110 réponses à ce sujet

[Lumix19]

It could have been what he was doing, yes, but I see no actual basis for that. Plenty of infections spread erratically, and if some people are resistant and others aren't then that proves that the different reactions stem from variations in the physiology of the diseased, not the disease itself. Figuring out what makes some plants more resistant than others would be interesting, yes, but how would it help? And would it help enough to justify the warden ignoring all his other responsibilities?
 
Fiona wasn't cured by some weird fluke of magic and blight sickness, the Architect who explicitly has power over the taint deliberately did something to her. And since there's no way the HoF could possibly know this, it should not affect the decision to go hunting for the cure. The HoF never met Remille and Avernus never met either him or the Architect. As such, Avernus developed his cure independently, meaning that it should be possible for any mage, and the HoF had no way of knowing that the Architect's power could be taught, so that shouldn't factor into his/her decisions.
  
Avernus' solution was not even remotely temporary, it doubled his lifespan many times over and effectively fixed the corruption of the taint. We don't actually know that it takes a lot of blood magic, only that it took a lot to develop the method. Even assuming the practice actively requires human sacrifices, he could not possibly have had to kill more than one person for every 30-50 years with which he extended his life. My warden's personal kill-count was in the triple digits over the course of a single year, only about half of which were darkspawn. If he'd known how to do what Avernus did from the start, he could have outlived Flemeth.

I don't see any evidence against the idea so I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. Fiona wasn't cured deliberately if I recall correctly. I thought the brooch Remille gave her which was supposed to accelerate the progression of her taint (which it did do) also cured her of it, sounds accidental to me. Of course I'm not saying the HoF will go looking for the Architect, I'm sure there are other lines of inquiry. Avernus' solution was only temporary in the context of his unnaturally long life, assuming he did know precisely how to slow down the taint of course. It's possible that Avernus' solution would only had a decade or so to a normal Warden because they would have a normal lifespan rather then hundreds of years like Avernus.

[Phoe77]

Yes, frankly. How many accomplished construction workers have ever decided to suddenly learn medicine and embark on a quest to discover the secret to eternal life, do you think? They have a vested interest in curing death, don't they?

 

Again, the Warden has no reason to believe that a possibility of removing the taint exists outside of Avernus' methods, and slowing the taint to the point where it doesn't affect you within your actual lifetime is damn well the same as eradicating it. And Wardens HAVE investigated. The wardens have been investigating it for almost a thousand years. The Tevinter Magisters, experts far superior to the HoF, have been experimenting since the very first Blight.

 

A construction worker or an accountant or a professional football player who has a degenerative and eventually fatal disease could very well develop an interest in the processes of that disease.  People have been inspired to change their entire career path because a disease has been discovered in themselves or someone they care about.  Why is it unfathomable that the Warden, knowing that they're suffering from the taint, not be interested in finding new ways to combat the taint?

 

Either way, it seems like you're too focused on my medical example.  The point was that there are new discoveries to be made from the examination of poorly understood phenomena.  The Warden, because he is intimately connected to this particular phenomenon, is definitely in a position to be interested in learning about it.  Learning more about it could possibly open up a number of possible ways to improve life for wardens and anyone who suffers from lingering effects of the taint. 

[Fireheart]

Hawke found a letter from Avernus to the Warden-Commander, suggesting that Avernus had been sharing his research with the WC and First Warden, and that what he had recently learned could be extremely valuable. Avernus did say that he didn't have much time left, but who knows, Bioware could just retcon it like they did Leliana's death. This letter is found in Act 1.

The letter from the wikia, if allowed unethical research.
If Avernus could continue without restrictions...
The last shipment was quite helpful for my research, Commander. If you could double the supply next time, it would prove most efficacious. Additionally, the information regarding the Architect has proven invaluable—we have made several breakthroughs recently. As the Architect surmised, considerable untapped power exists within Grey Warden blood. When properly prepared, its effects can be remarkable.

But my research has also revealed some alarming implications, which I've attached in the old Acanthan cipher. I urge you to send this to the First Warden at once.

I will conduct further tests as long as I'm able. My documentation is very thorough—if time finally claims me, others may follow in my footsteps.

The quest is also called "Dark Epiphany".

[Shahadem]

Everything dies. Extending life is admirable depending on the means, which is subjective to the thing looking to extend their life.

However that seems to be only part of this equation.

