110 réponses à ce sujet

[Chuvvy]

To explain why he isn't in inquisition.

[ThomasBlaine]

We don't know what he did to extend his life aside from that it was blood magic, and we don't know if whatever methods he used are even applicable to non-mage wardens.  Besides, if the Hero of Ferelden does find some way to remove or completely avoid the Calling that doesn't require blood magic, then I imagine that would be preferable to Avernus' methods.  

 

Even if it would only be applicable to mage wardens, it would be applicable to all mage wardens. That alone would make a huge difference.

 

He did it with blood magic, and I'm not entirely sure it had much to do with him being a Warden, or at least it didn't seem so from what he said. I would guess that depending on if Avernus was allowed to continue his research or not plays a part in how close the Warden is to finding the true cure.

 

Wardens on the whole seem perfectly willing to make use of blood magic for whatever ends they see as necessary.

 

Hm... if it's just standard blood magic that Avernus used, I guess it's not that big a deal since he's probably not the only one who knows how to do that.  It may be something similar to what Enchanter Sweeny alluded to in DAO's Mage origin when he said that magic that could fix his aging body wasn't anything he'd be interested in practicing.   And now that I think about it, I guess living twice as long as normal but still being plagued by nightmares and incessant whispering probably wouldn't be all that great...

 

You're right that extending one's life might be a known capability of blood magic, in which case it probably is only applicable to mages. But I hugely disagree that nightmares and whispering is too much to pay for an extra two hundred years (more or less the time Avernus spent in the tower according to the vague timeline) in which to live, study and fight the darkspawn.

[Raiil]

Because not wanting to die is a perfectly natural reaction?

 

Oh, I'm sure that every Warden has their own reason. I know my Amell a) didn't submit herself, Alistair and Morrigan to the Dark Ritual to still live a truncated life, to give her and Alistair time to reform Ferelden, and c) to spite the Order, as she hates the Order. My Cousland just wants to see his little boy grow up. And so on and so forth.

[Phoe77]

Even if it would only be applicable to mage wardens, it would be applicable to all mage wardens. That alone would make a huge difference.

 

 

Sure, but if Avernus' experiments could only benefit mage wardens and whatever the Warden finds can benefit all of them regardless of maginess, then that would be even more valuable.  Even if not, though, it still probably pays to have a backup plan, especially if said plan doesn't rely on blood magic.

[KaiserShep]

Eh, looking for a cure seems like a better option than waiting to die a horrible death in a miserable monster-filled tunnel. It's like that old saying goes: F*ck that.

[Icy Magebane]

You're right that extending one's life might be a known capability of blood magic, in which case it probably is only applicable to mages. But I hugely disagree that nightmares and whispering is too much to pay for an extra two hundred years (more or less the time Avernus spent in the tower according to the vague timeline) in which to live, study and fight the darkspawn.

I think it's a good option for those willing to accept the side effects.  Assuming he didn't die in a fire that also destroyed all of his research notes, Avernus should share his findings with the Wardens and let them decide if they want to use the same blood magic ritual (assuming that's what it is) he is using in order to defeat the Calling. 

 

But I guess the HoF is going to come up with something that can totally neutralize the Taint when a given Warden feels it getting too strong... I guess we'll just have to see if that has some unforeseen side effects that go beyond the normal problems associated with playing host to the Taint.  Knowing Bioware, it will.

[AresKeith]

What makes the Calling "bad" is that it cuts the Grey Wardens' lives short. Quadrupling their lifespans way past the natural limit would make it irrelevant, except in how the individual warden would feel about his manner of dying at the point of his demise - taking place centuries later than if he had never become a Warden at all. And again, Avernus grew old over the course of his extended life, past the proportional 30 years he should have had after taking the Joining potion. He did defeat the Calling as it's normally understood, at least.

 

Maybe Avernus wanted a better way to do it than constantly extending his life?

[ShadowLordXII]

I was asking the same question myself when Morrigan mentioned that the Warden left to find a cure. Most of my Wardens let Avernus live to continue his research, why wouldn't they go to Soldier's Peak (held by the Dryden's who are good friends to the Warden) and either ask Avernus for help or use his notes to at least prolong their life beyond 30 years?

 

Perhaps the idea is that the HOF has decided that he wants to be rid of the taint entirely. Why don't they go to Fiona and ask how she was cured of the taint?

 

You could keep spinning questions, but the honest truth is that Bioware wants the HOF to stay on the bus and out of the way of their plans for Thedas.

[Medhia_Nox]

Well - while it would have no merit as to why their "Hero of Ferelden" wanted a cure - MY Hero of Ferelden never wanted to be a Grey Warden, doesn't believe in some vaunted heroic myth about the order, and now that he's obtained glory, a kingdom (Ferelden) and has a normal son with Morrigan who he will position to take the throne... being free of the everything Grey Warden holds a huge interest to my HoF.

 

I was ecstatic to hear what the HoF was doing... totally fit my canon.

