28 réponses à ce sujet

[mickey111]

They are games which advertise themselves as highly plot focused, and yet the genre has absolutely no affinity for story telling. Imagine if you will that Empire Strikes Back was an open world RPG. The plot would shift very quickly from "Han Solo makes a frantic retreat from imperial forces" to "Han Solo takes his time to mine all the minerals he sees on route through the asteroid field, he will exit just as soon as he's done filling his inventory" Yo see how it completely kills the pacing of the dramatic and thrilling story line, right? Well that is how I see games like witcher and dragon age. they try so hard to tell good story, but they fill themselves up with so much nonsense and its a bit of a drag. 

[Kantr]

Try not to judge The Witcher 3 until after it's been released. Supposedly there won't be fetch quests.

 

Besides open world is fun.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

"Han Solo takes his time to mine all the minerals he sees on route through the asteroid field, he will exit just as soon as he's done filling his inventory" Yo see how it completely kills the pacing of the dramatic and thrilling story line, right?

 
You are describing an issue that occurs in literally every video game that doesn't rely exclusively on cinematics or linear scripted sequences. Player urgency and player agency are opposing ideas and very very few developers manage to get it right for fear of alienating casuals. It is not an open world problem at all. It's a game design problem.

 

Also, you cannot imagine story sequences where the player is disconnected from the open world at all? Pretty much every open world game that tries to have a compelling narrative has sequences like that. 

[mickey111]

open world world is only as fun as its gameplay. the whole reason GTA is such a fun opel world is because it's filled with fast cars, biks and big trucks to go runing everyone off the road, or chucking grenades out the window. If thats not fun for you then you can do minigames or fly a helicopter, or do street racing. 

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

open world world is only as fun as its gameplay. the whole reason GTA is such a fun opel world is because it's filled with fast cars, biks and big trucks to go runing everyone off the road, or chucking grenades out the window. If thats not fun for you then you can do minigames or fly a helicopter, or do street racing. 

 

 

For you.

[mickey111]

 
You are describing an issue that occurs in literally every video game that doesn't rely exclusively on cinematics or linear scripted sequences. Player urgency and player agency are opposing ideas and very very few developers manage to get it right for fear of alienating casuals. It is not an open world problem at all. It's a game design problem.

 

Also, you cannot imagine story sequences where the player is disconnected from the open world at all? Pretty much every open world game that tries to have a compelling narrative has sequences like that. 

Every one? Does that include Half-Life 2? It has puzzles. Other games like Binary Domain and Mass Effect 1 get the balance right I think. They're essentially just a linear corridor shooter, but it has short intermissions between corridors where you can talk to people, equip yourself and choose your squad. 

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

 
You are describing an issue that occurs in literally every video game that doesn't rely exclusively on cinematics or linear scripted sequences. Player urgency and player agency are opposing ideas and very very few developers manage to get it right for fear of alienating casuals. It is not an open world problem at all. It's a game design problem.

 

Also, you cannot imagine story sequences where the player is disconnected from the open world at all? Pretty much every open world game that tries to have a compelling narrative has sequences like that. 

 

Every one? Does that include Half-Life 2? It has puzzles. Other games like Binary Domain and Mass Effect 1 get the balance right I think. They're essentially just a linear corridor shooter, but it has short intermissions between corridors where you can talk to people, equip yourself and choose your squad. 

 

Exclusively may have been a step too far, but thanks for confirming my argument.

 

The point I am making is that player agency and player urgency are ideas that conflict with one another, and that is not a problem that affects open world games specifically, but all games that attempt to bring significant player agency outside of linear sequences.

 

Mass Effect 1 is actually a pretty bad example btw. I'd say Mass Effect 2's suicide run is easily the best example of player agency and player urgency working together to provide the best story experience that BioWare's ever done.

 

I mean your mineral harvesting example can apply to Mass Effect 1 in almost a direct 1-1 literal sense.

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

You should have grabbed one of these shields before attacking both Inquisition and Witcher 3:

 

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

You should have grabbed one of these shields before attacking both Inquisition and Witcher 3:

 

 

Inquisition is a mediocre game, and Witcher 3 isn't even out yet. So it's not about those games. The premise of the argument is just wrong.

 

Also, good shield. Those Roman Scutums are just about the best looking shields in history IMO.

[DanteYoda]

I didn't find this game a true open world game like say Skyrim, this game more reminds me of a themepark MMO..

 

And open world games i tend to get lost, get bored and move on..

