character was designed as a lone wolf if your trying to debate if he is bad a team player than yes he is but that is what pota is for. There is not one character that survive, dps, and carry like he can. There may be other characters that can do certain things better but not everything at a much lower promotion/skill level.

The bolded part is the problem, most don't use that ability.  If you really think you are a lone wolf then solo.  The bigger problem than just not having as much fun in games where an AW runs off to do his thing that you have a 50/50 chance of the guy actually being as good as he should be and many a AW is off way ahead after activating a spawn yelling 'over here!' as he crawls on hands and knees to the group.

 

I do agree for sure that in the right hands he is the class most able to handle needful soloing like in the last wave.  I won't look at him with total scorn because good ole Cillian has won a few extractions for the team when all else have croaked.

[Shelled]

its not designed as a lone wolf at all though if you know how to play it as a team tank. Clearly a lot of people here do not.

[veramis]

Yesterday, I played with a very good AW who knew how to time his abilities to work with the team. He cast PotA so that the entire large group of mobs before the next zone door was pulled in or walked in, and the assassin blew them all up in two hits. Total time of encounter from time of aggro to key drop sound was less than 8 seconds. The dead venatori on the ground looked like shrimp cocktails fanned out in a circle.

[Drasca]

Don't compare PotA to Firestorm, Firewalls or Walking Bomb's cc effects. We both know this is wrong. I love PotA but its main purpose is to make AoE more effective not outright prevent damage. 

 

In so far as weakness goes, pretty much every class has access to some kind of weakness. Irrelevant, because it;s not unique to the AW. 

 

Consistent weakness not irrelevant when looking at the shock weaken sleep combo. AoE CC both from pull and sleep status effect, and static charge paralyze.

 

Most AW's are SB scrubs, but not all AW's are scrubs. Don't try to compare unless you've seen my Combo King in action facetanking the RTC keeping him constantly paralyzed while everything else is stuck behind him. RTC goes down quickly as the team can focus fire on a perma-cc'ed target.

 

i.e. you haven't seen what a Combo King AW is really capable of.

[actionhero112]

it doesn't support the team better than a necro? You're dreaming.

 

 

Constant AoE knockdown and virulent Freezes is godlike cc. See when these status's occur, more important dps units don't get hit. This is support.

 

Please tell me more about why an AoE pull which doesn't disrupt aggro drawing is more valuable. Arrows will still fly around randomly. More important dps units will get hit. This is not support. 

[veramis]

Please tell me more about why an AoE pull which doesn't disrupt aggro drawing is more valuable. Arrows will still fly around randomly. More important dps units will get hit. This is not support. 

 

A properly played AW will grab all or almost all of the aggro before the rest of his team can, pull in most of the mobs to a single point, and either the AW or teammates will kill all of the mobs being pulled in before PotA animation even ends. Many abilities that appear to be single-target, or have very narrow AoE, can hit every single target pulled in assuming they haven't already died to someone else's attack.

 

AW is the best class to synergize with necromancer too PotA+walking bomb=1 second of epileptic seizure-inducing screen shake and all enemies pulled in dead. Some other great synergies are archer longshot/upgraded explosive shot, templar wombo combo, assassin deathblow and possibly even twin fangs/shadow strike if you don't have deathblow (but must time precisely), katari charging bull+mighty blow, and most elementalist dps abilities.

[actionhero112]

A properly played AW will grab all or almost all of the aggro before the rest of his team can, pull in most of the mobs to a single point, and either the AW or teammates will kill all of the mobs being pulled in before PotA animation even ends. Many abilities that appear to be single-target, or have very narrow AoE, can hit every single target pulled in assuming they haven't already died to someone else's attack.

 

AW is the best class to synergize with necromancer too PotA+walking bomb=1 second of epileptic seizure-inducing screen shake and all enemies pulled in dead. Some other great synergies are archer longshot/upgraded explosive shot, templar wombo combo, assassin deathblow and possibly even twin fangs/shadow strike if you don't have deathblow (but must time precisely), katari charging bull+mighty blow, and most elementalist dps abilities.