[line_genrou]

My warden wants to be with his love and watch his son grow up, so he's not planning to die anytime soon

[KaiserShep]

Well - while it would have no merit as to why their "Hero of Ferelden" wanted a cure - MY Hero of Ferelden never wanted to be a Grey Warden, doesn't believe in some vaunted heroic myth about the order, and now that he's obtained glory, a kingdom (Ferelden) and has a normal son with Morrigan who he will position to take the throne... being free of the everything Grey Warden holds a huge interest to my HoF.

 

I was ecstatic to hear what the HoF was doing... totally fit my canon.

 

 

Yeah my Warden objected from the very beginning, and would have been pretty resentful of Duncan, for both the opportunistic conscription while abandoning her parents, and for not simply kicking Jory out of Ostagar rather than knifing him (nuts to their secrets). With Alistair's annoying romanticizing of the order and everyone's ideas about how they're supposed to be great heroes, in conjunction with the history of Sophia Dryden and all this stuff about the Calling, my Warden would want out of this suicide squad after the Blight is dealt with.

[Phoe77]

I think it's a good option for those willing to accept the side effects.  Assuming he didn't die in a fire that also destroyed all of his research notes, Avernus should share his findings with the Wardens and let them decide if they want to use the same blood magic ritual (assuming that's what it is) he is using in order to defeat the Calling. 

 

Haven't the wardens caught enough flak for using blood magic rituals for things already?  Literally every time we see them doing it, things go badly.  I certainly wouldn't press my awful luck if I were them. 

[KaiserShep]

I certainly wouldn't press my awful luck if I were them. 

 

Well, in fairness, they're all screwed anyway, so it probably doesn't make that much of a difference.

[Icy Magebane]

Haven't the wardens caught enough flak for using blood magic rituals for things already?  Literally every time we see them doing it, things go badly.  I certainly wouldn't press my awful luck if I were them. 

Well, tbh I'm the last person who should be defending blood magic, but you have to admit that what Avernus did, however he did it, pretty much defeated the most frightening aspect of the Calling:  a greatly shortened life.  Whatever problems you and I may have with blood magic, the fact is that the Wardens do not forbid it and thus they should each be given the chance to decide for themselves if they want to use Avernus's cure.  Whatever it is... depending on the specifics, it might actually be so gruesome that I'd have to reconsider that stance (although my canon Warden probably would not).

 

It just seems odd that this part of the story was forgotten, especially by the HoF.  Maybe Bioware will kill Avernus in an upcoming novel and that will finish his plotline while simultaneously erasing most of the evidence of the cure...?  With the HoF, they can say whatever they want about why they'd refuse Avernus's method... just like Hawke, he is their character now, aftar all.

[Phoe77]

Perhaps, but I imagine they don't want to be reviled by the entirety of Thedas.  

 

Really though, I just think it's funny to see people advocating for the wardens to go ahead with blood rituals after the events in Inquisition.   Still, I was mostly joking.

 

I don't actually have a problem with blood magic.  I just think that the wardens should probably start trying to look better to the average Thedosian, and part of that would probably be distancing themselves from overt blood magic.  At the end of the day, my point in this thread has been that, even if Avernus' research turns out to work perfectly fine for people, it still couldn't hurt to have a different way to go about achieving a similar end.  

 

And by far the most frightening thing about the Calling and the taint, to me at least, is the gradual corruption that it signifies.  I would personally rather die than turn into a ghoul.

[Icy Magebane]

Perhaps, but I imagine they don't want to be reviled by the entirety of Thedas.  

 

Really though, I just think it's funny to see people advocating for the wardens to go ahead with blood rituals after the events in Inquisition.   Still, I was mostly joking.

 

I don't actually have a problem with blood magic.  I just think that the wardens should probably start trying to look better to the average Thedosian, and part of that would probably be distancing themselves from overt blood magic.  At the end of the day, my point in this thread has been that, even if Avernus' research turns out to work perfectly fine for people, it still couldn't hurt to have a different way to go about achieving a similar end.  

 

And by far the most frightening thing about the Calling and the taint, to me at least, is the gradual corruption that it signifies.  I would personally rather die than turn into a ghoul.

Yeah, the bolded part I can totally agree with.  While I do not like loose ends and would like Avernus's method fully explained (both how it works and why he isn't letting anybody else use it), I won't say no to alternatives.  Since these are people who come from all different walks of life, I doubt that every Warden is okay with their mages practicing blood magic... heck, there are probably mages among the Wardens who wouldn't even consider it.

 

And sorry for speaking for everyone about what the most frightening aspect of the Calling would be... I probably could have worded that differently.

[Phoe77]

Nah, it wasn't meant to be accusatory in any way.  I just like to derail my own posts with tangential information occasionally.

[Esmerella]

So your saying that my warden should be selfish enough to kill several other wardens to prolong her own life?  I mean I was selfish enough to talk Alistair into doing the dark ritual but actually killing other Grey Wardens to extend my own life..no..not happening.

 

As for Loghain I believe Alistair said  it was ten to twenty years before the Calling sets in and Loghain would have only been a warden for ten years.  His Calling may have been real and not caused by Corypheus.