[TheChris92]

I'll say this, I'm not as overtly fond of empty open worlds as I am with tightly designed areas that feel Big, ala The Asylum in Arkham Asylum or Silent Hill the town, in Silent Hill 2. There's a sense of familiarity and adventure with tight settings as those, when you slowly become more and more familiar with its workings only to discover new areas, new secrets. The same can be said for Rapture in BioShock 1, the first manor in Thief 2 and pretty much all areas in Hitman Blood Money. I miss having more games along the lines of those. Having said that, I don't find much fault with the more open ended areas of Inquisition, nor even that of Witcher 3. The Witcher always had a knack for sprawly hub areas, where the sequels have expanded upon that and thankfully done away with the awfully droll emphasis on tireless back 'n forth quests ala the first 10 hours or so of Witcher 1.

[Kaiser Arian XVII]

Inquisition is a mediocre game, and Witcher 3 isn't even out yet. So it's not about those games. The premise of the argument is just wrong.

 

Also, good shield. Those Roman Scutums are just about the best looking shields in history IMO.

 

I don't know. In +60 hours I've played inquisition half of it seemed like fetch quests which were better than Skyrim's. Plot missions were good though. Those related to Templars, Wardens, Fade, Corepheus, Tevinter & Venatori and Orlais Throne.

[Jeremiah12LGeek]

Err... where did you find this "inside info" on the quest design for Witcher 3?

[B.A. Broska]

Exclusively may have been a step too far, but thanks for confirming my argument.

 

The point I am making is that player agency and player urgency are ideas that conflict with one another, and that is not a problem that affects open world games specifically, but all games that attempt to bring significant player agency outside of linear sequences.

 

Mass Effect 1 is actually a pretty bad example btw. I'd say Mass Effect 2's suicide run is easily the best example of player agency and player urgency working together to provide the best story experience that BioWare's ever done.

 

I mean your mineral harvesting example can apply to Mass Effect 1 in almost a direct 1-1 literal sense.

 

What about games like Majora's Mask and Dead Rising that feature both player agency (sort of) and urgency in an open world environment? The player has agency in how they want to explore and use the time but there is also a sense of urgency due to the time limit you have to accomplish things, would be a good starting point to explore how to add a sense of urgency to an open world game.

[Mr.House]

Really, TW3 will probaly be lots of fun to play, but I'm far more concerned for the writitng if anything. Moving to a more cliche save the world and moving away from heavy politics like TW2 is a bad move right from the start, add true open world and the fact this is CDPs first jab at it, I'm extremely worried for the overall writing quality. I'm not holding my breath that it will even come close to TW2.

[B.A. Broska]

I did not realize TW3 was based around a save the world type plot, I thought Geralt had more personal reasons for tracking down the hunt? Of course if you have heard things about the plot that I have not KEEP IT TO YOURSELF as I have been trying hard to avoid Witcher 3 spoilers, not even watching gameplay footage or trailers

[Mr.House]

I did not realize TW3 was based around a save the world type plot, I thought Geralt had more personal reasons for tracking down the hunt?

Wild Hunt is threatening the world....  That is classic save the world right there. Whatever Gerelts reasons are is moot, we are still moving away from heavy politics, the thing that make TW series interesting in favor of such a thing. Add true open world ala not zones like DAI and there is a big cause to be wary of the writing quality.

[B.A. Broska]

Wild Hunt is threatening the world....  That is classic save the world right there. Whatever Gerelts reasons are is moot, we are still moving away from heavy politics, the thing that make TW series interesting in favor of such a thing. Add true open world ala not zones like DAI and there is a big cause to be wary of the writing quality.

 

We shall have to wait and see, I don't think being open world necessarily has a negative effect on writing however I do find myself wondering how TW3 will manage keeping a sense of scale if they truly are making the game fully open world, personally I would rather see the Witcher 3 use world zones rather than go fully open world but we will just have to wait and see how they handle it.

 

That said with how much I enjoyed the Witcher 2 I am willing to give CDProjekt the benefit of the doubt.

[mickey111]

Wild Hunt is threatening the world....  

 

Really? All I saw was a human looking figure dressed up in a suit that looked to be made of metal or something. The king of the wild hunt looked more ghostly as I remember, so what happened to make it go from the ghostly apparition I knew in Witcher 1 to the humanoid in armor as seen in trailer of this new game? 

[B.A. Broska]

Really? All I saw was a human looking figure dressed up in a suit that looked to be made of metal or something. The king of the wild hunt looked more ghostly as I remember, so what happened to make it go from the ghostly apparition I knew in Witcher 1 to the humanoid in armor as seen in trailer of this new game? 

 

Play the Witcher 2 and you will find the answer you seek at the end