What is this theory you have that PotA maintains aggro on the AW? I can tell you it doesn't. I have used PotA in multiplayer. Enemies will get pulled to the center with their backs turned to me firing arrows at another character. It wouldn't even make sense that PotA draws aggro considering where the ability comes from, the rift mage, the squishiest mage specialization. Thus the squishiest class in SP. If every time you used PotA in singleplayer, you got riddled with arrows, that would be straight bs. 

 

Because of how this game works, you are correct that all melee attacks have some degree of AoE. This doesn't make PotA better cc however, it just means it makes AoE more effective. 

 

PotA is a good move. It's easily the best team oriented one the AW has to offer and it acts as some degree of cc on melee units. (I hesitate to call it true cc because it doesn't prevent attacks from being made, which is the whole point of cc to begin with)  But it doesn't outclass what the Ele and Necro has to offer in terms of constant group cc. 

[veramis]

What is this theory you have that PotA maintains aggro on the AW? 

 

snip

 

PotA is a good move. It's easily the best team oriented one the AW has to offer and it acts as some degree of cc on melee units. (I hesitate to call it true cc because it doesn't prevent attacks from being made, which is the whole point of cc to begin with)  But it doesn't outclass what the Ele and Necro has to offer in terms of constant group cc. 

 

I never had such a theory. I know for a fact though, most enemies will aggro on the first person in sight. A properly played AW will grab aggro before the team can.

 

Crowd control is sometimes used to refer to moving enemies around or grouping them up to prep them for attacks, and it is in that sense I use the word, not claiming in any way it stops archers from firing. However, I personally believe it is stronger than even the elementalist firestorm. Maybe if you watched a video of shelled playing AW, you'll better understand why I think PotA  is such a good ability. Note that very often he just ignores enemies until he has PotA available, after which he will gather all of the enemies to a spot to kill them all with narrow or small AoE attacks.

 

http://forum.bioware...plar-commander/

[jamdjedi]

I'm interested in this class simply because I DO play the game and ME3 like it should be played -as a TEAM game.. I'm interested in unlocking him and making him a team player...my two favorite classes are the Keeper and Templar.. I've had many friend invites simply because how I played both classes

[actionhero112]

 

I never had such a theory. I know for a fact though, most enemies will aggro on the first person in sight. A properly played AW will grab aggro before the team can.

 

Crowd control is sometimes used to refer to moving enemies around or grouping them up to prep them for attacks, and it is in that sense I use the word, not claiming in any way it stops archers from firing. However, I personally believe it is stronger than even the elementalist firestorm. Maybe if you watched a video of shelled playing AW, you'll better understand why I think PotA  is such a good ability. Note that very often he just ignores enemies until he has PotA available, after which he will gather all of the enemies to a spot to kill them all with narrow or small AoE attacks.

 

http://forum.bioware...plar-commander/

Hm? Was it you or shelled that said PotA maintains and actively draws aggro? W/e. 

 

Line of sight pulling is unreliable at best when pugging. Even if every single pug allowed you to LoS pull, that strategy doesn't work for the most important area of all, the fifth one, which coincidentally is when threat management really matters. 

 

I've already solo'd perilous with the AW. I don't need to see someone else do it. PotA, walk into the middle with FC. Spirit blade, spirit blade dead. Repeat. 

 

It's not more powerful than a constant AoE knockdown, because while units are knocked down, they don't attack. Units can still attack while pulled. AW has no way to manage what way those attacks land. Not effective cc. Very good for AoE damage abilities, but it isn't cc. 

[akots1]

Don't compare PotA to Firestorm ... . 

PotA does not have screen shake, is very effective at weakening enemies and opens almost all available combo types either by AW or any other class. Try running Katari into fire storm and you won't be able to do a thing just because you won't be able to see a thing. But inside PotA, it is a two-button win (pommel strike + mighty blow if timed correctly). Same is true for other classes. PotA >>>> fire storm for everyone.

[veramis]

while units are knocked down, they don't attack.

 

snip

 

Very good for AoE damage abilities, but it isn't cc. 