 

The more interesting lead is Fiona.  I must admit it has been years since I read the books and seeing her has sparked an interest in rereading it though I haven't done it yet.  I am thinking this is the lead the Warden is following up on.

[ThomasBlaine]

Perhaps, but I imagine they don't want to be reviled by the entirety of Thedas.  

 

Really though, I just think it's funny to see people advocating for the wardens to go ahead with blood rituals after the events in Inquisition.   Still, I was mostly joking.

 

I don't actually have a problem with blood magic.  I just think that the wardens should probably start trying to look better to the average Thedosian, and part of that would probably be distancing themselves from overt blood magic.  At the end of the day, my point in this thread has been that, even if Avernus' research turns out to work perfectly fine for people, it still couldn't hurt to have a different way to go about achieving a similar end.  

 

And by far the most frightening thing about the Calling and the taint, to me at least, is the gradual corruption that it signifies.  I would personally rather die than turn into a ghoul.

 

The decision of whether or not to share and use Avernus' research more widely would have been made long before the events of Inquisition, and even the majority of DAII, and the Wardens are perfectly capable of keeping secrets, so that's a moot point. It's true that two ways to get out of the calling is better than one, but I don't understand why the HoF would think that a second option even existed, much less abandon his post or family to go hunting for it, when s/he already knew of one tried and true method.

 

It sounds to me that s/he must have found a concrete lead on something possibly more important than just one more solution for the Taint, although that in and of itself could be a side effect of some kind. Or it could be that s/he's doing or looking for something else entirely, and Morrigan is trying to deflect suspicion and keep the Inquisition from poking its nose in by making it sound like something harmless and apparently uninteresting to anyone not a Warden.

 

The most terrifying thing about the Taint to me is the fact that fellow Wardens and darkspawn can both sense and locate you by proximity. The shortened lifespan is not much of a bother, assuming the average age of recruits around 25 that would still allow you to live well beyond the normal life expectancy of medieval humans, much less dedicated warriors. The infertility hurts a bit more, but the real kicker to me is that if you attempt to desert you'll be easily identified by any Warden in the area, and you'll potentially be targeted by darkspawn wherever you go.

 

 

So your saying that my warden should be selfish enough to kill several other wardens to prolong her own life?  I mean I was selfish enough to talk Alistair into doing the dark ritual but actually killing other Grey Wardens to extend my own life..no..not happening.

 

As for Loghain I believe Alistair said  it was ten to twenty years before the Calling sets in and Loghain would have only been a warden for ten years.  His Calling may have been real and not caused by Corypheus.

 

The more interesting lead is Fiona.  I must admit it has been years since I read the books and seeing her has sparked an interest in rereading it though I haven't done it yet.  I am thinking this is the lead the Warden is following up on.

 

Who says that? To my knowledge, what Avernus did to extend his life is never stated to have required the sacrifice of other Wardens. He killed a few in his experiments to develop his methods, yes, but actually using them should not make it necessary.

 

Alistair said that it takes about thirty years for a Warden to begin to hear the Calling. Loghain hearing it was definitely Corypheus' doing.

 

That could be true, but in my playthough I killed Fiona, which is public knowledge, and am still told months later that the HoF is looking for the cure with no mention of her. It's not impossible that she was important to the investigation, but it doesn't seem like it.

[DanteYoda]

I kinda wish my Warden had died early now, after DA:I i'm kinda over Dragon Age loop holes and poor writing, I hope he doesn't find the cure and goes to fight Dark spawn myself it seems a more right thing to do.

[Shahadem]

The solution is already discovered, long before the first game. Avernus clearly figured out not only how to evade the Calling, he also prolonged his life by centuries. He's a perfectly cooperative resource of the Ferelden Grey Wardens, and the Hero of Ferelden already had the option of drinking his blood potion when they met. What's there to discuss?

 

And the HoF already drank the potion. And everyone already knows what the taint is and knows that the only actual solution will be a magical solution involving study of how to use magic to remove the taint, not running through the Deep Roads. 

 

I also wonder why no one wanted to study Fiona to figure out how she was cured. It was clearly magic to remove the taint, but no one seemed to really care.

[Nefla]

I always knew I should have kept a bit of Andraste's sacred ashes for myself.

[KaiserShep]

I always knew I should have kept a bit of Andraste's sacred ashes for myself.

It's too bad that we didn't have this option. It's not like the Warden wasn't entitled to a souvenir.

[katokires]

The only interesting discussion in the Inquisition forum is about Origins.

 

That beign said... To look for a cure is a lot more than the cure itself. It is to understand the calling, understand its origins and perhaps even get a lot of info about the blight, the archdemons and Maker knows what else! In this case, the quest makes it all worthy... probably.

 

Avernus probably made a lot of improvements but it can't be compared to what warden's quest would unveil. I would say that Avernus was about countering the EFFECTS of the calling and not the calling itself. Anyway, I loved the guy since not only he gave me skills in Origins but also stat points in DA2. Avernus

[BouncyFrag]

I was really excited when I saw the make contact with the Warden operation only to be disappointed when he just sends a postcard. TBH, I think Bioware did this because it would have been a challenge to pull off his appearance in the game.