The HoF-Warden (or perhaps the Orlesian-Warden, if the HoF is dead whatever) could be looking for a cure to the Calling to remove an Old God's influence from a Warden's mind. This, as we see in DAI, is a big problem for Wardens because once they hear it they become 'tards.

 

But there is already a viable solution. And Avernus's work has demonstrated that the only means to a cure is further magical study, something which requires no additional questing, just more lab work.

 

And if the HoF wasn't a mage, then the HoF likely has nothing useful to contribute to that lab work.

[Swaggerjking]

But there is already a viable solution. And Avernus's work has demonstrated that the only means to a cure is further magical study, something which requires no additional questing, just more lab work.

And if the HoF wasn't a mage, then the HoF likely has nothing useful to contribute to that lab work.

Lab work that requires torturing warden to their pain threshold on at least 4 yeah you could have the that greater good stuff but we don't know all that side effects but if they have a good way right now they go down fight killing as many darkspawn as they can and the cowards need to toughen up

If it ain't broke don't fix it

[MaxQuartiroli]

If you romanced Leliana she says to your Inquisitor that the HoF is looking for a cure so that they can live a longer life together, which really makes sense to me.. If you know you are going to die won't you do everything you can in order to stay alive for your beloved?

 

I don't know if they provide a reasonable explanation also in other cases.

[Uccio]

If you romanced Leliana she says to your Inquisitor that the HoF is looking for a cure so that they can live a longer life together, which really makes sense to me.. If you know you are going to die won't you do everything you can in order to stay alive for your beloved?

 

I don't know if they provide a reasonable explanation also in other cases.

 

It works with all of the LI´s. 

[Dieb]

My Warden was done with all the hassle of world saving, so she grew no beard and pretended to be Thom Rainier.

 

It makes as much sense to me.

[Poledo]

Why don't you all go ask Fiona - she figured it out apparently.

[Phoe77]

But there is already a viable solution. And Avernus's work has demonstrated that the only means to a cure is further magical study, something which requires no additional questing, just more lab work.

 

And if the HoF wasn't a mage, then the HoF likely has nothing useful to contribute to that lab work.

 

How was it proven that the only cure can come from magical study?

[Aren]

Everyone is free to think what they want but the truth is that this is simple a way to remove the HoF from the game with a lame excuse, yes we know that Avernus didn't evade the calling, however was the point to try to find a cure when you can use his researches to prolong your life for centuries.

 Don't tell me that is because is experiments  involve blood magic and demons because here into the BSN no one cares about how dangerous blood magic can be.

A lame excuse this is the answer.

[Raiil]

Reasons why Avernus's cure may not be doable?

 

-it could only work on mages. For non-mage Wardens or mage Wardens who romanced Alistair, this becomes an issues.

-resources. What Avernus did may require enough resources that it's not a viable cure for more than a few individuals.

-ethics. Perhaps the way Avernus did is violates the Warden's personal code, so they're looking for an alternative.

[Aren]

This is actually a very good point... considering how much longer than normal his natural lifespan became, whatever Avernus came up with is already a better option than the cure the HoF is currently seeking.

This, There is no need to find a cure, since the taint can be used better, and I'm still surprised that in all the Grey wardens history the only one who deserve truly the Nobel prize is Avernus genius of Thedas.

[Aren]

Reasons why Avernus's cure may not be doable?

 

-it could only work on mages. For non-mage Wardens or mage Wardens who romanced Alistair, this becomes an issues.

-resources. What Avernus did may require enough resources that it's not a viable cure for more than a few individuals.

-ethics. Perhaps the way Avernus did is violates the Warden's personal code, so they're looking for an alternative.

1) According to the lore every beings who carry the taint such as the emissaries are able to use their taint to cast spell, every grey warden can become a mage by using the taint  instead to the magical forces of the fade..

2) Maybe still the HoF is a single person  for the moment we cares about 1 person the order can wait.

3)I care nothing for the ethic of the grey wardens, they are   foolish in 2000 years the only one who make some progres seems Avernus.

[Phoe77]

Where do you get that bit of lore about the taint and magic?  I haven't read the books, but I would imagine that every other genlock would be casting spells at us if it were that easy.

 

As to ethics, it doesn't really matter whether or not you care.  It matters whether the characters do.  Judging by the events of Inquisition, it seems as though a lot of wardens aren't thrilled about sacrificing their own, even when it means stopping the blights once and for all (at least as far as they know).