 

In good perilous teams, all enemies pulled in by PotA will be dead either before the animation ends or soon after it ends, and dead enemies definitely don't attack. When you're in a perilous team with very high DPS many CC abilities simply don't have the chance to work on the enemies because they often die within 10 seconds of showing up on someone's screen.

 

Again, you claim that I am saying that PotA will cause enemies to do less attacks. Let me repeat myself, when I called it a CC, I meant that it groups up enemies. If you prefer, I will avoid calling it a CC, and simply call it an ability that groups up enemies.

[CelticRanger275]

Fiddzz, on 24 Feb 2015 - 10:56 AM, said:

6. Character balance changes

- As we said on the stream, these are of less concern to us that other fixes, as our game is not a PvP or competitive environment, having a character that is stronger than others is not game breaking.  We will keep monitoring agents and their power levels to adjust as we seen fit.

Suck it.

[actionhero112]

PotA does not have screen shake, is very effective at weakening enemies and opens almost all available combo types either by AW or any other class. Try running Katari into fire storm and you won't be able to do a thing just because you won't be able to see a thing. But inside PotA, it is a two-button win (pommel strike + mighty blow if timed correctly). Same is true for other classes. PotA >>>> fire storm for everyone.

I can see pretty clearly in Firestorm, I don't really have any trouble with vision at all with the move. Even if I did, I don't even need to see clearly in this game. All I have to do is attack my target, which I can lock onto. Any risk of counterattack is considerably lessened with the unit forced onto the ground. You know, that thing PotA doesn't prevent. Attacks by enemies. 

 

So no, Firestorm >>>>> PotA.

In good perilous teams, all enemies pulled in by PotA will be dead either before the animation ends or soon after it ends, and dead enemies definitely don't attack. When you're in a perilous team with very high DPS many CC abilities simply don't have the chance to work on the enemies because they often die within 10 seconds of showing up on someone's screen.

 

Again, you claim that I am saying that PotA will cause enemies to do less attacks. Let me repeat myself, when I called it a CC, I meant that it groups up enemies. If you prefer, I will avoid calling it a CC, and simply call it an ability that groups up enemies.

And enemies caught in a firestorm and walking bomb chain are basically dead as well. The difference is that normal mooks vulnerable to physical effects can't attack, and that includes the most dangerous mook, the archer mook. PotA does not prevent attacks, Walking Bomb/Freeze and Firestorm does. 

 

You're looking at this from the AW perspective. The fact that PotA is not an aggro grab or prevent attacks does not matter to you, because  you're invulnerable to attacks anyways. But for your teammates see, we notice the difference. 

 

If Perilous was as easy as you make it sound, we would never lose it.

[DANger0us]

damage
"oh look an AW i need to give him barrier!!!!" said no keeper eva !
CC
debuffs
erm..... the good feeling that he can solo perilous even when all 3 other ppl are dead...

BUT when your talking about bad AW´s.. you need to compare it vs bad archers/keepers/legos.........................

I agree ... I've played with some terrible people if every class build. I've seen some awful Legos but that build is a beast if done right. Should we start and anti-Lego thread?

I play all of the classes, including the AW. I'm not a scrub AW and I'm sure I'm not alone there...

[veramis]

You're looking at this from the AW perspective. The fact that PotA is not an aggro grab or prevent attacks does not matter to you, because  you're invulnerable to attacks anyways. But for your teammates see, we notice the difference. 

 

If Perilous was as easy as you make it sound, we would never lose it.

 

Actually I prefer other people play AW. That PotA doesn't grab aggro doesn't matter to me, because again, a properly played AW will aggro most if not all of the enemies before the team can.

 

It's pretty hard to lose on perilous with an AW . Anyway, I think we've reached an impasse but its not much of a divergence of opinion. I agree with you that elementalist and necromancer are great in most teams and some really good ones can be better assets to the team than some AW's. I just personally lean towards AW who knows how to tank and PotA for the team as being the most useful class from my own experiences.

[russ4ua16]

Who started this mess?