[Raiil]

1) According to the lore every beings who carry the taint such as the emissaries are able to use their taint to cast spell, every grey warden can become a mage by using the taint  instead to the magical forces of the fade..

2) Maybe still the HoF is a single person  for the moment we cares about 1 person the order can wait.

3)I care nothing for the ethic of the grey wardens, they are   foolish in 2000 years the only one who make some progres seems Avernus.

 

 

1) Uh, what? Emissaries are mages, that doesn't mean all tainted creatures are mages, unless you want to suggest my Warden's mabari is now casting spells.

2) Maybe the Warden doesn't feel that way. Or maybe the amount of resources are still staggering and rare enough that it necessitates a search.

3) Uh... I said the Warden might not feel that way.

[Aren]

I always knew I should have kept a bit of Andraste's sacred ashes for myself.

A bit? better the entire Urn.

[Aren]

1) Uh, what? Emissaries are mages, that doesn't mean all tainted creatures are mages, unless you want to suggest my Warden's mabari is now casting spells.

 

Mages are just like any other mortal, the difference is that they have a connection to the fade due to their blood properties, however darkspawn have no link no connection to the fade but they have the same blood,  they can use the taint  to cast spell, most of them are less intelligent too mindless and cannot learn how to use their taint.

In DAA the mother as well as her disciples can use magic, all of them are able to do this, even the first disciple of the game who is supposed to be a warrior but prior to that event one of the companions of Mhairi stated before to die that the disciples had cast a blood magic to infect him from distance.

Every disciples is a mage(fo gameplay reasons however some of them cannot cast spell in combat),the Mother is a mage, the architect is a mage while the other darkspawn are not only because for the most part they are mindless, a Grey warden who has learn how to master the taint can gain access to this talent instead of use the taint just to perceive darkspawn or kill archdemons.

Anyway the point of the topic is that there is no need to find a cure which is true, as excuse they could easly say that the Warden is in a party somewhere.

[Phoe77]

Well that's wildly speculative.  

[Nefla]

A bit? better the entire Urn.

Someone would have squealed on us!

[Raiil]

That's a lot of supposition, Aren.

[DanteYoda]

If you romanced Leliana she says to your Inquisitor that the HoF is looking for a cure so that they can live a longer life together, which really makes sense to me.. If you know you are going to die won't you do everything you can in order to stay alive for your beloved?

 

I don't know if they provide a reasonable explanation also in other cases.

See that bothers me..

 

If they want to live a long life together then why aren't they together, Leliana is off doing her religion thing, Warden is off looking for a cure, and now Leliana is the Devine (in my playthrough) does she just drop that to become the wardens partner again, it seems like something that would take years to be and not something you can just drop in a second..

 

Not to mention the Warden is a high ranking one with lots of expectations from his armies..

 

I do not get how they will ever live together long or short.

[Uccio]

See that bothers me..

 

If they want to live a long life together then why aren't they together, Leliana is off doing her religion thing, Warden is off looking for a cure, and now Leliana is the Devine (in my playthrough) does she just drop that to become the wardens partner again, it seems like something that would take years to be and not something you can just drop in a second..

 

Not to mention the Warden is a high ranking one with lots of expectations from his armies..

 

I do not get how they will ever live together long or short.

 

Elope, getting the hell out of Thedas. Go to the "western lands which have not known blight".

[Lumix19]

Mages are just like any other mortal, the difference is that they have a connection to the fade due to their blood properties, however darkspawn have no link no connection to the fade but they have the same blood,  they can use the taint  to cast spell, most of them are less intelligent too mindless and cannot learn how to use their taint.
In DAA the mother as well as her disciples can use magic, all of them are able to do this, even the first disciple of the game who is supposed to be a warrior but prior to that event one of the companions of Mhairi stated before to die that the disciples had cast a blood magic to infect him from distance.
Every disciples is a mage(fo gameplay reasons however some of them cannot cast spell in combat),the Mother is a mage, the architect is a mage while the other darkspawn are not only because for the most part they are mindless, a Grey warden who has learn how to master the taint can gain access to this talent instead of use the taint just to perceive darkspawn or kill archdemons.
Anyway the point of the topic is that there is no need to find a cure which is true, as excuse they could easly say that the Warden is in a party somewhere.

I think Alphas are proof this is not the case. They are intelligent, can speak and have access to the taint but not all of them can cast spells.

[KaiserShep]

Someone would have squealed on us!

 

I'm sure someone could be taken care of.